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Diablo III I can't find the old thread

#221 User is offline   Sparrohawk 

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 05:34 AM

View PostMentalist, on 14 June 2012 - 04:24 AM, said:

Well, with Kotick around, they can't not announce a release date, really....


Yes, yes, he's an evil bastard/idiot/moneymaking prat etc etc. Moving on to something more interesting.

I've had to stop playing Inferno, unfortunately; Act 2 is a bit ridiculous on the difficulty side of things, at least for me. The Elite packs are just nuts. Luckily they appear to have noticed that and may actually do something about it. No idea what. 'till then I'm playing a Demon Hunter. I'd love to know where the girl gets the hundreds upon hundred of crossbow bolts and explosives she throws every game session, though. We're talking Anime-levels of Hammerspace. Still, good fun.
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#222 User is offline   Lucifer's Heaven 

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 01:26 PM

Isn't the ammo meant to be sorcerous?
I don't recall how exactly (been ages since I've seen it), but I thought they highlighted that (at least a little) in the cinematic trailer for the Demon Hunter.
Maybe I'm wrong, but that's the impression I've had since I watched it...

EDIT: Just rewatched it, and they sorta highlight it. YOu see her put one arrow made out of the tooth in one crossbow, then it fires an arc of them. After that though you see her repeat firing them both without reloading :harhar: (and they're definitely not repeaters :))

This post has been edited by Lucifer's Heaven: 14 June 2012 - 01:33 PM

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#223 User is offline   Ceda Cicero 

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 03:18 PM

View PostSparrohawk, on 14 June 2012 - 05:34 AM, said:

View PostMentalist, on 14 June 2012 - 04:24 AM, said:

Well, with Kotick around, they can't not announce a release date, really....


Yes, yes, he's an evil bastard/idiot/moneymaking prat etc etc. Moving on to something more interesting.

I've had to stop playing Inferno, unfortunately; Act 2 is a bit ridiculous on the difficulty side of things, at least for me. The Elite packs are just nuts. Luckily they appear to have noticed that and may actually do something about it. No idea what. 'till then I'm playing a Demon Hunter. I'd love to know where the girl gets the hundreds upon hundred of crossbow bolts and explosives she throws every game session, though. We're talking Anime-levels of Hammerspace. Still, good fun.


By all accounts that I've read, Inferno Act II is almost a mandatory skip first time around, something to go back to after you've farmed Act III extensively and geared out. It's a cheap move (and a sure sign that Blizzard needs to seriously revisit things since it makes no sense to have to do things out of order like that in order to succeed) but I would be willing to believe it. I haven't made it that far yet (Act IV Hell with my level 58 wiz, taking my damn time) but it doesn't surprise me—I never had trouble with Act II on any of the lower difficulty levels, per se, but the monsters there are just more annoying than the other acts, it seems to me.

This post has been edited by Ceda Cicero: 14 June 2012 - 03:25 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 07 April 2011 - 08:37 PM, said:

How do you rape a cave? Do you ask, "You want to fuck, yes?" hear the echo come back, "Yes... es... es..." and get your barnacle-gouged groove on?

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#224 User is offline   Sparrohawk 

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 11:46 PM

View PostCeda Cicero, on 14 June 2012 - 03:18 PM, said:

By all accounts that I've read, Inferno Act II is almost a mandatory skip first time around, something to go back to after you've farmed Act III extensively and geared out. It's a cheap move (and a sure sign that Blizzard needs to seriously revisit things since it makes no sense to have to do things out of order like that in order to succeed) but I would be willing to believe it. I haven't made it that far yet (Act IV Hell with my level 58 wiz, taking my damn time) but it doesn't surprise me—I never had trouble with Act II on any of the lower difficulty levels, per se, but the monsters there are just more annoying than the other acts, it seems to me.


