[Kaschan]

Liosan, on 22 May 2014 - 09:11 PM, said:

So then, one of Fener, Liosan, Pallid you think Barghast? Lets leave you with a narrower field.

FENER IT IS TIME FOR YOU TO DIE!!!!

So what do you think of Pallid?

That looks remarkably like a suicide vig. I hesitate to lynch someone until PS gets on to clarify. Which will most like be after time out.

[Hood's Path]

OK, so looking back over the other cases on offer, the one that makes the most sense to me is the Eloth one. He displayed a couple of behavioural traits that I tend to be suspicious of:

- He was finding it difficult to actually accuse anyone of anything. This often manifests itself when a scum's need to blend in wars with his knowledge that everyone else in the game is innocent. So for example:
(NB: The following post was originally replied to inline, but I hate it when people do that because it's really unclear so I've reordered it in more-standard quote form)

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 12:01 PM, said:

Denul, on 22 May 2014 - 11:33 AM, said:

So you think Pallid is joking with his posts?

No not joking, pallid responded very aggressively to the double vote, and I don't yet know why, it of course is worth further consideration, but we can't draw any conclusions from it I think.

ie. "I find this suspicious, but I don't think it means anything." Seems a bit contradictory.

He also chickened out of actually pressuring anyone by dropping a vote on Sukul Ankhadu. Ampelas has already expressed why this is problematic here:

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 09:58 AM, said:

Since we actually only have just over 1 page of posts to look at after the switch up, the only two people who have caught my eye are you and Pallid. So much seriousness from the pair of you over relatively nothing.

When was the last time anything of consequence was said on day 1 that lead to a successful lynch?

Having said that, I'd really like to hear from some of the people who have yet to contribute in any way. Sukul Ankhadu no posts, three people with 1, most of them just checking in. So in that vein;

Remove Vote
Vote Sukul Ankhadu

Get online and give us what ya got, Sukul!

Ampelas, on 22 May 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

All right, here are my thoughts, because you all asked so nicely.

I see my joke vote has ballooned into a train on Liosan. Not because of anything I did, I just happen to be the first person on there. I'll replace said vote, if necessary, but I am going to

Remove vote

Vote Eloth

because he has answered questions and analyzed some things, yet the only person he can commit to pressure is someone who hasn't even shown up yet. Operation "Good Job" during the "Do Your Best" offensive has been a success, Eloth.

It appears involved. It appears to be active and information gathering-esque. But it lacks any real bite.

- He's also very wary of getting drawn into a shouting match, perhaps because he overvalues his own skin:

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 02:22 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 22 May 2014 - 02:12 PM, said:

<Case on Eloth>

I've already stated my uneasiness about Denul and his attempts to steer the thread, and will continue to keep an eye on Pallid. But as there are 13 hours left today I am content to see what (and who) else comes out of the woodwork before throwing around more speculation. You are accusing me of trying to coast by being ostensibly town but ultimately unhelpful and I suspect trying to get a more emotional or aggressive response before you make up your mind about me, but I'm not being needlessly antagonistic on day 1.

- And I didn't like his complaints about Denul 'leading the thread' either. It's Day 1, there's no reason why this should be threatening at this point, unless he's afraid that Denul is focusing on someone he wants to protect (or perhaps will in the near future). Here's where he does that:

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 11:21 AM, said:

Denul you are treating everything after that post as genuine and serious, when I think most of them are still humorous/joking. It wasn't until you started posting about it that things heated up.

Not sure I like where you are trying to take this thread, you admit he's unlikely to be scum then continue trying to vilify him and make others hostile to him as well. You are within the same post contradicting yourself here. Why?

There's enough for me to see this as a good alternative.

Remove Vote
Vote Eloth

[Hood's Path]

Welp, that's me done - won't be back before timeout. Seems like everyone else has left already though...

[Barghast]

Liosan, on 22 May 2014 - 09:05 PM, said:

So y'all want to lynch me?

Well that sucks. I suggest you all get your heads together and think up a new lynch target, fast. Because you need to.

PS, you hanging around a few min more?

