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Battle Ground SPOILERS OF DOOM discussion topic

#61 User is offline   champ 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 01:13 PM

View PostCause, on 10 October 2020 - 12:59 AM, said:

Cristos? Is black council separate to nemesis. Is he not black council. He played it loyal. He could have popped the black staff from behind and the outsiders win. How did nemesis or outsiders influence the titan? We never discuss people summoning outsiders/corner hounds again.


Maybe Cristos was straight all along and we were only led to believe he was Black Council - smoke and mirrors. Could be his death in this book is to show us that we were wrong and it is actually someone else that is Black Council in the Senior Council. Merlin seems like a wanker, could be him.


But that may be bollocks, I really need to reread this series...

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#62 User is offline   Tattersail_ 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 02:58 PM

Whoever is behind the Outsiders why not summon them during this conflict?
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#63 User is offline   Cause 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 03:21 PM

Someone summoned corner hounds which I think ere said to be outsiders? Def Cthulhu inspired. They never addressed it again.

A lot won’t make sense until we hear some reveals in later books maybe but I also think it’s hard to right something this big in fantasy and make it survive too mcluch examination. Summoning outsiders would be huge. Drakul summoning zombie army would have been huge.

We are always told what makes wizards powerful is time, preparardness and rituals. With that and cooperation they can go toe to toe with the big evils in the world. What we only ever see is Harry or the black staff slugging it out with pure power.

Also just remembered. The council voted unanimously to kick out Dresden. Not including listens to wind and McCoy who were in surgery? Was the gatekeeper present for the vote or was he at the gates can’t remember? He knows Harry is the WARDEN. Seems odd he would vote him out.

Actually given that most people don’t know Harry is the warden and didn’t see how he defeated the titan, I’m surprised more people are not freaking the fuck out.
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#64 User is offline   Tattersail_ 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 04:12 PM

The Gatekeeper can see the future and may know that Harry needs to be independent of the White Council to do what must be done. We know there's a time travel book and we know Jim wants Harry to break all the laws.

Has he broke them all except time travel so far?

I cannot wait for that book. He said it precludes the final trilogy.
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#65 User is offline   champ 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 04:26 PM

How does one summon the Outsiders, do you have to be magical? Could Justine have done it if magic is not required as she is infected afterall.


Also if there was an attack at the Gates the Gate Keeper would probably be there rather than at a council meeting.

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#66 User is offline   Cause 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 05:00 PM

I think the rule for outsiders so far has been they can only be summoned by mortal magicians. So red court, black court practitioners etc can’t do it. That said I think during the war it’s mentioned the red court used outsiders once, possibly using their venom to thrall human wizards. So there seems an easy way around this. Lord faith summoned an entropy cheese that’s linked to he who walks behind but he did use 3 mortal women to help.

Justine doesn’t have the juice though,


Know that you say it though it’s amazing they don’t summon more outsiders than they do.
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Posted 14 October 2020 - 06:40 PM

I'm going to do a reread after I finish with Harrow and the Mark Lawrence books.


There will be a reason why somewhere... or it'll be something yet to learn why they don't.


That second video I posted was a Q&A with Butcher, I'd recommend giving it a watch, he brings up some interesting facts...


Two of the best, Kemmler was a previous Warden of Demonreach, it was all out war stopping him from getting back to the island and unleashing hell, also Starborn have been kicking around since the dawn of creation...


There was more juicy in there but I've forgotten it now, blame the meds...

This post has been edited by champ: 14 October 2020 - 06:40 PM

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#68 User is offline   D'rek 

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 10:32 PM

The thing with the Outsiders is that whatever we first learned about them could have been heavily skewed by Harry's own perspective/lack of knowledge. We didn't even know He Who Walks Behind *was* an Outsider, rather than just some summoned demon thug, for quite a while, and even when we learned it was an Outsider we didn't know being a Walker was special.

So... what if it's never really been a matter of "who is behind the Outsiders?"... maybe the Outsiders have always been an independent force making their own moves this whole time, and anytime there's been a question of "What wizard /vampire would be crazy enough to summon Outsiders against us?" it's been a Nemesis'd person opening the gate?

View Postworrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.
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#69 User is offline   Cyphon 

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Posted 24 October 2020 - 08:49 AM

Gotta consumate the marriage, unless Harry stays celibate until he finds a new true love...
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#70 User is offline   Tiste Simeon 

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Posted 31 October 2020 - 07:40 PM

Finished. Great book. Final third was breathtaking and I went to sleep way too late considering I had to be up before 5am this morning haha but it was so good.

New Harry outside of the White Council should be fun as should the upcoming "wedding" however that ends up manifesting.

