[Nevyn]

 Messremb, on 23 February 2018 - 08:09 PM, said:

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 08:08 PM, said:

Have we started the voting on Messremb's government? Because he already messed it up.


Next chancellor is term limited. But not next president.

How so?

Say we approve your government and it passes a liberal policy.

We vote nein on Drek's government.

Who does Dolmen make chancellor?

This post has been edited by Nevyn: 23 February 2018 - 08:12 PM

[Nevyn]

This is the basic ideal playbook for the rest of the game



Messremb makes Dolmen chancellor
if Liberal:
Nein on Drek
Dolmen makes Vengeance chancellor
if Liberal, we win

if fascist, Dolmen uses next power to make vengeance next president
if Liberal we win

if fascist (that would be 6 fascist cards in a row), Dolmen uses kill on Nom or Cause
nein on tatts's gov
nein on cause/nom's gov (whichever wasnt killed)
vengeance makes Mess chancellor

etc

if Fascist (on Mess gov), Mess uses power to make Dolmen pres

Dolmen-Vengeance
then presidency reverts to Drek, then back to Dolmen, who adds Mess

If we need another pres after that it gets a bit messy, but we can also vote nein on 3 straight governments to "reset" term limits if you really don't want to trust another chancellor


Basically within the triangle you always want to make the next trusted president your chancellor

This post has been edited by Nevyn: 23 February 2018 - 08:21 PM

[D'rek]

Yup, sounds about right.

Though if we really do get 6 fascist cards in a row I might be suspicious

[Messremb]

So next president likely to elect someone needs to be Chancellor before president.

Too late on this one as my vote went in as I posted to thread.

[Nevyn]

No biggie, Dolmen will need 1 outside chancellor

And unless you pass a fascist policy with Venge, there will be no hitler risk on Dolmen's presidency

[Messremb]

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 08:34 PM, said:

No biggie, Dolmen will need 1 outside chancellor

And unless you pass a fascist policy with Venge, there will be no hitler risk on Dolmen's presidency

No risk he says.

WCS I get 3 fascist and Venge is Hitler

[Nevyn]

 Messremb, on 23 February 2018 - 09:21 PM, said:

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 08:34 PM, said:

No biggie, Dolmen will need 1 outside chancellor

And unless you pass a fascist policy with Venge, there will be no hitler risk on Dolmen's presidency

No risk he says.

WCS I get 3 fascist and Venge is Hitler

Hitler applies to the next government after the next fascist policy.

Also I know Venge is not hitler, so Im not exactly worried.

[Dolmen 2.0]

 Messremb, on 23 February 2018 - 09:21 PM, said:

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 08:34 PM, said:

No biggie, Dolmen will need 1 outside chancellor

And unless you pass a fascist policy with Venge, there will be no hitler risk on Dolmen's presidency

No risk he says.

WCS I get 3 fascist and Venge is Hitler

So I decided that Tatts and Nom are fascists. looking back at on thread interaction or lack thereof and I think its quite likely. it's my gut reaction so I'm just gonna commit to it.

I'm gonna appoint Nevyn as outside chancellor. Pretty sure he isn't Hitler and if he is fascist he is helping far too much.

Cause being Cause missed his chance to redeem himself by being subject to a find by Nevyn so either Nevyn is trying a long con or he is genuinely making an effort to get Liberal on track.

This will ruffle a few feathers but unless I see a beautiful mind type explanation against this I'm going this direction.

[Vengeance]

 Dolmen 2.0, on 23 February 2018 - 09:41 PM, said:

 Messremb, on 23 February 2018 - 09:21 PM, said:

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 08:34 PM, said:

No biggie, Dolmen will need 1 outside chancellor

And unless you pass a fascist policy with Venge, there will be no hitler risk on Dolmen's presidency

No risk he says.

WCS I get 3 fascist and Venge is Hitler

So I decided that Tatts and Nom are fascists. looking back at on thread interaction or lack thereof and I think its quite likely. it's my gut reaction so I'm just gonna commit to it.

I'm gonna appoint Nevyn as outside chancellor. Pretty sure he isn't Hitler and if he is fascist he is helping far too much.

Cause being Cause missed his chance to redeem himself by being subject to a find by Nevyn so either Nevyn is trying a long con or he is genuinely making an effort to get Liberal on track.

This will ruffle a few feathers but unless I see a beautiful mind type explanation against this I'm going this direction.

