[Slow Ben]

But to be fair, between this and Rings of Power my excite o meter for tv fantasy is pretty friggin low.

[Cyphon]

Come on Slow Debbie, get with Abyss on the hype train.

[Slow Ben]

Cyphon, on 20 July 2023 - 06:53 PM, said:

Come on Slow Debbie, get with Abyss on the hype train.

I mean, Im obviously gonna watch it, but my hype remains low.

[Cause]

It does look better, Ill be disappointed if they abandon the Ishmael plot. I Assume that women is lanfear so they are using the forsaken.

Season 1 mostly left me dissapointed but maybe they will redeam themselves. I think it will be key to accept its not a faithful adaption though. Despite mat being recast (at least I thought he was) there seems to be none of his plotpoints in the trailer?

The great hunt is for me one of the best books in WOT, I hope season 2 delivers.

[Macros]

The hunt for Faile resting bitch face must have been an epic casting quest

This post has been edited by Macros: 24 July 2023 - 10:24 PM

[TheRetiredBridgeburner]

Macros, on 24 July 2023 - 10:23 PM, said:

The hunt for Faile resting bitch face must have been an epic casting quest

I'm currently on book 7 in earbook form.... I forgot how much this was a thing, and how irritating she is. Some poor actress has quite the thankless task!

Cause, on 24 July 2023 - 09:15 PM, said:

It does look better, Ill be disappointed if they abandon the Ishmael plot. I Assume that women is lanfear so they are using the forsaken.

My expectation is that they'll use the Forsaken, but due to the limitations of fitting this into a potential eight series we won't get all thirteen, and they'll do some doubling/tripling up of who does what. I doubt just the Forsaken will be cut that way either.

My thoughts on that so far, based on what we've seen in the first series and the trailer (spoilers, all books):

Spoiler

I think Logain (as well as his own character stuff) is going to take the place of Asmodean - in the sense of becoming Rand's teacher, and then we won't get Asmodean at all, or his "mysterious" death that I could not even pretend to care about. They cast a really interesting actor in Alvaro Morte and spent a good chunk of time on him in episode 4, so he's my best bet for an expanded role combining characters. I CANNOT WAIT to see him play out his healing with Nynaeve, he did such a great job on the gentling and aftermath.

I've seen suggestions of Logain combining with Mazrim Taim but I'm pretty sure I saw someone else cast as Taim ages ago, though now can't find it, and I don't think it makes as much sense given the set up they gave Logain. Alternatively I think we're likely to get Taim as both himself and in place of one or more of the Forsaken. Cast well he has the potential to be a lot more interesting as an adversary than most of the Forsaken are, so I think there's a strong chance they'll go down that route instead.

We know we've got Ishamael and Lanfear. One of the reasons given for smushing together books 2 and 3 is that they both end with Rand in confrontation with Ishamael, so there's no need to do that bit twice. Can't disagree.

Pulling names out of a hat I'd go Sammael/Rahvin, Demandred, Moghedien and then one of Graendal/Semirhage/Mesaana, but as a mash up of all three of them. My memory of the later books isn't brilliant but I seem to remember Mesaana being hidden in the White Tower all along was an absolute damp squib of a plot that had very little pay off for the amount of time it was hanging around. I don't really remember much about Semirhage other than that she's the one that likes torturing people - does she do anything significant plot wise?

Outside the Forsaken, Liandrin has too much set up and far too good an actress to only be playing Liandrin's story, which becomes a whiny snooze fest of not a lot by the end. I think there's been confirmation from the show runner that we're getting Elaida, so my best guess would be she's going to be combined with Alviarin? I'd love to see what Kate Fleetwood could do with being Elaida's power behind the Seat manipulator.

Alanna is probably going to take the place of a bunch of Aes Sedai too - again, too much set up for a character that does one significant thing (which they may or may not keep) and then largely disappears until the last book, and another interesting actress we've spent time with.

This is also possibly a little bit wishful in that I enjoyed her and her Warders (particularly the sassy blonde one) and would be up for seeing more of them. Given they took the time in the Stepin story to set up Alanna being willing to take him as a Warder if he wished, perhaps she'll get the helping Lan plot (presuming we lose Moiraine in some capacity, though I'm not sure we will.)

When we get there I doubt we'll get all the individual Maidens and Wise Ones either - they seem like an obvious group to cut down to a few key characters and no more.

