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Draconian family tree
#61 Guest_Tempest_*
Posted 25 February 2006 - 05:39 PM
bonehunters might provide some explanation for the elder gods also loads more dragons
#62
jammer 
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Posted 03 March 2006 - 09:08 PM
New to this forum and I have only read the books once so far (am working on the second reading now) but where on earth did you guys get this stuff?? The family tree etc. Much of what you are discussing is familiar but some of it I do not remember at all. Did I miss somehting?? Is some of this in the korbal broach/bauchelain novellas that I have not been able to get my hands on our is their some kind of erickson encyclodepia out there?? I would really like to know as this series is by far the greatest work I have ever read and is quite fascinating.
Thanks
Thanks
#63 Guest_BAD_*
Posted 03 March 2006 - 09:44 PM
jammer said:
New to this forum and I have only read the books once so far (am working on the second reading now) but where on earth did you guys get this stuff?? The family tree etc. Much of what you are discussing is familiar but some of it I do not remember at all. Did I miss somehting?? Is some of this in the korbal broach/bauchelain novellas that I have not been able to get my hands on our is their some kind of erickson encyclodepia out there?? I would really like to know as this series is by far the greatest work I have ever read and is quite fascinating.
Thanks
Thanks
Go to the home page ---> http://www.malazanempire.com/ there is plenty of nice stuff on there.
#64
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 09:16 AM
So Envy is not mother to Nimander Gollit..but is to Phaed
so on that basis .. I wonder how unreliable the other information is on that tree?
Can we still assume that those Elder Gods listed are draconean... or merely an example of those who are considered to be Elder Gods? They sure seem to be coming out the woodwork fast and thick... which isn't surprising considering the convergence this appears to be building to.
so on that basis .. I wonder how unreliable the other information is on that tree?
Can we still assume that those Elder Gods listed are draconean... or merely an example of those who are considered to be Elder Gods? They sure seem to be coming out the woodwork fast and thick... which isn't surprising considering the convergence this appears to be building to.
#65 Guest_Rheanar Delh\'Suhn_*
Posted 07 March 2006 - 09:19 AM
well, we know for sure that this is not a complete list of all the elder gods Grizzin Farl is named in the glossary as being elder. Might be possible that it is a list if all the Draconian Elder Gods, I mean why assume that they are all draconian?
[edit]
or of course, just the elder gods known to Baruk. His information may be incomplete, infact has shown to be by said elder god above.
[edit]
or of course, just the elder gods known to Baruk. His information may be incomplete, infact has shown to be by said elder god above.
#66
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 09:38 AM
It was assumed that all characters on that list were draconian...of one form or another... because it is a draconian family tree 
Why put them on if they're not draconian... and how many times can I say the word draconian in one sentence? 
So as the word Eleint is in the top box... are they all Elder Gods too? elementals?
Why put them on if they're not draconian... and how many times can I say the word draconian in one sentence? So as the word Eleint is in the top box... are they all Elder Gods too? elementals?
#67
Folken
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 11:08 AM
A) Said tree was delievered to us by Kallor
He admitted he changed things around just because he loves us of so much
He admitted he changed things around just because he loves us of so much
<div align='center'>You must always strive to be the best, but you must never believe that you are - Juan Manuel Fangio</div>
#68
tiam
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 11:29 AM
isnt there another elder god mentioned in the book? i meant to make note of it for this site but i forgot. ne one?
as for the tree is it really that reliable. we now know that olar ethil was an elder god. its confirmed i think.
as for the tree is it really that reliable. we now know that olar ethil was an elder god. its confirmed i think.
#69
fan_83
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 03:05 PM
ethil is not an elder god but instead an imass soletaken...
said so by the dragons chained in KE...
i would guess that elder gods have the blood and power of all races in their blood... this is my guess.... cos then why would the eleint as a race agree to k'ruls request to become sources of power?
said so by the dragons chained in KE...
i would guess that elder gods have the blood and power of all races in their blood... this is my guess.... cos then why would the eleint as a race agree to k'ruls request to become sources of power?
