[amphibian]

Azath Vitr (D, on 06 July 2020 - 11:14 PM, said:

Not a Sheep, on 06 July 2020 - 10:57 PM, said:

Oh I'm definitely going to be finding another very soon and I hate that I have to do so. I just am so uncomfortable seeing people's eyes only. It's not human.

Right, just like using computers, automobiles, or clothes is 'not human'.

The eyes are extremely expressive, and can be more accurate indicators of emotion than the lips:

'A neurologist explains how to spot a fake smile

[...]

Look at the contraction of the muscles around his eyes. That only happens with smiles that reflect true, happy emotions.

On the other hand, a fake smile doesn't use those muscles. When forcing a smile, we use a muscle in each cheek, called the risorius, to pull our lips into the right shape, but the eye muscles don't contract. To demonstrate this, Duchenne electrically stimulated the risorius muscles of his tooth-less friend.'

https://www.business...%20the%20brain.

'It turns out that participants were highly accurate in determining emotions, such as fear and anger, just from looking at images of other people's eyes.'

https://blogs.scient...%20the%20truth.

Attitudes towards masks vary by culture (and over history). They're generally accepted in East Asia.

Interesting article:

'In Japan, it's sometimes said that the eyes speak as much as the mouth.

Perhaps the proverbial phrase captures the essence of the nation's affinity for face masks, a relationship that can be traced back centuries and a custom to which is attributed Japan's lower number of deaths from COVID-19 compared with Western nations — in particular the United States, where wearing a mask has recently become a politically charged issue.

Masks are now omnipresent in Japan as a result of the pandemic, thanks in part to an inherent mask-wearing culture. Besides being sporadically worn during hay fever and influenza seasons, masks have expanded beyond their traditional role over the years and have even been adopted by the fashion and beauty industries.

[...] There's even a term for women who look good in masks — masuku bijin (masked beauty) — and contests are held to decide who among them looks the most attractive donning one.

https://www.japantim...ks-coronavirus/

I'm deaf. Like 90-95% hearing gone in most frequencies.

Opaque masks mean I lose basically every other word a person says to me. Every social interaction takes longer, creates frustration for both sides, and has a higher chance of error.

It's hard with masks, but it's harder to go through COVID-19 and expose others to that.

So find a comfortable mask. I can send Etsy links to what I use - super comfy.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement announced Monday that international students "may not take a full online course load and remain in the United States" during the fall 2020 semester, as schools and universities across the country consider how to reopen amid the coronavirus pandemic.

International students [...] cannot remain in the U.S. or legally enter the U.S. if their studies are entirely online, and ICE recommended in a press release that students whose schools are online-only should "[transfer] to a school with in-person instruction to remain in lawful status."

[...] the school must certify "that the student is not taking an entirely online course load this semester."

[...] 1,095,299: The number of international students in the U.S. during the 2018-2019 academic year'

https://www.forbes.c...0g#1e387e3b5ee1

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 07 July 2020 - 03:26 AM

[Cause]

Azath Vitr (D, on 07 July 2020 - 03:25 AM, said:

'U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement announced Monday that international students "may not take a full online course load and remain in the United States" during the fall 2020 semester, as schools and universities across the country consider how to reopen amid the coronavirus pandemic.

International students [...] cannot remain in the U.S. or legally enter the U.S. if their studies are entirely online, and ICE recommended in a press release that students whose schools are online-only should "[transfer] to a school with in-person instruction to remain in lawful status."

[...] the school must certify "that the student is not taking an entirely online course load this semester."

[...] 1,095,299: The number of international students in the U.S. during the 2018-2019 academic year'

https://www.forbes.c...0g#1e387e3b5ee1

These people are sick!

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

amphibian, on 07 July 2020 - 03:01 AM, said:

Azath Vitr (D, on 06 July 2020 - 11:14 PM, said:

Not a Sheep, on 06 July 2020 - 10:57 PM, said:

Oh I'm definitely going to be finding another very soon and I hate that I have to do so. I just am so uncomfortable seeing people's eyes only. It's not human.

Right, just like using computers, automobiles, or clothes is 'not human'.

The eyes are extremely expressive, and can be more accurate indicators of emotion than the lips:

'A neurologist explains how to spot a fake smile

[...]

