[QuickTidal]

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

[Terez]

I'll pass on this one (for now at least) because I've been up all night and I can't even think straight any more.

[Gorefest]

 amphibian, on 09 November 2016 - 03:11 PM, said:

My father predicted back in January that Trump would win. Last night, he said he hated to be correct and that it was an embarrassment for politicians and media alike that this happened. Both groups need to change majorly in terms of how they address people and the one fucking guy who figured it out in today's world is now president.

Pah, January. I gave him a chance in this very thread in June 2015 and was told by the Americans here that there was no chance he'd even be the Republican candidate. They can put me right up there with Paul the Octopus. Sadly, big money talks.

[amphibian]

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I don't think anyone has a fucking clue at this point beyond the wall being out there. The majority in Congress isn't filibuster proof and he lost the popular vote by a bit, so his political capital isn't that immense. But he is entirely unpredictable at this point.

[Mezla PigDog]

 amphibian, on 09 November 2016 - 05:15 PM, said:

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I don't think anyone has a fucking clue at this point beyond the wall being out there. The majority in Congress isn't filibuster proof and he lost the popular vote by a bit, so his political capital isn't that immense. But he is entirely unpredictable at this point.

I think it's really difficult to even pin point what he genuinely believes. So much of his campaign was just spouting off rather than carefully considered policy. I can't believe he even has an opinion on immigration or healthcare as he's never been touched by any of it as a person or as a professional politician. It's so baffling.

The curse of "may you live in interesting times" feels prudent in the UK and US right now.

[Vengeance]

 Mezla PigDog, on 09 November 2016 - 05:25 PM, said:

 amphibian, on 09 November 2016 - 05:15 PM, said:

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I don't think anyone has a fucking clue at this point beyond the wall being out there. The majority in Congress isn't filibuster proof and he lost the popular vote by a bit, so his political capital isn't that immense. But he is entirely unpredictable at this point.

I think it's really difficult to even pin point what he genuinely believes. So much of his campaign was just spouting off rather than carefully considered policy. I can't believe he even has an opinion on immigration or healthcare as he's never been touched by any of it as a person or as a professional politician. It's so baffling.

The curse of "may you live in interesting times" feels prudent in the UK and US right now.

I am worried about who he will appoint to run the various government departments. I heard that department of the interior would be the former head of an oil company. I expect the justice department will be Guilani, Newt could be Sec of state. God knows what that Bretbart asshole is goign to get. With a republican congress and senate 25 million people can say seya to healthcare. I actually expect that he will get into serious fights with congress about the budget as Ryan wants to cut and Trump wants to cut taxes and spend money like crazy. We are going to be ran by a bunch of conspiracy theory nutjobs. But as long as we don't get involved in a nuclear war or are invaded. We might be able to survive 4 years. I mean the environment will go to shit and consumer protections will be eliminated and healthcare will be a pipe dream. Social security and welfare will be gutted.

[HoosierDaddy]

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I haven't looked because I'm traumatized, but as long as the Senate has 40+ democrats he can't do anything in legislation, SC justices (which was a terrible precedent (Republicans), because he'll be blocked by filibusters and can't get cloture.

The problem is that he is the Commander in Chief and he has a LOT of power with the armed forces to do anything without congressional say so for 60 days (more, really).

He can start a war on his own. It's why this is scary.

This post has been edited by HoosierDaddy: 09 November 2016 - 06:57 PM

[Primateus]

To anyone who thinks otherwise: A country is NOT A FUCKING BUSINESS! And it should not be run as such.

[QuickTidal]

 HoosierDaddy, on 09 November 2016 - 06:56 PM, said:

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I haven't looked because I'm traumatized, but as long as the Senate has 40+ democrats he can't do anything in legislation, SC justices (which was a terrible precedent (Republicans), because he'll be blocked by filibusters and can't get cloture.

The problem is that he is the Commander in Chief and he has a LOT of power with the armed forces to do anything without congressional say so for 60 days (more, really).

He can start a war on his own. It's why this is scary.

Well, you're more than welcome up here HD.

You gotta learn to love Poutine, the Blue Jays, and up your beer tolerance for our beer alcohol percentage, but otherwise come on up.