Is Murphy dead? I dunno, I can see Harry ending up with Molly at the end of things. I kind of hope she is not because I don't like her but it might cheapen her death of she's back so soon. I think the comment about her becoming an Einherajen (sp?) shows that she won't be back.
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#71 User is offline   Nicodimas 

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Posted 06 March 2022 - 10:31 PM

View PostTattersail_, on 14 October 2020 - 04:12 PM, said:

The Gatekeeper can see the future and may know that Harry needs to be independent of the White Council to do what must be done. We know there's a time travel book and we know Jim wants Harry to break all the laws.

Has he broke them all except time travel so far?

I cannot wait for that book. He said it precludes the final trilogy.


I’m a little behind on the current state of theories regarding this bit… we know he time traveled, but which book was the first book he went back to for sure. Just checking

This post has been edited by Nicodimas: 06 March 2022 - 10:32 PM

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#72 User is offline   Cause 

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Posted 29 December 2022 - 05:23 PM

I just finished a reread of peace talks and battleground. Where is peace 12 months!

It’s been two years. This isn’t like him.

This post has been edited by Cause: 29 December 2022 - 05:23 PM

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#73 User is offline   Lady Bliss 

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Posted 30 December 2022 - 03:29 AM

According to his site he has been wrapping up the second cinder spires book, so it might be a while still…
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Posted 21 May 2025 - 08:19 AM

NYT Interview with Jim Butcher

Twelve Months, the new book, is due to land in January apparently! The interview is an interesting read as well.
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Posted 21 May 2025 - 11:17 AM

View PostTheRetiredBridgeburner, on 21 May 2025 - 08:19 AM, said:

NYT Interview with Jim Butcher

Twelve Months, the new book, is due to land in January apparently! The interview is an interesting read as well.

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#76 User is offline   Tsundoku 

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Posted 21 May 2025 - 12:14 PM

Here you go ...

--------------------------------------

14 Million Books Later, Jim Butcher Thinks His Wizard Detective Needs a Hug
Now in its 25th year, The Dresden Files and its author have survived the darkness, fictional and otherwise.

By Benjamin Mullin
Benjamin Mullin has been reading “The Dresden Files” since he was 12, when his brother found the series in a bookstore during a vacation to Orlando.

May 19, 2025
Three decades ago, Jim Butcher put pen to paper and invented a wildly popular fictional universe. At the time, he was just trying to finish his homework.

Butcher, then a 25-year-old grad student at the University of Oklahoma, had days earlier turned in an unfinished novel for a writing class. The book was about a wisecracking Chicago gumshoe named Harry Dresden, a wizard whose miserable love life was occasionally interrupted by a grisly supernatural murder.

Butcher’s professor liked what she read. She told him to bring an outline for “the rest of it” to their next session. “She meant the rest of the novel,” Butcher recalled in an interview. “The next week, I rolled in with an outline for a 20-book series.”

On sketch pads and now-obsolete WordPerfect software, he planned out ways to put his poor hero through a gauntlet of indignities, poking his head out occasionally to watch Animal Planet with his son. Homemade posters in his cramped writing alcove cheered him on. (“The only way you fail is if you quit,” read one.)

That outline would lead to “The Dresden Files” series, which debuted with “Storm Front” five years later, with heroes and villains from just about every mythology — and some Butcher made up. Over the last 25 years, the series has sold 14 million copies in the United States, according to his publisher. For all the wizardry, the real magic in the books is the way that vampires, werewolves and even a zombie T. Rex feel completely at home alongside mobsters, attack helicopters and a reference to Regina George, the Queen Bee of “Mean Girls.”

Ushering me into his rustic Colorado home, a cabinlike fortress he jokingly called his “log castle,” Butcher, 53, resembles some of the wizards in his books, with a well-kept beard, long hair streaked with silver, a prominent brow and a piercing gaze underneath expressive eyebrows.

Like those wizards, Butcher has some superstitions of his own, particularly when it comes to following the early outline that catapulted him from a graveyard shift I.T. geek to a best-selling author. Anne Sowards, his editor at Ace, said she has never seen it, and only one other person knows how the series will end. That secret plan has (mostly) guided Butcher’s saga since 2000, almost as long as George R.R. Martin, the fantasy eminence who released “A Game of Thrones” in 1996, has been publishing his.

Image
This is a grid of four paperback covers of Dresden Files books by Jim Butcher: Clockwise from top left: “Turn Coat,” “Changes,” “Dead Beat” and “Ghost Story.”

Among Butcher’s novels are “Turn Coat,” “Changes,” “Ghost Story” and “Dead Beat.” In “Ghost Story,” his hero’s ghost has to solve his own murder.
Over 17 volumes and dozens of short stories, Butcher has hammered his hero, a mouthy P.I. with a beat-up Volkswagen, into a supernatural heavyweight who can vanquish titans. Along the way, Butcher has become one of the world’s leading authors of urban fantasy, a genre that blends the wondrous elements of magical realism, its more literary cousin, with the pulp and plotting of page-turners. This week, the publisher is announcing that “Twelve Months,” the 18th book in the series, will be published in January, five years after the last installment.