#71
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 04:13 PM
I quite like the speculation on D'rek for the KCCM....
but SE is introducing gods we didn't know about before... and there's still another four books to go *sighs happily*
but SE is introducing gods we didn't know about before... and there's still another four books to go *sighs happily*
#72 Guest_Nobody really ..._*
Posted 07 March 2006 - 05:26 PM
perhaps killmandros is the kccm goddess. maybe that's why she's so angry at scabardi
You can't blame me for this idea my dear Hetan for it was you who started me upon the path of 'crazy theories':)
You can't blame me for this idea my dear Hetan for it was you who started me upon the path of 'crazy theories'
:)
#75 Guest_Garm_*
Posted 08 March 2006 - 01:06 AM
fan_83 said:
a)elder gods are not of this world..
b)they exists in multiple realms..
c)thus they are not patron gods of any race
b)they exists in multiple realms..
c)thus they are not patron gods of any race
c) is not implicated by a),
or the combination of both. But their functions seem to be more abstract, while Ammanas rules Shadow via the throne on drift avalii K'Rul seems to embody the warrens which leads me to speculate that it would be more likely that there are "normal" gods for each of the races out there. (The Tiste are somewhat strange in that with being the progeny of Elder Gods but some of the Andii worship Rake for example.)
#76
Imperial Historian
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 11:21 AM
A lot of the races seem to have draconean soletaken who assume the role of god's, Rake, Osserc, Scabandari, Olar Ethil, they seem to be "elder" in many ways and I would guess these are the patron gods of the various races.
#77 Guest_Danyah_*
Posted 08 March 2006 - 04:16 PM
Several parts in GotM support that K'rul directly is formed, or at least emerged out of chaos. How? wel esotherically, dunno...,
Guess it's something like greek mythology were Chronos/Time is formed out of chaos, and he was a particulary nasty creature for his offspring.
So we might assume K'ruls buddies came from that general direction too, they were patron gods of whomever chose to worship him in an extent they chose themselves. Elder gods have the name to be very bloddthirsty, so I gues they didn't really care too much, except then when somebody destroys an entire continent.
SE makes someone state "if not for priests the gods wouldn't have any power, so they wouldn't be able to play their games. Works for elder gods too, K'rul vanished because of lack of followers.
I don't think Kilmandaros is specifically a KCCM goddess, the elder gods were just a bunch of young hooligans who just emerged out of chaos on an existing planet/warren/material plane, and when the tiste arrived they saw their position , especially by powerhungry bloodeye, so that's reason enough to bash his brains in, no?
Guess it's something like greek mythology were Chronos/Time is formed out of chaos, and he was a particulary nasty creature for his offspring.
So we might assume K'ruls buddies came from that general direction too, they were patron gods of whomever chose to worship him in an extent they chose themselves. Elder gods have the name to be very bloddthirsty, so I gues they didn't really care too much, except then when somebody destroys an entire continent.
SE makes someone state "if not for priests the gods wouldn't have any power, so they wouldn't be able to play their games. Works for elder gods too, K'rul vanished because of lack of followers.
I don't think Kilmandaros is specifically a KCCM goddess, the elder gods were just a bunch of young hooligans who just emerged out of chaos on an existing planet/warren/material plane, and when the tiste arrived they saw their position , especially by powerhungry bloodeye, so that's reason enough to bash his brains in, no?
#78
Tiger_sword
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 07:28 PM
Gods seam to arrive whenever and wherever they are needed thus if a race requires a god, potentially a god could arise through simple creation or from another ascendant seeing an opertunity
#79
Ellestra
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Posted 25 March 2006 - 08:35 PM
I'm rereading MoI and Lady Envy mentions her brother. I only remembered her sister Spite, but it seems there's more of them.
He's not on Draconian Family Tree, but neither is L'oric.
Maybe it's like with Anomandaris - we learned he has brothers.
Maybe Draconus and/or Sheltatha Lore have more children.
Or maybe that's a mistake like with Orfantal.
There are probably lots of other peple with draconian heritage but htey are either not relevant or not powerful enough to make it to the list eg. Rake is supposed to have lots of other children on Drift Avalli.
He's not on Draconian Family Tree, but neither is L'oric.
Maybe it's like with Anomandaris - we learned he has brothers.
Maybe Draconus and/or Sheltatha Lore have more children.
Or maybe that's a mistake like with Orfantal.
There are probably lots of other peple with draconian heritage but htey are either not relevant or not powerful enough to make it to the list eg. Rake is supposed to have lots of other children on Drift Avalli.
Evolution, just like gravity, works even if you don't believe in it.
Stupidity doesn't hurt but it kills.
Stupidity doesn't hurt but it kills.
#80 Guest_Nobody really ..._*
Posted 25 March 2006 - 09:10 PM
there's no indication that l'oric is a dragon. not even a soul-taken one.
can you quote what makes you think the Lady Envy has a brother? It's not something i'd noticed
can you quote what makes you think the Lady Envy has a brother? It's not something i'd noticed