I'd heard that too, yeah. I thought I'd be clever and try to beat it the hard way. Yeah, no. The snakes that go invisible (AND INVULNERABLE AND IMMUNE TO SLOWS) are murder on a wizard even with a full tanky setup. The fact that they pop up in the Belial fight is cause for much hesitation. And I hate skipping anything. Given that it's going to be a few weeks at least until they drop the Act 2 balancing patch (and altering item drops) I guess there's comparatively little choice. Out of the 22 elite packs I've run into, I have been able to kill 2 of them :)

View PostLucifer, on 14 June 2012 - 01:26 PM, said:

Isn't the ammo meant to be sorcerous?
I don't recall how exactly (been ages since I've seen it), but I thought they highlighted that (at least a little) in the cinematic trailer for the Demon Hunter.
Maybe I'm wrong, but that's the impression I've had since I watched it...

EDIT: Just rewatched it, and they sorta highlight it. YOu see her put one arrow made out of the tooth in one crossbow, then it fires an arc of them. After that though you see her repeat firing them both without reloading :harhar: (and they're definitely not repeaters :p)



I figured as much for a while, too. But one of the Demon Hunter passives talks about the self-reloading mechanisms in hand crossbows (and traps). I guess it's just a canon fail more than anything (not like their story is anything remarkable :) ).

This post has been edited by Sparrohawk: 15 June 2012 - 12:03 AM

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#225 User is offline   Lucifer's Heaven 

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 02:17 AM

View PostSparrohawk, on 14 June 2012 - 11:46 PM, said:

I figured as much for a while, too. But one of the Demon Hunter passives talks about the self-reloading mechanisms in hand crossbows (and traps). I guess it's just a canon fail more than anything (not like their story is anything remarkable :) ).

:harhar:
Right, I understand the confusion now :)
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#226 User is offline   Sparrohawk 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 05:29 AM

To my deep and abiding bitter amusement, I've stopped playing. The game was enjoyable. . . for a while. I liked the feeling of power that the characters gave you (Wizard firing Disintegrate, or the Archon version, for instance). But once you get to inferno, it's just a grind. The game ceases being challenging (depending on skill, Hell difficulty takes that title) and simply becomes a gearfest. You grind to get gold, which you then spend to get gear. If you refuse to obey this pattern, the game's difficulty will chew you up and spit you out in a globby mess like a half-chewed Mars Bar. For reference, in Act 3 Inferno 3 hits from a low-level demon will kill you. By comparison, you'd need about 7 hits over the same time period to kill it. However, if you have the gear, you can stand still and burn everything to the ground before they can even touch you.

Forget about good gear actually dropping; the sheer diversity of possible attributes (and the consequent likelihood of those attributes being rolled well enough to be usable) is so minute that you will end up using the AH. Maybe not the RMAH, but I suspect that temptation is what Blizzard is relying on; you need better gear, and the fact that a lot of people will try to make money off their lucky drops by selling them on the RMAH will probably draw you to said RMAH. It feels like the game veers dangerously close to the very worst kind of free-to-play MMOs (where paying more makes you more powerful) without ever actually going totally there. The choice is still yours to use or not use the (RM)AH, but the game has a number of conditions that push you towards it, very subtly. On a psychology level, I'm actually really impressed. It's a bit like guiding a rat through a maze, without the rat knowing the existence of the maze. That being the case, I'm probably not even seeing half the full picture of their psychological model.

But you know, even that is actually bearable. When I first saw their design, I (perhaps foolishly) thought that the elimination of stat points, of skill points, that whole system would be useful. For background, I hate theorycrafting; it takes all the damn fun out of a game (for me, anyway; others love it). Blizzard regularly said that many, many builds would be viable, all the way up to Inferno. And lo, I heartily call bullshit after quite a bit of time with it. Wizards have 2, maybe 3 builds that are viable. 2 out of those 3 require extremely good gear to work properly, and the third revolves around kiting enemies from one end of the map to another, and then back again. Not my idea of fun. Demon Hunters have 1 truly viable build, from what I've seen. I'm less sure about the other 3 classes, but from others who have played, it's much the same issue. It's not as if they even lowered the level of min-maxing and theorycrafting that you might see in many games; they just recreated the same problems via a different method.

