[worry]

I cannot believe they made No Escape. It seems goofier, even less self aware, perhaps even tackier than The Impossible, that movie about the white middle class family whose Thailand vacation was tragically cut short by the tsunami.

[QuickTidal]

worry, on 06 August 2015 - 07:21 AM, said:

I cannot believe they made No Escape. It seems goofier, even less self aware, perhaps even tackier than The Impossible, that movie about the white middle class family whose Thailand vacation was tragically cut short by the tsunami.

Re: The Impossible. So the family who experienced this (who were arguably Spanish IRL, not British) didn't deserve to have their story told? Why? Because the bigger event it was about has many more native inhabitant stories? It doens't change the fact that it happened to them, and it's a prety miraculous true story.

And what is your specific issue with No Escape?

[QuickTidal]

Wow, FANTASTIC 4 is tanking harder than I thought it would.

http://www.rottentom...stic_four_2015/

I knew it was a turkey when Fox refused press screenings and threw a review embargo on online AND print reviews...but damn this is worse than I expected.

It sounds like it has very little in the way of redeeming qualities and what should have been a cosmic space romp (ALA GotG) featuring a crazy foreign dictator villain sounds more like an updated and indie version of the EXPLORERS. I think the whole thing was also miscast, with the exception of Michael B. Jordan who I feel probably makes a solid Johnny Storm....but Teller is not and never will be Reed Richards (he does not have the gravitas), Mara as Sue is just meh (where I feel she FITS a role like her character in the upcoming THE MARTIAN like a glove...she's just not Sue Storm), and Jaime Bell as Thing? Ugh. Say what one will about the practical suit in the other two FF movies...but Michael Chiklis at least embodied Ben Grimm well.

Oh, and did you hear? The line "It's Clobberin' time" is in the film as something Grimm's older brother used to say to him before he would beat the shit out of him. Yup, they made The Thing's battle cry into something that came from domestic violence he suffered.

[Slow Ben]

SB's surprise level about the awfulness of the F4 movie = 0




Dark Tower confirmed.......again.

As always, i''ll believe it when i see it.

https://variety.com/...ers-1201557242/

This post has been edited by Slow Ben: 06 August 2015 - 01:51 PM

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

Oh, and did you hear? The line "It's Clobberin' time" is in the film as something Grimm's older brother used to say to him before he would beat the shit out of him. Yup, they made The Thing's battle cry into something that came from domestic violence he suffered.

That's all sorts of fucked up.

[QuickTidal]

Whisperzzzzzzz, on 06 August 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

Oh, and did you hear? The line "It's Clobberin' time" is in the film as something Grimm's older brother used to say to him before he would beat the shit out of him. Yup, they made The Thing's battle cry into something that came from domestic violence he suffered.

That's all sorts of fucked up.

Yuuuuup.

And apparently Sue doesn't get her powers with the rest of the crew...she just happens to be in the wrong place at the wrong time later on in the story and somehow gets powers as a result...and is apparently treated worse as a character after that than Jessica Alba's Sue was maligned to "love interest".

[polishgenius]

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 11:23 AM, said:

Re: The Impossible. So the family who experienced this (who were arguably Spanish IRL, not British) didn't deserve to have their story told? Why? Because the bigger event it was about has many more native inhabitant stories? It doens't change the fact that it happened to them, and it's a prety miraculous true story.

For me, it's just the enormous what-I'm-sure-was-a-coincidence that Hollywood made a story about one of the few white families (made a little bit whiter in the film than real life, because something) rather than something about the many, many local lives affected that grates. It's like, yeah, it was a remarkable story, but there were loads of them to be told, how come they just happened to pick that one?




With No Escape, even though it's obviously not just from the timings and having read the synpopsis the actual plot doesn't bear any resemblance, but the trailer I saw before Mission Impossible made it look horribly akin to something smashed out to somehow take advantage of the Tunisia attacks earlier in the year. Even without that connection, there's an air of 'white people beware them dodgy foreigners!' that tastes sour. Maybe the film avoids those pitfalls, but the trailer is dreadful.



On the subject of Mission Immpossible, you didn't even mention the best thing about it. Rebbecca Ferguson is brilliant.

