Ok, first I want to look at all the posts Amp made before I said I was going to take a look at him, because as far as I can tell on my reread, no one had said they were going to look at him until I did. So here's pre-pressured Amp, all the way through day 2:
Ampelas, on 14 April 2014 - 08:38 PM, said:
Ampelas, on 15 April 2014 - 08:15 AM, said:
Just caught up and what the hell is going on?
I could interpret half the posts on the first few pages as signalling should I so desire. All you idiots wise up - we don't need to signal our Warlord who we are so cut it out. The only people on thread remotely considering signalling should be symps, every one else of you is painting a bull's-eye on someone else for Kenshiro.
Ampelas, on 15 April 2014 - 05:58 PM, said:
Back and catching up
(lame post I know)
Ampelas, on 15 April 2014 - 06:31 PM, said:
Shadow, on 15 April 2014 - 06:23 PM, said:
I hate to admit it but I agree with Monkey boy.
To an extent I do too, I think my vote will be on one of the two, leaning slightly towards Denul but happy either way.
Ampelas, on 15 April 2014 - 08:23 PM, said:
Serc, on 15 April 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:
serves me right replying b4 scrolling down
welp, looks like I'm gonna get the chop. I'm too macho to self-vote, so I'll vote the person pinging my gut-based radar
vote Okral Lom
Hate to say it but read the OP, you can't.
Vote Serc
Ampelas, on 15 April 2014 - 08:47 PM, said:
Bek Okhan, on 15 April 2014 - 08:39 PM, said:
Okral Lom, on 15 April 2014 - 07:32 PM, said:
Alright, I've had a thread read and had a think, and unfortunately it's looking like a Denul or Serc lynch today. I don't think either of them rate out as any more than an average candidate (by which I mean essentially they've suffered from the luck of the draw).
That being said, they've been discussed to death and that discussion is not particularly interesting, so I'm going to point out a few things about some of the other players instead.
I'll start off with the player who interests me most at the moment: Monoch Ochem (henceforth MO). And that's not just for the Librarian RP.
I made an (admittedly weak) case on Korabas, and was immediately met by two responses from someone other than Korabas (which seemed surprising). There was a query about my logic from Bek Okhan (henceforth BO) and a surprisingly vigorous rubbishing from Monoch Ochem (henceforth MO). BO's interest seemed legit, but MO put quite a bit of time into attempting to disparage all those associated with the case:
Here he is initially (I've snipped the flavour text and the pictures for clarity) implying that the aggressive players (at that point myself and Tiamatha) are over-stepping their bounds:
Monok Ochem, on 15 April 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:
What the Librarian is trying to say is that the response to the vote on Master Korabas was a little sudden and aggressive. The Librarian is not so sure that at this stage of Day 1 "antics" such a case should garner such heat.
:
Now Librarian, I also thought that Master Tiamatha also seemed particularly aggressive as well...
:
What I'm saying is that Master Tiamatha seems to be jumping the musket, so to speak.
And again trying to sow suspicion on those who hold any weight in my case on Korabas:
Monok Ochem, on 15 April 2014 - 04:34 AM, said:
Now, what he wanted to express is that from the history of past games, signalling cases are kind of in a hang up, so to speak. They can't be discounted because of a couple of games back, but given that bloke Tatt's show last game, we all have to be wary. Now, seems to me, and the Librarian, that there is two sides to this coin, so to speak. We got a group really looking mean and hard into that Serc fellow, but harder in to his so called "symp" Korabas, or maybe that was Denul being the ringleader, I'm already getting turned around.
:
But here's the thing gentlemen: that Korabas fellow puts a little too much weightiness on the Serc "situation" to be trying to interrupt the show. The lack of conviction in that wishy-washy post itself is the problem, and I'll bet bananas to peanuts that the people playing up that post are more trouble than the guy posting the post himself.
:
So the question I have is why are we arsing about spending so much bloody time or Korabas when if he's the so-called symp, we ought to be focusing on Serc! I think this is all smoke and mirrors, and really, we ought to be testing by stringing up that Serc fellow, or maybe one of the supposedly upright citizens trying so valiantly to make a case on them!
So that's two posts devoted to making sure that the Korabas case is buried. In the process of doing so, he finds himself saying we should lynch Serc instead, despite previously making disparaging comments about the motives of Tiamatha in starting the case in the first place.
Then we come to his case on Denul. It seems to consist wholly of the over-aggressive clutching at straws Tiamatha and myself employed earlier. Here is the text of his argument - again I have snipped out the RP and the quoted posts themselves, which he doesn't analyze properly:
Monok Ochem, on 15 April 2014 - 04:52 AM, said:
Master Denul announced himself in the standard, provocative manner. Interestingly enough, as the Librarian pointed out, this manner quickly degenerates into base tomfoolery, making light of the last game's fake signalling, and a humorous switchero with a male picture where there ought to have been a more, er, beautiful lady. The quote (third below in the amazing MultiQuote device) that bothered him and myself the most was a comment about absence, not reading the OP, and speculation on a "symp" girlfriend. Quite the post for someone seemingly unengaged. Then Master Serc seems to "signal" closely followed by Master Korabas, and then it all just falls apart from there. But it comes back to Master Denul, don't you see? Master Denul's seemingly simple and easy going posts seems flippant, maybe even elusive, especially in context.
:
(QUOTED POSTS)
:
Vote Denul.
Now, let's get to the meat of that case...oh wait, there isn't any. An inconsistency in seriousness between posts is possibly the flimsiest argument constructed this year.