For the record, the core game I actually like. The way they manage skills, the ease of learning and playing it, and so on is quite good. The different classes do really feel different, and I like the art style of the game a lot. If they were to alter the difficulty such that the game was readily viable without using the AH or variants thereof, I'd happily play it. Similarly, online-only doesn't really bother me (but we've talked that to death already). Certain aspects of the design like I described are the problem, and they are big enough that I'm not going anywhere near it unless they change. Which, frankly, I doubt will happen because it looks like they are part of their business model as well as the game's design.
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#227 User is offline   Obdigore 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 05:58 AM

Inferno is being nerfed tomorrow. Krippi (some WoW hero or something) is rushing to get World First Hardcore Diablo Inferno kill before the nerf. There is a stream or something. He just put Izual down.
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#228 User is offline   Sparrohawk 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 06:03 AM

Where'd you get the inferno nerf news from?
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#229 User is offline   Gothos 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 06:04 AM

Kripparian? Figured he might.
And I actually agree with a lot that Sparrohawk said. Most of it, in fact. Personally, I think that if I'm going to play it again in the near future, I'll just get some alts to 60 or something like that. I've enough of a grindfest waiting for me in WoW. Maybe after a few months when there's more good gear around and it's cheaper on the gold AH, I'll gear one of them up and finish inferno.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly. So that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.
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#230 User is offline   Obdigore 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 06:09 AM

View PostSparrohawk, on 19 June 2012 - 06:03 AM, said:

Where'd you get the inferno nerf news from?


http://us.battle.net...en/blog/6262208

Changing item drop rates, making Inferno Act 2 easier, and changing Co-op so stuff does not hit as hard when you have multiple people in a game.

Then increasing Repair costs so 'throwing bodies at it' isn't a viable strat.

They are nerfing Attack Speed but fixing it so it applies as it should since it apparently isn't doing it now.

I don't have the full notes and am playing D3 so little I really don't care about them, but yea.
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#231 User is offline   Sparrohawk 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 06:21 AM

Interesting. I thought the patch was further off. Once I see the full patch notes I'll think more about it.
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#232 User is offline   Obdigore 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 08:46 AM

Welp looks like Kripparian duo-killed Diablo in HC Inferno with his Barbarian and a friend that is a Wizard.

Afaik its the first Hardcore Diablo kill in the game.
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#233 User is offline   Lucifer's Heaven 

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Posted 19 June 2012 - 10:33 AM

View PostSparrohawk, on 19 June 2012 - 05:29 AM, said:

To my deep and abiding bitter amusement...


:)
I was actually hoping they'd avoid doing that. It's something I've seen in a few Free-to-play MMOs. Ones where you can buy power but it is optional. They usually say you won't need to buy power and you should be able to finish the game otherwise, avoiding PvP of course. In the end though, they usually balance it for the people who are paying for power (otherwise it's too easy for them), meaning if you don't, you're so underpowered with normal game gear that you can't even do the PvE.
I remember one I stopped playing. We were having a hard time continuing through stuff designed for "our level" and some of it was completely impossible. Then I killed an elite mob with a random. Checked their stats and noticed they were a level 15 or something priest with considerably higher strength than my well geared friend's level 40 melee fighter. In fact they had a higher gear bonus to every one of their stats than I had total in any of my stats :rolleyes:
We stopped playing at that point.
And it sounds like D3 have essentially done the same thing, but with rarity instead of money shop.

Good luck with the new patch, hopefully that helps :D
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#234 User is offline   Illuyankas 

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 10:34 AM

So, I read the full patch notes.

Yeah, I'm not playing Diablo 3 again for a long time.