Look at the contraction of the muscles around his eyes. That only happens with smiles that reflect true, happy emotions.

On the other hand, a fake smile doesn't use those muscles. When forcing a smile, we use a muscle in each cheek, called the risorius, to pull our lips into the right shape, but the eye muscles don't contract. To demonstrate this, Duchenne electrically stimulated the risorius muscles of his tooth-less friend.'

https://www.business...%20the%20brain.

'It turns out that participants were highly accurate in determining emotions, such as fear and anger, just from looking at images of other people's eyes.'

https://blogs.scient...%20the%20truth.

Attitudes towards masks vary by culture (and over history). They're generally accepted in East Asia.

Interesting article:

'In Japan, it's sometimes said that the eyes speak as much as the mouth.

Perhaps the proverbial phrase captures the essence of the nation's affinity for face masks, a relationship that can be traced back centuries and a custom to which is attributed Japan's lower number of deaths from COVID-19 compared with Western nations — in particular the United States, where wearing a mask has recently become a politically charged issue.

Masks are now omnipresent in Japan as a result of the pandemic, thanks in part to an inherent mask-wearing culture. Besides being sporadically worn during hay fever and influenza seasons, masks have expanded beyond their traditional role over the years and have even been adopted by the fashion and beauty industries.

[...] There's even a term for women who look good in masks — masuku bijin (masked beauty) — and contests are held to decide who among them looks the most attractive donning one.

https://www.japantim...ks-coronavirus/

I'm deaf. Like 90-95% hearing gone in most frequencies.

Opaque masks mean I lose basically every other word a person says to me. Every social interaction takes longer, creates frustration for both sides, and has a higher chance of error.

It's hard with masks, but it's harder to go through COVID-19 and expose others to that.

So find a comfortable mask. I can send Etsy links to what I use - super comfy.

Please do share. Always looking out for a better mask.

[QuickTidal]

As of today, Masks are mandatory indoors everywhere and on the transit in Toronto...so that means that a lot of selfish people are going to come up with fake medical conditions that "prevent them from wearing a mask", and since you can't legally ask them about the condition, anyone who is anti-mask can just lie. I say this because a well-known 5G, alt-right conspiracy theorist put up a YouTube video call to action that tonight they will group up in the centre of the city and ride the TTC maskless to show how "free" they are and how Johhny Government can't tell them what to do!


Ugh. Thankfully, I would surmise that an overwhelming majority will follow the rules...but there are enough selfish Pricks out there to possibly ruin it for everyone else.

[amphibian]

QuickTidal, on 07 July 2020 - 01:45 PM, said:

As of today, Masks are mandatory indoors everywhere and on the transit in Toronto...so that means that a lot of selfish people are going to come up with fake medical conditions that "prevent them from wearing a mask", and since you can't legally ask them about the condition, anyone who is anti-mask can just lie. I say this because a well-known 5G, alt-right conspiracy theorist put up a YouTube video call to action that tonight they will group up in the centre of the city and ride the TTC maskless to show how "free" they are and how Johhny Government can't tell them what to do!


Ugh. Thankfully, I would surmise that an overwhelming majority will follow the rules...but there are enough selfish Pricks out there to possibly ruin it for everyone else.

The laws in Canada are different enough that I cannot speak with authority on them.

However, in the US, I am working with housing courts to provide reasonable accommodations to disabled people appearing in court. One issue is that some people cannot wear masks.

People who use mouthpieces to guide their wheelchairs and so on cannot wear a mask. Those who require supplemental oxygen often cannot wear a mask. Those with PTSD/severe claustrophobia/severe anxiety may not be able to wear a mask.

But there's face shields, remote appearances (especially good for those with anxiety), home delivery of groceries, and more that we can do to work around this mask problem. This should be nearly a non issue for just about everyone who has a set of problems that makes mask wearing difficult or impossible. Education of grocery store managers and other similar people will help towards cutting the bullshit fakers out.

This link says most of the relevant stuff in concise and authoritative form:https://www.adasoutheast.org/ada/publications/legal/ada-and-face-mask-policies.php

In the US, we can ask what the disability is - although this is severely curtailed in job interviews - and even ask to see medical documentation to figure out a beat reasonable accommodation. Is it different in Canada?

