[Tattersail_]

When Rand goes through Rhuidean he sees the Aiel past through his ancestors but he is the dragon born again how can he see through the eyes of aiel who followed the dragon?

[Terez]

Tattersail, on 30 March 2012 - 01:40 PM, said:

When Rand goes through Rhuidean he sees the Aiel past through his ancestors but he is the dragon born again how can he see through the eyes of aiel who followed the dragon?

I'm not sure what the problem is? All of the Aiel see through the eyes of their ancestors, including Rand. Also, they didn't actually follow the Dragon. That was a rumor that somehow got started, probably by Coumin himself, before everyone learned what happened to Lews Therin and the Hundred Companions. He was ashamed that Charn was telling people that Lanfear hadn't always been evil, and Charn was killed for precisely that reason. Some idiot Citizen thought that was a good excuse to kill him, anyway. And Coumin wished that Charn would tell people instead that they had served the great leader Lews Therin. (In truth, the Aiel served both, along with anyone else who was Aes Sedai.) By the time Coumin's son Jonai came around, the Aiel were rather upset about the fact that people called them the People of the Dragon. Of course, all that is backwards, so it's somewhat hard to pick up on. A few quotes:

TSR 26 - The Dedicated said:

Charn made his way down the side of the wide, crowded street beneath the spreading chora trees, their trefoil leaves spreading peace and contentment in the shadows of silvery buildings that touched the sky. A city without choras would seem bleak as wilderness. Jo-cars hummed quietly down the street, and a great white sho-wing darted across the sky, carrying citizens to Comelle or Tzora or somewhere. He seldom used the sho-wings, himself – if he needed to go very far, an Aes Sedai usually Traveled with him – but tonight he would, to M'jinn. Today was his twenty-fifth naming day, and tonight he intended to accept Nalla's latest offer of marriage. He wondered if she would be surprised; he had been putting her off for a year, not wanting to settle down. It would mean changing his service to Zorelle Sedai, whom Nalla served, but Mierin Sedai had already given her blessing.

Mierin=Lanfear.

TSR 26- The Dedicated said:

[Coumin] enjoyed Charn's stories even if he could not make himself believe, but some earned the old man frowns and scoldings. Like when he claimed to have served one of the Forsaken, once. Not just any Forsaken, but Lanfear herself. As well say he had served Ishamael. If Charn had to make up stories, Coumin wished he could say he had served Lews Therin, the great leader himself. Of course, everyone would ask why he was not serving the Dragon now, but that would be better than the way things were. Coumin did not like the way citizens looked at Charn when he said that Lanfear had not always been evil.

...

Abruptly something struck Coumin in the mouth and his legs buckled; he was pushing himself to his knees before he realized he was down. A hand put to his mouth came away bloody. He looked up to find an angry faced townsman standing over him, nursing a fist. "Why did you do that?" he asked.

The townsman spat at him. "The Forsaken are dead. Dead, do you hear? Lanfear will not protect you anymore. We will root out all of you who served the Forsaken while pretending to be on our side, and treat the lot of you as we treated that crazy old man."

A woman was tugging at the man's arm. "Come away, Toma. Come away, and hold your foolish tongue! Do you want the Ogier to come for you?" Suddenly wary, the man let her pull him away into the crowd.

Struggling to his feet, Coumin began to run, heedless of the blood oozing down his chin.

The inn was empty, silent. Not even the innkeeper was there, or the cook, or her helpers. Coumin ran through the building shouting, "Charn? Charn? Charn?"

Out back, maybe. Charn liked to sit under the spiceapple trees behind the inn, and tell his stories of the days when he was young.

Coumin ran out the back door, and tripped, falling on his face. It was an empty boot that had caught his toe. One of Charn's red dress boots that he wore all the time, now that he no longer joined in the singing. Something made Coumin look up.

Charn's white-haired body hung from a rope pulled over the ridgepole, one foot bare where he had kicked his boot off, the fingers of one hand caught at his neck where he had tried to pull the rope free.

"Why?" Coumin said. "We are Da'shain. Why?" There was no one to answer. Clutching the boot to his chest, he knelt there, staring up at Charn, as the noise of revelry washed over him.