But there was a period where it seemed like he might not finish the series at all.

In the final pages of his 2010 book, “Changes,” Butcher had written his hero into a tight corner: shot through the chest, falling from a boat, sinking into the icy waters of Lake Michigan.

Butcher was enthusiastically promoting the latest twist to fans, who alternated between glee and grief. Behind the scenes, however, he was suffering.

“I had just gotten to a point where I just didn’t see any hope for the future,” Butcher said. “Bear in mind, this is when ‘The Dresden Files’ was exploding.”

Depression, which he had struggled with for much of his life, was deadening his days. His marriage was fraying. The charming raconteur, telling jokes to hundreds of fans on the science fiction and fantasy convention circuit, belied a man in crisis. So, he made a decision to end things.

As the deadline for his next book loomed, Butcher took two bottles of pills that he’d been using to treat chronic migraines and braced for the worst. He recalled feeling terribly sick for 36 hours. But he survived.

“I am really lucky to be here,” Butcher said quietly, as his 7-year-old pit bull, Brutus — named for an earth spirit in one of his books — dozed next to him on the couch.

Afterward, he thought about what his death might have done to his two sons, James (a novelist himself) and Dylan. He felt he needed to “own up to the consequences of my choice, and what could have happened if I hadn’t just been very fortunate.”

The result was the next installment in the series, “Ghost Story.” The book followed Harry Dresden’s ghost as he tried to solve his own murder, observing the ripple effects of his death “It’s a Wonderful Life”-style. It was the first in the series that Butcher didn’t plan out chapter by chapter ahead of time.

Image
A photograph of the author Jim Butcher, lounging on a brown leather couch, with a large brown dog in the foreground.
Butcher at his Colorado home with his dog, Brutus.

Butcher hasn’t opened up publicly about his mental health difficulties until recently, and he’s still reluctant to discuss them. He has been divorced twice, separations that have taken a toll (though he is newly engaged). Sowards said that there was a period where she wasn’t sure when she was going to get another book from him.

“We were able to be patient, and we supported him,” she said.

For lunch, Butcher sears me a steak on the stovetop, not unlike the typical meal that McAnally, the taciturn bartender from his books, would serve up. As Butcher carefully glazes the meat with a heart-healthy balsamic, I suggest that talking to a reporter is probably not great for his blood pressure.

“I mean, I debated whether or not to do this interview,” Butcher said, after adding garlic powder.

Stepping outside into the brisk, pine-scented air, he tells me that talking about his mental health was motivated, in part, by an interaction he had with a fan. At a book signing, he met a young man carrying a printout of writing advice Butcher had published on his LiveJournal. He autographed it and offered the fan encouragement about his own writing.

Butcher thought little of it at the time. But afterward, he said, the fan got in touch to tell Butcher that he had been prepared to kill himself, and that the writer’s words of support helped him decide to keep going. Since then, the two have struck up a friendship.

“I’ve talked to other young men who’ve had the same issues,” Butcher said. “I say, ‘You’re feeling overwhelmed. You need to make your world a bit smaller for a while. Set out some reasonable goals for yourself, get up in the morning, get the bed made, get the kitchen cleaned up, make sure your house looks nice.’”

Butcher is similarly forthcoming about the ups-and-downs in his career. In 2004, the Sci-Fi Channel announced it was making a series based on the first book of “The Dresden Files,” produced by Nicolas Cage. Fans were elated by the prospect, even if there were some notable changes; Harry’s trademark magical staff, for instance, was transformed into a hockey stick.

Shortly before shooting, Butcher said, a new executive triggered a flurry of last-minute rewrites. (“They were filming it in Toronto, and he was going to be in charge of the project from L.A.,” Butcher said. “So you can imagine how well that worked out.”) The series was canceled after one season. The channel didn’t even comp Butcher a set of the DVDs, he said.

The experience did introduce his books to thousands of viewers, and changed Butcher’s approach to Hollywood. He is negotiating to be a producer on a plan to turn three “Dresden Files” books into a new series. The project, which has not yet been announced, would focus on Harry Dresden’s war against the vampires who infected his girlfriend, Susan Rodriguez. He hopes to do some of the screenwriting.

“There’s serious enough talks happening that I’ve had to share my tax I.D. number and so on,” Butcher said. “But we’ll see. I don’t know if anything’s going to happen or not.”

Butcher is taking a more active role in his career, too. In 2022, he put out a Dresden Files novella through Audible, doing all the voices himself. But he has not turned his back on the traditional publishing industry, as have other fantasy authors with large followings, who are selling books directly to readers. “I’m getting to make a really good living doing something that I really love,” he added. “I don’t need to be super rich. It seems like that might pose more problems than solutions.”

