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) but in terms of mage strength. tay was just a good adept and is a very powerful high mage but he would lose against the ceda IMOOn a side note whats all these reputation tabs about
Soldier of Death, Seguleh, T'orrud Cabal Analysis
#141
tiam 
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Posted 12 April 2006 - 11:21 AM
yes i agree that MORTALS are doin in all the old powers on the principle that every god falls at a mortals hands (bitterly ironic in the case of fener ) but in terms of mage strength. tay was just a good adept and is a very powerful high mage but he would lose against the ceda IMO
On a side note whats all these reputation tabs about
) but in terms of mage strength. tay was just a good adept and is a very powerful high mage but he would lose against the ceda IMOOn a side note whats all these reputation tabs about
#142
Imperial Historian
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Posted 12 April 2006 - 03:50 PM
If the Seguleh second and skinner have met it must be fairly recently in immortal terms, as the crimson gaurd only came about around a hundred years ago, so skinner can't be too old....
Re: the T'orrud Cabal's strength, Vorcan was an assasin high mage, now high mages are rare enough as we know from the Malazans shortage, and so are extremely powerful in there own right, so inevitably as an assasin her powers were focused on killing, hence she was very very good at it, while the T'orrud Cabal were a lot more scholarly in the direction there power pursued... alcehmy, history and such, so inevitably they were not equipped to face her.
Re: the T'orrud Cabal's strength, Vorcan was an assasin high mage, now high mages are rare enough as we know from the Malazans shortage, and so are extremely powerful in there own right, so inevitably as an assasin her powers were focused on killing, hence she was very very good at it, while the T'orrud Cabal were a lot more scholarly in the direction there power pursued... alcehmy, history and such, so inevitably they were not equipped to face her.
#143 Guest_addle_wit_*
Posted 13 April 2006 - 02:48 AM
I think I have all my textual bases covered as regards Skinner's gender. I might be wrong, but in MT chapter 16, the Crippled God says to Rhulad "Be glad it was not Skinner, or indeed Cowl. They would have taken more notice of you, and that would not have been a good thing. We're not yet ready for that."
As for "She left one alive? I doubt it", it could refer to Poliel. I would argue it doesn't. One reason is that survivors were kind of the point of Poliel's plagues. Another reason is that if the Soldier is referring to Poliel, then the stuff he says at the end about finding Hood a wife doesn't tie into as neat a package (and here I am making a very convincing gesture wherein my fingers all weave together to convey how well it would fit).
I think I have all my textual bases covered as regards Skinner's gender. In MT chapter 16, the Crippled God says to Rhulad "Be glad it was not Skinner, or indeed Cowl. They would have taken more notice of you, and that would not have been a good thing. We're not yet ready for that."
As for "She left one alive? I doubt it", it could refer to Poliel. I would argue it doesn't. One reason is that survivors were kind of the point of Poliel's plagues. Another reason is that if the Soldier is referring to Poliel, then the stuff he says at the end about finding Hood a wife doesn't tie into as neat a package (and here I am making a very convincing gesture wherein my fingers all weave together to convey how well it would fit).
As for what happened before the Soldier showed up in BH, I don't think we know anything close to enough to do more than guess at what happened before. We can guess how old the Crimson Guard is, but who knows what Skinner was doing before becoming an Avowed? In MoI K'rul says that the "Second Mask" is missing, does that mean that the individual Seluleh currently holding that position is missing, or that the position itself has gone unfilled for some time?
The sequence of events I laid out was meant to be a starting point. An example of the sort of thing that might of happened.
addle-wit
As for "She left one alive? I doubt it", it could refer to Poliel. I would argue it doesn't. One reason is that survivors were kind of the point of Poliel's plagues. Another reason is that if the Soldier is referring to Poliel, then the stuff he says at the end about finding Hood a wife doesn't tie into as neat a package (and here I am making a very convincing gesture wherein my fingers all weave together to convey how well it would fit).
I think I have all my textual bases covered as regards Skinner's gender. In MT chapter 16, the Crippled God says to Rhulad "Be glad it was not Skinner, or indeed Cowl. They would have taken more notice of you, and that would not have been a good thing. We're not yet ready for that."