This post has been edited by polishgenius: 06 August 2015 - 04:49 PM

[QuickTidal]

polishgenius, on 06 August 2015 - 04:48 PM, said:

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 11:23 AM, said:

Re: The Impossible. So the family who experienced this (who were arguably Spanish IRL, not British) didn't deserve to have their story told? Why? Because the bigger event it was about has many more native inhabitant stories? It doens't change the fact that it happened to them, and it's a prety miraculous true story.

For me, it's just the enormous what-I'm-sure-was-a-coincidence that Hollywood made a story about one of the few white families (made a little bit whiter in the film than real life, because something) rather than something about the many, many local lives affected that grates. It's like, yeah, it was a remarkable story, but there were loads of them to be told, how come they just happened to pick that one?

Right, and there are around 4 documentaries out there that go into the local lives that were affected and how during the 2004 Tsunami.

And Hollywood didn't make it. Spanish production, bought and paid for. The director is Spanish (Bayona), as was the writer (Sanchez; met him...awesome guy with a great set of films written under his belt!), and the entire production was actually Spanish as well. The director's reasoning behind casting as he did: Director Juan Antonio Bayona decided not to specify the nationalities of the main characters in order to create a universal film in which nationalities were irrelevant to the plot." It's certainly not a "Hollywood" film as in crafted, cast, and made with Hollywood money. It was all financed in Spain and is probably their biggest budget film in years. It was distributed by Hollywood studios later, but that's back end and can't be applied to up front choices.

But why is it bad that they chose this story? Are the others more important? Does the real family involved somehow rank lower because they aren't local inhabitants? I may feel more strongly about this because I attended the film fest screening and the actual family attended and it was a powerful Q&A. The mother actually spoke passionately about how she felt horrible that all the locals were going to have a much harder time than she did after she was airlifted out (a moment which is in the film). I don't think their story is any less important because they are visitors. Sure there are literally thousands of stories during that event...they chose this one. And I don't see anything wrong with that as a filmic choice. Setting/telling a story in around a traumatic event is nothing new. If you are telling a story where the main thrust is actually "survival" why can't someone want to tell the story of a family from their hometown like Bayona did?

polishgenius, on 06 August 2015 - 04:48 PM, said:

With No Escape, even though it's obviously not just from the timings and having read the synpopsis the actual plot doesn't bear any resemblance, but the trailer I saw before Mission Impossible made it look horribly akin to something smashed out to somehow take advantage of the Tunisia attacks earlier in the year. Even without that connection, there's an air of 'white people beware them dodgy foreigners!' that tastes sour. Maybe the film avoids those pitfalls, but the trailer is dreadful.

Thailand (where the film ostensibly takes place) has had 11 coup attempts since 1932 more than any other country apparently. If you happened to be living in a foreign country when such a thing went down, it would be pretty harrowing if you were right in the middle of it. This is not to say that the coup itself isn't more interesting fodder for storytelling...but rather I see this as no more problematic than German terrorists taking over an office tower in downtown L.A. (DIE HARD).

Now, the trailer doesn't give us a lot to go on as far as what their life is like BEFORE the coup and fighting begins...as long as the coup is a contained group of people, it could be just fine. You could be right that they could go the route of "beware dodgy foreigners"...I hope that's not the case. Bold Films are hardly a big Hollywood production company churning out pointless crap though, and have financed some of the more well received indie films of the last 5 years (DRIVE, WHIPLASH, NIGHTCRAWLER)...and the production company on-site was entirely Thai-based (Living Films). I'm not saying that's a sign of "it will be good and respectful", but it's better than some other productions who shoot globally without respect for the local population (20th Century Fox on THE BEACH for example).

polishgenius, on 06 August 2015 - 04:48 PM, said:

On the subject of Mission Immpossible, you didn't even mention the best thing about it. Rebbecca Ferguson is brilliant.

It wasn't until I got home and Googled her that I realized who she was and I was like...Oh! From THE WHITE QUEEN! Yeah, she was excellent, and stood on her own far more than any female IMF member in the last few films.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 06 August 2015 - 06:33 PM

[polishgenius]

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 05:40 PM, said:

And Hollywood didn't make it. Spanish production, bought and paid for. The director is Spanish (Bayona), as was the writer (Sanchez; met him...awesome guy with a great set of films written under his belt!), and the entire production was actually Spanish as well. The director's reasoning behind casting as he did: Director Juan Antonio Bayona decided not to specify the nationalities of the main characters in order to create a universal film in which nationalities were irrelevant to the plot." It's certainly not a "Hollywood" film as in crafted, cast, and made with Hollywood money. It was all financed in Spain and is probably their biggest budget film in years. It was distributed by Hollywood studios later, but that's back end and can't be applied to up front choices.