So basically MO's play last night was an inconsistent mess that he hid behind his posting style. He was very strongly trying to rebut and discredit arguments against another player (Korabas) by dismissing others as aggressive, but then turned around and posted one of the most powderpuff cases in the history of powderpuff cases! And somehow it worked.
So MO and by extension Korabas are the players I find the most suspicious at this point and I will be looking at them with a fine-tooth comb tomorrow.
I'm not sure I appreciate being BO
However, this post perfectly explains for I feel about MO. He seems to have blinkers on, determined to paint any action of Denul's as scummy, without much reference what Denul actually says.
For now, I want a lynch, so I will
Remove vote
Vote Serc
Edit: just seen that my vote isn't needed. Ah well.
Agreed on MO as well.
Ampelas, on 15 April 2014 - 08:47 PM, said:
Rikkter, on 15 April 2014 - 08:43 PM, said:
And 20 minutes worth of posts appear at once?
F5 fail?
Ampelas, on 16 April 2014 - 06:58 AM, said:
Tiamatha, on 16 April 2014 - 06:35 AM, said:
first off night kill speculation:
Lock(?) is suggesting MO (gusty) has been killed because he was irritating. Surely this is absolute nonsense, if anything MO being annoying would be a dead cert for survival, many players (myself included) expressed frustration over his posting style and anything that annoys us is good for the scum. At some stage I probably would have voted for him to make him stop that shit.
A far more likely set of options are: despite his infuriating posting style MO was contributing actively and regardless of how accurate his finger pointing may be once he dropped the librarian schtick he was a lucid reasoned poster, which spells trouble for scum in later stages. Second option is pure meta, he could have been alted, and lets face it, if you're scum you don't want Gusty around, he can be uncanny at times with his scum hunting.
anything outside this is wifom, infact even that is wifom, was his kill a frame job? Was it pre-emptive? Was it a 'shut him up before he really.gets the bit between his teeth?
we don't know, we WON'T know until spoiler heaven, and basing todays actions on speculation over scums logic is as useful as putting a handbrake on a canoe.
So , beyond that, I'm still interested in Denul, he's been too helpful, too reactionary and, as gust predicted, his name has faded into the mist today. I voted Serc to get a lynch and a CF, but its by no means the lynch I wanted to see
So you're saying go with MO on the basis that MO tagged him?
Ampelas, on 16 April 2014 - 07:23 AM, said:
Tiamatha, on 16 April 2014 - 07:05 AM, said:
not in the slightest Amp, I'm saying I wasn't a proponent of a serc lynch yesterday, I was after Denul, gusts prediction of interest fade just seems to be coming true, which I don't like, someone who garnered that much heat one day shouldn't simply fade to black the next
The first MO in the post above yours should be Denul btw
So, 9 posts. All are three sentences long or less, 2 that are pure "catching up" posts, 2 that are pointless one-sentence question responses to a quote, and 4 that either explicitly mention MO _and_ Denul (obvious potential lynch targets) or mention one and refer to the other in a quote. Very little content, at least a third of the posts are nothing at all, and the only legitimate post in my mind is his second, where he mentions signalling. Discounting the "catching up" posts, this is also the only posts where Amp makes a statement without quoting someone else first and then agreeing or questioning whoever he quoted.
He did drop a vote on Serc with little reasoning, but to be fair I crossposted almost the same reply to Serc about the OP and ended up voting Serc afterward as well.
Just as an interesting aside, Amp's second post is the only one with real content and Tiam replies immediately:
Tiamatha, on 15 April 2014 - 08:42 AM, said:
who mentioned warlords Amp??
we've been discussing possible sympage of scum entirely, stop trying to muddy the water further and derail our conversation
Good point - who had been mentioned Warlords up until then? Amp may have been the first. The obvious two answers when a new topic comes up like that are that people usually talk about their role or people try to redirect the thread with a new focus. Neither is clear with Amp at this point since it's early on in his play, but it is kind of odd to bring up something like that in your first "real" post after checking in. Tiam calls him on it and Amp not only acts like he forgot he ever mentions Warlords but doesn't respond to Tiam either. Instead he disappears for about 12 hours.
Also, in Amp's last post, I underlined his comment about coasting and Denul. There are two reasons I don't like this - because the description he gives fits himself perfectly (low-posting and/or coasting), and it looks like he's implying that he is going to investigate Denul based on low-posting/coasting not being ok. This makes no sense, because the entirety of day 1 was pretty much a back and forth between Serc and Denul (in terms of the lynch) and Denul certainly wasn't low-posting at that point in the game, so it seems like bullshit.
Then I said this:
"My initial response right now is to look at our lowest posters - Amp and GL. It looks like Lock has already gone through GL and someone else (I need to read those cases more carefully), so I'm going to look at Amp as I have the time." --
http://forum.malazan...85#entry1119885 (out of quote tags)
Less than 1 hour later Amp comes out with several posts in succession. I will analyze the rest in a separate post, but I wanted to look at early Amp first as that was my intention from the beginning.
So this is pretty much only half my read-up on Amp but just looking at these posts, it's not pretty. I think he says a good amount later that I remember agreeing with (again, will return to go over) but at this point he has contributed almost nothing, coasted through two full days as one of (sometimes THE) lowest poster in the game, and then shows up with fire after the Korabas reveal with a massive boner for Korabas (not totally unwarranted, but again was yelled at by Tiam for jumping the gun).
That is all the time I have right now, I will finish the second half of this later.
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