[QuickTidal]

amphibian, on 07 July 2020 - 02:19 PM, said:

In the US, we can ask what the disability is - although this is severely curtailed in job interviews - and even ask to see medical documentation to figure out a beat reasonable accommodation. Is it different in Canada?

As far as I'm aware, you cannot ask someone what their disability is for any reason because that can lead to discrimination. I believe it's in place to prevent discrimination in like jobs and whatnot.

That said, the majority of people with actual medical issues that prevent mask use, are not going to swan up into the local grocery store and video themselves making a stink about having to wear one. So the liars are easy to suss out.

But yeah, this guy is a well-known local POS conspiracy/freedom asshole:

http://www.youtube.c...eature=emb_logo

[QuickTidal]

And here is the lady kicked out of the hospital upthread, AND the dude I just posted about...doing what they set out to do...what a bunch of absolute entitled morons.

[Aptorian]

It's been half a year or so since the pandemic began. Is there any examples of people who've had the virus, gotten cleared and then getting infected again? Or are people actually temporarily immune after getting sick?

[amphibian]

Aptorian, on 07 July 2020 - 03:40 PM, said:

It's been half a year or so since the pandemic began. Is there any examples of people who've had the virus, gotten cleared and then getting infected again? Or are people actually temporarily immune after getting sick?

We don't know for sure. Right now, there isn't enough information to be definitive about COVID-19 in that way. It's possible that people are being deemed "better" when they're not and having the same infection surge after they leave the hospital. It's possible that they're getting infected again due to rapid loss of antibodies.

There's just not enough information to have a clear theory on this yet.

However, some other corona viruses do have well documented cases of reinfection, so being cautious seems like a better idea than not.

This does a decent job of explaining the above:

https://consultqd.cl...ient-questions/

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'Brazilian president Jair Bolsonaro tests positive for coronavirus

Bolsonaro, 65, announces: "It came back positive"

[...] In March, as Covid-19 claimed its first victims in Brazil, the far-right populist used an address to the nation to brag that, if infected, he would quickly shake off the illness thanks to his "athlete's background".

After announcing his positive result on Tuesday, Bolsonaro stepped back from the reporters he was addressing, removed his mask and, grinning, said: "Just look at my face. I'm well, fine, thank God … Thanks to all those who have been praying for me … and to those who criticise me, no problem, carry on criticising as much as you like."
[...] Reports of Bolsonaro's possible infection first emerged on Monday evening, with local news outlets reporting that he had been tested after developing coronavirus symptoms, including a 38C temperature and a persistent cough.

[...] Bolsonaro's son, Carlos, attacked critics of his father who he claimed were willing the president's death.

"The immense number of people rooting for the death of the head of the executive right now should trigger an immediate show of solidarity from other [political] leaders," Carlos Bolsonaro tweeted.'

https://www.theguard...ro5wVSgXsaHaYpw

I hope he dies.

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 07 July 2020 - 04:15 PM

[Vengeance]

I feel that this plague scenario is finally starting to ramp up. Once the first government falls it usually starts a waterfall effect. Can someone show me the cure bar and the % infected. It might be time to make it harder for 1st world countries to develop a cure.

[QuickTidal]

amphibian, on 07 July 2020 - 03:57 PM, said:

Aptorian, on 07 July 2020 - 03:40 PM, said:

It's been half a year or so since the pandemic began. Is there any examples of people who've had the virus, gotten cleared and then getting infected again? Or are people actually temporarily immune after getting sick?

We don't know for sure. Right now, there isn't enough information to be definitive about COVID-19 in that way. It's possible that people are being deemed "better" when they're not and having the same infection surge after they leave the hospital. It's possible that they're getting infected again due to rapid loss of antibodies.

There's just not enough information to have a clear theory on this yet.

However, some other corona viruses do have well documented cases of reinfection, so being cautious seems like a better idea than not.

This does a decent job of explaining the above:

https://consultqd.cl...ient-questions/

Add into this what I'm hearing from the people I know on the frontlines that people who are getting better are having problems for weeks an months and in some cases have developed major issues with respiratory problems, but also with blood clotting, kidney issues...ect. long after the fact.

The after effects of this almost seem scarier than the virus in some cases. I'm terrified of getting this and having it be mild only for it to give me LIFELONG problems afterwards.

