[caladanbrood]

Apologies if this is answered later in the book - I'm still on page 640.

Clip, while that particular group of travellers are resting in the Tiste warren (whichever one, or mixture of ones, it is) specifically states that Andarist, Silchas and Anomander have (or had) a father. And, it was implied, the same one. So, either he's lying, which seems pointless, unless I'm about to read about a far larger betrayal, or this, obviously, runs contrary to everything we know about their heritage.

I have a lurking theory nagging in the back of my head, but I won't post it until I've finished the book and read any of your responses, if it still makes sense:)

[Dolorous Menhir]

It's all up in the air now. Pass.

[caladanbrood]

No, you're right. Doh.

It was Udinaas. I guess his self-gratifyingly obtuse pronouncements just roll into one, so I attribute anything of significance to others.

On the other hand, he's still right, most likely.

[Tenaka Khan]

Another thought about the draconian family tree: Nimander and Phaed were also listed, them being Anomander's kids. It became pretty obvious in RG though that neither of them is a draconian soletaken, otherwise their little scrap in Withal's bedroom would probably have caused a bit more damage on the prison island...

A bit of a pity, as I was really looking forward to see more of those kids (because I obviously expected them to be more than a murderous little wench and a whiner....).

On a side note: 'thas been quite a while since I've been around, so I just wanted to add that I really ejoyed RG and that after a still good but a bit disappointing BH I am reassured that SE has not lost the touch. Hooray

[caladanbrood]

It seems that becoming a soletaken is transferred to the children from the mothers - after all, L'oric (Osserc's son) isn't an elient either, while Rud Ellale is, despite being Udinaas' son (though of course he was possessed by the Wyval at the time Menandore raped him).

[Dark Mac]

It's really seeming likely that Envy is a dragon, from a genetic point of view.

Tenaka Khan;184783 said:

Another thought about the draconian family tree: Nimander and Phaed were also listed, them being Anomander's kids. It became pretty obvious in RG though that neither of them is a draconian soletaken, otherwise their little scrap in Withal's bedroom would probably have caused a bit more damage on the prison island...

Not sure about that. Remember how Sukul had to revert back to her human shape to enter that cave and fight the Imass?

[Talamadas]

I was wondering the same thing.
If dear lady Envy is soletaken why didnt she show it in MoI?
Of course the 3 Seguleh and the former mortal sword of the T'lan Imass were probably quite capable of handling what the Domin threw at them but with her temper...
Although you could argue that the deadly magic she used sufficed as a relaxer also we know that Spite is soletaken.

By the way i hope they meet in TtH. Who wouldnt like to see that catfight?

[Thelomen Toblerone]

Seeing as Spite's a soletaken, It hink it's pretty much a given that Envy is too. They're supposed to be a match for eachother, so it wouldnt be just one having such a clear advantage. Also, alot of the battles across the Domin lands are not described, and in any case Envy had no real reason to veer, as her magic was already strong enough.

[caladanbrood]

Envy hasn't really been in any situations when she's need to veer, has she - and, like Ruin said, taking an elient form makes your mind colder, more ruthless. I mean, even when she was taking on entire Pannion Armies, she was hardly breaking sweat most of the time;)

And maybe she just renounced her draconic heritage and refuses to use it, or something. In a tantrum one day - she's the kind of person who'd hold to a promise like that, even it was made when without thinking.

[Dragnipurake]

and i am now convinced veering into a dragon doesnt make one more powerful, apart from a physical perspective. esp considering that silchas ruin, although damaged, still got a beating from quick ben.

[caladanbrood]

I imagine it makes it easier to access Starvald Demelain - after all, there's two or three examples of dragons (Rake and the Sisters, that I can remember) breathing Starvald Demelain out of their jaws.
Other than that, no, there doesn't seem to be any increase in magical power.

[Thelomen Toblerone]

Is it just me, or does it seem liek draconic soletaken have the raw end of teh deal?

I mean, they become huge targets which is bad, as we saw with cussers and magical attacks, and as such also become a bit ungainly, while benefiting from no real magical bonus.

Other soletaken we've seen, like Ochem's gorilla and the two bear imass soletaken that fought Sukul/Sheltatha (forgotten which already!), dont suffer from much of an increased target, but benefit from huge strength and speed advantages that can be used in close combat situations.

I'd much rather be a bear soletaken than an eleint soletaken.

[caladanbrood]

Well... they can fly And, like, bite your head off.

[Thelomen Toblerone]

Flying is vastly overrated when overwhelmed by the desire to kill everything in sight.

And a gorilla or bear could rip a head off. Dragons dont got no arms! How would they eat their sandwiches at a picnic?

[Aptorian]

Thelomen Toblerone;187971 said:

Flying is vastly overrated when overwhelmed by the desire to kill everything in sight.

And a gorilla or bear could rip a head off. Dragons dont got no arms! How would they eat their sandwiches at a picnic?

Uhn... no arms? They have front and hind legs... I'm guessing it's a bad TT joke (as usual)

I did find it odd that ascendant dragons didn't have better protection against magic than the sisters and ruin did. They're supposed to have immunization as Beak reveals... and it just sounds weird that any old mage can pick them out of the sky.

I liked how the magic, much like Raest in GotM, keeps their bodies going no matter how much damage they took. Untill, their heads are severed/crushed of course. That last powerswing Sukuhl? took litterally destroying one of the bonecasters was awesome.

[caladanbrood]

Ah yes, but then, it wasn't just any old mage, was it? QB is basically an Archmage at this point.

[Thelomen Toblerone]

Yes, it was a joke Apt, seeing that front "legs" are not "arms". Distinction between quadrapedal and bipedal creatures and all that.

[tiam]

caladanbrood;184880 said:

It seems that becoming a soletaken is transferred to the children from the mothers - after all, L'oric (Osserc's son) isn't an elient either, while Rud Ellale is, despite being Udinaas' son (though of course he was possessed by the Wyval at the time Menandore raped him).

It doesnt have to be the mothers side. Thats probably why menandore made Udinaas choose the blood of the Wyval to ensure that Rud had all draconic blood and therefore be an ally against Ruin

[fortyseven]

I got the image of Yogi Bear as a soletaken