[Mockra]

Hmm, and the other thing that I've just thought of, for the theory that both Tiam and Serc were Xia, they would both have to know already that the other was Xia. But emperors only know locations, not alts, I think.

[Serc]

Rashan, on 04 October 2011 - 12:08 AM, said:

Serc, on 04 October 2011 - 12:05 AM, said:

Mockra, on 03 October 2011 - 11:38 PM, said:

And here I was all set to just believe Serc's find...but luckily smarter players than I are on the ball and have suggested various other possible intentions. As has been said, investigating Tiam seems mighty convenient. I find the argument that Serc is an Emperor and Tiam is one of his lackeys who knows him quite convincing at present, strengthened by Tiam's non-vote on Serc. Tiam has said they haven't done this because people would just say "oh, only doing it to deflect away from their own lynch", but on reflection, so what? Wouldn't most in the same situation vote for the other candidate in order to rack up their vote count? They would, unless there's more going on beneath the surface.

Of course, if this is correct, then the theory that Gamelon and Serc are connected (which started all this) is wrong. So I'm not sure how we reconcile that. Because if the above theory is correct, then that seems mighty unlucky for the Xia faction, having two of their members up against the wall, no?

You can't have it both ways - the only possible evidence for me being an emperor, weak though it may be, is the Gamelon connection. If I'm not connected to Gamelon, there is no reason to suggest that I'm an emperor at all. Zero. Except whatever someone wants to pull out of their ass.

Yes, I was lucky that my Find on Tiam succeeded, but I'm not an idiot. I clashed with Tiam on day one and he was one of the few players I went back and forth with while defending myself; Tiam's been pretty active anyway, so investigating him made a lot of sense. It was a good play that turns out to have worked in my favor more than I thought it would.

As for the location problem, no matter where you assume I started on the map, a single Move could always put me adjacent to at least one Xia territory. Assuming I could Move successfully, there is no possible starting location that would prevent me from being able to Find a Xia player.

Not if you were Ma Teng. Just saying.

Sorry, but you're wrong. If I was Ma Teng and started in Tlan Shui, a Move to Han Zhong would put me in range of Chang An, which is half in Xia territory. Of course, speculation on locations is still unreliable, since there are a lot of possibilities when you take the target's possible movements into account.

[Tiamatha]

Serc, on 03 October 2011 - 10:55 PM, said:

First, I'll

Vote Tiamatha

and now I will explain why.

I am a finder, and like any finder reveal, the proof will lie in the outcome of a lynch; namely, Tiam's. I know that Tiam is in the Xia faction. I don't know what role he is. (Personally, I think it's likely that he's the Usurper due to how often he mentions that role, but that is just opinion.) I've debated the value of revealing this information but with my lynch imminent, I don't see how this can hurt me. It will also force those of the Xia faction who may have voted for Tiam without knowing he was on their team to reconsider their votes if Tiam's lynch train picks up steam. They will be forced to either vote one of their own players or risk being identified as possible Xia members. Already we have the common (yet erroneous) assumption that I am the Lu Emperor, so anyone voting for me has already declared themselves non-Lu or they already know that I'm not the Lu Emperor and intend to remain quiet about that fact.

There are only a few possibilities concerning this reveal -

Option 1) I'm telling the truth about Tiam's faction. This means I cannot be the Lu Emperor which so many people seem to think I am. The OP states that Emperors know many of the locations of their faction members but not their alts, and although they have "special abilities that can affect numerous players", I'm guessing that one of those abilities isn't a simple find. However, I wouldn't know for sure, since I'm not an Emperor. So, what faction am I? Hard to say, and I'm not telling you. I could be Xia and now I'm throwing Tiam under the bus to save myself but that's unlikely; however, all other options are viable. I think many people forget that there are a total of six factions in this game, not three (with five currently active - Xia, Lu, Yan, and both Warlord factions), as well as roles that are not listed in the OP - not to mention seven players who haven't even posted ten times yet. There are a lot of possibilities out there.

Option 2) I'm lying about Tiam to avoid getting lynched. If you really, really think I'm the Lu Emperor then you haven't listened or paid attention to anything I've said all game anyway, so I don't expect this to change your mind. However, if you are an intrepid player who could see themselves voting for me or Tiam, try me. Test my claim and see if I'm lying; if so, lynch me tomorrow, it's not like I can prevent it.

