[SonOfDarkness]

I know I know, we have had alot of threads about top 10 magic dudes. But im reading some threads and I hear Osserc as described in NoK by Taysch as the most powerful? something about storm riders etc. Osserc could have stopped the storm riders....

Who is Ze Man/Woman when it comes to Magic?

If I were to pick someone to be with me when shit got ugly I would want Rake with me. For obvious reasons ( he is awesomeoooo)

Quick Ben would be a close second but I think 1on1 Rake could take Quick out.

Lets not get into a list of top 5 or 10 etc.

Just your number 1 pick for magic. its great that Brood is high Denul, but he wont help much in a fight, magic wise.

So whos your pick?

This post has been edited by SonOfDarkness: 24 October 2008 - 04:57 PM

[Lisheo]

Rake would DESTROY QB.
The best mage is probably Gothos. He froze death, after all!

[Grief]

Freezing death is impressive, but he doesnt actually defeat death(this is something MILLIONS of jaghut couldnt do). He just stops the souls being taken by Hood. So technically all he needs is something more powerful than Hood.

Id say Rake, with the power of Tiam and MD, he kills Tiam, and does things MD couldnt.
Probably with K'rul or Osserc getting a close second, then Gothos, Draconus etc soon after.

Although where MD/Tiam fit in is rather hard.

[Dutch]

Briar King, on Oct 24 2008, 07:54 PM, said:

I say it is Beak.

All 13 candles lit wasn't it?

And on Rake. aye he's quite powerfull.

Quick Ben has quite some tricks in his sleeve, but against the Edur magic on the ships he could only put Meanas (illusion) against it (correct me if I'm wrong)

Btw, wasn't Spindle a Mage too? I remember something out of MoI about working up magic with one hand while throwing a sharper (or cusser) with the other.

[muco]

Among mortals, I would say Taysch.

In GotM he took on Rake as well as few of his own High mages.

[zwitterion]

It's kind of hard to gauge now that quick ben levelled up to some unknown new state, and rake evaporated. Also SE doesn't necessarily seem too keen on quantitative, anime style power matchups
(Quick Ben: in this form my fighting power is over one million!
Menandore: *gasp* fighting power one million?! impossible! IMPOSSIBLE!)
(yeah.. no.)
so who knows. QB probably has access to the most warrens but there don't seem to be any "rules" about this stuff set out when Beak can do what he did with little to no explanation.

[teholbeddict]

I would say it's a toss up b/w Quick Ben and Beak. Now, if only you could combine QB's cunning and know how with all of Beak's candles!

[Silencer]

Hmmm...I wouldn't rank Beak anywhere near QB.
Did he ever once face off against someone with volatile magic? No. He only defended. Destroying himself in the process.
I've said it before, if Quick was willing to incinerate himself, he'd have done a lot more than Beak did.

Saying "Beak stood up against the Letherii Hold sorcery when QB couldn't stand against the Edur" is irrelevant. Beak was willing to sacrifice everything to protect his friends. QB wasn't. He had a way to get around a direct confrontation, why kill himself when he didn't need to?

Now...Rake is quite possibly the best. He stood against Tay, Nightchill, Bellurdan, the Mage Cadre, and A'Karonys, while trying to defend the Moon. He even said himself that he only retreated to save Moon's Spawn. Admittedly, Tay wasn't going all-out or anything, but I think that's irrelevant.

Tay is great...but he agreed to be QB's shaved knuckle...which means Tay respects QB's power, and seems as an equal or near-equal. Those two are pretty damn dangerous, and probably the best mortal mages we've yet seen.

[Sinisdar Toste]

yeah tayschrenn had some great but sparse moments in RotCG but i loved them because of what they told me about him. he is a bad motherfucker

This post has been edited by Sinisdar Toste: 26 October 2008 - 07:42 AM

[Crow Clan Baby]

Lady Envy did some very impressive stuff in MoI, I would have thought she'd be high on the list. Goddam scary too, cos you never do know which way she's going to turn.

[Aptorian]

RRRAAAAAARRHHHGHH!!! BEST MAGE TOPIC MAKE APTORIAN AAAAANNNGGRRYYY!!!

Good lord how I hate these topics and peoples strange arguments for what ever magic whielder is more powerfull than the next.

First of you're discussing human mages, ascendants and elder gods in one giant mix, it doesn't work that way... not if you're sane anyway.

Human, unascended, mages and priests, draw upon a powersource, a warren or perhaps a god.

Now how the hell do you expect a mage to beat a god that is directly hooked in or perhaps even the wellspring of that very power the mortal uses? It doesn't work that way.

Quick Ben no matter his power, Tay, Beak, Heuk, what ever... is not going to out gun ST, Hood or any other god sitting on a whole realm of power at his disposal. That just doesn't compute.

Second of all, if you're going to compare the gods in powerlevel type match-up, think of this. Rake isn't known for destroying gods and monsters with forceblast or anything, gods like to settle things with their swords or fists Killy style... for some reason... that doesn't make much sense besides the fact that it looks really awesome when your read it.