You warn us that we need to lynch an alternative, which if you're right, is actually a great play.

Liosan, on 22 May 2014 - 09:11 PM, said:

So then, one of Fener, Liosan, Pallid you think Barghast? Lets leave you with a narrower field.

FENER IT IS TIME FOR YOU TO DIE!!!!

So what do you think of Pallid?

A few minutes later you portray using some type of suicide vig ability. I don't fault your play here, especially if you felt you have a good beat on scum and didn't want us losing your vig, but why only give us 6 minutes to think about things?

If you're not bluffing and Fener is scum, then this is more than a fair trade. If he's not, then we go from only potentially lynching you and losing a townie, to losing two townies.

For now.

remove vote

Liosan is either telling the truth, therefore we're going to lose him and Fener(for better or worse), or he's lying and we try to figure out his intentions, because his post is typical of a suicide vig, not a normal one.

If he's lying, and scum, he only gains a night. Assuming m&p, we have 2 killers with a shared kill. They would still only have one kill with him dead or alive, MOST likely. This leads me towards believing his claim.

Why the rush to action, though? I can't help but think if this turns out bad that waiting longer to pop would have been the wiser choice.

[Galayn Lord]

Begin Boot-up Sequence.............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Install New Drivers.......................................................................................................................................................................................Download Java Applet...........................................................................................................................................................Run Program "Offer Opinion"......................................................................................................................Buffering....................................................................................................................................Run.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Application Liosan 78.375879682897487278378278498737492702180328974386298820748998237839% likelihood of running vigilante program.

Application Liosan 69.98394878934798349828903829874898747489789738732987389% of suicide vigilante behaviour.

Application Fener 34.87459873908432074092384937249898349738570294092805278947590q80927987923% likelihood of survival.

Advise: Caution. Advise: Distance <10 feet from application Fener.

Application Hood[ERROR UNKNOWN SYMBOL INVALID INPUT]s Path calculations compute. Logic is valid. Findings match application Galayn Lord computation.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

.......................................Opening program "Vote"...........................................................................................................................New update found would you like to install new update................................................................................................................................................................................................No I would not fuck off................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Running program "Vote"..................................................................................Deleting old data...............................................................................................................................

Remove Vote

.....................................................................Installing new data.....................................................................................................................................................63% complete.........


Vote Eloth


...............................................End Program...........................................................................Shut Down Systems.........................................................................................................


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Path-Shaper]

Liosan, on 22 May 2014 - 09:11 PM, said:

So then, one of Fener, Liosan, Pallid you think Barghast? Lets leave you with a narrower field.

FENER IT IS TIME FOR YOU TO DIE!!!!

So what do you think of Pallid?

At this point....

Liosan is dead. He was a town ninja and Messremb.

Fener is dead. He was a Roleless Innocent, and The Unfound.

[Path-Shaper]

At timeout...


11 players are alive: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Hood's Path, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

7 votes to lynch. 7 votes to go to night.

3 votes Eloth: Ampelas, Hood's Path, Galayn Lord

Not voted: Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

[Path-Shaper]

Night =

Hood's Path is dead. He was a Roleless Innocent and Sir Thursday

This post has been edited by Path-Shaper: 23 May 2014 - 01:14 PM

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 2. 36 hours remaining.

10 players are alive: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

6 votes to lynch. 5 votes to go to night.



Not voted: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

[Eloth]

Why Lio? Why use the vig on Day fucking 1. We get it, it sucks to be lynched in the randomness of day 1. But it would have been so much better to have you die without using it, than to have the situation we have now...

Got to go asap, I will respond to the accusations against me later today, I'll just say this - I avoided making cases and joining in the slap fights because it was an incredibly banal (and short) Day 1.

[Denul]

PS is the TDMi of this game 2?

Quote

TMDI:1 = X+Y players, X roleless innocents, Y killers
TMDI:2 = As 1, but a small number of simple roles. Eg: 12 players, 2 Killers, Symp, Healer, BP/Vig.

I am 50/50 on Liosan's vig, I can see the benefit of it as it does removes a doubt, I would have preferred someone different than Fener though but I can see why he picked him.

