[Tiste Simeon]

Obdigore, on 26 February 2020 - 04:11 PM, said:

Tiste Simeon, on 26 February 2020 - 04:06 PM, said:

Bernie's Left is kind of middle of the road for much of Europe, so far skewed to the right is the American political spectrum as a whole.

Our own bunch of crazed fascists that call themselves a government notwithstanding of course.

PS - I think your fascists think they are leaving europe. Fascism doesn't care about geography

Hah. If brexit meant a physical leaving of Europe and moving us to somewhere with a bit less rain instead of racism and shooting ourselves in the collective foot, I might have been for it...

[Terez]

Obdigore, on 26 February 2020 - 04:09 PM, said:

Tiste Simeon, on 26 February 2020 - 04:06 PM, said:

Bernie's Left is kind of middle of the road for much of Europe, so far skewed to the right is the American political spectrum as a whole.

Our own bunch of crazed fascists that call themselves a government notwithstanding of course.

Bernie's platform is just a continuation of the New Deal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Deal

Honestly it isn't new or crazy for the US, according to our own history. However those with Money have been shifting the Overton Window to the right over the following decades.

The funniest thing is, under the New Deal the US was at its strongest as a society and economically. It ushered in the greatest growth in our history. But then the capitalists came.

Bernie's platform policies are popular but he's been showing signs of dementia for years and his reputation precedes him thanks to 2016. Even ignoring that, he campaigns and governs like an activist, a pioneer on the frontiers of leftism, wherever they may be at any given time. He mainstreams the minimum required to stay relevant, sometimes arguably less.

Biden is also showing signs of dementia, more than Bloomberg who is up there in age. Warren seems fine. She would have been better in 2016, but Hillary gonna Hillary. Bernie was able to get away with running against Hillary without pissing off most people outside of Washington too badly; they kind of expect that kind of rebellion out of him because that is his brand. And they can write him off as not really being one of their own. If Warren had run in 2016, woman vs woman, everyone in the party establishment would have taken it as a personal betrayal. How did we get to that point? idk but there we were. (I voted for Warren anyway, in the general election by write-in.)

Just went and cast my early vote this morning. It's post-Super Tuesday and might not matter much, but I voted for Warren for President for the 2nd time today, and I'll do it for the 3rd time in November whether her name is on the ballot or not, because I am in one of the bluest states in the nation and my general vote will probably never matter. The primary one is the only one that might. (I voted for Bernie last time, and he barely lost my state.)

[Cause]

Biden does some remarkably stupid things. He said he was campaigning for the senate last night. The press calls him a gaffe machine and there are a ton of examples. Some people get tongue tied in public speaking. So far I’m not aware of him saying anything outrageous.

Not seen anything really linking Bernie and dementia before.

[QuickTidal]

Cause, on 26 February 2020 - 05:50 PM, said:

Not seen anything really linking Bernie and dementia before.

That's because there isn't anything.

Bernie may have typical age-related memory issues (that everyone gets as they age) but this does not in any way mean that he is suffering from a serious neurodegenerative disease like Alzheimers.

That's not a claim that can be backed up with any real evidence. Worse, unlike Trump (who very much exhibits a lot of the traits of dementia, often), Bernie forgetting some words or what his intended pathways of thought/speech are is simply because he's 78. No 78 year old is without such mild cognitive issues. Hell, I know some 50 years olds with worse cognitive issues (who also are not sick with dementia).

When Sanders is at a debate and actively forgets not just that he is at a debate, but WHY he's debating, slurs his speech and/or has issues walking with a straight gait...then call me about dementia. Until then, we have no reason to make comments about him having a neurodegenerative disease.

~signed~ a dude who is married to a health care worker in this exact field whose job it is to define and diagnose these conditions.

[Malankazooie]

Bernie's recent heart attack will come up if gets the democratic ticket. His fitness to deal with the stresses of being president will be questioned.

[Obdigore]

Cause, on 26 February 2020 - 05:50 PM, said:

Biden does some remarkably stupid things. He said he was campaigning for the senate last night. The press calls him a gaffe machine and there are a ton of examples. Some people get tongue tied in public speaking. So far I’m not aware of him saying anything outrageous.