In a versus match between magic wielding gods, I'm pretty certain that THE GOD OF MAGIC, K'rull, might have a slight advantage against the likes of Envy and Rake. It's just a guess.

What ever the other suspected Elementals like Mael and MD, etc are able to do with what ever they've got, no warren dependant god is going to attempt to duke it out with K'rull. That's just silly. I'm not saying K'rull would beat them, I'm not sure he can use his own magic that way, but it is his veins and flesh, so he could probably just cut them off. Then put them to sleep for a million years.

[Gem Windcaster]

There there, Apt. Here's a bone to gnaw on. *pats Apt's head*

I'm going with Quick Ben, because he's the smartest of them. Raw power only takes you so far - if your enemy has outsmarted you even before you're on the battlefield, it doesn't matter if you're a god or an ancient creature that has stood on thousand battlefields - you're screwed.

[Grief]

Couple of points, for you apt:

K'rul didnt make the Elder warrens(not really sure who did, another azath builder type relevation forthcoming perhaps?). I think that Maels warren runs in Maels blood, at least partly etc, like dragons. Same with Rake, MD, whoever.
This is, perhaps, the reason only the jaghut can use OP etc. Because its only in their blood, whereas the warrens in K'ruls are accessible to anyone. More ordered.

Anyway, the reason I answered:

I reckon the ascendants etc like to fight it out using swords etc, because of the cost on the land, and anyone nearby, of using magic.
Its been noted at various points that mage battles kill most of the soldiers nearby, cause of rebounding magic etc. Anyone with any care for their people, probably wouldnt engage in a mage battle to the death(see Rake over Pale).

Whereas with swords, you'll kill each other, rather than each other, and everyone else within a miles radius.

And its not all ascendants that do this. For example, Raest, who doesnt give a shit about other people in GotM is happy to go flinging magic about.

There is also the risk, I imagine, that massive magic duels will draw the attention of other beings, which may not be something you want, unlike a fairly inconspicious sword fight.

[Osric]

I have to agree with apt here,

It just doesn't work like this, shadowthrone and quick ben arent going to duke it out in an arena, if they did shadowthrone would win. In the game of gods and mortals it's not about power, it's about cunning. How many times has Quick shown his power? He almost always solves things with his cunning. He got lured by the Crippled God once, he blasted the CG with all the power he has and got the fuck out but the CG was only stunned, for like 5 seconds, before he grabbed Quick and would have killed him if it wasnt for Burn's servants. All of Quick Ben's power directed in one blast fased the CG about as much as a pretty hard slap in the face.

Mortal's are no match for god's and ascendants, and there the power level is and will always be undecided. Like zwitterion said, this isn't dragonball Z, any god could get killed if they let their guard down, look at mael when the Errant trapped him, how easy did he go down?

Among mortals, it kind of depends as well. I'm pretty sure Tay is the most powerful, but that doesnt mean he's the best mage. Quick Ben has a lot of cunning and skill, with about 7 souls and lives worth of experience of magic use. Pure strength means a lot but skill and brains mean more. Look at Kruppe, who knows how powerful he is, he's never even had to use his strength, except to get into Baruk's wine cellar lol.

This post has been edited by Osric: 26 October 2008 - 06:10 PM

[Mentalist]

bah
of those still with us, QB's the strongest human mage.
won't elaborate to avode spoilers.

[Aptorian]

This is the TTH forum, unless you're thinking RCG spoilers, there's no problems here.

[Mentalist]

yes, I am thinking RCG

RCG SPOILER YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED AND DONT COMPLAIN IF YOU READ IT

Spoiler

Tay goes MIA into the chaos rent, so he's down for the count

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 26 October 2008 - 07:29 PM

[Beld]

Apt is obviously correct. Comparing a human mage to Rake ... to an elder god etc. makes no sense.

Also grief you seem to be mixing up part of the dragons being the flavor of certain warrens with Krul's blood.

With respect to the RCG spoiler... it is clear from a reading of RCG not only what the answer is... but that the spoiler is not dispositive at all. There is more to come with respect to that person, it seems certain.

Also let's not cite QB's "illusion" against the edur as indicative of a limit of his powers. QB himself goes on to describe how his encounter with Icarium stretched him out. Not to mention while Beak may have had all of candles... its seems pretty clear from QBs encounter with Bauchelain that he is not limited in the number of warrens he can access.

Heck we don't even know where someone like Bottle will fall out in the grand scheme of things.

[Sucka27]

I think this is a valid debate if only discussing mortals as well. I don't know who it is, but I know who I hope it ends up being - Sinn. I just like her, and we don't know her true potential just yet. A natural high mage is something to consider though.

This post has been edited by Sucka27: 01 November 2008 - 12:26 AM

[Ain't_It_Just_]

Sometimes it ain't a matter of sorcery...just how one intends to use it. That can make the difference in all the "who would be more powerful" arguments.

Sinn, I reckon, hasn't used her magic to try and help the 14th, her efforts to just coincide with their goals.

And another thing... In HOC, wasn't Sinn a young woman? Then in BH she's turned into a little kid.