[Imperial Historian]

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 11:44 AM, said:

So either D'rek is the only one with a sabotage or you all are well... You all realize I offered a VP for a sabotage use right? And no one thinks a VP isn't worth 1 action card? Noone?

It's not really a VP though is it, it's a support ie a recipe for you to continually attack someone until they are forced to attack you and lose it.

And with what a 100 action cards in the game it's not surprising that the 4 sabotages are not drawn yet

[Imperial Historian]

Morgoth, on 07 May 2021 - 08:06 AM, said:

That was a lot duller than your original plan, IH

It is much more dull, I had 3rd and 4th thoughts on this, but I think ultimately it will give a better result.

[Imperial Historian]

D, on 07 May 2021 - 11:38 AM, said:

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 11:29 AM, said:

A forum play rules question:

So IH changed his action after changing his mind. He did that soon after posting the original action, and I have no problem with that. But my question is, how long do you have before you can no longer change your mind?

For example, I posted my action, and then a while later Tatts started talking about invading one of my systems. Now, could I have gone back and changed my action to something which would instead better protect me? At the time I decided I could not, because 1) I would be changing it a while after posting, and 2) I was changing it based on new information. However, technically, it was still my turn, so...

We don't have a specific rule for this. Perhaps we should.

Definitely you can't change your mind after anyone else has done any official play like taken their turn, played an actin card on something you did, etc.

And agreed that it is bad form to change something after some new information is revealed in discussion that you didn't think of... but at the same time if someone is just pointing out that you forgot to put in a trade or whatnot we allow that even though it could technically be called a misplay you should have to live with instead.

If no one plays anything on/after your turn and there's no new information from discussion, how long should you be allowed to fix/change your turn before your turn is "over" ? I dunno, we've never really set a limit before.

Yeah that's something which isn't clear, I think it's normally pretty obvious what is okay and what isn't it, with mod decision if someone can't modify there turn. With the necessity of drive by posting to keep the game going I think the current rules work. Otherwise it is much more likely that turns will take longer as people wait until they have time to check through so they don't miss anything.

[Imperial Historian]

It's interesting with all these war like races how things will play out, as traditionally conflict hasn't ended well, but I think this game may be different.

Of course the obvious answer to this is all the war-like races attack those who aren't warlike to reduce the risk of combat.

How do captured units work if the vuil rath cabal are already blockaded, automatically become not captured? Do captured units get uncaptured during an invasion?

[Morgoth]

D, on 07 May 2021 - 11:04 AM, said:

@Morgoth you asked/negotiated for:

D, on 06 May 2021 - 08:09 PM, said:

Morgoth, on 06 May 2021 - 08:08 PM, said:

D'rek, I'll take that deal if you're also willing to trade/wash my commodities.

I agree to this.

And then didn't put it in your turn?

I completely forgot about it. I'll do it on my next turn

[twelve]

Imperial Historian, on 07 May 2021 - 12:07 PM, said:

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 11:44 AM, said:

So either D'rek is the only one with a sabotage or you all are well... You all realize I offered a VP for a sabotage use right? And no one thinks a VP isn't worth 1 action card? Noone?

It's not really a VP though is it, it's a support ie a recipe for you to continually attack someone until they are forced to attack you and lose it.

And with what a 100 action cards in the game it's not surprising that the 4 sabotages are not drawn yet

I think I'm going to be occupied with a certain cat the rest of the game so your comment about me attacking the recipient of the card doesn't track.

Also I have 3 commodities anyone willing to wash them for me?

[twelve]

I also see my luck has returned in full form. 0 hits with experimental battlestation. Great!

[Tattersail_]

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 12:06 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 11:54 AM, said:

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 11:49 AM, said:

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 11:41 AM, said:

I am still mulling over my turn and my heart is swaying towards you Khell. My mind is not. I just cannot see a clear resolution which won't end up in back stabbing and betrayal.

Well, that's really on you. The reason you believe that is because you think you've riled me up so much that there's no way I won't seek revenge. That's nothing I've done. I've actually never broken my word to you.

Look at it this way. Invade Lodor and we'll definitely have a drawn-out conflict. Any dreads I capture, you will never get back. I will never use them.