As for "She left one alive? I doubt it", it could refer to Poliel. I would argue it doesn't. One reason is that survivors were kind of the point of Poliel's plagues. Another reason is that if the Soldier is referring to Poliel, then the stuff he says at the end about finding Hood a wife doesn't tie into as neat a package (and here I am making a very convincing gesture wherein my fingers all weave together to convey how well it would fit).
As for what happened before the Soldier showed up in BH, I don't think we know anything close to enough to do more than guess at what happened before. We can guess how old the Crimson Guard is, but who knows what Skinner was doing before becoming an Avowed? In MoI K'rul says that the "Second Mask" is missing, does that mean that the individual Seluleh currently holding that position is missing, or that the position itself has gone unfilled for some time?
The sequence of events I laid out was meant to be a starting point. An example of the sort of thing that might of happened.
addle-wit
#144
Cause
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Posted 13 April 2006 - 05:15 AM
she left one alice definatly refers to drek. excuse me their aspects are so similiar I earlier confused them. Its in dreks temple and drek as we know just killed her entire priesthood. She left one alive, doubtfull. But your no whelp of drek. I think their is something about skinner in NoK if someone could just tell us and get the debate overwith
#145
Imperial Historian
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Posted 13 April 2006 - 03:18 PM
I've had a look through the books looking for CG quotes and on skinner, and I can't find anything which refers to skinner as either male or female. So it's up in the air there.
However i personally think "she left one alive" refers to Drek who killed her priesthood in the monastery Cutter enters. When the soldier sees someone alive among teh lsughtered priesthood, he wonders over Drek leaving one of her priesthood alive, but then decides that cutter isn't of Dreks priesthood, and hence she didnt leave him alive. Nothing to do with skinner in my view.
the finding him a wife buisness seems to be a curse on the seguleh seconds part... maybe in seguleh society getting married is the worse thing that can happen to a man...
However i personally think "she left one alive" refers to Drek who killed her priesthood in the monastery Cutter enters. When the soldier sees someone alive among teh lsughtered priesthood, he wonders over Drek leaving one of her priesthood alive, but then decides that cutter isn't of Dreks priesthood, and hence she didnt leave him alive. Nothing to do with skinner in my view.
the finding him a wife buisness seems to be a curse on the seguleh seconds part... maybe in seguleh society getting married is the worse thing that can happen to a man...
#146
Nazaar
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 02:58 AM
*bump*
I thought this was more like a universal curse, as in 'he's got way too much time on his hands, he needs a gf/wife so I can actually get some work done'.
Anyone else curious if the Soldier leaving his spear behind is significant? Anyone else wonder what Trull could do with a spear that a martial Ascendant owned, instead of getting chopped to bits a la the fight with Icarium?
Edit: I'm an idiot, only just saw the weapon for Trull thread. Searching backwards is silly.
Quote
the finding him a wife buisness seems to be a curse on the seguleh seconds part... maybe in seguleh society getting married is the worse thing that can happen to a man...
I thought this was more like a universal curse, as in 'he's got way too much time on his hands, he needs a gf/wife so I can actually get some work done'.
Anyone else curious if the Soldier leaving his spear behind is significant? Anyone else wonder what Trull could do with a spear that a martial Ascendant owned, instead of getting chopped to bits a la the fight with Icarium?
Edit: I'm an idiot, only just saw the weapon for Trull thread. Searching backwards is silly.
#147
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 07:15 AM
The whole spear thing has to have some significance I'm sure... except where is it now? Last seen in Greyfrog's mouth?
I loved the energy of that scene with the Soldier of Death.. that whole 'Uncle? absurd!..' bit was really funny..
I loved the energy of that scene with the Soldier of Death.. that whole 'Uncle? absurd!..' bit was really funny..
#148 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 09 May 2006 - 08:47 AM
Imperial Historian said:
However i personally think "she left one alive" refers to Drek who killed her priesthood in the monastery Cutter enters.
D'rek is male, poliel is female. Check the glossary. Funny huh.
Anyway, it's just a spear. Otherwise someone would have recognized it as "the spear of death and decay" (+1/+2when carried by shadow creature).
It's like finding the panties of Rake, what abilities would they have? (total immunity against brown stains). Don't think all the accessories of ascendants are aspected.
#149
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 09:08 AM
Danyah said:
D'rek is male, poliel is female. Check the glossary. Funny huh.
