Malazan Empire: COVID-19 (aka Coronavirus, aka 2019-nCoV) - Malazan Empire

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COVID-19 (aka Coronavirus, aka 2019-nCoV)

#3421 User is offline   Azath Vitr (D'ivers 

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Posted 20 November 2022 - 10:45 PM

'Eric Topol
@EricTopol
I'm outraged by this pathetic and inexcusable inability for this country to go after nasal and better, durable, variant-proof vaccines

"U.S. FALLS BEHIND
ON COVID VACCINES

'WARP SPEED' SET BACK

Prospects Dim for Nasal
Sprays and Universal
Shots for Variants"

An explainer for why the US is not pursuing nasal vaccines. TLDR: there is no good explanation

The End of Covid Vaccines at 'Warp Speed' - The New York Times (nytimes.com)
'

Eric Topol on Twitter: "I'm outraged by this pathetic and inexcusable inability for this country to go after nasal and better, durable, variant-proof vaccines https://t.co/CuRQ51q8pi" / Twitter

'Efforts to test and produce next-generation Covid vaccines are bogged down by bureaucratic problems and funding shortfalls. Foreign rivals have raced ahead in approving long-awaited nasal-spray vaccines, including one invented in St. Louis, creating a scenario in which Americans would have to travel abroad for the latest in American vaccine technology.

The Biden administration has launched a last-ditch effort to restore the country's edge. [...] Biden asked the lame-duck session of Congress this week for $5 billion for next-generation vaccines and therapeutics, as part of a broader $9.25 billion pandemic spending request. But Republicans, having blocked requests for next-generation vaccine funding since the spring amid complaints about how the White House spent earlier pandemic aid allocations, have shown no signs of dropping their resistance.

[...] No next-generation vaccines are as close at hand, or as likely to reduce the spread of the virus, as those that can be inhaled or sprayed into the nose. [...]

China, India, Russia and Iran have all approved vaccines delivered through the nose or the mouth, even though they have not released much data about how the products work.

In the United States, nasal sprays have been held back by the same funding constraints and logistical hassles that, before the pandemic, often made developing vaccines a decade-long ordeal. [...]

"It went back to the prepandemic speed of vaccine development," [...] His team's nasal vaccine has undergone its most advanced testing in Mexico; collaborating with a pharmaceutical company there offered the fastest path to clinical trial funding. In the United States, he said, "The funding situation is pretty dire."

[...]

Last month, a nasal version of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine failed in a trial[...]

"It's a fundamentally more difficult venture than a shot in the arm, which we've been doing for over 100 years," [...]

The chances of any one candidate failing have discouraged America's largest vaccine makers from investing. [...]

[...] What is missing, scientists said, is money for pushing those vaccines out of university laboratories and into real-world studies now that they are urgently needed.

"We're at the last mile," [...] The costs of speeding up testing, he said, paled in comparison to the risks of waiting.'

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 20 November 2022 - 10:47 PM

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#3422 User is offline   Tsundoku 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 04:25 AM

So is China and by extension the rest of the world - unless we do what didn't but should have 3 years ago and isolate them - going to get that bad?

https://www.news.com...11280f7d99c998d
"Fortune favors the bold, though statistics favor the cautious." - Indomitable Courteous (Icy) Fist, The Palace Job - Patrick Weekes

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#3423 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 04:45 AM

I hope it doesn't. I have come not to trust Dr. Eric Feigl-Ding though. I don't believe he's a quack in his personal career or a grifter in the traditional sense (ie a profiteer), but he's extremely trigger happy with alarmist information and seems addicted to social media attention, at least enough that being frequently wrong hasn't influenced him to develop any kind of filter.
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#3424 User is offline   Lady Bliss 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 04:46 AM

I honestly don’t know what to believe anymore.
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#3425 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 06:25 AM

In summary (as far as I've gathered): Take as many preventative measures as you can to avoid contracting or spreading COVID-19. The vaccines are good for protecting against severe infection (ie the issues with the lungs that put people in ICUs and often kill them). However, "long COVID" can develop regardless of the severity of infection (higher severity does increase the likelihood, but it's not 1:1), and that may have mild to severe long-term effects on your cardiovascular, respiratory, neurological, and gastrointestinal health. It seems to also increase the likelihood of chronic conditions or even susceptibility to other illnesses.

