[Terez]

He confessed to her that what he wants is to sit on the Iron Throne with her at his side. There's no reason for her to doubt that.

[Malankazooie]

Hey, this just occurred to me. I wonder if Arya will be reunited with Nymeria? No spoilers if you already know, kay? If it happens though... boy oh boy oh boy, ALL THE FEELS!

[TheRetiredBridgeburner]

Malankazooie, on 17 July 2017 - 10:48 PM, said:

Did any of you guys catch the not so subtle theme that emerged from the scene with Cersei and Jamie and the big painting of Westeros on the floor? And that is that this whole shebang is headed towards a battle of the Queens / women.

Sansa in the north. Yara in the west. Dany in the east. Ellaria Sand/Sand Snakes in the south. Queen of thorns centrally located. Arya floating down to Kings Landing. With Cersei in the middle of it all?

Is this a crazy theory or something you guys see as well?

I hadn't thought of it that way but I do think you're on to something there.

Loved the ep. Best premiere of a series in ages.

Dragonstone was perfect - lovely to see the return of the excellent touch of lots of score and very little dialogue to sell a scene that we saw at the end of last series.

Sansa the Sass Queen is my new favourite thing!

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

Can we talk about how dope the face of the rock wall on the Dragonstone beach was!?

[Coco with marshmallows]

Briar King, on 17 July 2017 - 11:06 PM, said:

So that has to earn a code name right? Red/Purple weddings so what should that toast be named?

well, the wine was called Arbor gold, so "The Golden Toast"?

works for me.

[Spoilsport Stonny]

That arbor gold was red as fuck. Also Lyanna Mormont was a highlight as was forgiving the Umbers and the Karstarks. Euron absolutely can capture a dragon with his Armada, provided he has the right tools. Sam scene was shit (lamao). And oh there is Jorah. He made it back west before dany. Guess not in ashai then. Hound was epic and we knew it was the family because of the before-episode montage.

What I hate is that everyone knew the Frey's we're dead almost instantly but no one knew that little fingers Vale army was on the move north last season? This stuff pulls me out of the show. Also as Preston Jacobs pointed out, it's prob pretty tough logistically to get all the Freys back to the walder after just two weeks.

Nevertheless good episode, but how come not one single soldier was left behind at Dragonstone by Stannis? Again, that shit just don't fly.

Still I'm ok with it cuz the whole thing looks awesome as fuck.

[amphibian]

Stannis went on a holy war driven by his red priest. He didn't care for Dragonstone beyond the immediate strategic value, which wasn't as good as winning everything up north.

Bad call, but I respect that move more than Sansa being a tough yet still overruled voice.

[Spoilsport Stonny]

Stannis didn't give one red fuck about the red god. His wife did. He used the religion as a way to seize the throne. If his end goal was to rule the seven kingdoms, he would have left a small force there, no matter what. It's just bad writing again. Same with Sansa. But it's all gonna not matter cuz bran is alive so he is the king.

[amphibian]

Spoilsport Stonny, on 18 July 2017 - 11:59 PM, said:

Stannis didn't give one red fuck about the red god. His wife did. He used the religion as a way to seize the throne. If his end goal was to rule the seven kingdoms, he would have left a small force there, no matter what. It's just bad writing again. Same with Sansa. But it's all gonna not matter cuz bran is alive so he is the king.

Selyse regretted the decision to offer up Shireen. Stannis remained true to his holy war of getting the throne, which was powered by the red priest/god.

[Spoilsport Stonny]

I just argue that it wasn't very holy and more about him being the rightful heir. He would use any tool to achieve it. This is a divergent character trait tho and makes a lot of sense as to why show stannis isn't the same and it affects the overall story.

[Malankazooie]

It's been awhile since I've read the books, but is not a castellan always left in charge to handle the basic upkeep and defense of a castle? Which implies a basic staff and garrison to keep the place running. That's how I remember the books anyway.

So, I too was surprised when Dany, Tyrion, et al. walked into Dragonstone to be greeted by NO ONE (whether hostile or welcoming). Maybe I've forgotten how the HBO series has gone and it was expressed that Stannis, Davos, Melisandre and Co. abaondoned the castle completely in a previous season/episode?

Anyway, about Dragonstone
* I liked the scene where Dany pulled down the drooping "Stag in a flaming Heart" banner.
* The throne looks bad ass!
* And I want to see Dragonmont. Is it still active? Or is it dormant? And will Drogon, Rhaegal and Viserion make it their home?

[Spoilsport Stonny]

One word: DINNISTY

[worry]

I think everyone who wasn't needed got burnt or fled from being burnt.

[Traveller]

Yes very unlikely in life or fantasy that an unguarded fortress would be left empty.

Only a few would be required to defend it and Stannis surely wouldn't have taken everyone with him.

(Would have been funny if the gates were locked and the French knights from The Holy Grail had been leaning over..)

This post has been edited by Traveller: 19 July 2017 - 11:20 AM

[Gorefest]

Spoilsport Stonny, on 18 July 2017 - 11:52 PM, said:

What I hate is that everyone knew the Frey's we're dead almost instantly but no one knew that little fingers Vale army was on the move north last season? This stuff pulls me out of the show. Also as Preston Jacobs pointed out, it's prob pretty tough logistically to get all the Freys back to the walder after just two weeks.