TSR 26 - The Dedicated said:

Someshta sat against the wall near the door, a great shape seemingly woven of vines and leaves, his head a little above Jonai's even so. A fissure of withered brown and charred black ran up the Nym's face and furrowed the green grass of his hair, and when he looked at Jonai, his hazelnut eyes seemed troubled.

When Jonai nodded to him, he fingered the rift and frowned. "Do I know you?" he said softly.

"I am your friend," Jonai replied sadly. He had not seen Someshta in years, but he had heard of this. Most of the Nym were dead, he had heard. "You rode me on your shoulders when I was a child. Do you remember nothing of it?"

"Singing," Someshta said. "Was there singing? So much is gone. The Aes Sedai say some will return. You are a Child of the Dragon, are you not?"

Jonai winced. That name had caused trouble, no less for not being true. But how many citizens now believed the Da'shain Aiel had once served the Dragon and no other Aes Sedai?

...

"What of Coumin, Jonai? Has he calmed?"

He did not know any way but to tell her; he would rather have bitten his tongue out. "My father is hiding somewhere in the city. He tried to talk us into... resisting. He would not listen, Aes Sedai. He would not listen. He found an old shocklance somewhere, and..." He could not go on. He expected her to be angry, but her eyes glistened with tears.

"Keep the Covenant, Jonai. If the Da'shain lose everything else, see they keep the Way of the Leaf. Promise me."

"Of course, Aes Sedai," he said, shocked. The Covenant was the Aiel, and the Aiel were the Covenant; to abandon the Way would be to abandon what they were. Coumin was an aberration. He had been strange since he was a boy, it was said, hardly Aiel at all, though no one knew why.

[Tattersail_]

This happened to me last time!! I get too engrossed in the books and also in mafia that I forget to post thoughts and questions on here, now i'm on book 6, Lord of Chaos. So much has gone on and went by that I don't know what to comment on. My main thought as I write this is what i've thought each time i've read through the series. I feel a "tiny" bit let down, maybe wrong word, more like i've been robbed or something regarding book 5. All through the book it focuses on Sammael and at the last minute Rahvin is killed. I always forget Rahvins name because of this. I mean he doesn't quickly go and destroy Sammael does he. I don't know, I like Nynaeve turning up in the world of dreams with Moggy (sorry Terez just being lazy there). I like Mat killing Couly Maybe it had to be that way, I just feel like I've missed out on something.

[Terez]

Tattersail, on 24 April 2012 - 08:56 AM, said:

This happened to me last time!! I get too engrossed in the books and also in mafia that I forget to post thoughts and questions on here, now i'm on book 6, Lord of Chaos. So much has gone on and went by that I don't know what to comment on. My main thought as I write this is what i've thought each time i've read through the series. I feel a "tiny" bit let down, maybe wrong word, more like i've been robbed or something regarding book 5. All through the book it focuses on Sammael and at the last minute Rahvin is killed. I always forget Rahvins name because of this. I mean he doesn't quickly go and destroy Sammael does he. I don't know, I like Nynaeve turning up in the world of dreams with Moggy (sorry Terez just being lazy there). I like Mat killing Couly Maybe it had to be that way, I just feel like I've missed out on something.

Well, I can sort of see where you're coming from, but the death of Rahvin at the end of the book was entirely appropriate for several thematic reasons. Sammael was always intended to be bait; you find that out in the prologue, incidentally in Rahvin's point of view. It was Lanfear's plan, no doubt intended to get Sammael out of the picture while she did her thing with Rand.

To get a picture of the themes...I tend to look at 4-6 as being a trilogy of sorts. 1-3 are exposition, foreshadowing to hell and back, some concrete, some very much seeds planted in the Gardener style. Things to play with later, with a few options that have interesting potential. Rand's biggest theme in these books is the onset of the Lews Therin memories. He gets blatant ones in the beginning of TSR, and then for the rest of the book it's very much under the surface, for Rand and thus for the reader as well. There's an implication that the memories might have been lurking under the surface all along, manifesting in more subtle ways in the first three books, particularly TDR.

