[twelve]

The warfare card is assigned to a ship that gives all other ships in the same system as it a +1 to attack rolls and movement. Fyi

[ToasTer86]

Khellendros, on 10 October 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

Jazzarm, on 10 October 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

Let's talk Trade.

With every faction vying for a free refresh, the person picking Trade will always have a huge advantage every round. Now while Trade is meant to bring wealth to the person picking it, the standard 1 tg tax for a free refresh would give them too much of a benefit compared to the rest of the table. In addition, with no tg's entering the game through unpicked strategy cards - until we see our first elimination, I suppose - the Trade SC has a near monopoly on trade goods entering the game.

One way to solve this issue is to form trading unions, where two or three players will agree to take turns paying the tax for multiple refreshes. Another is to form a pact between all 2-commodity factions including myself, to always grant a free refresh to other 2-comm factions. These are just some examples, but if enough players agree, I'm sure we can work something out.

This first round I am happy to give anyone a free refresh who agrees to give me a free refresh in the future should they ever pick up the Trade card themselves. Before we unlock the agenda phase it’s going to be tough for us to pay non-neighbours with TGs in any case.

I am in for that !
Will definitely pick trade following rounds

This post has been edited by ToasTer86: 10 October 2019 - 06:12 PM

[twelve]

Khellendros, on 10 October 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

Jazzarm, on 10 October 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

Let's talk Trade.

With every faction vying for a free refresh, the person picking Trade will always have a huge advantage every round. Now while Trade is meant to bring wealth to the person picking it, the standard 1 tg tax for a free refresh would give them too much of a benefit compared to the rest of the table. In addition, with no tg's entering the game through unpicked strategy cards - until we see our first elimination, I suppose - the Trade SC has a near monopoly on trade goods entering the game.

One way to solve this issue is to form trading unions, where two or three players will agree to take turns paying the tax for multiple refreshes. Another is to form a pact between all 2-commodity factions including myself, to always grant a free refresh to other 2-comm factions. These are just some examples, but if enough players agree, I'm sure we can work something out.

This first round I am happy to give anyone a free refresh who agrees to give me a free refresh in the future should they ever pick up the Trade card themselves. Before we unlock the agenda phase it’s going to be tough for us to pay non-neighbours with TGs in any case.

I'm good for that deal.

[D'rek]

twelve, on 10 October 2019 - 06:11 PM, said:

The warfare card is assigned to a ship that gives all other ships in the same system as it a +1 to attack rolls and movement. Fyi

I forget, did we say we were gonna simplify it sometime around last game / the one before and if so did we ever actually do so?

[twelve]

D, on 10 October 2019 - 06:13 PM, said:

twelve, on 10 October 2019 - 06:11 PM, said:

The warfare card is assigned to a ship that gives all other ships in the same system as it a +1 to attack rolls and movement. Fyi

I forget, did we say we were gonna simplify it sometime around last game / the one before and if so did we ever actually do so?

No clue on either of those questions. If we are we should do it now. I'll default to those that have a better understanding of this game in either case.

[Morgoth]

Toaster, dear mindsnake, I would be happy to trade you my pn in return for the speaker token. I will in addition agree to not pick the strategy card you want. You lose nothing and gain a nifty pn. On the condition that you place the B wormhole, and that you do not place it in, or ajacent to, one of my systems.

[D'rek]

re Trade:

@Khell yeah, I'm in for that

Free refreshes are probably going to be cheaper than normal since there's only two races with a bigger commodity pool than 3 (Nom-Xxcha and Morgoth-Creuss). And none of the races that gain trade goods from racial abilities/tech are in the game (Mentak, Saar, Muaat, Jol-Nar) so literally the only way anyone will acquire trade goods in this game is the Trade strategy and action cards/agends, right?

Khell will be especially incentivized to play the Trade strategy a lot so he can use his Letnev abilities. Morgoth and Nom have a positive exchange rate. As Nekro I probably will pay to refresh a fair bit since I can get a lot of CTs. But the other 5 players may balk at non-free refreshes most of the time and we could have a very low-TG overall game. Interesting.

[Khellendros]

Khellendros, on 10 October 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

Jazzarm, on 10 October 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

Let's talk Trade.

With every faction vying for a free refresh, the person picking Trade will always have a huge advantage every round. Now while Trade is meant to bring wealth to the person picking it, the standard 1 tg tax for a free refresh would give them too much of a benefit compared to the rest of the table. In addition, with no tg's entering the game through unpicked strategy cards - until we see our first elimination, I suppose - the Trade SC has a near monopoly on trade goods entering the game.

One way to solve this issue is to form trading unions, where two or three players will agree to take turns paying the tax for multiple refreshes. Another is to form a pact between all 2-commodity factions including myself, to always grant a free refresh to other 2-comm factions. These are just some examples, but if enough players agree, I'm sure we can work something out.

This first round I am happy to give anyone a free refresh who agrees to give me a free refresh in the future should they ever pick up the Trade card themselves. Before we unlock the agenda phase it’s going to be tough for us to pay non-neighbours with TGs in any case.