During nearly six hours talking about Butcher’s books, I have assiduously avoided asking how the “Dresden Files” series will end. Does Butcher ever feel constrained by the blueprint he made for himself some 30 years ago?

He demurs, but acknowledges that he has had to make changes along the way. Years ago, he reconsidered his approach to a villain after meeting a fan from the Navajo Nation. And he said he has “tried to learn more as he’s gone along” in response to criticism from readers who say his female characters lack complexity.

His experiences will be reflected in “Twelve Months,” the first “Dresden Files” tale that wasn’t in the original outline at all. Indeed, the novel is a significant departure for Butcher, whose books usually take place during one action-packed and miserable week in his P.I.’s life. This time, Dresden takes an entire year to come to grips with the emotional pain he’s endured over the course of the series.

“I write at the end of this book that peace and happiness are the same thing,” Butcher said. “Peace is happiness at rest, and happiness is peace in motion.”

“When I find myself working and writing and thinking, ‘Hey, this chapter’s going really well,’ that is happiness, you know?” he added. “And that happiness doesn’t have to be perfect to be real.”
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#77 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 21 May 2025 - 01:21 PM

I had no idea about the Suicide attempt. That's rough. Two divorces is not easy either, especially since the latter one to Kitty seemed to come out of nowhere and is murky as there was a lot of social media shenanigans with unfollowing and abrupt image deletions on her part. You can see how he landed on some of his nonsense during Covid Lockdown if he was going through depression and divorce though, so I'm going cut him more slack than I had been. It also helps explain why PEACE TALKS (overly dialogue heavy explainy) and BATTLE GROUNDS (a long string of action set-pieces with every character under the sun and not much else) didn't end up as one book with both things in it as it clearly should have been, he got into his own head....you can see how he lost his way after 2010 storywise....and I'm glad he's re-adjusting now and it sounds like TWLEVE MONTHS being NOT a part of the original plan is a good way to keep things fresh for Jim so that he can mentally make it to the end he had planned even if it ends up being different.

A good read. Thanks for posting it.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 21 May 2025 - 01:22 PM

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#78 User is offline   TheRetiredBridgeburner 

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Posted 21 May 2025 - 01:55 PM

Daniel Greene's Fantasy News pointed me at it - I rarely listen to the whole thing, but do occasionally go investigating things in the episode titles :D
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#79 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 21 May 2025 - 06:07 PM

View PostQuickTidal, on 21 May 2025 - 01:21 PM, said:

I had no idea about the Suicide attempt. That's rough. Two divorces is not easy either, especially since the latter one to Kitty seemed to come out of nowhere and is murky as there was a lot of social media shenanigans with unfollowing and abrupt image deletions on her part. You can see how he landed on some of his nonsense during Covid Lockdown if he was going through depression and divorce though, so I'm going cut him more slack than I had been. It also helps explain why PEACE TALKS (overly dialogue heavy explainy) and BATTLE GROUNDS (a long string of action set-pieces with every character under the sun and not much else) didn't end up as one book with both things in it as it clearly should have been, he got into his own head....you can see how he lost his way after 2010 storywise....and I'm glad he's re-adjusting now and it sounds like TWLEVE MONTHS being NOT a part of the original plan is a good way to keep things fresh for Jim so that he can mentally make it to the end he had planned even if it ends up being different.

A good read. Thanks for posting it.


Same same, i didn't know about most of that, interesting insight. Past interviews i've read w him usually amounted to 'grateful for my success/trying to be a cool nerd'.
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#80 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 22 May 2025 - 12:32 AM

View PostAbyss, on 21 May 2025 - 06:07 PM, said:

View PostQuickTidal, on 21 May 2025 - 01:21 PM, said:

I had no idea about the Suicide attempt. That's rough. Two divorces is not easy either, especially since the latter one to Kitty seemed to come out of nowhere and is murky as there was a lot of social media shenanigans with unfollowing and abrupt image deletions on her part. You can see how he landed on some of his nonsense during Covid Lockdown if he was going through depression and divorce though, so I'm going cut him more slack than I had been. It also helps explain why PEACE TALKS (overly dialogue heavy explainy) and BATTLE GROUNDS (a long string of action set-pieces with every character under the sun and not much else) didn't end up as one book with both things in it as it clearly should have been, he got into his own head....you can see how he lost his way after 2010 storywise....and I'm glad he's re-adjusting now and it sounds like TWLEVE MONTHS being NOT a part of the original plan is a good way to keep things fresh for Jim so that he can mentally make it to the end he had planned even if it ends up being different.

A good read. Thanks for posting it.


Same same, i didn't know about most of that, interesting insight. Past interviews i've read w him usually amounted to 'grateful for my success/trying to be a cool nerd'.


I figured the next book was farther off than early next year…so I think I’ll do a re-read of everything GHOST STORY forward to prepare.
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