This post has been edited by TheRetiredBridgeburner: 25 July 2023 - 09:03 AM

[Tsundoku]

Please, please, please cut the absolute bejeezus out of the legions of generic Aes Sedai/Sewing Circle/Wise Ones/various other bitch faces, plus all the nobles and fuck me this dramatis personae is longer than most trilogies these days ...

[TheRetiredBridgeburner]

Watched the first episode and most of the second (the first three are available).

First ep is a nice slow burn setting up where the main characters are and who they're with. Second one also positive so far - I'll probably catch the rest over the weekend.

Overall it looks a ton better than the first series, the costumes have all improved and the people all look like they're part of the environment now. Sets so far also look great.

Further first impressions/thoughts below (spoilers for TV series and books):

Spoiler

1. Verin, Verin, VERIN. Superb bit of casting, love her already. Adeleas feels a bit heavy handed but fine (and I assume Verin is now the stand in for Vandene)

2. I think I can say with almost certainty we're not going to lose Moiraine as we do in the books, and that her no longer being able to touch the One Power is going to be the substitute story line. Lan dropped the hint about needing eight sisters to still someone in conversation, and she dismisses it out of hand. The line is surely there for a reason though, so I stand by my theory of tied off shield rather than stilled. The parting with Lan where she pushes him away was COLD AS FUCK though. Alanna is clearly getting the role of Lan's caretaker too, I feel like they're perhaps going to fast track he and Nynaeve getting back together. It all lends weight to why they spent the time on Stepin that they did (which I liked anyway, though I understand plenty of people whinged).

3. Liandrin gets more and more surprising. I feel like they're potentially setting up a Darkfriend for the audience to potentially sympathise with or feel conflicted about with her - possibly to add more weight to the eventual reveal of Verin? To be honest I don't care what they do with her as long as it means more Kate Fleetwood on screen, she's wonderful. Is Nynaeve discovering the man she's trying to help going to be the reason she betrays them to the Seanchan?

4. Uno is great. Please can we have more Uno, and more everyone taking the piss out of Uno.

5. YAY Elyas at last. Hasn't had too much interaction with Perrin so far, but it's good to have him here and I liked the way they showed the wolf visions at the little farm with the dead fade. And Elyas having no time for Perrin's "this is your fault" spiel was fun.

6. Don't make me like Elayne, TV folks. Please don't. It's going to make my abiding eye rolling at her existence in the books harder. But I do like the actress so far and she has great chemistry with Egwene.

7. Not the set up I expected for Rand and Selene, but I assume we'll get a bit of flashback as to how they met. Very unexpected turn of Rand working in the asylum (or am I just blanking on that from the books?). Clearly going to be how he meets Logain, given that nod about "more famous residents" from the World's Most Punchable Guard. Loved the interaction between Rand and the former blademaster, I do enjoy that the show spends time on little things like that.

8. Min and Mat is a great pairing. New Mat looks very good already.

9. Having the actor who played Sihtric in The Last Kingdom in the Shienaran gang, and looking pretty similar to his Sihtric look at first glance, is throwing me out because I can hear him bantering with Finan in my head and I keep half expecting him to break out in shenanigans. Ho hum.

This post has been edited by TheRetiredBridgeburner: 01 September 2023 - 10:26 AM

[QuickTidal]

TheRetiredBridgeburner, on 01 September 2023 - 10:21 AM, said:

Watched the first episode and most of the second (the first three are available).

First ep is a nice slow burn setting up where the main characters are and who they're with. Second one also positive so far - I'll probably catch the rest over the weekend.

Overall it looks a ton better than the first series, the costumes have all improved and the people all look like they're part of the environment now. Sets so far also look great.

Further first impressions/thoughts below (spoilers for TV series and books):

Spoiler

1. Verin, Verin, VERIN. Superb bit of casting, love her already. Adeleas feels a bit heavy handed but fine (and I assume Verin is now the stand in for Vandene)

2. I think I can say with almost certainty we're not going to lose Moiraine as we do in the books, and that her no longer being able to touch the One Power is going to be the substitute story line. Lan dropped the hint about needing eight sisters to still someone in conversation, and she dismisses it out of hand. The line is surely there for a reason though, so I stand by my theory of tied off shield rather than stilled. The parting with Lan where she pushes him away was COLD AS FUCK though. Alanna is clearly getting the role of Lan's caretaker too, I feel like they're perhaps going to fast track he and Nynaeve getting back together. It all lends weight to why they spent the time on Stepin that they did (which I liked anyway, though I understand plenty of people whinged).

