[Terez]

Rand doesn't believe it was the Creator. He doesn't even think about it.

What is it that I'm not acknowledging? There are no huge gaping plot holes in WoT - none have even been put forward. That was Macros' original claim. There's a big difference between some errors and huge gaping plot holes. You find WoT's errors, those real and those you imagine based on not actually remembering what happened in the books, frustrating, but yet you can sweep the same sort of errors in Erikson's work to the side. I sweep the errors of both to the side, being non-discriminatory in my sweeping.

[dolfanuk]

agrred, plot holes in WOT and in MBOTF and in any other substantial series out there.

just happens over time, you get new ideas or you decide old ones weren't to hot.

just the way it is.

[Macros]

I think my penchant for using exageration to get a point across has been witnessed enough not to take any of my statements at face value terez
That said, you're clearly a big fan and fair play, If someone were to produce such points against Feist and Tolkien I'd shrug and say, good for you now go do something constructive with your time please
whilst some of your answers have cleared up issues that I really didnt get, (although I'll admit I threw a few in there to be awkward and they were sitting in front of me begging to be copied and pasted) others just dont cut it for me, too many "well thats just the way it works" (a cheap get out, as its difined as working diffrenetly several times) or "its documented in the books" I dont have Raza stuff book marked at home but If I feel the dreive tomorrow I'll pull up his shaido arguement again and post the whole damned lot of it. Thing like the numbers etc are minor mistakes and I'm just being a git for pulling them up:)
His writing style and story arcs, how you can argue that he hasnt protracted the series deliberately is beyond me, theres several key plots that have been forced on the characters against the easier and logical solution to distance them and keep the story going for longer. Totally nonsensical shit like failes abduction was totaly irelavent and was simply a page filler.

ETA if he hadnt been pushed to it, we likely wouldnt have heard of morainnes impending rescue yet, we would likely be looking at another 3 damned books

[Cougar]

I applaud Terez's non-dicriminatory sweeping.

I think plot wise the thing I find most frustrating in a non-specific sort of way is the number of occasions when travelling or skimming might have been used and wasn't/isn't despite it seeming bleedin' obvious that it would be beneficial.

I also agree on the Egwene getting captured point, having already kept her safe from the Dragon etc which woul dhave sorted out a raft of problems why she is then risked in this endevour seems a bit daft, you can put that down to Egwenes own dumbassedness though I supose.

[caladanbrood]

You won't win this argument, she thinks you're all Erikson fanboys trying to put down "the competition"...

[Macros]

with egwenes capturenagain, the get out clause is semantic.
which is bullshittery, if she can semantic round that one she can go see the rand and sort the worlds problems out.


ETA, I'm not anyones "fanboy" so again, another flawed arguement

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Terez;334063 said:

I don't buy that. He had plans for another series, and he could have wrapped up WoT and started the new one if he wanted and all his fans would have bought it.

I don't know, people sometimes like a series more than the author. I love AsoIaF, but have read nothing else by GRRM, nor do i plan to.

[caladanbrood]

Raymond Luxury Yacht;334284 said:

I don't know, people sometimes like a series more than the author. I love AsoIaF, but have read nothing else by GRRM, nor do i plan to.

Fevre Dream is very good, but the rest of it... meh.

[Terez]

Raymond Luxury Yacht;334284 said:

I don't know, people sometimes like a series more than the author. I love AsoIaF, but have read nothing else by GRRM, nor do i plan to.

Probably because he hasn't finished aSoIaF yet, and he took time off from it to do the other stuff - everyone seems to resent that. Generally, when an author finishes one series, the fans transfer to the next one. If they don't like it, they'll drop it, but they'll buy it at first.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

I have to admit to feelings of "If I buy anything else, it'll only encourage him to write more random stuff instead of AdWD."

[Terez]

That's certainly why I haven't bought any of his other stuff.

[Gem Windcaster]

The thing with SE's 'plot holes' is that a large amount of them can either be classified as misunderstandings, a character lied or was lied to, or we just never will know...
Can't really say the same about RJ, although I'd like to.

[Zelech]

I don't see the huge plot-holes either. I'm glad most of us agree to that fact.

Is this where we start estimating the # of pages in WoT 12?

[Cougar]

Zelech;334475 said:

I don't see the huge plot-holes either. I'm glad most of us agree to that fact.

Is this where we start estimating the # of pages in WoT 12?

PM Brandon and ask

[Terez]

We estimated that on Theoryland months ago, as soon as BS announced the word count. Probably around 800 pages.

[Terez]

Gem Windcaster;334474 said:

The thing with SE's 'plot holes' is that a large amount of them can either be classified as misunderstandings, a character lied or was lied to, or we just never will know...
Can't really say the same about RJ, although I'd like to.

I can say the same about RJ's "plot holes". Some of them are real errors - most of them are not.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

BS are not flattering initials.

[caladanbrood]

Terez;334522 said:

We estimated that on Theoryland months ago, as soon as BS announced the word count. Probably around 800 pages.

He announced the word count already?

But... but... he hasn't written it yet:confused:

[Terez]

Yeah, it's obviously an estimation. He said he thinks it might end up a little longer than what he estimated, but he's basing the number partly off of what RJ's written already.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Do you think this will be good for BS's career? Regardless of how good it is, it's a lot of exposure. I wonder if it will end up being a good thing or not.