[Coltaine -]

Just checked the official results.

Donald Trump: 59,441,355 votes
Hillary Clinton: 59,649,230 votes

This system doesn't work. Whats so wrong with letting every single vote count? Like in a normal democracy.

[Mentalist]

 - Coltaine -, on 09 November 2016 - 07:31 PM, said:

Just checked the official results.

Donald Trump: 59,441,355 votes
Hillary Clinton: 59,649,230 votes

This system doesn't work. Whats so wrong with letting every single vote count? Like in a normal democracy.

Then there'd be a few elections the Dems lost before.

I believe the original point of their system is to prevent a particular group (especially densely populated coastal conurbations) from having disproportionate weight due to their high population.

Of course this creates its own issues, but basically if US was straight-up PR, then given the general low voter turnout rates (the past few bein exceptions rather then the rule), you'd get the voters from LA, NYC, Chicago and a few other big cities deciding most elections. So there's an overly complicated checks and balances sub-system in place . Prevent that being the case.

[Cause]

 - Coltaine -, on 09 November 2016 - 07:31 PM, said:

Just checked the official results.

Donald Trump: 59,441,355 votes
Hillary Clinton: 59,649,230 votes

This system doesn't work. Whats so wrong with letting every single vote count? Like in a normal democracy.

Thats ridiculously close! Also voter turnout seems incredibly low? 120 million votes out of 350/400 million people?

[HoosierDaddy]

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 07:20 PM, said:

 HoosierDaddy, on 09 November 2016 - 06:56 PM, said:

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I haven't looked because I'm traumatized, but as long as the Senate has 40+ democrats he can't do anything in legislation, SC justices (which was a terrible precedent (Republicans), because he'll be blocked by filibusters and can't get cloture.

The problem is that he is the Commander in Chief and he has a LOT of power with the armed forces to do anything without congressional say so for 60 days (more, really).

He can start a war on his own. It's why this is scary.

Well, you're more than welcome up here HD.

You gotta learn to love Poutine, the Blue Jays, and up your beer tolerance for our beer alcohol percentage, but otherwise come on up.

Gravy on fries is weird, but can it be that different from mashed with gravy? Yankees (for real, but baseball ain't my favorite sport anymore. Argonauts? TFC?), don't need anymore alcohol tolerance, lol.

Your government is as friendly as y'all. To be expected, immigration is rough sledding.

[HoosierDaddy]

 Cause, on 09 November 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

 - Coltaine -, on 09 November 2016 - 07:31 PM, said:

Just checked the official results.

Donald Trump: 59,441,355 votes
Hillary Clinton: 59,649,230 votes

This system doesn't work. Whats so wrong with letting every single vote count? Like in a normal democracy.

Thats ridiculously close! Also voter turnout seems incredibly low? 120 million votes out of 350/400 million people?

Turnout was ridiculously high in rural areas, low in Democrat strongholds.

1. Voter suppression works
2. No voting holiday
3. People don't care about these candidates
4. Fuck Trump

[Hairshirt]

 Briar King, on 09 November 2016 - 07:37 PM, said:

I was expecting it but my FB is stupid right now blowing up from over the top doom n gloom/freak outs(I'd not do this if she won) or over the top unneeded gloating(Id not do this either) I hope that shit calms down asap but it won't be overnight.

I voted for Hillary, I'm a Independent who voted for issues I believe in. Watching last night's election coverage has shown me why Trump won. What I basically took from listening to pundits (as well as certain people here) was that Hillary lost because of dumb, racist, sexist, and in general terrible white males. This is nothing new. In my social circles people who disagree with liberal ideas are immediately labeled whatever the appropriate description to the topic is. For example, if you don't like BLM, you're racist. When that happens, and it always does people shut down and stop discussing issues. You're not a racist if you think the Michael Brown was shot because he's a bad guy and tried to kill a cop.

I think Trump winning was a big middle finger to liberal elites at college campuses, at politicians and especially at the media who on a daily basis talk down to them and refuse to even listen to what they say because of whatever "ism" they feel like using at the time.