Path-Shaper, on 23 May 2014 - 04:57 AM, said:

Liosan, on 22 May 2014 - 09:11 PM, said:

So then, one of Fener, Liosan, Pallid you think Barghast? Lets leave you with a narrower field.

FENER IT IS TIME FOR YOU TO DIE!!!!

So what do you think of Pallid?

At this point....

Liosan is dead. He was a town ninja and Messremb.

Fener is dead. He was a Roleless Innocent, and The Unfound.

Interesting choice by the scum team because people were mentioning HP as a possible symp.

Path-Shaper, on 23 May 2014 - 05:20 AM, said:

Night =

Hood's Path is dead. He was town and Sir Thursday

If I have time today, I will go through day one with the new information.

[Denul]

Eloth, on 23 May 2014 - 06:52 AM, said:

Why Lio? Why use the vig on Day fucking 1. We get it, it sucks to be lynched in the randomness of day 1. But it would have been so much better to have you die without using it, than to have the situation we have now...

Got to go asap, I will respond to the accusations against me later today, I'll just say this - I avoided making cases and joining in the slap fights because it was an incredibly banal (and short) Day 1.

This sounds like false indignation.

Messremb is a newish player but you can see why he used his vig. He was getting lynched anyway, and it clears another player. I would prefer it to be used now, than on D day or something like that. The situation is not a bad one. Like I say, this reads false.

[Pallid]

fuck me, things have changed dramatically since I was last here. I didn't get on last night because of real life stuff. Suffice to say I would not have been good company on here last night anyway.
What I don't get is, if Lios vote on Fener was a bloody joke why did he vig him? Why not take me out as it was me he was butting heads with??
quick post pre breakfast, the points on Eloth of being helpful inappearance but not in reality bear closer scrutiny, if I can figure out how to get post isolation to work properly this will be easier

[Eloth]

Hood, on 22 May 2014 - 11:04 PM, said:

OK, so looking back over the other cases on offer, the one that makes the most sense to me is the Eloth one. He displayed a couple of behavioural traits that I tend to be suspicious of:

- He was finding it difficult to actually accuse anyone of anything. This often manifests itself when a scum's need to blend in wars with his knowledge that everyone else in the game is innocent. So for example:
(NB: The following post was originally replied to inline, but I hate it when people do that because it's really unclear so I've reordered it in more-standard quote form)

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 12:01 PM, said:

Denul, on 22 May 2014 - 11:33 AM, said:

So you think Pallid is joking with his posts?

No not joking, pallid responded very aggressively to the double vote, and I don't yet know why, it of course is worth further consideration, but we can't draw any conclusions from it I think.

ie. "I find this suspicious, but I don't think it means anything." Seems a bit contradictory.
I didn't say that at all. I said very explicitly, that it is worth looking at further but jumping to a conclusion based on it is premature. You are either deliberately misreading my posts in an effort to get me lynched by making others misread it, or you are just unable to understand simple short sentences. Since you are playing Mafia I'd say it is more likely the former.

He also chickened out of actually pressuring anyone by dropping a vote on Sukul Ankhadu. Ampelas has already expressed why this is problematic here:
I didn't chicken out of anything, I chose not to, at no point on Day 1 did anyone perform any action I felt was scumlike. I feel this is vindicated soemewhat by the lynch on Liosan being full of shit, his vig of Fener being full of shit, and the NK of Hoods Path revealing he was ALSO town, as he was getting apparent pressure for symping. You want to make being reasonable lynchable? Why not just bend over right now? We already lost 3 town in a single day, this is not the time to jumping up and down screaming and making any case we can, so I will sit back and continue to look carefully at each player.

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 09:58 AM, said:

Since we actually only have just over 1 page of posts to look at after the switch up, the only two people who have caught my eye are you and Pallid. So much seriousness from the pair of you over relatively nothing.

When was the last time anything of consequence was said on day 1 that lead to a successful lynch?

