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What is it about Pat Rothfuss?

#41 User is offline   Andorion 

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Posted 06 February 2016 - 10:49 AM

View PostGrimjust Bearegular, on 06 February 2016 - 10:00 AM, said:

I like Kote.

I hate Kvothe.

Rothfuss is a good writer, and a not so great storyteller.

I'm seriously considering skipping book two and just reading book three (4, 5,6)...


If it ever gets published. I read a post saying that his editor has not seen a single page of book 3 and has no idea how much work is done
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#42 User is offline   Tatterdemalion 

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Posted 14 February 2016 - 01:39 AM

Reading Wise Man's Fear right now.

I like lots of fantasy books because I usually read stuff suggested by many and many are usually pretty all right on knowing their shit. But give me Abercrombie any day.

I feel like Name of the Wind has one of the worst book beginnings of a fantasy novel I've ever read. Like, 8-10 chapters before you get a hint of something interesting. And nothing bothers me more than regular names in a fantasy novel (see: Kyle, RotCG [and yes, I know it was explained pretty cool by ICE/SE but don't care, it's irksome]).

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#43 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 02 April 2016 - 04:38 AM

View PostTatterdemalion, on 14 February 2016 - 01:39 AM, said:


I wish I could consume fantasy novels faster.


Granted! I hope you needed more fiber in your diet because oh... sorry, wrong thread...
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#44 User is offline   Nicodimas 

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Posted 02 April 2016 - 07:36 AM

I have read this series about five times now, went to a few of his speakings too at Cons. So a little obsessed..I hope everyone is all caught up at this point right? If you haven't now probably don't continue:

A) The value of the series really is tied into the small portions in his stories that are being told by people pay very very careful attention to the mythos he is making.

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#45 User is offline   Werthead 

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Posted 26 July 2020 - 09:31 PM

View PostAndorion, on 06 February 2016 - 10:49 AM, said:

If it ever gets published. I read a post saying that his editor has not seen a single page of book 3 and has no idea how much work is done


Four years later, his editor has still not seen a single page of Book 3 and still has no idea what's going on. She does reiterate how proud she is of the series and Pat, but expresses considerable frustration that DAW has no idea what the situation is with the book or even if it's still being written (!!!).

Wollheim is one of the most respected, mild-mannered and liked editors in the entire field, so her expressing this frustration publicly is quite something.
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Posted 26 July 2020 - 10:25 PM

View Post20 Days of Sheep, on 26 July 2020 - 10:18 PM, said:

And all these later I still maintain that back when bk 1 was just released he stated his 1-3 were already written.



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#47 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 05:30 AM

View Postpolishgenius, on 26 July 2020 - 10:25 PM, said:

View Post20 Days of Sheep, on 26 July 2020 - 10:18 PM, said:

And all these later I still maintain that back when bk 1 was just released he stated his 1-3 were already written.



You don't have to maintain anything. It's right here.


oh this is something....

Quote

What can readers expect from the two sequels and the trilogy that will follow this one?

Well.... I've already written them. So you won't have to wait forever for them to come out. They'll be released on a regular schedule. One per year.

You can also expect the second book to be written with the same degree of care and detail as this first one. You know the sophomore slump? When a writer's second novel is weaker because they're suddenly forced to write under deadline? I don't have to worry about that because my next two novels are already good to go.



That was 2007.
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#48 User is offline   Cause 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 06:04 AM

View PostWerthead, on 26 July 2020 - 09:31 PM, said:

View PostAndorion, on 06 February 2016 - 10:49 AM, said:

If it ever gets published. I read a post saying that his editor has not seen a single page of book 3 and has no idea how much work is done


Four years later, his editor has still not seen a single page of Book 3 and still has no idea what's going on. She does reiterate how proud she is of the series and Pat, but expresses considerable frustration that DAW has no idea what the situation is with the book or even if it's still being written (!!!).

Wollheim is one of the most respected, mild-mannered and liked editors in the entire field, so her expressing this frustration publicly is quite something.


This is scary.

One of my most anticipated books. Even wondered if I should $o a reread wow the delay will b insane
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#49 User is offline   TheRetiredBridgeburner 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 06:37 AM

I've maintained the state of the comments sections every time he's posted about Worldbuilders etc is pretty rough... but whilst it doesn't make it okay to yell at him about book 3 that certainly frames the frustration differently.
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#50 User is offline   Macros 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 07:17 AM

He needs to shave the beard, look less like Martin and more like Erikson
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Posted 27 July 2020 - 10:34 AM

9 years and the editor hasn’t seen a word of a book Pat claims was already written...yeah, that shit is not cricket Pat. Dafuq?!