(also the public games started off with 40,000 players in America and dropped 10k every week until today, where there's 1,600 people playing in them now)
Hello, soldiers, look at your mage, now back to me, now back at your mage, now back to me. Sadly, he isn’t me, but if he stopped being an unascended mortal and switched to Sole Spice, he could smell like he’s me. Look down, back up, where are you? You’re in a warren with the High Mage your cadre mage could smell like. What’s in your hand, back at me. I have it, it’s an acorn with two gates to that realm you love. Look again, the acorn is now otataral. Anything is possible when your mage smells like Sole Spice and not a Bole brother. I’m on a quorl.
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#235 User is offline   Ceda Cicero 

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 05:06 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 20 June 2012 - 10:34 AM, said:

So, I read the full patch notes.

Yeah, I'm not playing Diablo 3 again for a long time.


(also the public games started off with 40,000 players in America and dropped 10k every week until today, where there's 1,600 people playing in them now)


That's 'cause public games suck.

Okay, maybe that's not entirely the reason, but you gotta admit it makes a little sense.

Also, Illy, I swear to god if you're one of the people bitching and moaning in the blizz forums today, I'm going to neg rep every single one of your posts I can find.

View PostIlluyankas, on 07 April 2011 - 08:37 PM, said:

How do you rape a cave? Do you ask, "You want to fuck, yes?" hear the echo come back, "Yes... es... es..." and get your barnacle-gouged groove on?

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#236 User is offline   Lucifer's Heaven 

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 03:16 AM

What's wrong with the patch notes?
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#237 User is offline   Sparrohawk 

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 03:32 AM

View PostLucifer, on 21 June 2012 - 03:16 AM, said:

What's wrong with the patch notes?


They're quite big; you'd need to read them all. Some people don't like that they are nerfing attack speed items a bit (it was becoming a mandatory stat, apparently). They are increasing repair costs by a truly hilarious about (4 to 6 times their previous) which is sending some people nuts. They are altering drop rates on items from the big unique bosses and on the rare/elite packs. If your magic/gold find stat is maxed (it goes up by killing elite/rare packs) then you will get one guaranteed Rare item, not two. However, rare/elite packs will drop at least 1 Rare guaranteed at full stacks (before there was no guarantee). They also balanced a few of the Rare/Elite packs that were generally considered totally unbeatable. There are other things as well. Have a look: http://us.battle.net...en/blog/6457499

May not mean much, though.


The big one for me that makes things perhaps tolerable is that you can get top-level items even from Act 1 Inferno (2% drop chance overall, but considering how many items drop, it may not seem that bad). Previously you had to be in Act 3 or 4 to get them. The idea being that if you wanted to do a 'quick run' of Act 1 (it's not that hard once you have semi-decent gear) you can still get good stuff and not have to bust your balls in the harder Acts. Personally I got an insanely good level 63 (top level you can get) weapon last night during my tentative play post-patch, so I can't see an issue there.
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#238 User is offline   Lucifer's Heaven 

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 11:14 AM

Ah okay. Thanks :rolleyes:
Yeah I considered looking through it, but figured I wouldn't be able to spot what people were whinging about.
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#239 User is offline   Illuyankas 

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 12:13 PM

View PostCeda Cicero, on 20 June 2012 - 05:06 PM, said:

That's 'cause public games suck.

Okay, maybe that's not entirely the reason, but you gotta admit it makes a little sense.

Also, Illy, I swear to god if you're one of the people bitching and moaning in the blizz forums today, I'm going to neg rep every single one of your posts I can find.