At the beginning of TFOH, the memories really start popping off, with three blatant ones in Rand's first chapter, and Rand actually realizing where those weird thoughts were coming from in chapter 6 when Lanfear shows up. Lanfear, who was the first woman he loved. One of his weird moments in ch 2 (his first chapter) was calling Moiraine 'little sister'. And before long, Rand finds himself following Couladin across the Dragonwall into Cairhien, where "Selene" claimed to be a noblewoman, and Moiraine actually was one.

This is the book where Rand's relationship with Aviendha develops, and this of course happens alongside his developing relationship with the Aiel. The crossing into Cairhien is thus very significant. The Gift of a Sword is very significant. The fact that Moiraine is Laman's niece is significant if for no other reason than its apparent insignificance. Moiraine, the first wetlander woman to go to Rhuidean, and heir to the Oathbreaker himself, if she would only accept her inheritance. The girl who, when just raised Aes Sedai, served a self-imposed penance because she shed no tears at her uncles' deaths.

The Lews Therin memories are the key to what's going on here thematically because of the baggage they come with, particularly the emotional baggage that is interpreted through the filter of Rand's preconceptions about the Kinslayer. Those two elements work together, really, because Lews Therin does not think much more of himself than the average person does.

Pay special attention to Rand's thoughts and feelings during the Battle of Cairhien, and in the aftermath. He's seen the bait they've been dangling for him, and to him it appears as though Sammael is antagonizing him, but when he's delirious after the battle, and talking to Sammael, the underlying significance is not their rivalry, but the consequences of being Lews Therin reborn. He has to remember who he was, and what he did, specifically to Ilyena. Like here:

TFOH—This Place, This Day said:

A memory slid across the emptiness. Not his; Lews Therin's. For once he did not care. In an instant he channeled, and a ball of fire enveloped the top of a hill nearly five miles away, a churning mass of pale yellow flame. When it faded, he could see without the looking glass that the hill was lower now, and black at the crest, seemingly melted. Between the three of them, there might be no need for the clans to fight Couladin at all.

Ilyena, my love, forgive me!

The Void trembled; for an instant Rand teetered on the brink of destruction. Waves of the One Power crashed through him in a froth of fear; the taint seemed to solidify around his heart, a reeking stone.

Clutching the rail until his knuckles ached, he forced himself back to calmness, forced the emptiness to hold. Thereafter he refused to listen to the thoughts in his head. Instead he concentrated everything on channeling, on methodically searing one hill after another.

This is precisely why Rand is fucked up in the head until his epiphany in TGS. He actually feels the emotional pain of Lews Therin's grief for Ilyena, because as he said on Dragonmount, they were not two men, and never had been.

RJ is pretty good at avoiding predictability. There are many things that are predictable to an extent, but he rarely ever takes you along as simply as point A to point B to point C. Because sometimes in life, you're aiming at point A, and then something comes along and distracts you, and becomes more important. We got the heads up on the alliance between Rahvin and Sammael and the others in the prologue, so it's not exactly a rip to the astute reader. And in "News Comes to Cairhien", Mat brings the 'news' that Morgase is dead, the same news that Moiraine saw when she went through the Rings of Rhuidean. From that news, she knew that she would face Lanfear the next day.

The news about Morgase was the distraction, but thematically, it ties in perfectly with Rand's arc in the book. The confrontation with the Maidens before the Battle of Cairhien was an early culmination of Rand's growing obsession with the women who die for him. It's growing because the guilt factor that was already present before is magnified in the extreme when Lews Therin's memories start to become personal for him. Morgase is Elayne's mother, and he blamed himself for her 'death' because he knew that Rahvin had her, and he hadn't done anything about it, because he didn't want to let the Forsaken know that he cared about Elayne. He put off facing Rahvin until the next day at Moiraine's suggestion, and Rand thought it a good idea because he needed to cool down, but that lead to him facing Rahvin after the loss of Moiraine—probably more his fault than any other name on the list, except those he killed personally. He let Moiraine 'die' because he could not bring himself to kill Lanfear. And Mat, who brought the 'news' to Cairhien, is the one who had to go and save her.