If I do get hammered before I get another chance to respond or before others get a chance to switch their votes, be wary of these players, as they clearly are trying to avoid the possibility of Tiam's lynch and that makes them probable Xia members.

The bottom line is, if you're voting for me because you think I'm an Emperor, I don't see any reason that you would lynch me before testing my claim, because if I'm not the Lu Emperor, I may be on your team.

Oh, please!
Really?

So, if you're coming out in the open, trying to appear honest and sincere, pleading people to believe you and test your claims, why are you withholding information from then now?
Why not come out clean? Spill out the beans?


What am I talking about?
Well, something pretty much everyone should know, since it's like... in the rules and all... first page, you know?

D, on 24 August 2011 - 10:37 PM, said:

Game Mechanics


All players will have the following qualities:


Role: the character name of the role assigned to them (ex: Dong Zhuo)
Faction: the kingdom to which the player belongs

Night Actions:

Players have access to a wide variety of Night Actions depending on their role and role type. All Night Actions can largely be divided into either Standard (Std) or Special (Spc) NAs.



Standard Night Actions:

There are four standard NAs: Guard, Find, Heal and Kill.


Find - Discloses to the caster the role name and faction of the targeted player.

Vote Serc


Not for being associated with Gamelon or linked to him or anything else.
But for possible fake revealing, as a desperate measure.
For withholding information from the rest of you (and me), by not adding my role name to his reveal and claim, something that can just as easily be tested with my CF, and further back up his claim.
And for alterior motives.

ALEA IACTA EST!

[Mockra]

I think we can pretty safely assume that Tiam is indeed Xia, because if they turned out not to be, then Serc knows their own lynch would only have been temporarily postponed.

I think we can also pretty safely assume that the vast majority/all the people who've so far voted Serc are - unless they didn't understand the case - of any faction except Lu.

What else? If we end up lynching Tiam and they are, say, the Xia emperor, do we then go and lynch Emur after (if you all remember the old case that Emur as civil official may have been signalling Tiam) in a culture hunt?

[Serc]

Tiamatha, on 04 October 2011 - 12:21 AM, said:

Serc, on 03 October 2011 - 10:55 PM, said:

First, I'll

Vote Tiamatha

and now I will explain why.

I am a finder, and like any finder reveal, the proof will lie in the outcome of a lynch; namely, Tiam's. I know that Tiam is in the Xia faction. I don't know what role he is. (Personally, I think it's likely that he's the Usurper due to how often he mentions that role, but that is just opinion.) I've debated the value of revealing this information but with my lynch imminent, I don't see how this can hurt me. It will also force those of the Xia faction who may have voted for Tiam without knowing he was on their team to reconsider their votes if Tiam's lynch train picks up steam. They will be forced to either vote one of their own players or risk being identified as possible Xia members. Already we have the common (yet erroneous) assumption that I am the Lu Emperor, so anyone voting for me has already declared themselves non-Lu or they already know that I'm not the Lu Emperor and intend to remain quiet about that fact.

There are only a few possibilities concerning this reveal -

Option 1) I'm telling the truth about Tiam's faction. This means I cannot be the Lu Emperor which so many people seem to think I am. The OP states that Emperors know many of the locations of their faction members but not their alts, and although they have "special abilities that can affect numerous players", I'm guessing that one of those abilities isn't a simple find. However, I wouldn't know for sure, since I'm not an Emperor. So, what faction am I? Hard to say, and I'm not telling you. I could be Xia and now I'm throwing Tiam under the bus to save myself but that's unlikely; however, all other options are viable. I think many people forget that there are a total of six factions in this game, not three (with five currently active - Xia, Lu, Yan, and both Warlord factions), as well as roles that are not listed in the OP - not to mention seven players who haven't even posted ten times yet. There are a lot of possibilities out there.

Option 2) I'm lying about Tiam to avoid getting lynched. If you really, really think I'm the Lu Emperor then you haven't listened or paid attention to anything I've said all game anyway, so I don't expect this to change your mind. However, if you are an intrepid player who could see themselves voting for me or Tiam, try me. Test my claim and see if I'm lying; if so, lynch me tomorrow, it's not like I can prevent it.