Having said that, I'd really like to hear from some of the people who have yet to contribute in any way. Sukul Ankhadu no posts, three people with 1, most of them just checking in. So in that vein;

Remove Vote
Vote Sukul Ankhadu

Get online and give us what ya got, Sukul!

Ampelas, on 22 May 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

All right, here are my thoughts, because you all asked so nicely.

I see my joke vote has ballooned into a train on Liosan. Not because of anything I did, I just happen to be the first person on there. I'll replace said vote, if necessary, but I am going to

Remove vote

Vote Eloth

because he has answered questions and analyzed some things, yet the only person he can commit to pressure is someone who hasn't even shown up yet. Operation "Good Job" during the "Do Your Best" offensive has been a success, Eloth.

It appears involved. It appears to be active and information gathering-esque. But it lacks any real bite.

- He's also very wary of getting drawn into a shouting match, perhaps because he overvalues his own skin:
Of course I am wary of getting into a shouting match, the only possible outcome of one is distracting from locating scum. I don't overestimate my own importance. I correctly estimate my own value to town.

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 02:22 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 22 May 2014 - 02:12 PM, said:

<Case on Eloth>

I've already stated my uneasiness about Denul and his attempts to steer the thread, and will continue to keep an eye on Pallid. But as there are 13 hours left today I am content to see what (and who) else comes out of the woodwork before throwing around more speculation. You are accusing me of trying to coast by being ostensibly town but ultimately unhelpful and I suspect trying to get a more emotional or aggressive response before you make up your mind about me, but I'm not being needlessly antagonistic on day 1.

- And I didn't like his complaints about Denul 'leading the thread' either. It's Day 1, there's no reason why this should be threatening at this point, unless he's afraid that Denul is focusing on someone he wants to protect (or perhaps will in the near future). Here's where he does that:

Eloth, on 22 May 2014 - 11:21 AM, said:

Denul you are treating everything after that post as genuine and serious, when I think most of them are still humorous/joking. It wasn't until you started posting about it that things heated up.

Not sure I like where you are trying to take this thread, you admit he's unlikely to be scum then continue trying to vilify him and make others hostile to him as well. You are within the same post contradicting yourself here. Why?

There's enough for me to see this as a good alternative.

Remove Vote
Vote Eloth

[Eloth]

Galayn Lord, on 23 May 2014 - 12:28 AM, said:

Begin Boot-up Sequence.............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Install New Drivers.......................................................................................................................................................................................Download Java Applet...........................................................................................................................................................Run Program "Offer Opinion"......................................................................................................................Buffering....................................................................................................................................Run.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Application Liosan 78.375879682897487278378278498737492702180328974386298820748998237839% likelihood of running vigilante program.

Application Liosan 69.98394878934798349828903829874898747489789738732987389% of suicide vigilante behaviour.

Application Fener 34.87459873908432074092384937249898349738570294092805278947590q80927987923% likelihood of survival.

Advise: Caution. Advise: Distance <10 feet from application Fener.

Application Hood[ERROR UNKNOWN SYMBOL INVALID INPUT]s Path calculations compute. Logic is valid. Findings match application Galayn Lord computation.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

.......................................Opening program "Vote"...........................................................................................................................New update found would you like to install new update................................................................................................................................................................................................No I would not fuck off................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Running program "Vote"..................................................................................Deleting old data...............................................................................................................................

Remove Vote

.....................................................................Installing new data.....................................................................................................................................................63% complete.........


Vote Eloth


...............................................End Program...........................................................................Shut Down Systems.........................................................................................................


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You need to cut this stuff out now, because this seriously looks like you are just obfuscating your opinions and trying to bury your vote by making us want to skip over this kind of awfully formatted post. You could at least give a reason for you swapping your vote to me above anyone else after the vig reveal.

[Pallid]

I too would like to hear a bit of reasoning behind GL's vote on ELoth, not that I dislike the vote, but the manner its put forth is frustratingly pointless, you may as well have said "hmmm, looks like lio just vigged fener, vote eloth". Whilst I'm sure the coding took a respectable amount of effort is doesn't change the fact that there is zero justification for the vote, its a glorified drive by from a player thats had nothing much to offer previously. My good man GL, I do command thee to appear and answer for this nonsense.