Anyway, it's just a spear. Otherwise someone would have recognized it as "the spear of death and decay" (+1/+2when carried by shadow creature).
Anyway, it's just a spear. Otherwise someone would have recognized it as "the spear of death and decay" (+1/+2when carried by shadow creature).
D'rek is both male and female.. check it out
http://encylopaediamalazica.pbwiki.com/D'rek
and the spear...Greyfrog called it's being left.. 'Wondrous news'
#150 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 09 May 2006 - 10:07 AM
What would Greyfrog know? He just came over from some warren where he hadn't seen humans before. Don't credit him too much knowledge.
#151
fan_83
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 12:09 PM
errr greyfrog is old enough to know what is good news and what is bad news for him.. he may not know of humans doesn;t means htat he doesn;t have the senses to sense the presence of the spear and its capabilities
#152 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 09 May 2006 - 12:19 PM
Dunno, Greyfrog seems rather singular of mind. I don't hold a high esteem of the spear. Which seems forgotten some 50 pages further...
#154 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 09 May 2006 - 04:05 PM
I've done my 20th reread on that part, and the Soldier chases Skinner, because as an avowed he is immortal (can't die a natural death at least) and Hood does not like that, so he sends his minions.
Greyfrog says "The Soldier of Death! Wondrous! He left his spear. Wondrous applies to the soldier, not to the spear. Cutter grabs it, and since then it's been forgotten. If they kept it, it's on the bottom of the Otataral Sea, with the rest of their stuff.
Greyfrog says "The Soldier of Death! Wondrous! He left his spear. Wondrous applies to the soldier, not to the spear. Cutter grabs it, and since then it's been forgotten. If they kept it, it's on the bottom of the Otataral Sea, with the rest of their stuff.
#155
Dolorous Menhir
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 04:09 PM
I guess Trull will be going for a swim then...
or maybe Mael will give it to him.
or maybe Mael will give it to him.
#156 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 09 May 2006 - 04:49 PM
Other options are Barathol's village or with Shai'ik the third/Felisin Younger.
Or Heboric shows up with it.
Or Heboric shows up with it.
#157
Abyss
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 05:13 PM
I do so love the notion of Skinner being female. It so suits SE's tendency towards twists. I don't recall anything to disprove it... anyone have the exact quote from 'Ballad of Skinner'... MT i think... anyone? *fires up the Vaiski-signal*
As for the spear of death, easy enough for that to reappear. It could be as simple as being washed on board by a wave during the mess.
- Abyss, gender-bender defender.
As for the spear of death, easy enough for that to reappear. It could be as simple as being washed on board by a wave during the mess.
- Abyss, gender-bender defender.
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#158
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 06:15 PM
Interestingly enough.. Iron Bars is ranked right up there alongside Skinner by the Guardsmen... and it would appear that only Cowl is better... but there is no indication in the Lay of Skinner as to gender.
sorry.. it's gone wildly off-topic... back to the Seguleh ..
sorry.. it's gone wildly off-topic... back to the Seguleh ..
#159
Imperial Historian
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Posted 09 May 2006 - 08:18 PM
I checked all the skinner quotes I could find, most of which are in the crimson gaurd section of the encyclopedia: http://encylopaediam...Crimson%20Guard
And the lay of skinner: http://encylopaediamalazica.pbwiki.com/The...%20of%20Skinner
I also quite like the theory that skinner is female, even if tehre's no evidence whatsoever for it... it's a good theory.
not better, more feared by the CG for his magical knowledge... he's no swordsman
and back on topic
Seguleh Second: looking for a wife yes, skinner being that wife... unlikely, that quotes more likely to be refering to drek, even drek IS a he/she
And the lay of skinner: http://encylopaediamalazica.pbwiki.com/The...%20of%20Skinner
I also quite like the theory that skinner is female, even if tehre's no evidence whatsoever for it... it's a good theory.
Quote
and it would appear that only Cowl is better
not better, more feared by the CG for his magical knowledge... he's no swordsman
and back on topic
Seguleh Second: looking for a wife yes, skinner being that wife... unlikely, that quotes more likely to be refering to drek, even drek IS a he/she
#160 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 09 May 2006 - 08:31 PM
Skinner cheated death, Hood sends minions. Poll it.