He went to Caemlyn to get Rahvin, and first thing, Mat and Aviendha are dead. Aviendha, in the same category as Elayne and Ilyena. He uses balefire—which Moiraine warned him not to use—to bring them back, and in LOC, Moiraine's name tops the list.

Moiraine and Morgase are also tied together, since Morgase was married to Moiraine's half-brother Taringail, the father of Elayne and Gawyn. Morgase is a queen who lost her throne, and Moiraine is a queen who ran away from the throne as a young girl. Morgase was Thom's lover, and now Thom is with Moiraine. Moiraine was Siuan's lover, and now Siuan is with Gareth Bryne, who was also with Morgase. Moiraine is both Morgan le Fay and Mordred, so the Arthurian stuff gets interesting too. The theme really continues in the opening chapter of LOC.

LOC said:

The lions sing and the hills take flight. The moon by day and the sun by night. Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool. Let the Lord of Chaos rule.

chant from a children's game heard in Great Arvalon, the Fourth Age

Lions=Andor, Hills=Cairhien. Moon=Lanfear, Sun=Moiraine.

That theme really continues in chapter 1. Too much to quote. And in LOC, Rand begins to build the construct, the idea of Lews Therin being another man in his head that he can actually have conversations with. It takes the whole book for him to build that illusion, and Dumai's Wells seals the deal.

[QuickTidal]

Terez, I find you very knowledgeable about WOT. In fact you know more than most folk do...

...But sometimes when I read through your ridiculous long posts and rebuttals to peoples issues about things, and I see a person who wants SO badly to believe the work she is such a fangirl of is totally infallible... that you literally (LITERALLY) have a rebuttal and reason for EVERYTHING Jordan did. In your head, I am convinced you believe he never misstepped. Not once.

Meanwhile the rest of WOT fandom is not only aware of missteps, but that he loaded books with filler.

Other people have other opinions. But you always seem to come across as if you are within your right to dismiss them as stupid for not having "seen" it the way you did.

You can chastise a great composer like Mozart for not being perfect...but gods forbid anyone ought to interpret a WOT book differently than you.

I appreciate your wealth of thematic knowledge...but is it too much to ask that you not refute every last thing anyone has an opinion on when it comes to WOT. It's simply exhausting to watch.

/rant

[Terez]

In case you didn't notice, she asked for my opinion. So go suck a goat's foot.

[QuickTidal]

Terez, on 26 April 2012 - 03:06 AM, said:

In case you didn't notice, she asked for my opinion. So go suck a goat's foot.

You "opinion" is not how you shared it. You shared it like you always do. Like the other person is stupid and you know all.

And I'm talking about the whole thread, not just your most recent post.

[Terez]

I explain things like I know more about WoT than most people do. I notice things the casual reader does not. Which is precisely why she asked me for my opinion...and guess what? You don't have to read anything I write, ever, if you don't like it. I will continue to explain things in my own way, regardless of whether or not you get your panties in a bunch about it.

[QuickTidal]

Terez, on 26 April 2012 - 03:12 AM, said:

I explain things like I know more about WoT than most people do. I notice things the casual reader does not. Which is precisely why she asked me for my opinion...and guess what? You don't have to read anything I write, ever, if you don't like it. I will continue to explain things in my own way, regardless of whether or not you get your panties in a bunch about it.

Come on Terez, that is a "welcome to the internet" rebuttal. It's a forum, we all read everything. I read the WOT threads cause I'm a fan of the series.

But you always stand on some high ground where your opinion is ultimately superior and everyone else is WRONG somehow.

Their opinion isn't wrong. It's their opinion. They are entitled to it.

Quote

I notice things the casual reader does not.

WHAT
THE
BLEEDING
HELL?

You assume the rest of us are CASUAL readers?! That's an elitist thought process right there. So let me get this straight...from the outset EVERYONE else is not as well read or learned in WOT as you are?... As if the rest of us aren't reading it thoroughly enough? Really? That's your defense?

That's not condescending at all.