Don't invade Lodor and there is much less chance of conflict. I don't say it won't happen - I have never said that - because it might, but that would be due to objectives, not vindictiveness. Right now, there are three POs for me to chase, plus my SO, none of which involve having to fight anyone. So what's in it for me to stab you in the back? Believe it or not, I don't actually play this game with the intent to go after others while losing my own chance at winning.

Make no mistake, I would be doing it to score the construction PO and reducing a threat.

Whilst having fun at the same time. I obviously don't want the drawn out war but as you say it may go that way.

5TGs from me buys you a PO. That and no contest of Mallice, which gains you a CT and TGs in later rounds.

I'm listening. My thoughts are a bit haphazard here so bear with me.

Agenda; Vortex, Mallice, Cormund, Leadership, Carrier, Tg's, Votes, Trade PN. Borders.


I wanted to discuss borders earlier in the game but you gave a nonchalant reply that was a bit wishy washy. So let us establish them now.

You don't use Vortex on me.


Mallice was my intention and I can agree to that.


You get to have Cormund.


You pop leadership on your next turn. D'rek already taken Twelve's home system and I would prefer to activate my home system to build,


You can keep my carrier.


You give me 5 TG's and your trade PN. In return I will give you an agreed amount of votes on the upcoming agendas.

I don't think you would go for this deal, and given that it is not a nice way to deal with neighbours I doubt you would stick to it anyway.

Honestly, I think it'd be more fun to attack Lodor and it would push me towards the construction PO. Obviously it'll put a dent in your plans which is an unfortunate bonus.

[twelve]

As obvious as my move should be I'm having a hard time deciding what to do. If the fight was more or less guaranteed I'd attack Ixth but with my miss on the pds fire I'm not feeling so good about my chances. I need to think about it for a while but I'm off to work so it could be a while

[twelve]

Khell what do you need to pop Leadership on your next move?

[Imperial Historian]

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 02:17 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 12:06 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 11:54 AM, said:

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 11:49 AM, said:

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 11:41 AM, said:

I am still mulling over my turn and my heart is swaying towards you Khell. My mind is not. I just cannot see a clear resolution which won't end up in back stabbing and betrayal.

Well, that's really on you. The reason you believe that is because you think you've riled me up so much that there's no way I won't seek revenge. That's nothing I've done. I've actually never broken my word to you.

Look at it this way. Invade Lodor and we'll definitely have a drawn-out conflict. Any dreads I capture, you will never get back. I will never use them.

Don't invade Lodor and there is much less chance of conflict. I don't say it won't happen - I have never said that - because it might, but that would be due to objectives, not vindictiveness. Right now, there are three POs for me to chase, plus my SO, none of which involve having to fight anyone. So what's in it for me to stab you in the back? Believe it or not, I don't actually play this game with the intent to go after others while losing my own chance at winning.

Make no mistake, I would be doing it to score the construction PO and reducing a threat.

Whilst having fun at the same time. I obviously don't want the drawn out war but as you say it may go that way.

5TGs from me buys you a PO. That and no contest of Mallice, which gains you a CT and TGs in later rounds.

I'm listening. My thoughts are a bit haphazard here so bear with me.

Agenda; Vortex, Mallice, Cormund, Leadership, Carrier, Tg's, Votes, Trade PN. Borders.


I wanted to discuss borders earlier in the game but you gave a nonchalant reply that was a bit wishy washy. So let us establish them now.

You don't use Vortex on me.

Mallice was my intention and I can agree to that.

You get to have Cormund.

You pop leadership on your next turn. D'rek already taken Twelve's home system and I would prefer to activate my home system to build,

You can keep my carrier.

You give me 5 TG's and your trade PN. In return I will give you an agreed amount of votes on the upcoming agendas.

I don't think you would go for this deal, and given that it is not a nice way to deal with neighbours I doubt you would stick to it anyway.

Honestly, I think it'd be more fun to attack Lodor and it would push me towards the construction PO. Obviously it'll put a dent in your plans which is an unfortunate bonus.

For a deal you don't think he'll stick to you are taking a remarkable amount on trust there!

[D'rek]

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 02:17 PM, said:

You pop leadership on your next turn. D'rek already taken Twelve's home system and I would prefer to activate my home system to build,

That deal wasn't setup as until I take Twelve's HW, though. The idea was to force Twelve to pass. Against any other faction there wouldn't be much difference, but Mahact can deactivate their systems so playing Leadership now means Twelve can deactivate his currently-stuck fleet in Ab/Ash/Loki and attack with it.