[Mentalist]

 HoosierDaddy, on 09 November 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 07:20 PM, said:

 HoosierDaddy, on 09 November 2016 - 06:56 PM, said:

 QuickTidal, on 09 November 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

Can an American "in the know" about this stuff (Terez?) explain what Trump CAN and CAN'T do from his campaign promises? I know he can't build a wall at Mexico...but what else was pie in the sky, and what could come to pass more easily?

I haven't looked because I'm traumatized, but as long as the Senate has 40+ democrats he can't do anything in legislation, SC justices (which was a terrible precedent (Republicans), because he'll be blocked by filibusters and can't get cloture.

The problem is that he is the Commander in Chief and he has a LOT of power with the armed forces to do anything without congressional say so for 60 days (more, really).

He can start a war on his own. It's why this is scary.

Well, you're more than welcome up here HD.

You gotta learn to love Poutine, the Blue Jays, and up your beer tolerance for our beer alcohol percentage, but otherwise come on up.

Gravy on fries is weird, but can it be that different from mashed with gravy? Yankees (for real, but baseball ain't my favorite sport anymore. Argonauts? TFC?), don't need anymore alcohol tolerance, lol.

Your government is as friendly as y'all. To be expected, immigration is rough sledding.

It's all about the cheese curds. And optionally bacon.

You forgot the Leafs. And Raptors (more important then Argos).

[Nevyn]

 Cause, on 09 November 2016 - 08:06 PM, said:

 - Coltaine -, on 09 November 2016 - 07:31 PM, said:

Just checked the official results.

Donald Trump: 59,441,355 votes
Hillary Clinton: 59,649,230 votes

This system doesn't work. Whats so wrong with letting every single vote count? Like in a normal democracy.

Thats ridiculously close! Also voter turnout seems incredibly low? 120 million votes out of 350/400 million people?

Ok, those are not the official results. A third of the California vote still isn't counted, for example. Also 350 million people does not mean 350 million registered voters. Its more like 250 million people who could potentially vote.

Also Cause did not include the third party votes.

I mean, its still low, but ...

[Mezla PigDog]

 HoosierDaddy, on 09 November 2016 - 08:08 PM, said:

2. No voting holiday

I was looking last night UK time at what time to expect results and it said that voting closed at like 6.30pm in some states. Is that right? In the UK it is always open until 10pm so even if you have had a long day you can always squeeze it in. And I noticed you mentioned you couldn't park to vote. I've voted in 4 different places in the UK and the polling station has been less than a 5min walk in 3 of those places and 10mins in one. Are polling places few and far between in the US?

[worry]

 Hairshirt, on 09 November 2016 - 08:20 PM, said:

I voted for Hillary, I'm a Independent who voted for issues I believe in. Watching last night's election coverage has shown me why Trump won. What I basically took from listening to pundits (as well as certain people here) was that Hillary lost because of dumb, racist, sexist, and in general terrible white males. This is nothing new. In my social circles people who disagree with liberal ideas are immediately labeled whatever the appropriate description to the topic is. For example, if you don't like BLM, you're racist. When that happens, and it always does people shut down and stop discussing issues. You're not a racist if you think the Michael Brown was shot because he's a bad guy and tried to kill a cop.

Who said it was just white males?

[Gorefest]

It seems to me that the biggest group of Trump voters are white Americans - both male and female - from the suburbs or rural areas who often are even reasonably well off, but are scared of change: immigration, changing morals and attitudes, fear of an upset to their ingrained ways of life, etc. They don't care about things that happen outside of their community, they just want the Stepford Wives lifestyle to be protected and shielded from anything that doesnt fit in with their very framed view of how things ought to be. The only contact they have with the world is what is bombarded at them on a daily basis through populist media outlets such as Fox who tell them that terrorists are coming to destroy their churches and devious big city people who will turn their kids gay and rape babies.

That's all we see here on tv when they pull a Trump voter in front of the camera anyway: they all seem to be white middle class types from little church communities who 'want their country back' (back from what?) and who want to be 'proud' and live in the 'judeo-christian' tradition (whatever that means). I imagine the majority of them have never even spoken to a Muslim or had any immigrants threatening their jobs, it's just that their traditional local job positions have moved to the big cities or made obsolete by big supermarkets and other big corporations. It's fear, not malice.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 09 November 2016 - 09:40 PM