I read Malazan, I like to think I am reading the books I read deeply enough, Thank you very much.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 26 April 2012 - 03:42 AM

[Terez]

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

Terez, on 26 April 2012 - 03:12 AM, said:

I explain things like I know more about WoT than most people do. I notice things the casual reader does not. Which is precisely why she asked me for my opinion...and guess what? You don't have to read anything I write, ever, if you don't like it. I will continue to explain things in my own way, regardless of whether or not you get your panties in a bunch about it.

Come on Terez, that is a "welcome to the internet" rebuttal. It's a forum, we all read everything. I read the WOT threads cause I'm a fan of the series.

Yes, but if my posts annoy you, then you should really stop reading them. I just went back and glanced through the thread to see what the hell you were talking about, and I really don't get it. People ask questions, and I answer them.

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

Their opinion isn't wrong. It's their opinion. They are entitled to it.

Sure they are. In this case, it seemed to me that Tattersail felt like she was missing something, and would be happy to have gaps filled in, so that's what I did. That's what I usually do, and Tattersail claims to like it.

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

Terez, on 26 April 2012 - 03:12 AM, said:

I notice things the casual reader does not.

WHAT
THE
BLEEDING
HELL?

You assume the rest of us are CASUAL readers?!

If I'm not mistaken, you have read the books once, twice at most. That's extremely casual. Talk to me when you've read it ten times or more; a few people on this forum have, and you're not one of them by a long shot. I had read them that many times by the time I joined Theoryland, and I was still pretty casual at that point, relatively. Tattersail is relatively casual too, even though she loves the books, and has read them more than once (don't remember how many times). I'm a casual Malazan reader, and a casual Martin reader, and I have no problem saying so. Which causes one to wonder what your problem is. "Casual" doesn't mean you don't like the books. It just means you don't really study them. I know you wrote reviews of all the books; I even read some of them. That's beside the point.

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

That's an elitist thought process right there. So let me get this straight...from the outset EVERYONE else is not as well read or learned in WOT as you are?... As if the rest of us aren't reading it thoroughly enough? Really? That's your defense?

Oh dear god, now you sound like a Tea Partyer. Really? Elitist? As amphibian so eloquently (and, as he indicated later, grudgingly) said on another thread (in response to a troll, incidentally):

amphibian, on 19 November 2010 - 03:03 AM, said:

Spiridon_Deannis, on 19 November 2010 - 01:20 AM, said:

this whole discussion started with that very peculiar statement of a fangirl about *mankind discussing RJ´s ubertropes for centuries to come*. My position is simply *Honey, I don´t fucking think so. Keep dreaming*.

Terez is a longstanding member of the forum who has contributed excellently to discussion. And she is no mere fangirl. I'd say maybe three people on the planet know as much about WoT as she does. She's up to her eyeballs in this stuff 24/7 and I give her respect for the incredible amount of work she puts into scholarly-like exegesis of WoT things. It's kind of terrifying once you realize how intense she is about this stuff and how much she truly does know about it.

I disagree with her statement, but not because the books are bad or because she has no clue what she's talking about.

Now that, my friend, is self-important. He's right, by the way; there might be 3 people on the planet who know more about WoT than I do, excluding Team Jordan. That doesn't mean other people can't have opinions. It just means that I have a reason for writing in what you perceive to be a condescending tone (it's not intended that way; it's specifically in response to the way Tattersail has approached me thus far). My opinions are informed by years of reading WoT, thinking about it more than most things, reading everything that RJ had to say about it outside the books (including his comments on themes), and Brandon, and everyone else associated with WoT. I believe I know a little bit more about how RJ's brain worked than most people who didn't know him personally (and unfortunately most people who knew him personally don't know WoT near as well as I do).

That doesn't mean I don't like other people's theories. I often do. You'll see this quite a bit more often on WoT boards than you'll see it here, and it's not because I'm prejudiced against Malazanfans—it's because people with a truly solid knowledge of the canon are far more rare here. Abyss is one of the best, and even he is a bit casual, as the whiners in the cage match threads were quick to point out. Illy is probably about the same, maybe even a little better. HD is pretty good, maybe better than Abyss and Illy. Actually, of the other people who post here semi-regularly, Wert is probably the best. I could list several others who I assume have read the books a few times. If you'd like to post opinions about WoT without people pointing out things you might have missed, then you might want to avoid me. Just saying.