[twelve]

D, on 07 May 2021 - 04:11 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 02:17 PM, said:

You pop leadership on your next turn. D'rek already taken Twelve's home system and I would prefer to activate my home system to build,

That deal wasn't setup as until I take Twelve's HW, though. The idea was to force Twelve to pass. Against any other faction there wouldn't be much difference, but Mahact can deactivate their systems so playing Leadership now means Twelve can deactivate his currently-stuck fleet in Ab/Ash/Loki and attack with it.

Hence why I'm willing to pay for a Leadership pop. I have this naked unwarranted aggression by the Hacan. The board letting her steamroll me will just let her do what she did as the Mentak when she won. Just look at her economy and trade good count. She will also take two more planets off of me before the end of the round and she can get earlier initiative than me next round and start the mop up there. I need the leadership pop now just to tread water. Delay Leadership and she will waltz right through me to the victory.

[Khellendros]

Tattersail_, on 07 May 2021 - 02:17 PM, said:

I'm listening. My thoughts are a bit haphazard here so bear with me.

Agenda; Vortex, Mallice, Cormund, Leadership, Carrier, Tg's, Votes, Trade PN. Borders.


I wanted to discuss borders earlier in the game but you gave a nonchalant reply that was a bit wishy washy. So let us establish them now.

You don't use Vortex on me.


Mallice was my intention and I can agree to that.


You get to have Cormund.


You pop leadership on your next turn. D'rek already taken Twelve's home system and I would prefer to activate my home system to build,


You can keep my carrier.


You give me 5 TG's and your trade PN. In return I will give you an agreed amount of votes on the upcoming agendas.

I don't think you would go for this deal, and given that it is not a nice way to deal with neighbours I doubt you would stick to it anyway.

Honestly, I think it'd be more fun to attack Lodor and it would push me towards the construction PO. Obviously it'll put a dent in your plans which is an unfortunate bonus.

Most seems agreeable, but playing Leadership is a sticking point. Not just because I don't think D'rek would go for it, but because there's no guarantee that you wouldn't then just attack me in Lodor anyway. Think about it, I agree to this, give you all my stuff, you take Mallice or build in your home system, I pop Leadership, and then you use Leadership to just attack me anyway.

[twelve]

Khell can I get a wash for my commodities?

[twelve]

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 04:35 PM, said:

Khell can I get a wash for my commodities?

Tapper Morgoth either of you willing to wash? If not what will it cost me for any of you to do it?

[Khellendros]

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 04:35 PM, said:

Khell can I get a wash for my commodities?

At the moment D’rek is helping me get hold of some PNs should I need to use them, so I am loth to help out and upset that, sorry!

[twelve]

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 04:54 PM, said:

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 04:35 PM, said:

Khell can I get a wash for my commodities?

At the moment D'rek is helping me get hold of some PNs should I need to use them, so I am loth to help out and upset that, sorry!

If you have a deal with her then you have a deal with her. This isn't the same as popping Leadership which would break a deal with her. This is a deal just between you and me. If you are afraid that dealing with me will make is so she won't honor her deal with you then why should you honor yours?

[Khellendros]

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 05:04 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 07 May 2021 - 04:54 PM, said:

twelve, on 07 May 2021 - 04:35 PM, said:

Khell can I get a wash for my commodities?

At the moment D'rek is helping me get hold of some PNs should I need to use them, so I am loth to help out and upset that, sorry!

If you have a deal with her then you have a deal with her. This isn't the same as popping Leadership which would break a deal with her. This is a deal just between you and me. If you are afraid that dealing with me will make is so she won't honor her deal with you then why should you honor yours?

Well you do make a compelling argument. But why is everyone else staying silent on this? Or possibly Morghy’s just not around till tomorrow now.

Let me see what Tatts has to say in reply to me first.

[twelve]

Khell how many more turns are you going to stall Leadership? I see you have 1 Tactical and 1 tech stall. Are you going to stall longer than that? I think I've found a possible play to salvage this mess D'rek put me in but it could only work if that is all the longer you stall. I'm trying to remember if D'rek has offered you a stall action or not.