[Abyss]

Tsundoku, on 25 January 2022 - 09:46 PM, said:

Abyss, on 25 January 2022 - 08:08 PM, said:

Tsundoku, on 25 January 2022 - 08:54 AM, said:

... I recall getting the 4th one - The Adversary - as a present from some relative back in the 80s.
Well, I read it and enjoyed it but had NFI what was going on. ...

You read bk 4... first... ok wow ... that's like starting Malazan with DUST OF DREAMS.

Yeah pretty much. The relative knew I was into SFF so they bought me a book that looked like it was SFF ...
But I'm quite grateful to them. It showed you could make more complicated concepts readable and entertaining.
Remember back in the 80s SFF was pretty much Asimov, Heinlein and Clarke. Especially in regional Australia (western NSW).
OK, ok we also had some stuff from CJ Cherryh, Andre Norton, Frank Herbert, but I'm really struggling to come up with others. David Brin, Greg Benford, Greg Bear et al were starting to emerge in the later half of the 80s as a sort of newer wave.
While there's some full-on stuff going on in some of their books, Exiles was ... different. Can't exactly explain why.

EXILES fuzzed the sf to fantasy line in a way almost no one else was doing at the time... Cherryh did it but with a heavy lit bend, SIlverberg did but leaned hard towards sf, and Mooorcock was doing it but with all the drugs... May just... made it work.

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All I know is after reading the full series, when Intervention came out in 88(?) it was a complete surprise to me and I just went "Yoink!".

I was absolutely certain INTERVENTION had already been written and I had started the story in the middle because the level of trust May puts on the reader to figure out what happened before is SE level before SE was SE.

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My only caveat is that it IS a product of the 80s so it's a little bit pulpy at times and there's zero modern sensitivities. Don't expect some sort of modern deep philosophical brooding, self-castigation or politics. And Marc Remillard is one of my all-time favourite characters.

May's 'future' that sets the stage for the Pliocene is fairly modern and she stayed away from a lot of misogyny and racism one might otherwise expect. Occasionally a character drops 'groovy' into a sentence but that's about it

Rermillard is great but there are a pile of glorious characters in this series.

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Man, how did we find anything out before the internet? 20 year old encyclopaedias and actual mailing lists.

Cool covers.

[Tsundoku]

Abyss, on 26 January 2022 - 02:33 AM, said:

May's 'future' that sets the stage for the Pliocene is fairly modern and she stayed away from a lot of misogyny and racism one might otherwise expect. Occasionally a character drops 'groovy' into a sentence but that's about it

Point.

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Remillard is great but there are a pile of glorious characters in this series.

True, Felice, Aiken Drum, Mon Onc' Rogi, Denis, Jack the Bodiless, Dorothea MacDonald, Culluket the interrogator, even Alex Manion etc etc etc.
Hell, even Marcel la Plume is interesting, and he is why I always wanted a Maine Coon cat.

Here is a pretty fair summary page of the entire series, but ALL THE SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!!

https://julianmay.blogspot.com/

This post has been edited by Tsundoku: 26 January 2022 - 06:33 AM

[Maark Abbott]

Abyss, on 25 January 2022 - 04:09 AM, said:

Abyss, on 04 January 2022 - 04:15 AM, said:

Aptorian, on 01 January 2022 - 12:16 PM, said:

Is there any fantasy out there that takes place in a golden age of magic and technology?

It seems like all the fantasy books I read are always placed in a setting after the great empire collapsed, magic was outlawed and the gods died. Or something to that effect.

Are there any authors writing the equivalent of hard fantasy or Utopian fiction, where there's an abundance of magic power, golden gods and an endless surplus?

NK Jemisin's INHERITANCE TRILOGY.

Just remembered another one... technically it's closer to sf than fantasy, but very deliberately exists where the distinction is meaningless... i can't explain that without major spoilers but it's absolutely a thing and it's also at times brilliant... Julian May's SAGA OF THE PLIOCENE EXILE. 4 books, medium length, worth a look. In the future the world is perfect, but people who don't love the perfection are given the option of voluntary exile back in time a few million years, but what was supposed to be a rougher, less sophisticated paradise has become someone else's idea of perfection.