Hahaha, no, no, I'm not a Blizz forum complainer. There are some cool things about the patch but a lot of it is hurting your bogstandard casual player to cut off the fraction of exploiters and botters, plus almost every single person I've seen liking the patch has a ton of money and a load of good gear already, so enormous repair costs don't hurt them as much. My brother had a go at Inferno act 1 on his monk, ran into a bastard mob and ended up dying twice (and if any of you say 'just don't die noob' I will fucking stab you) and had to fork out 40k in repairs, and after getting the Staff of Herding together and buying a crappy 880 dps axe for my wizard I'm down to 100k gold so pain would ensue costwise. Playing through acts 3 and 4 on hell for ilvl 61 and 62 gear is actually doable now at least, even if the drops won't be that good, but I just don't have the motivation to do it. If they drop the repair costs down a bit later I'll try it again but for now I'm going to give it a break.
Hello, soldiers, look at your mage, now back to me, now back at your mage, now back to me. Sadly, he isn’t me, but if he stopped being an unascended mortal and switched to Sole Spice, he could smell like he’s me. Look down, back up, where are you? You’re in a warren with the High Mage your cadre mage could smell like. What’s in your hand, back at me. I have it, it’s an acorn with two gates to that realm you love. Look again, the acorn is now otataral. Anything is possible when your mage smells like Sole Spice and not a Bole brother. I’m on a quorl.
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#240 User is offline   Ceda Cicero 

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Posted 21 June 2012 - 02:28 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 21 June 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

View PostCeda Cicero, on 20 June 2012 - 05:06 PM, said:

That's 'cause public games suck.

Okay, maybe that's not entirely the reason, but you gotta admit it makes a little sense.

Also, Illy, I swear to god if you're one of the people bitching and moaning in the blizz forums today, I'm going to neg rep every single one of your posts I can find.

Hahaha, no, no, I'm not a Blizz forum complainer. There are some cool things about the patch but a lot of it is hurting your bogstandard casual player to cut off the fraction of exploiters and botters, plus almost every single person I've seen liking the patch has a ton of money and a load of good gear already, so enormous repair costs don't hurt them as much. My brother had a go at Inferno act 1 on his monk, ran into a bastard mob and ended up dying twice (and if any of you say 'just don't die noob' I will fucking stab you) and had to fork out 40k in repairs, and after getting the Staff of Herding together and buying a crappy 880 dps axe for my wizard I'm down to 100k gold so pain would ensue costwise. Playing through acts 3 and 4 on hell for ilvl 61 and 62 gear is actually doable now at least, even if the drops won't be that good, but I just don't have the motivation to do it. If they drop the repair costs down a bit later I'll try it again but for now I'm going to give it a break.


Yeah I'm a bit torn on the repair costs. On the one hand I feel you because they broke the shit out of my bank after I tried to tackle the spider caves in Act I (the rest of Act I inferno seems pretty easy so far but man those spiders suck BALLS.) Then I got lucky and sold a legendary ring i happened to score for 2 mill, which was the first time I've sold anything with anywhere near that level of success on the AH. I want to splurge on some new armor but I also need to bank that for repairs.

Anyhow, on the other hand, I sort of like the fact that I'm scared to die now. I read a lot of reports from people who got burned out on softcore, rolled hardcore instead, and it completely reinvigorated them on the game. Granted increased repair costs are no where near losing your char and all your shit, but I do feel like it's added an element of excitement to the game for me. And honestly pre-patch I thought it was kind of strange that the penalty for dying stayed the same (and relatively low, all things considered) across all difficulty levels. The old repair costs were never really a noticeable strain on my funds at all, and dying just sort of felt like a free teleport out of a shitty situation back to a safe zone where I could re-approach.

My big hope here is that the increased repair costs plus the shift in drop rates will stabilize the economy a little bit. I despise the AH and try to use it as little as possible, but man it sure would be nice if I could pop on and grab a pair of gloves or something for less than 40 million.

This post has been edited by Ceda Cicero: 21 June 2012 - 02:30 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 07 April 2011 - 08:37 PM, said:

How do you rape a cave? Do you ask, "You want to fuck, yes?" hear the echo come back, "Yes... es... es..." and get your barnacle-gouged groove on?

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