[Yellow]

But who is scum, Obdigore? Riddle us that.

[Yellow]

Obdigore, on Oct 21 2008, 11:01 PM, said:

I will feast on your liver

No worries, mate. I'm sure the skiing finals will be fun this year.

[Lacedaemonian]

Morgoth, on Oct 21 2008, 10:45 PM, said:

Lacedaemonian, on Oct 21 2008, 11:34 PM, said:

EDIT: The Dude - I have built a very sound case against Morgoth. A better case than anybody else has provided against anybody else. I am sticking with Morg until anything significantly changes my view of the game. The death of Dib only adds weight to my argument. Perhaps I am being played? Either way I want to find out.

Hey, you wouldn't happen to have a link to your case, or a copy of it laying around? Seeing I've not been very much around today as a result of work, I've probably just browsed through it without really noticing. If you have it, I can try to respond

My case against you was made on Monday, mate. I too have been away from the game today. It is not that my case is brilliant - just that I can not see the merit in many other cases.

A brief version of my case:

• There was some heat on Morg on Day One. Suddenly a train against Alt, who had voted Morg. Alt is dead.
  
• There was a definite effort to get a train against me over the weekend - I was talking about and voting Morg. The train efforts seemed a little contrived, similar to the contrived vibe I was getting on the Alt train.
  
• Only Dib backed me and his words carry more weight than mine because I am considered unreadable despite my heavy teacherous effort at using bulletpoints. Ohh Dib is dead as a result of a night kill.
  
• My case was first built on my gut feelings over the weekend - the physical evidence (ie the deaths) just added substance to my feelings.
  
• You seem to obvious a killer at times, but I have not played this game before so I do not know how you all play.
  
• Gem seemed to invite a lynching yesterday. This could be for many reasons. However, I placed her in the group of suspects and stated that I thought she was a Symp. So this invitation of a lynching through quite terrible play took some attention away from who I suspect are the killers. I know she was probably vig killed - but she seemed to be seeking a lynching yesterday.
  
• I think the heat has been taken off me - for no reason. This is also could add weight to my views.
  
• Vengence is hiding behind some personal abuse line - he used it as an afront for his support for you. The derailer. Whether he is a killer though? I am not sure.
  
• I am thinking less about Tapper now. Not because of Gems death but just my gut feelings are closing that door.

Hope this helped.

[Lisheo]

Right, well I expected something to have been said, but nothing except Morgoth commenting on Tapper's play style. While I agree he has a likeable playing style, I would hardly call what he did panicking now, would you? Admittedly he defended himself rather thoroughly, but I don't think any of us want to get lynched when we're inno for not standing up for ourselves; this Silencer business is an example of that. If it was the case we'd all just speed lynch him, get the CF and be done with the business.
I think it might be an idea to look at possible pairings: See who has steered arguments carefully away from another player specifically YET has not actually mentioned them. I'll go through the posts tonight if I have time, unless someone has anyone they want to suggest?
As there is only one kill, that means the killers have to discuss it and both agree before they can kill, yeah?
Edit: the special K

This post has been edited by Lisheo: 21 October 2008 - 10:06 PM

[Lacedaemonian]

Panicking. Don't fear using the K lads.

[Lisheo]

Woah, lot of cross posting there, my bad lol

[Morgoth]

Obdigore, on Oct 22 2008, 12:01 AM, said:

Morgoth, on Oct 21 2008, 04:59 PM, said:

Obdigore, on Oct 21 2008, 11:56 PM, said:

Yellow, on Oct 21 2008, 04:45 PM, said:

Are Lace's insistence on referring to Morgoth as a woman and Morgoth's insistence on referring to Tapper as a man related somehow?

TIME WILL TELL.

edit - Tapper is a woman, right? She eats stilton and drinks white wine. She must be a woman.

Err... akaik Tapper is male.

Noone likes my thoughts on Lisheo enough to even mention them? Well fiddlesticks.

what were your thoughts on Lisheo? sorry, as I said I read the thread at work, so I had to skim a lot

He has the most posts in the game by a huge margin. He has no content, and swings whichever way the wind is blowing. He will agree with pretty much anything that might get a lynch going. He jumped straight on Silencer after a kinda weak case from JA just barely into the day.

He is aching for a lynch, posting a lot but not participating.

Ah. Lisheo is a difficult question. Mainly because he plays much like I did in my first game (malazan mafia 1 for you youngsters ). Naturally, it's difficult to say exactly how much of that is reall or not. I needed about 20 games to get half decent at this game, so perhaps I'm not the best of examples.