But why is it bad that they chose this story? Are the others more important? Does the real family involved somehow rank lower because they aren't local inhabitants? I may feel more strongly about this because I attended the film fest screening and the actual family attended and it was a powerful Q&A. The mother actually spoke passionately about how she felt horrible that all the locals were going to have a much harder time than she did after she was airlifted out (a moment which is in the film). I don't think their story is any less important because they are visitors. Sure there are literally thousands of stories during that event...they chose this one. And I don't see anything wrong with that as a filmic choice. Setting/telling a story in around a traumatic event is nothing new. If you are telling a story where the main thrust is actually "survival" why can't someone want to tell the story of a family from their hometown like Bayona did?

This is all fair enough- I didn't realise it was a Spanish production. Though the whole 'didn't specify nationality because wider audience etc' kind of ties into my point - why are the people they picked more relatable than an actual Spanish couple?

The problem isn't really with the film itself but with the entire mentality of the studio structure, and indeed a continuation of the 'Western-disasters-matter-more' approach of our media. How often do films like this get made, or get a big push, that aren't about the white western folk? No, their story isn't less important, but it's not more important either, and the concern is that it always seems to be their story that gets most easily told. This particular film is a symptom of a wider perceived problem.

Quote

Now, the trailer doesn't give us a lot to go on as far as what their life is like BEFORE the coup and fighting begins...as long as the coup is a contained group of people, it could be just fine. You could be right that they could go the route of "beware dodgy foreigners"...I hope that's not the case. Bold Films are hardly a big Hollywood production company churning out pointless crap though, and have financed some of the more well received indie films of the last 5 years (DRIVE, WHIPLASH, NIGHTCRAWLER)...and the production company on-site was entirely Thai-based (Living Films). I'm not saying that's a sign of "it will be good and respectful", but it's better than some other productions who shoot globally without respect for the local population (20th Century Fox on THE BEACH for example).

All good signs. I literally knew nothing of the film before I saw the trailer the other day and me and my brother both found it to be dreadful. It's to be hoped that it's a misrepresentation.

Quote

Yeah, she was excellent, and stood on her own far more than any female IMF member in the last few films.

Frankly I thought she stood on her own perhaps more than Tom Cruise in this one. She's like Black Widow if she were handled properly.

This post has been edited by polishgenius: 06 August 2015 - 07:12 PM

[QuickTidal]

polishgenius, on 06 August 2015 - 07:08 PM, said:

This is all fair enough- I didn't realise it was a Spanish production. Though the whole 'didn't specify nationality because wider audience etc' kind of ties into my point - why are the people they picked more relatable than an actual Spanish couple?

The problem isn't really with the film itself but with the entire mentality of the studio structure, and indeed a continuation of the 'Western-disasters-matter-more' approach of our media. How often do films like this get made, or get a big push, that aren't about the white western folk? No, their story isn't less important, but it's not more important either, and the concern is that it always seems to be their story that gets most easily told. This particular film is a symptom of a wider perceived problem.

Ah, okay. Fair enough.

polishgenius, on 06 August 2015 - 07:08 PM, said:

Quote

Yeah, she was excellent, and stood on her own far more than any female IMF member in the last few films.

Frankly I thought she stood on her own perhaps more than Tom Cruise in this one. She's like Black Widow if she were handled properly.

Spot on. She was indeed that.

[Tiste Simeon]

Just watched a great great film called Begin Again featuring Kiera Knightly and Mark Ruffalo. Just a lovely film that made me smile.

This post has been edited by Tiste Simeon: 06 August 2015 - 08:56 PM

[Primateus]

Just saw The Age of Adeline today with Blake Lively and Harrison Ford. Movie was better than expected, but still, nothing we haven't seen before. Harrison Ford delivers, as he almost always does, but I was rather impressed with Blake Lively. She actually really delivered a believable performance in this movie. I've seen her in a couple of other movies, most notably Green Lantern (where she was awful) Also, I regret to admit I've seen the first two episodes of Gossip Girl (even more awful than green lantern) Nice to see she's not just another talented hack blonde who got her part because she's pretty or possess some other "talent" besides acting.