All of the above appear to be unpredictable, somewhat correlated to, but again not 1:1 with, certain pre-existing conditions. The pandemic is not over -- may never be, in our lifetimes -- and a lot of people are dying earlier than they otherwise would be due to the deleterious effects of COVID even if the immediate cause of death is listed as a stroke or a heart attack, for instance. That's on top of the people still officially dying of COVID.

The article about China is focused on some very bad IFs leading to some very bad THENs -- and they're not outside the realm of possibility -- but neither should they be treated as facts, or without skepticism given Dr. Feigl-Ding's track record.in particular (in my opinion). With the perhaps obvious caveat that there's plenty of room for bad before you get to worst case scenario.

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#3426 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 07:07 AM

Perhaps worth noting that the sum total of my medical knowledge comes from Looney Tunes.



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#3427 User is offline   Gorefest 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 07:46 AM

View PostTsundoku, on 20 December 2022 - 04:25 AM, said:

So is China and by extension the rest of the world - unless we do what didn't but should have 3 years ago and isolate them - going to get that bad?

https://www.news.com...11280f7d99c998d


China is not like the rest of the world though, so you cannot just pose such an extension. Obviously time will tell, but there are very China-specific issues that make this such a big domestic problem. The two main reasons being a poor vaccination picture, especially among the vulnerable elderly - China claims a vaccination cover of over 90%, but their official heathcare data are notoriously unreliable and they have mostly shunned successful foreign vaccines in favour of much less effective China-made vaccines - and a very strict isolation policy which has led to an overall lack of herd immunity among the younger population.

The news floated about that this explosion of infections is self-inflicted by the Chinese people due to their protests against the lockdowns is dubious as well, because cases had already been ramping up badly prior to the world cup footage of full unmasked stadiums that supposedly triggered protests domestically. It was more likely a convenient scapegoat for the government to deflect the obvious failings of their chosen lockdown and vaccination approach. So now they can say 'You wanted this, you didnt listen to us, and now see what happens' and save face internationally. It is all very sad.

The biggest risk of course with cases spiralling out of control this badly (apart from all the tragic deaths and long covid cases) is that the virus mutation rate can also drastically increase. And that may lead to new, more nasty variants. Although the common trend seems to be that the most successful viral mutations tend to lean towards milder but more persistent infections and symptoms, as this improves longevity of infection among the global population.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 20 December 2022 - 07:47 AM

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#3428 User is offline   Azath Vitr (D'ivers 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 11:17 AM

Intranasal Sinovac doesn't require much special training to administer, which would make it easier for the government to force people to get vaccinated:

Posted Image


But they'll probably let the people suffer and die, at least for a while... 'see what happens when you protest and doubt the judgment of the government---be careful what you wish for!' Of course they don't want to harm the economy too much, or cause too much social unrest from inaction. And IDK how far along they are with their home-grown mRNA vaccine. Or how effective the intranasal vaccine actually is (intranasal seems like the best way to stop transmission, but it needs to be one that's effective and induces mucosal immunity...).
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#3429 User is offline   Tsundoku 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 12:46 PM

They'll probably let it rip until their ageing population problem is no longer a problem.
"Fortune favors the bold, though statistics favor the cautious." - Indomitable Courteous (Icy) Fist, The Palace Job - Patrick Weekes

"Well well well ... if it ain't The Invisible C**t." - Billy Butcher, The Boys

"I have strong views about not tempting providence and, as a wise man once said, the difference between luck and a wheelbarrow is, luck doesn’t work if you push it." - Colonel Orhan, Sixteen Ways to Defend a Walled City - KJ Parker
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#3430 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 03:02 PM

View PostTsundoku, on 20 December 2022 - 12:46 PM, said:

They'll probably let it rip until their ageing population problem is no longer a problem.


No joke, as far as their gov is concerned they have the population to spare.

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#3431 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 03:44 PM

View PostAbyss, on 20 December 2022 - 03:02 PM, said:

View PostTsundoku, on 20 December 2022 - 12:46 PM, said:

They'll probably let it rip until their ageing population problem is no longer a problem.


No joke, as far as their gov is concerned they have the population to spare.