This is what I kept trying to tell the "it's just the flu" crowd...this virus literally didn't exist in humans until Nov '19....as such the idea that we know everything about it to make that type of call is asinine and immature.

[Mezla PigDog]

As far as I am aware there is no credible peer reviewed evidence of reinfection yet. The incidence of virus in most of the world is too low to get statistically valid data for some time e.g. in Wuhan it is pretty much under control. The best data will come from healthcare workers who are more exposed than the rest of us and should be better tested than the average citizen. Lucky them being the guinea pigs for the rest of us!

The most likely scenario due to knowledge gained from other coronaviruses is that infection will almost definitely confer some temporary immunity. The question is how temporary - months or years. I have seen some evidence showing the measurable immune response dying down 2+ months post infection but what that means clinically remains to be seen. I can fully see us in 5 years time living in a world where everyone needs their COVID-19 vaccine booster every 1, 2 years or 5 years or something.

[Malankazooie]

Been hearing a lot if misinformed dummies say "oh this is just the 2nd wave and it's expected, it will eventually go down like what happened in May". Uh, no dummies, we are still in the first wave. 2nd wave has been projected by some scientists to hit in the autumn when the weather turns colder. Remember when that doctor who was shunned by the Trump admin said we could have one of the darkest winters ever? Heed those words and keep them on the front burner of your consciousness as the autumn approaches.

This post has been edited by Malankazooie: 07 July 2020 - 06:51 PM

[QuickTidal]

Not a Sheep, on 07 July 2020 - 07:09 PM, said:

I don’t think school going to reopen doors this year.

Probably not in your country, no.

Hell, we have flattened the curve quite well in Canada (only 182 cases in our country today, & 15 deaths), and even our school boards are leery and cautious about what's going to happen in September. I mean, they will open, but it's going to be touch and go as we see how it goes. As long as by then we're under 50 cases for the country per day, we should be in good shape.

Considering the USA has had multiple days of 40-50k+ cases...you guys may not even see a proper school year until second half of 2021...and that's if you elect Biden in November and he's able to steer the country away from the anti-science crowd....if you re-elect Trump, the virus is going to be rampant for a long long time yet, and the cases and deaths will continue to climb.

[amphibian]

I hope that there is no physical school in the US this fall, but we have actual movie villains in power in many states and the federal government that are demanding that schools reopen.

If we'd contained it like Canada, it's worth exploring. But we haven't and the lies + yelling in anger at a virus and the libs continue to happen.

This post has been edited by amphibian: 07 July 2020 - 08:28 PM

[Mezla PigDog]

The US is blatantly still in the first wave. The UK could be, it will depend on what the curve looks like when it starts going up again. The only silver lining is that having western countries in the grip of infection means there will be more cases for the countries with good research infrastructure to investigate. The UK has a decent study going following healthcare workers who had confirmed infection through next phase - this is something we are actually good at as a country. Although I did think Public Health England was world beating before this so I may very well be wrong. In my defense it was world beating 10 years ago.

You also can't prove a vaccine works without plenty of cases so ... erm .... thanks US and UK governments on behalf of the rest of the world I guess. Just got to keep our economies afloat to be able to pay for the research I guess. There's always Brazil if not...

My son starts school in September. The school have today said they plan to open fully with no social distancing between year groups but no cross over between year groups or teachers. Pre coronavirus I had been fretting about wraparound care to keep him until 5pm when I finished work but now I can't be bothered making any plans. We have decided to wing it and our employers hopefully won't notice and I'll never have to travel for work again. I never would have attempted this in a million years before April but it feels futile to fuss over plans that probably won't even happen over winter when we're all locked down again. My mantra these days is very much "Well, fuck it".

[amphibian]

One of the shitty things about this pandemic is that it's really highlighting how there's work expectations of not having children pop up during the day, especially for women.

We're all home and some of us don't have 4000 square feet to disperse within.

My pups pop in every now and then. My co-workers have kids and pets too. We're making sure to give room and grace.

I hope yours do at least something towards that.

[Andorion]

Things are really shitty here. Cases are increasing, testing is still difficult, hospitals are full.

We are consistently above 20K daily cases. Just going grocery shopping is scary.

The government opened up a lot of things in June and now we are all facing the consequences of that. Lockdown is being selectively reimposed, but a huge amount of damage has been done