3. Liandrin gets more and more surprising. I feel like they're potentially setting up a Darkfriend for the audience to potentially sympathise with or feel conflicted about with her - possibly to add more weight to the eventual reveal of Verin? To be honest I don't care what they do with her as long as it means more Kate Fleetwood on screen, she's wonderful. Is Nynaeve discovering the man she's trying to help going to be the reason she betrays them to the Seanchan?

4. Uno is great. Please can we have more Uno, and more everyone taking the piss out of Uno.

5. YAY Elyas at last. Hasn't had too much interaction with Perrin so far, but it's good to have him here and I liked the way they showed the wolf visions at the little farm with the dead fade. And Elyas having no time for Perrin's "this is your fault" spiel was fun.

6. Don't make me like Elayne, TV folks. Please don't. It's going to make my abiding eye rolling at her existence in the books harder. But I do like the actress so far and she has great chemistry with Egwene.

7. Not the set up I expected for Rand and Selene, but I assume we'll get a bit of flashback as to how they met. Very unexpected turn of Rand working in the asylum (or am I just blanking on that from the books?). Clearly going to be how he meets Logain, given that nod about "more famous residents" from the World's Most Punchable Guard. Loved the interaction between Rand and the former blademaster, I do enjoy that the show spends time on little things like that.

8. Min and Mat is a great pairing. New Mat looks very good already.

9. Having the actor who played Sihtric in The Last Kingdom in the Shienaran gang, and looking pretty similar to his Sihtric look at first glance, is throwing me out because I can hear him bantering with Finan in my head and I keep half expecting him to break out in shenanigans. Ho hum.

Have not watched yet (we were into ONE PIECE live aciuton last night), but I'll chime in when I do! Excited!

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

Watched the first episode and a half.

- Some really nice scenery.

- Could be a coincidence but I found myself yawning a lot and thinking about doing something else. Before this I finished two series that were mostly pretty meh in the great balance of things, but they seemed to hold my attention much better than this.

- Director seems overly fond of this formula: long drawn-out shot of character doing something boring while having a neutral facial expression... and then they

Spoiler

have a facial expression that's mildly expressive!

Usually I have a high tolerance for this sort of thing, but they could at least do a better job with the score, or add some internal monologue.... Seems like they're stretching for prestige drama-ish but it's a leap that falls very flat. Even with Rosamund Pike.

- Some of the SFX are still bad---for example

Spoiler

the creature---Trolloc?---right near the beginning.

- Presumably phrases like 'taking the piss' [without 'out of'] and other iirc relatively modern Britishisms aren't in RJ's dialogue? It was a bit jarring at first, and it seems like a very odd choice (are the screenwriters from the UK?), though I don't mind.

- There's a fight scene where it's so hard to see what's happening it's even worse than the GoT episode so many people were complaining about. And unlike that GoT episode, it wasn't done very well. And it dragged on too long. There was one moment I liked a bit where

Spoiler

it looks like Moirane's magic might be coming back, but it's a fake out.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

TheRetiredBridgeburner, on 01 September 2023 - 10:21 AM, said:

Watched the first episode and most of the second (the first three are available).

First ep is a nice slow burn setting up where the main characters are and who they're with. Second one also positive so far - I'll probably catch the rest over the weekend.

Overall it looks a ton better than the first series, the costumes have all improved and the people all look like they're part of the environment now. Sets so far also look great.

Further first impressions/thoughts below (spoilers for TV series and books):

Spoiler

1. Verin, Verin, VERIN. Superb bit of casting, love her already. Adeleas feels a bit heavy handed but fine (and I assume Verin is now the stand in for Vandene)

2. I think I can say with almost certainty we're not going to lose Moiraine as we do in the books, and that her no longer being able to touch the One Power is going to be the substitute story line. Lan dropped the hint about needing eight sisters to still someone in conversation, and she dismisses it out of hand. The line is surely there for a reason though, so I stand by my theory of tied off shield rather than stilled. The parting with Lan where she pushes him away was COLD AS FUCK though. Alanna is clearly getting the role of Lan's caretaker too, I feel like they're perhaps going to fast track he and Nynaeve getting back together. It all lends weight to why they spent the time on Stepin that they did (which I liked anyway, though I understand plenty of people whinged).

3. Liandrin gets more and more surprising. I feel like they're potentially setting up a Darkfriend for the audience to potentially sympathise with or feel conflicted about with her - possibly to add more weight to the eventual reveal of Verin? To be honest I don't care what they do with her as long as it means more Kate Fleetwood on screen, she's wonderful. Is Nynaeve discovering the man she's trying to help going to be the reason she betrays them to the Seanchan?