[Terez]

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:04 AM, said:

Terez, I find you very knowledgeable about WOT. In fact you know more than most folk do...

...But sometimes when I read through your ridiculous long posts and rebuttals to peoples issues about things, and I see a person who wants SO badly to believe the work she is such a fangirl of is totally infallible... that you literally (LITERALLY) have a rebuttal and reason for EVERYTHING Jordan did. In your head, I am convinced you believe he never misstepped. Not once.

By the way, this is the main reason I neg-repped you. If you'd paid the slightest bit of attention to my WoT postings, you'd know I've taken a great deal of flak from WoT fanatics—the type who truly believe RJ can do no wrong—for daring to criticize RJ, particularly when it comes to his gender quirks (which get even worse when you go back into Fallon territory). And if you haven't paid that much attention to my WoT postings, then you have no business making comments like that.

[QuickTidal]

Terez, on 26 April 2012 - 07:22 AM, said:

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:04 AM, said:

Terez, I find you very knowledgeable about WOT. In fact you know more than most folk do...

...But sometimes when I read through your ridiculous long posts and rebuttals to peoples issues about things, and I see a person who wants SO badly to believe the work she is such a fangirl of is totally infallible... that you literally (LITERALLY) have a rebuttal and reason for EVERYTHING Jordan did. In your head, I am convinced you believe he never misstepped. Not once.

By the way, this is the main reason I neg-repped you. If you'd paid the slightest bit of attention to my WoT postings, you'd know I've taken a great deal of flak from WoT fanatics—the type who truly believe RJ can do no wrong—for daring to criticize RJ, particularly when it comes to his gender quirks (which get even worse when you go back into Fallon territory). And if you haven't paid that much attention to my WoT postings, then you have no business making comments like that.

Bullshit. Straight up bullshit.

I seem to recall an entire posting where you allow for RJ's gender issues because they were meant to be "caricatures".

So tell me another one Terez.

Look, it's okay to be backed into a corner, but don't try to pretend like you don't do the "holier than though" thing...because you do. I'm also clearly not the only one who thinks so.

And I could care less about the neg rep, that's what it is for I suppose. To get revenge right?...oh no wait. You kneejerk neg rep me...and then a 3 1/2 hours later post "this is why"...because you had to take the time to come up with a reason that sounded neg-rep worthy. Let's not beat around the bush...you were friggin mad at me...and you neg repped as a reaction. And I'm totally cool with that. That's pretty much what the red is used for anyways.

[Terez]

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 11:13 AM, said:

Terez, on 26 April 2012 - 07:22 AM, said:

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 03:04 AM, said:

Terez, I find you very knowledgeable about WOT. In fact you know more than most folk do...

...But sometimes when I read through your ridiculous long posts and rebuttals to peoples issues about things, and I see a person who wants SO badly to believe the work she is such a fangirl of is totally infallible... that you literally (LITERALLY) have a rebuttal and reason for EVERYTHING Jordan did. In your head, I am convinced you believe he never misstepped. Not once.

By the way, this is the main reason I neg-repped you. If you'd paid the slightest bit of attention to my WoT postings, you'd know I've taken a great deal of flak from WoT fanatics—the type who truly believe RJ can do no wrong—for daring to criticize RJ, particularly when it comes to his gender quirks (which get even worse when you go back into Fallon territory). And if you haven't paid that much attention to my WoT postings, then you have no business making comments like that.

Bullshit. Straight up bullshit.

I seem to recall an entire posting where you allow for RJ's gender issues because they were meant to be "caricatures".

I allow for certain caricaturish character traits because that's how they were intended. That has little to do with the real gender issues, for the most part. Have you read this, for example? In that one, Brandon was defending RJ, and I was defending those who recognized the elements of sexism in the books. At first, anyway. I think we came to an agreement fairly quickly.

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 11:13 AM, said:

Look, it's okay to be backed into a corner, but don't try to pretend like you don't do the "holier than though" thing...because you do. I'm also clearly not the only one who thinks so.

lol. This is what internet trolls such as yourself do when backed into a corner. Nice try, though.

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 11:13 AM, said:

You kneejerk neg rep me

If it was kneejerk, I would have neg-repped your other posts too, promise.