How does his contract allow him to do that?
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#52 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 10:42 AM

I heard somebody specualate that the publisher is so small that they have no interest or reason to make demands of him. As long as they may see a third book, eventually, they stand to make a large profit that helps fund other projects.
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#53 User is offline   Werthead 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 02:54 PM

DAW isn't Tor, but it's not THAT small. They still publish a lot of big names like Seanan McGuire and Tad Williams.

I suspect that although they are frustrated with him, they are also very happy to take the millions or tens of millions of dollars that legacy sales of the first two books and the novella still bring in every year.

It's also worth noting that Showtime actually greenlit the TV series, which means they exorcised the option and must have paid Rothfuss millions of dollars. The fact that it was cheaper for them to un-greenlight the project afterwards (which would almost certainly not have required Rothfuss to give back the money) speaks to how much they were getting rinsed on the HALO show instead.
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#54 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 03:55 PM

The whole "all three books are essentially done" thing way back when he released the first one....smacks 100% of GRRM's post AFFC hardcover afterword comment about ADWD being not far away because most of it was indeed written since he'd just split AFFC into two books...then nearly 7 damned years later...ADWD finally comes out...

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#55 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 03:57 PM

View PostQuickTidal, on 27 July 2020 - 10:34 AM, said:

9 years and the editor hasn’t seen a word of a book Pat claims was already written...yeah, that shit is not cricket Pat. Dafuq?!

How does his contract allow him to do that?


Demand author meet contract, no book, no money.
Terminate contract, no book, no money.
Sue author, no book, probably no money or less money, bad PR for disrespecting a known mental health case.
Or...
Stay supportive, wait, hope.... maybe book, maybe lots of money. Market the fuck out of book, make more money, even if it sucks.
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#56 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 04:29 PM

View PostAbyss, on 27 July 2020 - 03:57 PM, said:

View PostQuickTidal, on 27 July 2020 - 10:34 AM, said:

9 years and the editor hasn’t seen a word of a book Pat claims was already written...yeah, that shit is not cricket Pat. Dafuq?!

How does his contract allow him to do that?


Demand author meet contract, no book, no money.
Terminate contract, no book, no money.
Sue author, no book, probably no money or less money, bad PR for disrespecting a known mental health case.
Or...
Stay supportive, wait, hope.... maybe book, maybe lots of money. Market the fuck out of book, make more money, even if it sucks.


I bet that it's been so long now that Rothfuss is nervous about the finale...add in those of us who thought about half the last book was middling-to-garbage...that's probably weighing on him.

Still, 9 years is pretty rough.
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#57 User is offline   polishgenius 

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Posted 27 July 2020 - 05:12 PM

View PostQuickTidal, on 27 July 2020 - 10:34 AM, said:

9 years and the editor hasn’t seen a word of a book Pat claims was already written...yeah, that shit is not cricket Pat. Dafuq?!

How does his contract allow him to do that?



In fairness like, as I understand it it is fairly standard to not submit any of a book till the manuscript is done- no point the editor making notes that the author may yet make completely irrelevant in the course of further writing and development. GRRM does it otherwise but he writes differently to many and also committed to shortening the post-completion editing time by doing it his way.

That said, Rothfuss not showing at least proof of existence after this long or even providing updates is kinda screwed up.
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#58 User is offline   Werthead 

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Posted 28 July 2020 - 07:43 PM

View PostQuickTidal, on 27 July 2020 - 03:55 PM, said:

The whole "all three books are essentially done" thing way back when he released the first one....smacks 100% of GRRM's post AFFC hardcover afterword comment about ADWD being not far away because most of it was indeed written since he'd just split AFFC into two books...then nearly 7 damned years later...ADWD finally comes out...


The difference was that GRRM didn't make the mistake of saying the book was already 100% done and ready to go. Suggesting that the book would come out a year later when that was already looking dodgy when the book was published (and highly questionable when he first suggested it five months earlier when AFFC was submitted), and I know people who urged him to leave that promise out but his response was along the lines of, "It'll be fine, I can see how to do it."