4. Uno is great. Please can we have more Uno, and more everyone taking the piss out of Uno.

5. YAY Elyas at last. Hasn't had too much interaction with Perrin so far, but it's good to have him here and I liked the way they showed the wolf visions at the little farm with the dead fade. And Elyas having no time for Perrin's "this is your fault" spiel was fun.

6. Don't make me like Elayne, TV folks. Please don't. It's going to make my abiding eye rolling at her existence in the books harder. But I do like the actress so far and she has great chemistry with Egwene.

7. Not the set up I expected for Rand and Selene, but I assume we'll get a bit of flashback as to how they met. Very unexpected turn of Rand working in the asylum (or am I just blanking on that from the books?). Clearly going to be how he meets Logain, given that nod about "more famous residents" from the World's Most Punchable Guard. Loved the interaction between Rand and the former blademaster, I do enjoy that the show spends time on little things like that.

8. Min and Mat is a great pairing. New Mat looks very good already.

9. Having the actor who played Sihtric in The Last Kingdom in the Shienaran gang, and looking pretty similar to his Sihtric look at first glance, is throwing me out because I can hear him bantering with Finan in my head and I keep half expecting him to break out in shenanigans. Ho hum.

I agree that old lady and dreadlocks guy were good, and

Spoiler

princess new girl

was charming.

Horseback muscles guy might look the part, but his line delivery seemed a bit off---awkward, overly forced, unrealistic.

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 02 September 2023 - 11:28 PM

[the broken]

Big step up from Season 1

Spoiler

I find it interesting academically, because I want to see how the writers handle the difficult situation they are in.

Since Mat is already healed from the dagger, moving to his book 3 plot is probably the best fix they have for that. The main thing left is whether and how he blows the horn. I literally want to see where he goes from here, Toman Head or Tear. Ditto Rand.

Moving Rand to Cairhien, probably also a good move.

And Perrin goes on the hunt, the girls go to the Tower. All neat ways of getting back on track. Elyas instead of Hurin is a good way of getting him back in when they need him.

Liandrin has an interesting arc and the actress is good. Realising she had been accidentally leaving her son in pain for years, that one hurt.

Adaptation issues

They established the effects of a severed Warder bond in Season 1 with Steppin, why is Lan not suffering from it?

Fain doesn't seem to be rebelling against the Dark One, so who crucified the Fade and why?

What was Moiraine threatening in Season 1? Why would the red ajah do to one of their members' bedbound son and why?

Letting Nynaeve break out of the arches like that is a bad move, because it is world shattering. The Aes Sedai have been using the ter'angeal wrong for 3,000 years, that should shake the tower to its foundations. How many other women did they give up on that could have been saved? Having your characters do the impossible too often is dangerous, because the next time they have an impossible challenge, you risk the audience going 'eh, it's probably as impossible as the last time, no big deal.'

Whoever Perrin's postman is is very dedicated.

[TheRetiredBridgeburner]

Caught up.

My comment about wanting more of a given character aged extremely badly!

Spoiler

I know Nynaeve struggled to leave the arches the third time in the books, but I agree with the broken in that it seems to break what's been established about their nature - especially when they kept saying the way back would come but once and then it appears twice.

However, I'll forgive it because what a blazing performance from Zoe Robins. That scream as she realises her arms are empty was genuinely heart wrenching. What an incredible bit of casting she was - every time she has to do extremes of emotion she delivers and then some.

Also the Seanchan are bad. Very bad. Who knew? joking aside I like them so far, aside from being a little unsure about the change from leash to gag. I guess a physical leash would become a pain to act with if they've got to be able to move around a lot, but the look is just a bit bizarre. I'm sure I'll adjust though, it's not that big a thing.

This post has been edited by TheRetiredBridgeburner: 05 September 2023 - 09:27 AM

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

Perhaps they're making

Spoiler

Elayne

likable because they're setting up a

Spoiler

hook-up between her and Egwene and/or Aviendha? Would make love triangles (pentagram?) with Rand more interesting. Why not toss in Perrin too? One big happy orgiastic polycule....

[Abyss]

Azath Vitr (D, on 05 September 2023 - 05:26 PM, said:

Perhaps they're making

Spoiler

Elayne

likable because they're setting up a

Spoiler

hook-up between her and Egwene and/or Aviendha? Would make love triangles (pentagram?) with Rand more interesting. Why not toss in Perrin too? One big happy orgiastic polycule....

I would bet cash on Amazon not having the guts to go ahead w the Rand+3 thing.