If I do get hammered before I get another chance to respond or before others get a chance to switch their votes, be wary of these players, as they clearly are trying to avoid the possibility of Tiam's lynch and that makes them probable Xia members.

The bottom line is, if you're voting for me because you think I'm an Emperor, I don't see any reason that you would lynch me before testing my claim, because if I'm not the Lu Emperor, I may be on your team.

Oh, please!
Really?

So, if you're coming out in the open, trying to appear honest and sincere, pleading people to believe you and test your claims, why are you withholding information from then now?
Why not come out clean? Spill out the beans?


What am I talking about?
Well, something pretty much everyone should know, since it's like... in the rules and all... first page, you know?

D, on 24 August 2011 - 10:37 PM, said:

Game Mechanics


All players will have the following qualities:


Role: the character name of the role assigned to them (ex: Dong Zhuo)
Faction: the kingdom to which the player belongs

Night Actions:

Players have access to a wide variety of Night Actions depending on their role and role type. All Night Actions can largely be divided into either Standard (Std) or Special (Spc) NAs.



Standard Night Actions:

There are four standard NAs: Guard, Find, Heal and Kill.


Find - Discloses to the caster the role name and faction of the targeted player.

Vote Serc


Not for being associated with Gamelon or linked to him or anything else.
But for possible fake revealing, as a desperate measure.
For withholding information from the rest of you (and me), by not adding my role name to his reveal and claim, something that can just as easily be tested with my CF, and further back up his claim.
And for alterior motives.

ALEA IACTA EST!

I was smart enough to hold something back for when you came around to accuse me, Cen Pi.

[Rashan]

Damn it you bitch, how can he respond if you just hammered him....?

[Mockra]

Oooh, twist!

[Rashan]

Cen Pi, ok I will remember that.

[Mockra]

Wait, what? Is that a lynch?!

[Serc]

Rashan, on 04 October 2011 - 12:27 AM, said:

Damn it you bitch, how can he respond if you just hammered him....?

? Aren't I at L-2?

[Path-Shaper]

Vote Count

It is Day 2. 10 hours and 24 minutes remaining
24 Players still alive: Atrahal, Barghast, Emurlahn, Galain, Hood's Path, Karosis, Kaschan, Kessobahn, Korlat, Meanas, Mockra, Okaros, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Serc, Sheltatha Lore, Silanah, Sorritt, Telas, Tennes, Thyrllan, Tiamatha

13 votes to lynch, 12 votes to go to night.

7 Votes for Tiamatha ( Kessobahn, Ruse, Karosis, Osseric, Rashan, Serc, Silanah )
11 Votes for Serc ( Sorritt, Sheltatha Lore, Tiamatha, Meanas, Okaros, Emurlahn, Tennes, Telas, Barghast, Atrahal, Korlat )

Players not voted: Galain, Hood's Path, Kaschan, Mockra, Omtose, Thyrllan

---

Hammer? Did I miss a vote or two?

This post has been edited by Path-Shaper: 04 October 2011 - 12:31 AM

[Rashan]

Sorry Serc, I read your post as you had one more vote to go and you were trying to get info in last minute. My mistake, maybe, hopefully PS will give us a count.

[Mockra]

No, actually, I think there's only been 11 votes on Serc so far....

[Path-Shaper]

Rashan, on 04 October 2011 - 12:32 AM, said:

Sorry Serc, I read your post as you had one more vote to go and you were trying to get info in last minute. My mistake, maybe, hopefully PS will give us a count.

>.>

<.<

[Rashan]

Damn cross posting....

[Mockra]

Goddamn it Rashan

[Mockra]

Ok, after that little scare....So Tiam, what's your next throw of the dice going to be?

[Rashan]

nothing to see here, move on...

[Silanah]

Well that's it then. People need to vote Tiam, test this theory out.

Neither of them are off the hook, but I see a Tiam vote as making more sense.

[Path-Shaper]

Special Clarification


Someone pointed out in PM a rule I missed putting in the OP:

If you use a standard NA on a target that is not in your location or an adjacent location (in my lingo, an "Out-of-range" action), it will not do any blocking (or anything else). Basically, all out-of-range actions submitted are immediately discarded at the start of NA resolution and not considered further.

Let me know if you have any questions about this.