[Werthead]

This thread has taken a turn for the random.

Terez is well-known as a major WoT fan, has contact with Team Jordan, has read the books more than anyone else here (I'd wager) and certainly has a stronger knowledge of the series than most people. I've read WoT Books 1-7 five times and 8-11 four times (I may have skimmed CoT a bit on the rereads though), and compared to the hardcore WoT fans I certainly classify myself as a 'casual' fan. I certainly have no problem with that and it's a bit odd that people should think it's unreasonable that someone with superior knowledge shouldn't be able to answer questions more in-depth than less-experienced readers (such as first-timers).

Quick, you're normally a well-reasoned and respectable poster but you've massively overreacted and attacked Terez for little discernible reason in two separate threads now. You are definitely coming across as someone with some kind of grudge, which I'm sure this is not your intention.

[Imperial Historian]

Can we put this drama to bed now? Quick you have randomnly attacked Terez in two threads now for little discernable reason, give it a rest please.

I for one Terez enjoy most of your posts about WoT, even if I don't necessarily agree with them. This thread seems to have become the go to place for Terez to share some of her knowledge (though I think I'm going to have to change the title Eye of the World doesn't really cover this topic anymore), Quick if you have a problem with that stay out of the topic.

Now can we all play nice again?

[Terez]

Happy to. Sorry for reacting; I was caught a little off guard.

[QuickTidal]

Sure, thing. I've messaged you Historian with my reasons for commenting on those threads.

Terez has blocked me, so I can't really say much further to her out of thread.

Though how it can my comments DEFENDING Drek in another thread can be construed as "attacking" when Terez was the one who was DEMANDING someone "kill their sig" because "it annoyed her"...but whatever.

I'll play nice.

[Terez]

QuickTidal, on 26 April 2012 - 01:04 PM, said:

Sure, thing. I've messaged you Historian with my reasons for commenting on those threads.

Terez has blocked me, so I can't really say much further to her out of thread.

I haven't blocked you from anything.

[QuickTidal]

I attempted to send you a PM with a quasi-olive branch (AKA explaining myself without the anger)...but it won't allow it (maybe you need to empty your inbox). Whatever. I can do it here.

I'm going to be honest...It riles me the fuck up when you get holier than thou about WOT...and I decided to tell you about it...I was pos repped for telling you so clearly I'm not the only one.

I appreciate your breadth of knowledge (like I already said), but sometimes you come off as arrogant as all hell about it is all. I'm not perfect, and I can damn sure be arrogant myself on a lot of days...but people usually call me on my shit and I normally attempt to reign it in. You don't. Ever. I don't think I was in the wrong telling you how I think you sometimes come across. Lastly on that point...my initial post to you was lucid and not trollish at all...I was merely stating how I felt about the thread and your part in it...and I did so without swearing, or using all angry caps like Illy does, or any other troll behavior. I even made sure it was known to be a rant, so I everyone was aware I was getting something off my chest. If the Admin's consider that over the line, then I apologize.

Troll though? So now I can't disagree with you without you calling me a troll? And everyone sees this as decent behavior on your part? Baffling. Say what one will about what I said to you but I didn't reduce things to petty name calling.

And you worded your stuff in the other thread poorly (if you truly didn't intend to come off as nasty)...so poorly that it sounded like demands and snark. I was reacting to that. It's all there in what you said and how you said it though...so I don't need to go on and on about it. If you truly didn't mean it the way I read it, then I apologize.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 26 April 2012 - 02:07 PM

[Tattersail_]

I like the new name for my little thread!!

Terez I do not want you to stop posting. I enjoy what you write and you do make/help me think differently. I would ask you otherwise, in fact instead of having a go it would have been good to see what QT thought of what I said too. He is a fan, he has read the series and that is what this thread is for. The final book comes out next year and I plan to have re read it twice by then. I'm on my 4/5 re read of the series at the very least but its always good to find out more, or actually see a more complex side of things.

Terez, Nicola's foretelling when they link in Salidar for the first time. I haven't got it right now but do you know the one I mean? The guy with the dagger I want to know about or is this still to come?