What blows my mind is that China has an eye-wateringly huge population. If the regular ass people rose up and overthrew Xi Jinping and his ilk, they could be so much freer. Of anyone on the planet, they hold SO MUCH "people" power if they only saw fit to use it, this would all be over in a week. The only reason that the CCP still can control people is that the people accept it. Their numbers en-masse would be overwhelming, even for the Chinese military.
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#3432 User is offline   Gorefest 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 04:19 PM

I'm sure sure why you would think that the Chinese people overthrowing this government would resolve the Covid-19 issue. If anything, they probably benefit from having a strict regime in place to try and contain further excesses, regardless of how untasteful this may sound to a western ear. Obviously they wouldn't be in remotely as much of a mess if it wasn't for this regime in the first place, but at this point in time overthrowing the government seems like the last thing that they (or we) should want.
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#3433 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 20 December 2022 - 04:54 PM

View PostGorefest, on 20 December 2022 - 04:19 PM, said:

I'm sure sure why you would think that the Chinese people overthrowing this government would resolve the Covid-19 issue.


An apparently BIG part of the issue is Xi Jinpings refusal to use globally-created MUCH better vaccines. So they have a 90% vaccinated population with their own locally made, and much less efficacious vaccines...add in relaxing their insane Zero Covid policy and it's a recipe for a disaster. If the CCP wasn't in charge, they could get someone to allow the vaccines we have in the West into their population and maybe stem some of this wave.


View PostGorefest, on 20 December 2022 - 04:19 PM, said:

If anything, they probably benefit from having a strict regime in place to try and contain further excesses, regardless of how untasteful this may sound to a western ear. Obviously they wouldn't be in remotely as much of a mess if it wasn't for this regime in the first place, but at this point in time overthrowing the government seems like the last thing that they (or we) should want.


I feel like ZERO COVID or the new lax measures mean not much in a 90% vaccinated population to stem the wave...the problem other than obvious healthcare capacity ones for such a huge population, is clearly shitty homegrown vaccines that aren't doing their job well.
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#3434 User is offline   Tsundoku 

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Posted 24 December 2022 - 04:17 AM

Estimated 37 million people in China infected in one day. Holy shit.

https://www.news.com...29e70711a39da01

China Covid-19 outbreak is the ‘largest the world has ever seen’
China’s top health authority has confirmed the country’s current outbreak is, by far, the largest the world has ever seen.

Chloe Whelan

December 24, 2022 - 2:49PM

Near 37 million people in China were estimated to have been infected with Covid-19 on a single day this week, according to minutes from a meeting of the country’s National Health Commission, Bloomberg reported.

As many as 248 million people – nearly 18 per cent of China’s 1.4 billion-strong population – likely contracted the virus in the first 20 days of December, the health body estimated.

The figures dwarf the previous daily record of about four million and, if accurate, confirm China’s current outbreak is easily the worst ever seen – all while the official tally screams of a cover up.

Suspicions of a cover up

The 37 million daily cases estimated for Tuesday is drastically different to the mere 3049 infections that were officially reported, and is several times higher than the previous world record.

Global cases hit an all-time high of four million on January 19, 2022, as Omicron took the reins as the most prevalent variant.

The estimate is also miles higher than a recent estimate from London-based predictive health researcher Airfinity, which earlier this week guessed about one million people in China were being infected, and 5000 people were dying each day.

Chinese President Xi Jinping abruptly abandoned his controversial zero-Covid policy amid fierce anti-government protests, prompting the tsunami of cases while the official death toll remains suspiciously low.

Officially, China claimed on Wednesday there had been just eight Covid deaths since the beginning of December.

But that number doesn’t include Solomon Islands ambassador John Moffat Fugui, who has died in China amid Beijing’s Covid wave, according to The Australian.

The statistics contrast a growing number of reports of overwhelmed hospitals and crematoriums pushed beyond their capacity. Horrifying footage has shown bodies “piling up” outside morgues and in hospital hallways as the medical system buckles.

On Thursday, AFP reported visiting a crematorium in China and witnessing 40 bodies being unloaded in two hours.

The relatives of several of the deceased told the publication the deaths were due to Covid. One woman said her elderly relative, who was suffering from cold symptoms, had tested negative but died after they could not get an ambulance in time.

A woman in her 20s said she suspected her father had died of Covid, though he had not been tested.

“He died too quickly, while on the way to hospital,” she sobbed. “He had lung issues to begin with … He was only 69.”

One Shanghai hospital has told its staff to prepare for a “tragic battle” with COVID-19, as it expects half of the city’s 25 million people to be infected by the end of next week.