The only caveat to this is to Morgoth who has to come and trade with me as well, but he has already agreed to do so

[D'rek]

twelve, on 10 October 2019 - 06:17 PM, said:

D, on 10 October 2019 - 06:13 PM, said:

twelve, on 10 October 2019 - 06:11 PM, said:

The warfare card is assigned to a ship that gives all other ships in the same system as it a +1 to attack rolls and movement. Fyi

I forget, did we say we were gonna simplify it sometime around last game / the one before and if so did we ever actually do so?

No clue on either of those questions. If we are we should do it now. I'll default to those that have a better understanding of this game in either case.

I think it was two things:

{a} people didn't like assigning the primary ability's effect to one particular ship. Invariably it would get assigned to a fighter so that none of the big ships in the fleet don't get the +1 movement, and then you have this wonky fighter that has to be treated differently, and perhaps unfairly advantages the races that can choose what enemy ships to destroy (Creuss/Yin/Sardakk) as they can target the fighter and you lose the effect halfway through combat. One possible suggestion was to make it more like the TI3 Warfare II where the token does the same thing (+1 movement, +1 combat rolls) but is not assigned to a particular ship.

{b} confusion over whether the secondary allowed transport of units or not, and if so can they pick-up/land infantry? I think we ruled that yes they could transport, and yes they could pick-up infantry (from non-activated systems), but no landings allowed (even to owned planets). But I'd like to get agreement/opinion on that.

If we can get a consensus on these, I can edit the card text to describe the abilities better so there isn't future confusion if anyone forgets this chat.

[twelve]

I'm not sure what to do with the primary but the secondary I'm okay with picking up troops as long as they cant land.

[ToasTer86]

Morgoth, on 10 October 2019 - 06:18 PM, said:

Toaster, dear mindsnake, I would be happy to trade you my pn in return for the speaker token. I will in addition agree to not pick the strategy card you want. You lose nothing and gain a nifty pn. On the condition that you place the B wormhole, and that you do not place it in, or ajacent to, one of my systems.

Hey I was hoping we could make a trade for the speaker token.
Although your pn is mostly beneficial for yourself :-)

Could we sweeten the deal ?

Like for example you pop logistics on round 2 in the first turn, stalling me out building my second carrier would be really bad for me.

I would want technology for my pick in turn 2.

Edit: are you already trading your commodities ?

This post has been edited by ToasTer86: 10 October 2019 - 07:07 PM

[Jazzarm]

Khellendros, on 10 October 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

This first round I am happy to give anyone a free refresh who agrees to give me a free refresh in the future should they ever pick up the Trade card themselves. Before we unlock the agenda phase it's going to be tough for us to pay non-neighbours with TGs in any case.

That's very generous of you, and the L1Z1X will be happy to take you up on that offer. It appears we don't need an agenda phase to pass 'Economic Equality'! The L1 will be sure to repay the favor if we're ever in a position to pick the 'Trade' card, or otherwise time our SC timing in a way that might benefit your people.

[Jazzarm]

As for New Warfare, when moving ships you should be allowed to bring fighters/infantry along, since that's also how similar effects work (Naalu Foresight, Skilled Retreat etc). And yeah, no landing on planets allowed.

Quote

49.5 When a ship with a capacity value moves or is moved, it maytransport ground forces and fighters.

[Tattersail_]

Khellendros, on 10 October 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

Jazzarm, on 10 October 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

Let's talk Trade.

With every faction vying for a free refresh, the person picking Trade will always have a huge advantage every round. Now while Trade is meant to bring wealth to the person picking it, the standard 1 tg tax for a free refresh would give them too much of a benefit compared to the rest of the table. In addition, with no tg's entering the game through unpicked strategy cards - until we see our first elimination, I suppose - the Trade SC has a near monopoly on trade goods entering the game.

One way to solve this issue is to form trading unions, where two or three players will agree to take turns paying the tax for multiple refreshes. Another is to form a pact between all 2-commodity factions including myself, to always grant a free refresh to other 2-comm factions. These are just some examples, but if enough players agree, I'm sure we can work something out.

This first round I am happy to give anyone a free refresh who agrees to give me a free refresh in the future should they ever pick up the Trade card themselves. Before we unlock the agenda phase it’s going to be tough for us to pay non-neighbours with TGs in any case.

Deal

[Imperial Historian]

Deal khell!

[Itwæs Nom]

Yes knell

[Tattersail_]

That'll save me a CT down the line I suppose.

[D'rek]

Tattersail_, on 10 October 2019 - 09:01 PM, said:

That'll save me a CT down the line I suppose.

Yup. Better than a measly refresh from Diplo or a movement boost you can't use from Warfare. I thought Jazz was gonna take Warfare to rush towards Dal Bootha and then I'd have to try and convince you to leave me Diplo somehow!

[Tattersail_]

Yes Warfare would be no good for me in this situation. Maybe later down the line. I don't know what you could have offered to make me consider it. I was hoping for diplomacy out of the 3 options.

[Tattersail_]

Naughty IH, leave the provisional but Naalu first