Not seen anything really linking Bernie and dementia before.

Anything outrageous like weed should never be legalized and that video game designers are creeps living in their parents basement who design murder simulators? Calling someone a, and I quote, 'Dog-faced pony soldiers'?

Dude was Obama's Beard, and that's literally all he had going for him.

[Abyss]

I'd go one further: Not a comment on his positions on any issue, just an opinion of his physical state. I cannot help but wonder whether Sanders - age 78, one heart attack in the bag - has the physical and mental endurance necessary to do an effective job as president of the USA. Those 'typical age related memory issues' might be cause of concern in one of the most utterly atypical jobs on the planet. The average male life expectancy in the US is approx 78.5 years. Seems like taking a chance on his staying healthy another 9.

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 26 February 2020 - 07:16 PM, said:

I'd go one further: Not a comment on his positions on any issue, just an opinion of his physical state. I cannot help but wonder whether Sanders - age 78, one heart attack in the bag - has the physical and mental endurance necessary to do an effective job as president of the USA. Those 'typical age related memory issues' might be cause of concern in one of the most utterly atypical jobs on the planet. The average male life expectancy in the US is approx 78.5 years. Seems like taking a chance on his staying healthy another 9.

That's a viable argument to make.

It is not, however, the "he has dementia showing" argument which is what I was disputing.

Whether his age-related cognitive issues, or heart issues otherwise would affect his presidency...that's certainly a conversation to have.

But I mean, on the flip side if the medically obese, cheeseburger-snarfing, eats only the congealed toppings off the pizza, drinks more Coca Cola than any human should EACH day (I think the count was 11/day?) guy can sit in the Oval Office with his arteries hardening audibly, nothing about a post-heart attack 78-year old Sanders says he can't.

And it's not like the only other worthy candidate (Warren) is much younger at 70.

[Terez]

The average life expectancy for women in the US is 81.4. Elizabeth Warren is 70 and appears to be in exceptional health.


The average live expectancy for men in the US is 76.3. Bernie is 78 and just had a heart attack.


That's a huge difference.

[QuickTidal]

Terez, on 26 February 2020 - 07:51 PM, said:

The average life expectancy for women in the US is 81.4. Elizabeth Warren is 70 and appears to be in exceptional health.


The average live expectancy for men in the US is 76.3. Bernie is 78 and just had a heart attack.


That's a huge difference.

So wait, you want to try to debate their relative ages and then pinpoint them down with a life expectancy census? I mean...I know you like Warren, but that's quite absurd. Life Expectancy is a hypothetical thing, and depends on a lot of variables to be viable in even a random discussion of a group of people, let alone singling out one guy and trying to use it to oust him.

Your country has basically made it so the two most electable people who want good things for it on the democratic side...are 70 and 78...this is the ballgame you need to play. Trying to then dissect that down to play who is the most elderly...is silly. Both are old. Both are under health threats or a myriad of kinds than any human lay under. What purpose does it serve to nitpick that into "who's going to kick off first"? It serves no one. It serves even less to make blanket statements about dementia because Sanders is a human with normal human cognitive decline.

Sidebar: Because I was curious. Warren's father (who died at 86) outlived her mother (83). How's that for life expectancy rates?

[Terez]

I said it was an average. Probabilities are significant, and a 70-year-old woman in good health and a 78-year-old man are just not the same thing. Nothing to get irrationally angry about.

[QuickTidal]

Terez, on 26 February 2020 - 08:09 PM, said:

I said it was an average. Probabilities are significant, and a 70-year-old woman in good health and a 78-year-old man are just not the same thing. Nothing to get irrationally angry about.

Do you see me as irrationally angry? Interesting.

[Cause]

Life expectancy is tricky. You have to factor in infant mortality and a host of other things.

The life expectancy for a 75 year old in the USA is another 12 years. So if you already made it to 75 you can expect to make it to 87.

If you already 65 you can expect to make it to 84

If you were just born you can expect to make it to 78

Edit- it’s a lesser issue in the us but most developing nations quite life expectancy from age five because most deaths occur then. Life expectancy from birth and age five are often decades apart.