Jacobs is a bit of a sourpuss, though. He's still angry that the show overtook the books and now he cannot look all-knowing anymore. We already know that the show's internal consistency isn't as tight as the books, but the trade-off is better pacing and epic views. The problem with highlighting such issues is that it would take a lot of uninteresting filler to explain away these inconsistencies so as long as it isn't too galling I can look past it. Littlefinger is a supreme organiser and schemer plus the Vale is not easily accessible, so it is probably easier to hide or delay info on troop movements, whereas Frey's wife was deliberately left alive by Arya to get the word spread out about the Frey deaths as soon as possible. So that could explain it away. And the Freys were already back, this was the second 'party' and most of them were already there for the first one.

Quote

Nevertheless good episode, but how come not one single soldier was left behind at Dragonstone by Stannis? Again, that shit just don't fly.

They were. In the books Stannis left a steward and a small force. But in the books it wasn't Dany who sailed into Dragonstone but instead Tommen (Cersei) ordered a siege. Loras eventually captured Dragonstone after a hard and bloody battle in which Loras was badly wounded. Obviously in the TV show they cannot have Dany's triumphant entrance into Westeros be spoilt by a drawn-out bloody battle against opposition that storyline-wise wouldn't really be opposition, so they clearly chose to just leave the keep completely deserted on the premise that Stannis took everyone (including his family) to the Wall as a show of full commitment to the cause.

If we are going to be nitpicky about the show, I think a far more grating issue is how Dany can sail to Dragonstone unopposed with a big Greyjoy fleet when Euron must have sailed past that exact point shortly beforehand with an even bigger fleet to go to King's Landing. After all, it is a pretty narrow seamouth with Dragonstone practically plugging the hole. Which begs the questions: why didn't Euron simply campture/plunder Dragonstone on the way, it being in such a strategic position, and why did he not see or engage with Dany's fleet? There is no way he can have gotten to King's Landing without at least spotting the fleet.

Quote

Still I'm ok with it cuz the whole thing looks awesome as fuck.

That it did. That it did

[Gorefest]

Spoilsport Stonny, on 19 July 2017 - 12:33 AM, said:

I just argue that it wasn't very holy and more about him being the rightful heir. He would use any tool to achieve it. This is a divergent character trait tho and makes a lot of sense as to why show stannis isn't the same and it affects the overall story.

The TV show badly dropped the ball on Stannis, just as they did on Dorne. I'm clinging to the hope that book Stannis will survive the battle and actually play a role in future events, because book Stannis is a very interesting character. TV Stannis makes no sense and is terribly written. I guess he just got in the way of their perceived end game.

[Tattersail_]

I enjoyed the episode and I am glad to be back in Westeros

[Khellendros]

Gorefest, on 19 July 2017 - 09:23 AM, said:

If we are going to be nitpicky about the show, I think a far more grating issue is how Dany can sail to Dragonstone unopposed with a big Greyjoy fleet when Euron must have sailed past that exact point shortly beforehand with an even bigger fleet to go to King's Landing. After all, it is a pretty narrow seamouth with Dragonstone practically plugging the hole. Which begs the questions: why didn't Euron simply campture/plunder Dragonstone on the way, it being in such a strategic position, and why did he not see or engage with Dany's fleet? There is no way he can have gotten to King's Landing without at least spotting the fleet.

Do they, though. I mean, aren't the Iron Islands on the opposite side of the continent to Dragonstone? Euron sailing anti-clockwise around Westeros could miss Dany's fleet. Plus I think you have to take it as given that not everything in the episode is happening at the same time. Although we got the scene between Cersei and Jaime and then immediately after that Euron arrives, it could just as easily be that Cersei and Jaime talk, then there's a significant gap waiting for Euron, during which Dany arrives at Dragonstone.

Quote

"You have to be smarter than Dad, smarter than Robb. They made stupid mistakes and ended up beheaded."

Except of course the mistake Robb made was doing exactly what Sansa said Jon should do - namely banishing the Karstarks, which led to Robb losing half his army

[Gorefest]

Khellendros, on 19 July 2017 - 03:32 PM, said:

Do they, though. I mean, aren't the Iron Islands on the opposite side of the continent to Dragonstone? Euron sailing anti-clockwise around Westeros could miss Dany's fleet.

Euron is coming from the south. Dany is coming from the south-east. On the open sea one can see for miles. There is no way two such major armadas can miss each other completely.

Quote

Plus I think you have to take it as given that not everything in the episode is happening at the same time. Although we got the scene between Cersei and Jaime and then immediately after that Euron arrives, it could just as easily be that Cersei and Jaime talk, then there's a significant gap waiting for Euron, during which Dany arrives at Dragonstone.

That significant gap should be weeks then, because days isn't enough to prevent an encounter. And weeks apart those events are not if you consider all the other stuff going on in the rest of the episode. But I guess if you want you could reason it away, in which case it lines up with my earlier remark to Stonny about the Vale army movements going unseen.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 19 July 2017 - 03:43 PM

[Nevyn]

Khellendros, on 19 July 2017 - 03:32 PM, said:

Except of course the mistake Robb made was doing exactly what Sansa said Jon should do - namely banishing the Karstarks, which led to Robb losing half his army

That was not the only Robb mistake. And Robb didn't die because of the size of his army.