[QuickTidal]

Watched episode 1 (loved it!) and my gods, the budget increase is PALPABLE even in the matte painting backdrops...the city of Tar Valon beyond the tower in that one shot in episode 1 was GORGEOUS.

Knowing that behind the scenes viewership of WOT stayed mostly the same throughout the whole run of eps, VS the significant drop-off from ep 1 of ROP to Ep 8 had to have figured into budget discussions at Amazon...like if things keep as they are, I can see WOT siphoning off more budget from ROP than the other way around.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

Abyss, on 05 September 2023 - 06:11 PM, said:

Azath Vitr (D, on 05 September 2023 - 05:26 PM, said:

Perhaps they're making

Spoiler

Elayne

likable because they're setting up a

Spoiler

hook-up between her and Egwene and/or Aviendha? Would make love triangles (pentagram?) with Rand more interesting. Why not toss in Perrin too? One big happy orgiastic polycule....

I would bet cash on Amazon not having the guts to go ahead w the Rand+3 thing.

Wonder if the Mormon showrunners of the Rings of Power will introduce gratuitous harems....

They've already (in tWoT, season 2 episode 1 iirc)

Spoiler

very strongly implied that two of the warders are in a polycule with one of the Aes Sedai---the warders are asked why they came (... to the White Tower) and one says he fell in love with a warder and iirc his body language indicates it's the other warder, who in turn says he fell in love with an Aes Sedai, and warder number one says something like 'You always make me feel like the third wheel'

(is that the one in the front?...). And I think the same episode had a pretty

Spoiler

raunchy speech encouraging Egwene to take another sex partner, also I think the same episode where she's introduced to Elayne and they have nice chemistry.

[Cause]

I remember this forum discussing how the plots of the books could be adapted for tv and no one came close to this mess. I’m enjoying it more than season 1 but the deviation is massive.

Also the weird add that the flows of power have to be drawn from the elements nearby is a strange thing to add.

Spoiler

I see some of what they are doing, some of the changes seem unnecessary and won’t serve a later purpose. Not sure yet but it also looks like Perrin and may are being taken to tommen head for Rand to have to rescue rather than Egwene. Still time for that to happen though.

Edit: okay it did happen

Also wierd take on lan fear.

This post has been edited by Cause: 08 September 2023 - 10:14 AM

[TheRetiredBridgeburner]

Really enjoyed episode 4.

Spoiler

After checking it turns out I'm wrong and Nynaeve missed the doorway in her Accepted test in the book too.

Lanfear - the actress is brilliant and the build up was great, but I felt like the end with Moiraine arriving was a bit rushed. This is something I've noticed the series does, they pace the action very inconsistently. When you think of how good the build to the end of episode 4 in the first series was, they've proved they can build and pace really well. They just don't always manage it, and I felt like this was a little off. Can't wait to see fully nuts Lanfear - there were glimmers in her reaction when Rand says he loves her.

HOPPER. Yay! Nothing more to say really, just yay!

Alanna is definitely getting the Myrelle job. I know people who whinge about any tiny change are just primed for that sort of thing, but this is a prime example of where I cannot believe anyone could really prefer the book version. Book Alanna is a whiny mess who commits the in-universe mental equivalent of rape and doesn't seem to have any understanding or remorse for it. Show Alanna is vastly more interesting and her dynamic with her warders is great. I asked for more of the sassy blonde one before the series started and I'm getting it. Happy days. Enjoyed both scenes between the warders and Lan.

I've said before I think Kate Fleetwood is a wonderful actress - but again the jump from her lovely scene with Nynaeve in the arch chamber to betraying them at the end felt a bit too rushed. Could be personal preference but that beat didn't land very well for me. Kate Fleetwood and Zoe Robins nailed their scene together though, beautiful bit of writing and acting - even with the very obvious manipulation.

Mat and Min are a great double act, and I enjoy the evidence were seeing of how many people Liandrin has her claws in.

Ishy messing with EVERYONE is wonderful. Great actor, and I'm glad we're getting that side of Ishamael. It's crucial and I'm glad they aren't overlooking it.

This post has been edited by TheRetiredBridgeburner: 08 September 2023 - 10:43 AM

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

Didn't yawn at all during the second 90 minutes. Much better pacing (and plotting...). Some good acting by Zoe Robins. Liked the

Spoiler

Seanchan

.

Still not great, and some lines didn't quite hit the mark (not sure how much of that is the actors or the writing), but pretty good overall.

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 09 September 2023 - 09:07 PM