This post has been edited by Cause: 26 February 2020 - 08:27 PM

[Terez]

Cause, on 26 February 2020 - 08:25 PM, said:

Life expectancy is tricky. You have to factor in infant mortality and a host of other things.

The life expectancy for a 75 year old in the USA is another 12 years. So if you already made it to 75 you can expect to make it to 87.

If you already 65 you can expect to make it to 84

If you were just born you can expect to make it to 78

Edit- it's a lesser issue in the us but most developing nations quite life expectancy from age five because most deaths occur then. Life expectancy from birth and age five are often decades apart.

I believe all these things are fairly common knowledge. Doesn't stop us from using life expectancy numbers as a reference point, nor does it make them a bad reference point.

This post has been edited by Terez: 26 February 2020 - 08:28 PM

[Cause]

Well Bernie sanders can say he has a good chance of living through two terms. as opposed to saying he lives everyday as a statistical anomaly waiting to die.

[Malankazooie]

Didn't watch the debate but have seen some clips and highlights. Bloomberg is such an unappetizing individual, so out of touch, that it's enervating to watch him speak. I recoil in abject disgust when the camera is on him. But, 3 billys, so yeah.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'Donald Trump's re-election campaign has filed a libel lawsuit against the New York Times, accusing America's newspaper of record of intentionally publishing a false story last year about Russia's interference in the 2016 election.

In the lawsuit, which the campaign annouced was filed in New York State Supreme Court on Wednesday, the campaign alleges that the Times published a false story on 27 March 2019 claiming that Mr Trump and his campaign had engaged in a deal with the allies of Russian president Vladimir Putin to help his campaign in 2016 in exchange for a pro-Russia policy once Mr Trump became president.

[...] "The Trump Campaign has turned to the courts to try to punish an opinion writer for having an opinion they find unacceptable[...] Fortunately, the law protects the right of Americans to express their judgments and conclusions, especially about events of public importance. We look forward to vindicating that right in this case."'

https://www.independ...obox=1582748322

Here's the op-ed:

https://www.nytimes....id-pro-quo.html

'Why Donald Trump Has Never Won a Libel Case

"Donald J. Trump is a libel bully. Like most bullies, he's also a loser, to borrow from Trump's vocabulary.”

That's the opening of “Donald J. Trump Is A Libel Bully But Also A Libel Loser,” an analysis of seven different lawsuits he's filed, by Susan Seager, a media law specialist at the University of Southern California. (Media Law Resource Center)

“Trump and his companies have been involved in a mind-boggling 4,000 lawsuits over the last 30 years and sent countless threatening cease-and-desist letters to journalists and critics.” Neither he nor his companies have won a speech-related case, something to be recalled as he threatens The New York Times and several women who have accused him of sexual assault.'

https://www.vanityfa...on-a-libel-case

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 26 February 2020 - 09:58 PM

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'Trump official refuses to say a coronavirus vaccine would be affordable to all

Alex Azar also appears to contradict president's contention that deadly virus will disappear once it gets warmer

[...] Giving evidence to Congress on the administration's efforts to contain the deadly virus, Mr Azar said: "We would want to ensure that we work to make it affordable, but we can't control that price, because we need the private sector to invest. Price controls won't get us there."'

https://www.independ...vu7OY4V5RElAaD8

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 27 February 2020 - 02:18 AM

[Cause]

Why would anyone suggest a virus would disappear when it got warmer. That’s not how it works ever.

Also I’d imagine it’s basic economics to vaccinate the population against disease than have 2 percent of the workforce die, a third take sick leave and the rest stay home from fear.

[Maark Abbott]

Cause, on 27 February 2020 - 04:35 AM, said:

Why would anyone suggest a virus would disappear when it got warmer. That's not how it works ever.

Also I'd imagine it's basic economics to vaccinate the population against disease than have 2 percent of the workforce die, a third take sick leave and the rest stay home from fear.

Seems you haven't been in America long enough to learn about windmill cancer, huh...

Facetious comments aside, it's because Trump is an idiot.