Hm. He is very flip-flopping I agree. Yet, I do not think it is reason enough to go for him at this point. Apart from your point there's little pointing to him being a killer. He might be a bad symp as I mentioned earlier mind you.

In the end, I agree he should be looked at more closely but I firmly believe that my case on Tapper is substansialy better.

[Lacedaemonian]

He is on my radar but lower down the list. At best he is a bad Symp. I take my hat off to the lad if he turns out to be a killer.

[mocker]

lace i still canny see why your so adament!

your 'detailed' accusations are still just conjecture! how are you so confident?

[mocker]

i ask this coz i dont have a bastard clue lol

[Lacedaemonian]

mocker, on Oct 21 2008, 11:11 PM, said:

lace i still canny see why your so adament!

your 'detailed' accusations are still just conjecture! how are you so confident?

This whole game is based on conjecture. I like to think that I have applied intellect, logic, and an element of psychological profiling in making my case(s). The truth is my case is built on very limited evidence and a gut feeling. I am guessing this is how the game is played.

[Morgoth]

Lacedaemonian, on Oct 22 2008, 12:03 AM, said:

Morgoth, on Oct 21 2008, 10:45 PM, said:

Lacedaemonian, on Oct 21 2008, 11:34 PM, said:

EDIT: The Dude - I have built a very sound case against Morgoth. A better case than anybody else has provided against anybody else. I am sticking with Morg until anything significantly changes my view of the game. The death of Dib only adds weight to my argument. Perhaps I am being played? Either way I want to find out.

Hey, you wouldn't happen to have a link to your case, or a copy of it laying around? Seeing I've not been very much around today as a result of work, I've probably just browsed through it without really noticing. If you have it, I can try to respond

My case against you was made on Monday, mate. I too have been away from the game today. It is not that my case is brilliant - just that I can not see the merit in many other cases.

A brief version of my case:

• There was some heat on Morg on Day One. Suddenly a train against Alt, who had voted Morg. Alt is dead.
  
• There was a definite effort to get a train against me over the weekend - I was talking about and voting Morg. The train efforts seemed a little contrived, similar to the contrived vibe I was getting on the Alt train.
  
• Only Dib backed me and his words carry more weight than mine because I am considered unreadable despite my heavy teacherous effort at using bulletpoints. Ohh Dib is dead as a result of a night kill.
  
• My case was first built on my gut feelings over the weekend - the physical evidence (ie the deaths) just added substance to my feelings.
  
• You seem to obvious a killer at times, but I have not played this game before so I do not know how you all play.
  
• Gem seemed to invite a lynching yesterday. This could be for many reasons. However, I placed her in the group of suspects and stated that I thought she was a Symp. So this invitation of a lynching through quite terrible play took some attention away from who I suspect are the killers. I know she was probably vig killed - but she seemed to be seeking a lynching yesterday.
  
• I think the heat has been taken off me - for no reason. This is also could add weight to my views.
  
• Vengence is hiding behind some personal abuse line - he used it as an afront for his support for you. The derailer. Whether he is a killer though? I am not sure.
  
• I am thinking less about Tapper now. Not because of Gems death but just my gut feelings are closing that door.

Hope this helped.

Aye, thanks.

I can do little but agree that a lot points towards me. When it comes to playing style, I do not think I playing different than I normaly do, but that's hardly a piece of information that will or should clear me from suspicion. As for the heat on me day 1, I think how things shifted towards alt can be blamed almost purely on Yellow. DiBs made a case on me that -seeing it was an early day 1 case- was very weak, but not utterly insubstansial. That garnered a couple of votes. But then Yellow presented his case on me based it seemed mainly on me admitting to having sent PMs to spoilerheaven. That didn't sit right with a lot of people, so when Gavin presented the case on Alt, a several saw a way out of a somewhat uncomfortable situation. People remembered Yellow's case, not DiBs' case. I'm not saying DiBs' case had any worth. It didn't. But at least it was based on behaviour in game and not purely on meta arguments.

I still stand by the opinion that night kills almost never provide usefull information. there are exceptions, but the J_slr and DiBs kills are too WIFOM to have much value as arguments at this point.

As for why the heat was taken of you. You've begun playing the game in the way that benefits the innocents, and as such the main argument against you is moot.

... and what do you think about my Tapper case?