It was very clearly Not Fine, and I think probably the single main reason why he refused to give any updates at all on TWoW (and had to be kind of pressured into giving each update he has done). That said, it was not a lie, certainly not of the order of Rothfuss when he said all three books were 100% done and ready to go, but a mistake.

Quote

In fairness like, as I understand it it is fairly standard to not submit any of a book till the manuscript is done- no point the editor making notes that the author may yet make completely irrelevant in the course of further writing and development. GRRM does it otherwise but he writes differently to many and also committed to shortening the post-completion editing time by doing it his way.


If you're a "tentpole" author - an author who's books are guaranteed to sell so much that the publisher's bottom line for the entire year will be dramatically impacted by the booking coming out - the situation becomes rather different, and the author and editor are expected to work much more closely together and for more feedback to be available. I know Scott Lynch is in much more regular contact with his publishers even before the first draft is complete, and Joe Abercrombie also has a much more thorough back-and-forth with his editor.

It sounds like Rothfuss has not only not provided any material at all from Book 3 in nine years, but he has also not communicated significantly with his editor for six years, which is the bit that's really bemusing. Even GRRM flies to NYC once a year or every two years to speak to his publishers in person (usually involving an apology about the book not being done and discussions about future plans), and exchanges telephone calls and emails much more frequently. It sounds like Rothfuss has been ghosting his publisher whilst going on Twitch several times a month so people can watch him play video games which is really weird.

SE had the opposite problem, his editors not giving him any feedback and not bothering to let him know until he was a year into working on WALK IN SHADOW that FALL OF LIGHT had bombed and they wanted him to write something else, which is also weird (but is also not unknown, especially when behind the scenes there'd probably be wrangling about cancelling the contract outright or letting him finish as a courtesy because of how successful his earlier books were etc), as they lost a year which could have been spent on THE GODS IS NOT WILLING instead, and we'd have it out by now.

This post has been edited by Werthead: 29 July 2020 - 12:08 PM

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#59 User is offline   amphibian 

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Posted 28 July 2020 - 08:11 PM

Rothfuss has been increasingly open about having major depression and the effects his parents both getting cancer within a year - then dying close in time to each other, then raising two kids, then having marriage struggles etc.

Life has not been easy for him. He also has several other projects that are doing fairly well, yet take time + energy.

That does not excuse the lack of communication with his editors or the angry stuff he was/is doing. But knowing and discussing that he has (in his own words) debilitating depression does help to provide a more detailed picture of why this book is taking over a decade to get out - there's a lot going on in his head and he's the only one that can deal with it. Dealing with that and his family is more important than the book. The twitch streams may be what he's capable of for now.

I do feel for his publisher, but this is kind of the risk of the business.
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#60 User is offline   polishgenius 

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Posted 28 July 2020 - 09:07 PM

View PostWerthead, on 28 July 2020 - 07:43 PM, said:

SE had the opposite problem, his editors not giving him any feedback and not bothering to let him know until he was a year into working on WALK IN SHADOW that FALL OF LIGHT had bombed and they wanted him to write something else, which is also weird (but is also not unknown, especially when behind the scenes there'd probably be wrangling about cancelling the contract outright or letting him finish as a courtesy because of how successful his earlier books were etc), as they lost a year which could have been spent on THE GODS IS NOT WILLING instead, and we'd have it out by now.



While I don't know what went on at the end there and they clearly shoulda told him the Walk in Shadow thing sooner, that may have been (probably was?) someone at the publisher other than the editer themself making that decision, I'd imagine? In term's of SE's communication with his editor I know SE admitted fairly early on that he was a nightmare to edit because any notes questioning why something was in there and maybe should be cut would be met with 'don't worry that'll pay off in three book's time' so that might explain any shortfall in feedback later on.


Quote

Rothfuss has been increasingly open about having major depression and the effects his parents both getting cancer within a year - then dying close in time to each other, then raising two kids, then having marriage struggles etc.



I think this is very much one of those situations where it's possible to have genuine, sympathetic reasons for something and to be a dick about it. The lack of communication with his editor is very much out of line. Not airing every detail of any problems he has with his fans is obviously understandable and normally I don't believe an author necessarily owes communication, but given those promises he made, he I think owes some.

On the other hand I don't really think him twitch-streaming is weird or out of order. Him doing lesiure-time things has no bearing on whether he's writing the book or not, unless he's streaming 10 hours a day every day.
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