‘Deceased, deceased’: Makeshift wards handle the dead

“Deceased, deceased,” a staffer in full protective gear shouted as she handed a nurse a death certificate, their hospital in central China overflowing with Covid patients.

At No. 5 People’s Hospital in Chongqing, the main entrance lobby had been converted into a makeshift Covid ward when AFP visited on Friday.

In the vast atrium, about a dozen beds occupied by mainly elderly patients on IV drips were cordoned off with red and white tape.

In a nearby room, about 40 mostly elderly and middle-aged patients sat on sofas and lay on beds receiving IV drips, some coughing.

A nurse said they all had Covid.

A political death toll

The official death tally also appears to ebb and flow with political protests in the country.

Jin Dongyan, a virologist at the University of Hong Kong told CNN the definition of a “Covid death” was broadened slightly in April this year, to justify the suffocating restrictions of Shanghai’s Covid lockdown.

Shanghai was locked down from March to June amid fervent protests, with residents barred from leaving their homes even for groceries. Just 588 Covid deaths were reported in that time, from 600,000 infections.

Once the lockdown lifted, however, the official nationwide death toll sat at zero for six months – despite soaring case numbers.

According to Dr Jin, these inconsistencies reveal China’s method of counting Covid deaths to be “entirely subjective.”

“The death data has been misleading from the start,” he told the publication.

Government seizes medications as residents struggle

Meanwhile, the government has been accused of seizing medical supplies as residents struggle to buy the essentials.

Authorities urged those with mild symptoms to stay at home and take treatment into their own hands, leading to a run on everything from ibuprofen to rapid antigen tests. However, more than a dozen Chinese pharmaceutical firms have been tapped by officials to “secure supplies” of key drugs for the government, according to AFP interviews and local media.

At least 11 of 42 test kit makers whose products are licensed by China’s medical regulators had a part of their production seized by the government or received orders from the state, local reports said.

The sweeping illness has “collapsed” China’s broader logistics and transportation sector. Viral footage taken in China shows huge piles of boxes lying in the street and packed into overflowing vehicles, indicating a serious backlog of deliveries.

It adds to an already worrying shortage of pain and fever medications, and sparked concerns of a global shortage given China’s status as a global manufacturing hub.

Spread of a new variant

There are also fears a dangerous subvariant could form in the rapid-fire transmission among China’s huge population.

Daniel Lucey, a fellow at the Infectious Diseases Society of America and professor at Dartmouth University’s Geisel School of Medicine, previously told Bloomberg there would “certainly be more Omicron subvariants developing in China in the coming days, weeks and months”.

The World Health Organisation also rang the alarm bells, with Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus telling reporters on Wednesday that more information was needed as a matter of urgency.

China’s foreign ministry spokesperson, on the other hand, claimed China had always released Covid-19 information in a “transparent” manner.

The outbreak is particularly worrying in a country with low vaccination rates among the elderly.

China has relied largely on its own vaccines, which have been proven less effective at preventing serious illness and deaths from Covid than the mRNA jabs used across the world.
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#3435 User is offline   Nicodimas 

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Posted 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM

“As a physician I believe Damar Hamlin was likely suffering from commotio cordis where a blow to the chest at a precise moment in the electrical cycle stops the heart. Those trying to tie this to vaccine status to project their unscientific beliefs are terrible, horrible people." Chris Haddock

Actually one of things that will strike me hardest about Covid is the vaccinated pointing out each time someone died from Covid who was unvaccinated. Like they would shout out with glee that person deserved it. How dare they resist the standing orders set forth.

Of course the question we should be asking is why profits over people. Excess deaths double digits, sports players daily news dieing from heart attacks, in there sleep. SADs (sudden acute death syndrome) for adults being normalized.

https://rwmalonemd.s...deling-gone-bad

Of course can’t talk about side effects cause it saved humanity…

https://goodsciencin...ter-covid-shot/

Just a weird set of events have been going down. If your curious go looks at the stats of people dieing. It’s all public information.I think it’s okay to realize profits over people is a thing :

https://gettr.com/post/p23qpm4d47a
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#3436 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 03 January 2023 - 08:08 PM

View PostNicodimas, on 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:

Actually one of things that will strike me hardest about Covid is the vaccinated pointing out each time someone died from Covid who was unvaccinated. Like they would shout out with glee that person deserved it. How dare they resist the standing orders set forth.