[Morgoth]

Lacedaemonian, on Oct 22 2008, 12:14 AM, said:

mocker, on Oct 21 2008, 11:11 PM, said:

lace i still canny see why your so adament!

your 'detailed' accusations are still just conjecture! how are you so confident?

This whole game is based on conjecture. I like to think that I have applied intellect, logic, and an element of psychological profiling in making my case(s). The truth is my case is built on very limited evidence and a gut feeling. I am guessing this is how the game is played.

Aye, that is true. though thorough case building helps if only to show people where your suspicions are placed. You've presented a case on me, which is more than a lot of people here.

[mocker]

hmm a little bit less gut feeling i think lol

coz if your gut is rong you got the killers 1 up n us 1 down. boo! lol

the trouble is, by being too adament with no basis for it, when you in fact do get 'evidence' it will be obvious that your heavily twisting a simple statement to fit your needs. your certainty will make it v v hard for others to follow in your lead.

[Morgoth]

Lisheo, on Oct 22 2008, 12:03 AM, said:

Right, well I expected something to have been said, but nothing except Morgoth commenting on Tapper's play style. While I agree he has a likeable playing style, I would hardly call what he did panicking now, would you? Admittedly he defended himself rather thoroughly, but I don't think any of us want to get lynched when we're inno for not standing up for ourselves; this Silencer business is an example of that. If it was the case we'd all just speed lynch him, get the CF and be done with the business.
I think it might be an idea to look at possible pairings: See who has steered arguments carefully away from another player specifically YET has not actually mentioned them. I'll go through the posts tonight if I have time, unless someone has anyone they want to suggest?
As there is only one kill, that means the killers have to discuss it and both agree before they can kill, yeah?
Edit: the special K

If you'd read my post you'd notice I only bring up Tapper's play style as one factor pointing towards his guilt. There are several others too. You have to look at the broader picture I think. As for his post, how you do not see the panic in it is beyond me. I am quite sure I'm not the only one who noticed it. Indeed I think dk even mentioned it earlier, though I might have him mixed up with someone else.

And if you have ideas about pairings, present them. We all benefit from knowing whom you suspect

[Morgoth]

mocker, on Oct 22 2008, 12:11 AM, said:

i ask this coz i dont have a bastard clue lol

Well, what do you think of my case on tapper then? Surely you must've made up some opinions regarding him generally and the case specificly?

[Yellow]

Morgoth, on Oct 21 2008, 11:07 PM, said:

Ah. Lisheo is a difficult question. Mainly because he plays much like I did in my first game (malazan mafia 1 for you youngsters ). Naturally, it's difficult to say exactly how much of that is reall or not. I needed about 20 games to get half decent at this game, so perhaps I'm not the best of examples.

Hm. He is very flip-flopping I agree. Yet, I do not think it is reason enough to go for him at this point. Apart from your point there's little pointing to him being a killer. He might be a bad symp as I mentioned earlier mind you.

In the end, I agree he should be looked at more closely but I firmly believe that my case on Tapper is substansialy better.

Morgoth, if you truly believe that Lisheo should be looked at more closely, then you should take it upon yourself to do it. If you don't, it will come across as an enforcement of Lish's certainty that out of the four of us who were left on the Gem vote yesterday, you were the only one who he deemed to be not scummy. See below.

Lisheo, on Oct 21 2008, 03:00 PM, said:

What content do you have? You've simply challenged me to put my opinions out the last four or five times we've talked. My suspects are Yellow, Silencer, and Gavin. Not Morgy, because I think maybe the DiBs kill was an attempt to make him look like scum. But also Lace looks kinda dodgy. And I'm not sure about you or Tapper. You've both been dominating arguments, and not coming up with much, really.

Lish is clearly very defensive of you. Any idea why he might be symping you?

[Yellow]

Morgoth, on Oct 21 2008, 11:21 PM, said:

Well, what do you think of my case on tapper then? Surely you must've made up some opinions regarding him

Her.

[mocker]

im torn regarding tapper. your case carries a lot of weight but for some reason i find it hard to stomach.

i cant get rid of the feeling that its someone swingin completely under the radar laughin there tits off wile the power players are muntin each other!

[mocker]

Yellow, on Oct 21 2008, 11:25 PM, said:

Morgoth, on Oct 21 2008, 11:21 PM, said:

Well, what do you think of my case on tapper then? Surely you must've made up some opinions regarding him

Her.

haha whoever said this should be a soap was right, this is pure married with children shit

ace!