[worry]

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 11:23 AM, said:

\
Re: The Impossible. So the family who experienced this (who were arguably Spanish IRL, not British) didn't deserve to have their story told?

This is such a weird, sideways question that I don't really know what to do with it. Why would I think in terms of who deserves to have their story told in a major feature film? If it happened to me and a movie studio wanted to buy the rights to my story, I'd sell them too I guess, if that answers your question. You and pg seemed to hash out the bigger issues well enough I guess, though his posts lacked the keywords Disgusting, Distasteful, and Godforsaken. It also went unremarked that the filmmakers chose blonde, beautiful A-list actors to universalize the story. Even European Spaniards don't rank "normal" enough, I guess.

I won't say this movie wasn't a labor of love for the people who made it, but I will say they their labor produced a mid-budget disaster film whose most valued stakes weren't life and death, but white life and white death. That doesn't exactly differentiate them from Hollywood any. Now I'm just going over ground pg covered though, so I'll skip to No Escape: the same white life/white death prioritization combined with the fight-your-way-out action mentality of World War Z and the brain dead dad-saves-family wish fulfillment of Taken.

[QuickTidal]

worry, on 07 August 2015 - 01:18 AM, said:

QuickTidal, on 06 August 2015 - 11:23 AM, said:

\
Re: The Impossible. So the family who experienced this (who were arguably Spanish IRL, not British) didn't deserve to have their story told?

This is such a weird, sideways question that I don't really know what to do with it. Why would I think in terms of who deserves to have their story told in a major feature film? If it happened to me and a movie studio wanted to buy the rights to my story, I'd sell them too I guess, if that answers your question. You and pg seemed to hash out the bigger issues well enough I guess, though his posts lacked the keywords Disgusting, Distasteful, and Godforsaken. It also went unremarked that the filmmakers chose blonde, beautiful A-list actors to universalize the story. Even European Spaniards don't rank "normal" enough, I guess.

I won't say this movie wasn't a labor of love for the people who made it, but I will say they their labor produced a mid-budget disaster film whose most valued stakes weren't life and death, but white life and white death.

You know what, I wrote a whole long post questioning you and refuting your comments...but fuck it. It's simply not worth it for either of us. I'm not going to change your mind (since you used some strong words to denote your feelings)...just mark me down as disagreeing with you, and let's move on.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 07 August 2015 - 03:21 AM

[worry]

Okay, instead let's talk about how the Fantastic Four comic sucks and the upcoming movie is going to improve their origin story in every way.

Spoiler

[polishgenius]

worry, on 07 August 2015 - 01:18 AM, said:

It also went unremarked that the filmmakers chose blonde, beautiful A-list actors to universalize the story. Even European Spaniards don't rank "normal" enough, I guess.

Hey, I remarked that!

[worry]

I know you brought up the whitewashing. But what I mean is the filmmaker specifically and deliberately chose the whitest of white leads over Spanish casting for the sake of universalizing the story, and said so. This wasn't just macro level film industry tides of influence, it was micro level white-default bias laid bare.

[amphibian]

QuickTidal, on 07 August 2015 - 03:11 AM, said:

You know what, I wrote a whole long post questioning you and refuting your comments...but fuck it. It's simply not worth it for either of us. I'm not going to change your mind (since you used some strong words to denote your feelings)...just mark me down as disagreeing with you, and let's move on.

FWIW, I agree more with worry and polishgenius than I do with you.

You got healthy dollops more context due to the filmfest viewing with the people all there - and you still missed what PG and worry pointed out.

An entirely Spanish movie production purposely went out and got Ewan McGregor, Naomi Watts and so on to show the "Bennetts" in Thailand.

They went all in on the whiteness to show "universality" and to make more money than they would have if they showed the Alvarez/Belon family. The film production also purposely preserved Watts' blonde hair over Belon's brunette hair.

[QuickTidal]

Probably one of the more balanced reviews of FANT4STIC out there...still not good.

[Primateus]

QuickTidal, on 07 August 2015 - 04:59 PM, said:

Probably one of the more balanced reviews of FANT4STIC out there...still not good.

Wow, that sounds even worse than I imagined. And what the hell is this about Sue not even going on the trip that caused it in the first place, but getting her power from "a blast when they return"? What the hell?