TIL that getting a voluntary vaccine to protect yourself and those around you from possible serious illness or death is somehow "standing orders"

Smoking that shit early in the day today huh Nico?

View PostNicodimas, on 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:

Of course the question we should be asking is why profits over people. Excess deaths double digits, sports players daily news dieing from heart attacks, in there sleep. SADs (sudden acute death syndrome) for adults being normalized.


Sources and what this has to do with COVID please?

View PostNicodimas, on 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:



Oh look, one of the hundreds of people who have been involved in the stages of the research into mRNA during his tenure as a graduate student in 1988, who figured out MUCH later in his life that if he pretended like he invented the thing he could grift the fuck out of people by telling people it's bad...cool cool....When in reality hundreds of scientists, doctors and scholars have spent nearly 40 years making mRNA vaccines what they needed to be for COVID, which include not just other
Respiratory virus events like SARS, but the leaps made to ANY science (especially health sciences) in the 29 years SINCE his relatively minor involvement in the science that is mRNA vaccination could fill volumes...unless we are all pretending like medicine in 1988 and 2020 are interchangeable...which....yeah...it very much amuses me you fell for his grift though...bravo I guess.

The mRNA vaccines have repeatedly been shown to help prevent symptomatic coronavirus infections and reduce their severity. This is an indisputable fact. It was a fact when they were being tested on many tens of thousands of patients for the trials, and remains a fact 2+ years after their debut and distribution to the populace.

Anything else is misinformation combatted by MOST scientists, doctors, immunologists, and others in the academia associated with them.

What's better, mRNA is going to lead to Nobel prizes when it starts being adapted to help with other diseases and afflictions...my bet is that by that time Malone will want that piece of the pie and will try to grift off that once it's no longer making him money to be the Vaccine Skeptic he currently is.

View PostNicodimas, on 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:

Of course can’t talk about side effects cause it saved humanity…


Side effects from vaccines (ALL VACCINES) occur in short term, not long term. Most in the days after you get the shot. The vaccine is out of your system weeks after.

You might want to look into something called population risk.

View PostNicodimas, on 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:



Fucking hell...if the web addy "goodsciencing" wasn't enough to tell you how bullshit the "misinformation" on that site is...the manifesto of "Real Science. Science needs open discussion anything else is totalitarian." should seal that view...holy fuck...LOL

Do you get tired of posting links to terrible websites that not only lack any hierarchy of evidence, but also clearly tell you up front they are part of the fringe of misinformation with their weird ass manifestos Nico? My gods....

View PostNicodimas, on 03 January 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:

Just a weird set of events have been going down. If your curious go looks at the stats of people dieing. It’s all public information.


Stats of people dying from what? COVID Vaccines? Yeah, sure, please post them from a reputable site. And don't try to post the VAERS site, using that to prove your easily disprovable shit has already been long debunked.

Moreover, I can't believe you are still doing this...most of you dropped off this nonsense a while back. Even my own sister came to her senses about it.

Lastly, tell me this....for the countries that used a MASSIVE amount of (and still use) NON-mRNA vaccines....like the Astra Zeneca vaccine they developed and used in Britain (and Canada; I have one shot of that) which follow the more common Viral Vector vaccines we have used in all of our previous history of vaccine use....what about them? You can't fall back on Malone's idiocy about the mRNA vaccines with regards to them, as we've been using viral vector vaccines since the 1970's guy....so please, tell me how that jives with your shit?

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 03 January 2023 - 08:08 PM

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#3437 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 03 January 2023 - 09:24 PM

QT you have to start from the knowledge that a certain group of individuals who happen to share certain traits are secretly running the world, and work backwards from there.
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#3438 User is offline   Tiste Simeon 

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Posted 04 January 2023 - 12:07 AM

People like Nico get confused at stuff like viruses because you can't solve the problem with a gun... Hence the hokey websites.
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#3439 User is offline   Tsundoku 

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Posted 04 January 2023 - 04:38 AM

President Xi is awesome. He has opened up the economy, generously pushed to share the virus restore unrestricted travel around the world and is even solving China's ageing population problem ... all at once!

https://www.news.com...fa8a9640fa8681f
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#3440 User is offline   TheRetiredBridgeburner 

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Posted 04 January 2023 - 09:50 AM

View Postworry, on 03 January 2023 - 09:24 PM, said:

QT you have to start from the knowledge that a certain group of individuals who happen to share certain traits are secretly running the world, and work backwards from there.


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