I think that you are wrong and I think that Nevyn is a bad choice. I think that Nevyn is doing a long con. I need to read back over the rules. I feel like I am missing something. I am going to hold off voting until I have a better understanding of the presidential rules and if someone can be a chancellor then a president.

[Vengeance]

Quote

Eligibility: The last elected President and Chancellor are “term-limited,” and ineligible to be nominated as Chancellor Candidate.
ON ELIGIBILITY: •
Term limits apply to the President and Chancellor who were last elected, not to the last pair nominated.
• Term limits only affect nominations to the Chancellorship; anyone can be President, even someone who was just Chancellor

Who do we have. So if Dolman has Mess be his Chancellor then Mess is President with me as Chancellor then I am President with Dolman as Chancellor. No need for a 4th party.

Actually scratch that. According to the sign up list

Drek
Dol
Tatts
Cause
Nomnomnomnom
Venge
Nyven
Messremb.

I would be the next one after Dol to be President. Is that correct? I really don't like the thought of adding a 4th componant to the equation if we have 3 players who are VPI liberal.

[Nevyn]

You are correct on the order venge.

You can't really avoid a 4th player (once only) now unless the next president gets 3 fascist cards, which is unlikely


The only alternative would be to enact a random policy, which would reset term limits.


But that is something liberals usually only try when there are already 3 fascist policies past , and "sudden death" with Hitler is online.


And again, if a third fascist policy is passed now, you can keep it within the 3.




I wasn't kidding earlier. Liberals have it won. Even with Messremb's mistake, as long as the 3 of you hold faith in one another, everything is fine.

[Vengeance]

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 10:11 PM, said:

Quote

Eligibility: The last elected President and Chancellor are “term-limited,” and ineligible to be nominated as Chancellor Candidate.
ON ELIGIBILITY: •
Term limits apply to the President and Chancellor who were last elected, not to the last pair nominated.
• Term limits only affect nominations to the Chancellorship; anyone can be President, even someone who was just Chancellor

Who do we have. So if Dolman has Mess be his Chancellor then Mess is President with me as Chancellor then I am President with Dolman as Chancellor. No need for a 4th party.

Actually scratch that. According to the sign up list

Drek
Dol
Tatts
Cause
Nomnomnomnom
Venge
Nyven
Messremb.

I would be the next one after Dol to be President. Is that correct? I really don't like the thought of adding a 4th componant to the equation if we have 3 players who are VPI liberal.

There are a couple of things that we need to be aware of.

Call Special Election The President chooses any other player at the table to be the next Presidential Candidate by passing that player the President placard. Any player can become President—even players that are term-limited. The new President nominates an eligible player as Chancellor Candidate and the Election proceeds as usual.
A Special Election does not skip any players. After a Special Election, the President placard returns to the left of the President who enacted the Special Election.
If the President passes the presidency to the next player in the rotation, that player would get to run for President twice in a row: once for the Special Election and once for their normal shift in the Presidential rotation.

and

If the group rejects three governments in a row, the country is thrown into chaos. Immediately reveal the Policy on top of the Policy deck and enact it. Any power granted by this Policy is ignored, but the Election Tracker resets, and existing term-limits are forgotten


There are 3 presidents between Dol and Me. If we tried to skip all of them then the top policy would be inacted.

That seems like a huge gamble. Frankly I don't like this at all.

[Vengeance]

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 10:23 PM, said:

You are correct on the order venge.

You can't really avoid a 4th player (once only) now unless the next president gets 3 fascist cards, which is unlikely


The only alternative would be to enact a random policy, which would reset term limits.


But that is something liberals usually only try when there are already 3 fascist policies past , and "sudden death" with Hitler is online.


And again, if a third fascist policy is passed now, you can keep it within the 3.




I wasn't kidding earlier. Liberals have it won. Even with Messremb's mistake, as long as the 3 of you hold faith in one another, everything is fine.

The biggest problem that I see is the 3 presidencies in between Dol an me. Skipping will reset.

[Nevyn]

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 10:25 PM, said:

The biggest problem that I see is the 3 presidencies in between Dol an me. Skipping will reset.

Thats not really a problem either.

Look at the next 2 presidential powers on fascist missions

And if there are no fascist missions, the game is won on Dolmen's presidency.

Seriously guys, we cannot lose.

[Messremb]

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 10:31 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 10:25 PM, said:

The biggest problem that I see is the 3 presidencies in between Dol an me. Skipping will reset.

Thats not really a problem either.