[Denul]

I am just reading up. For now...


Vote Atrahal

[Eloth]

Denul, on 23 May 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

Eloth, on 23 May 2014 - 06:52 AM, said:

Why Lio? Why use the vig on Day fucking 1. We get it, it sucks to be lynched in the randomness of day 1. But it would have been so much better to have you die without using it, than to have the situation we have now...

Got to go asap, I will respond to the accusations against me later today, I'll just say this - I avoided making cases and joining in the slap fights because it was an incredibly banal (and short) Day 1.

This sounds like false indignation.

Messremb is a newish player but you can see why he used his vig. He was getting lynched anyway, and it clears another player. I would prefer it to be used now, than on D day or something like that. The situation is not a bad one. Like I say, this reads false.

Using his suicide vig Fener does not help us in any scenario at this point. "Clearing" that player means nothing when that player is now DEAD. I would GREATLY prefer using the vig on D day when we have FAR more evidence to go on and can base our actions on more than gut feeling.

I disagree that the situation is not bad, this was the worst possible outcome for day 1. The situation is far from untenable of course, and we can still win, but it would have been easier if the situation were other than what it is right now.

I don't understand the heat I'm getting for playing cautiously on the only day when we have no concrete evidence of any kind, but I will lay my cards on the table right now.

Denul is behaving like someone who is not worried in the slightest about getting NKed. With how often he is posting and how many half baked opinions he feels confident sharing and throwing votes on as many people as he can, it makes me wonder whether he is scum, symp, or simply useful for the scum to keep around. If I were scum he would have been the number one target for a NK because he has only added to the confusion, as well as killing off the highest poster in the game, slowing the exchange of information. The only reasons I can imagine him being alove today over HP is (1) He is scum (2) He is symp/useful to scum at the moment by distracting from them) (3) He is barking up the wrong tree or (4) HP was on point with his posts.

He agreed with me that putting pressure on Sukul is a good vote, and votes on Barghast for the exact same reason 59 minutes later he agrees that it is a bad tactic, what the hell? He puts pressure on Pallid while saying he finds it unlikely Pallid is scum and quotes posts that he himself has previously stated to be joke posts like he is building a case against Pallid. Not good play at all. Even if Pallid is a symp, misusing the posts of others is a awful way to go about trying to convince others to do that.

I don't understand how anyone could be so brazen in throwing accusations and votes all over the thread only to come out unscathed the next day without being scum or completely wrong.

Vote Denul

HP voted for GL at the start of the day, we connect briefly over our desire to have more people contribute (I miss you you dead bastard!) Wonders about Denuls quick abandonment of a Pallid vote once Denul is threatened. Further attempts to bring GL into the limelight and GLs coasting RPing may be scum tactic. Criticises Denul once again. He leaves for a few hours then comes back on thread and agrees with the other people who are suspicious of me, I have already responded to this a few posts up. TL:DR for that post is he read a few of my statements incorrectly and disagreed with my suspicion of Denul.

Long and short of it is HP was NKed after putting 3 people into the spotlight during day 1. GL, Denul, and me. He seemed to switch off Denul in favour of a vote for me since he seems to think my dislike of Denul is due to sheltering Pallid. I don't have a read on GL yet, but that is because he hasn't stopped RPing which I think he should now. I think HP was killed for pointing at GL or Denul (Obviously, since I'm ne and I know I'm town, I am certain he was not killed for pointing at me, but obviously you will all have to consider the evidence yourselves) and would welcoime further discussion about both of them. Until then my vote stays where it is

[Denul]

Eloth I am doing a full read up and think I have found some good stuff. Whilst I welcome your posts I would also like to add that you are barking up the wrong tree with me. Right now I think Atrahal is best vote today, I will share my thoughts with you later, but I have only completely read through 3 players and written my notes on each of their activities.

[Nimander Golit]

Subsistence requires sustenance. I shall return posthaste upon earning the latter half of my daily bread. Erudition and elucidation shall surely follow.