It's followed by another (also very good) five books if you love it but those are separate, PLIOCENE is absolutely self-contained.

TLDR: Reject modernity, return to monke

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

...Peter Newman's second series? I think it's called The Deathless. I enjoyed his first series a lot.

This post has been edited by Whisperzzzzzzz: 10 February 2022 - 04:43 PM

[Chance]

Whisperzzzzzzz, on 10 February 2022 - 04:43 PM, said:

...Peter Newman's second series? I think it's called The Deathless. I enjoyed his first series a lot.

Tried to start it a few times, didn't grip me at all. Might try it again but remember some really really unsympathetic pow character, who due to the way immortality work in universe are unquestionably evil regardless of their motivations. Made for hard going

This post has been edited by Chance: 10 February 2022 - 08:16 PM

[Abyss]

Miles Cameron's TRAITOR SON CYCLE....
Books 1-4 in earbook, $24CDN.




Yea or nay?

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 25 April 2022 - 05:02 PM, said:

Miles Cameron's TRAITOR SON CYCLE....
Books 1-4 in earbook, $24CDN.




Yea or nay?

Many here seem to enjoy it I think?

I bonded off it once, but it wasn't "not good" either just not the right time for it was my feeling at the time. I recall the word "kirtle" will come up more than it will ever in your life anywhere else.

[Briar King]

War and Peace any good?

[Tsundoku]

I have tried numerous times and never got any further than around page 150. Boring as batshit. Just a bunch of upper-crust Russians speaking French (many "bon mots" or whatever they're called left untranslated in my old edition, completely defeating the purpose of having an English version) to each other at boring soirees.

Maybe I need to get a fully translated version. Maybe I need to push past the WTF stuff to get to the good stuff which I am assured is later on (I guess a Malazan fan should be able to). Couldn't be bothered, did not hold my interest at all.

[Briar King]

Was trying to find a public domain title to listen to on YouTube.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

Tsundoku, on 14 August 2022 - 07:49 AM, said:

I have tried numerous times and never got any further than around page 150. Boring as batshit. Just a bunch of upper-crust Russians speaking French (many "bon mots" or whatever they're called left untranslated in my old edition, completely defeating the purpose of having an English version) to each other at boring soirees.

Maybe I need to get a fully translated version. Maybe I need to push past the WTF stuff to get to the good stuff which I am assured is later on (I guess a Malazan fan should be able to). Couldn't be bothered, did not hold my interest at all.

My grandfather was supposedly forced to type it out by hand in graduate school iirc because his spelling was terrible.

They also forced them to demonstrate proficiency in three languages (other than English) for a PhD in physics....

But his Russian was pretty good, and he apparently read at least most of the great Russian novels in the original. Applied to immigrate to the USSR (and move his family there) during WWII. Thankfully they assumed he was a spy and said no. Suffice it to say he later realized he was terribly wrong about Stalin and didn't talk about it much by the time I was born.

Aside from some short stories and poetry I haven't read much Russian literature---have also been thinking of starting on some audiobooks. War and Peace might make a good bedtime story if it's boring. But my to-read pile is already very large... OTOH I could start doing two books at a time. One while pacing, and one while trying to fall asleep (without being too tempted to keep listening...).

[Gwynn ap Nudd]

Cancelled, on 14 August 2022 - 06:07 PM, said:

Was trying to find a public domain title to listen to on YouTube.

https://www.youtube....rt=p&shelf_id=0

No idea the quality, but it looks like this channel has a few interesting titles, including one by Lovecraft if that interests you. I expect some, like Gulliver's Travels, would be difficult to listen to unless they somehow include the footnotes clarifying Olde English terms. Wonder if I would still like the Three Musketeers.