Look at the next 2 presidential powers on fascist missions

And if there are no fascist missions, the game is won on Dolmen's presidency.

Seriously guys, we cannot lose.

Better point that out to Mac then, call the game.

Unless we're wrong about something...

[Messremb]

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 10:23 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 10:11 PM, said:

Quote

Eligibility: The last elected President and Chancellor are “term-limited,” and ineligible to be nominated as Chancellor Candidate.
ON ELIGIBILITY: •
Term limits apply to the President and Chancellor who were last elected, not to the last pair nominated.
• Term limits only affect nominations to the Chancellorship; anyone can be President, even someone who was just Chancellor

Who do we have. So if Dolman has Mess be his Chancellor then Mess is President with me as Chancellor then I am President with Dolman as Chancellor. No need for a 4th party.

Actually scratch that. According to the sign up list

Drek
Dol
Tatts
Cause
Nomnomnomnom
Venge
Nyven
Messremb.

I would be the next one after Dol to be President. Is that correct? I really don't like the thought of adding a 4th componant to the equation if we have 3 players who are VPI liberal.

There are a couple of things that we need to be aware of.

Call Special Election The President chooses any other player at the table to be the next Presidential Candidate by passing that player the President placard. Any player can become President—even players that are term-limited. The new President nominates an eligible player as Chancellor Candidate and the Election proceeds as usual.
A Special Election does not skip any players. After a Special Election, the President placard returns to the left of the President who enacted the Special Election.
If the President passes the presidency to the next player in the rotation, that player would get to run for President twice in a row: once for the Special Election and once for their normal shift in the Presidential rotation.

and

If the group rejects three governments in a row, the country is thrown into chaos. Immediately reveal the Policy on top of the Policy deck and enact it. Any power granted by this Policy is ignored, but the Election Tracker resets, and existing term-limits are forgotten


There are 3 presidents between Dol and Me. If we tried to skip all of them then the top policy would be inacted.

That seems like a huge gamble. Frankly I don't like this at all.

The Special Election one can be bypassed by rejecting 3 governments and getting it enacted as a default - as it says in the bit I underlined.

[Tattersail_]

As long as everyone thinks we cannot lose then I'd go with the plan.

[Vengeance]

 Nevyn, on 23 February 2018 - 10:31 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 10:25 PM, said:

The biggest problem that I see is the 3 presidencies in between Dol an me. Skipping will reset.

Thats not really a problem either.

Look at the next 2 presidential powers on fascist missions

And if there are no fascist missions, the game is won on Dolmen's presidency.

Seriously guys, we cannot lose.

So here is the problem I have. I don't trust you. You say you have to be a chancellor but according to the rules I could be chancellor for dolman then president with mess as my chancellor then mess could be president with dolman as his chancellor. All of which could happen with out someone who was part of passing a fascists policy being in power.

You say hey guys we cannot lose could be interpreted as a talking to liberals or fascists. Because if you and dolman pass a fascists policy and then a fasists policy is pulled out of the pile all it would take is mess being Hitler to win.

If you think I was paranoid about the people I don't trust I am 1000% more paranoid about the people who I have said that I trust. When some thing starts to feel wrong it usually is.

Unless you can convince me why nyven needs to be in any government going forward I am voting no.

[Vengeance]

 Messremb, on 23 February 2018 - 06:43 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 23 February 2018 - 05:06 PM, said:

Honestly can we move this train along. We are getting one or two governments a week. At this rate we will be wrapping up in May.

But it is so much fun watching Tatts and D'rek at each other.


Venge, you're my Chancellor.

Fuck I completely missed this. I only went back because I couldn't remember who was mess chancellor.

Ok what happens if I don't accept?

[Nevyn]

I think you have lost track of where we are. This is messrembs government. He proposed you as chancellor.


If that goes through, you cannot be dolmens chancellor too.If messremb gets 3 fascist policies and thus you two enact one, Mess can make you president via special election and u can add dolmen as chancellor and i am not needed

If you two pass a liberal policy the options are dolmen pivks a chancellor outside the three, or enact a random policy to make you the next president (if needed). The only risk of a fascist chancellor is them burning a drawn liberal card, because at 2 the hitler loss condition is not active.

I dont need you to add me. I dont need you to trust me. Trust dolmen and Messremb no matter what.

The only way to lose is to make someone outsode the 3 of you chancellor AFTER enacting one more fascist policy, and as i just explained that need not happen.