It's been a long time since I read any Russian literature. From way back then, I remember most references about Tolstoy saying Anna Karenina was a better story and more accessible than War and Peace. I have read that, but not War and Peace. It was slow, but interesting enough I finished it. I enjoyed The Brothers Karamazov by Fyodor Dostoevsky much more.

Edit: Actually, if Lovecraft interests you, you can find most of his works on YouTube.

This post has been edited by Gwynn ap Nudd: 15 August 2022 - 05:52 AM

[Briar King]

Oh yeah I’ve listened to a few over last few months. Solid shit that.

[Briar King]

I made it 15 minutes into War and Peace before realizing I was also net surfing on the laptop after about the 2 minutes mark. Will have to start over if I get back in.

[ContrarianMalazanReader]

What is the general consensus on Robert A. Heinlein? I know he's a very influential sci-fi author, but I also know he's got his detractors as he's perceived as being pro-war, which according to what I've read and seen, is why the 1997 movie Starship Troopers outright satirises the book rather than being a faithful adaptation, as Paul Verhoeven stated that he started reading the book but couldn't finish it because he found it depressing.

This post has been edited by ContrarianMalazanReader: 29 August 2022 - 06:59 AM

[Tsundoku]

Never read Starship Troopers, but enjoyed Friday, Job, Stranger in a Strange Land, Red Planet, Citizen of the Galaxy, Farmer in the Sky and The Number of the Beast.

Admittedly the earlier books are far simpler and more accessible than the later ones where he goes all out with his own particular philosophies.
Stranger in a Strange Land in particular was very difficult for the 18 or 20 year old me to ... uhhh ... grok.

I never picked up on any pro-war stuff in those but I read his stuff in my late teens to early 20s so wasn't particularly aware of themes etc back then, more straight up story.
I guess that hasn't really changed, I'm still a bit dense.

[amphibian]

ContrarianMalazanReader, on 29 August 2022 - 06:58 AM, said:

What is the general consensus on Robert A. Heinlein? I know he's a very influential sci-fi author, but I also know he's got his detractors as he's perceived as being pro-war, which according to what I've read and seen, is why the 1997 movie Starship Troopers outright satirises the book rather than being a faithful adaptation, as Paul Verhoeven stated that he started reading the book but couldn't finish it because he found it depressing.

The "detractors" are basically people who point out that he got incredibly weird about jamming incest, anti-liberal governments, Marty and Mary Sue (perfect) libertarian protagonists into pretty much every story past a certain point in his life. He was definitely someone who believed that a smart person with a gun should pretty much get to do whatever they wanted.

At this point, I don't think he's really worth doing a deep dive for. Read Starship Troopers and maybe The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress or Stranger in a Strange Land and leave the rest to the scrap heap of history.

[Tiste Simeon]

amphibian, on 29 August 2022 - 12:28 PM, said:

The "detractors" are basically people who point out that he got incredibly weird about jamming incest, anti-liberal governments, Marty and Mary Sue (perfect) libertarian protagonists into pretty much every story past a certain point in his life. He was definitely someone who believed that a smart person with a gun should pretty much get to do whatever they wanted.

The perfect Republican!

[JPK]

amphibian, on 29 August 2022 - 12:28 PM, said:

At this point, I don't think he's really worth doing a deep dive for. Read Starship Troopers and maybe The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress or Stranger in a Strange Land and leave the rest to the scrap heap of history.

I completely agree with Amph on those three works being the ones worth looking at but would say that the first two, Starship Troopers and The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, are the two actually good books while Stranger in a Strange Land is an interesting blend of being generally well written but leaning into the questionable morals that define his later works.

As an alternative for an author with string insight to war and at times nearly phophetic takes on social commentary I would suggest Kurt Vonnegut instead.

[amphibian]

Comparing Heinlein to let's say Poul Anderson (a contemporary in field and in time) really leaves Heinlein wanting in terms of writing quality. The Ensign Flandry books are just so much more fun romances/political intrigues than what Heinlein put out.

It's goofily cool that Heinlein's likely greatest legacy is going to be the Starship Troopers movie - which I bet he'd hate. That movie is so good at what it does.