[Galactic Council]

 D, on 10 July 2018 - 01:14 PM, said:

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:10 PM, said:

I was gonna use the randomized signup list in the exact same way that you used the signup list last game.

I don't remember how I did that.

So the list that we are using for race choices and map tile placement order will be the strategy phase initiative order. That means that in the first round, Khell will choose first, then we will move down the list the same way we're currently doing for race choices and map tile placement. Once the speaker chip is moved to someone else, it will start on them, then move down the list, then back from the start. So let's say that Tapper gets the speaker chip after first round, he will choose strategy first during second round, then Khell, then Lady Bliss, and so on.

[D'rek]

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:47 PM, said:

 D, on 10 July 2018 - 01:14 PM, said:

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:10 PM, said:

I was gonna use the randomized signup list in the exact same way that you used the signup list last game.

I don't remember how I did that.

So the list that we are using for race choices and map tile placement order will be the strategy phase initiative order. That means that in the first round, Khell will choose first, then we will move down the list the same way we're currently doing for race choices and map tile placement. Once the speaker chip is moved to someone else, it will start on them, then move down the list, then back from the start. So let's say that Tapper gets the speaker chip after first round, he will choose strategy first during second round, then Khell, then Lady Bliss, and so on.

but y tho

[Tattersail_]

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:47 PM, said:

 D, on 10 July 2018 - 01:14 PM, said:

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:10 PM, said:

I was gonna use the randomized signup list in the exact same way that you used the signup list last game.

I don't remember how I did that.

So the list that we are using for race choices and map tile placement order will be the strategy phase initiative order. That means that in the first round, Khell will choose first, then we will move down the list the same way we're currently doing for race choices and map tile placement. Once the speaker chip is moved to someone else, it will start on them, then move down the list, then back from the start. So let's say that Tapper gets the speaker chip after first round, he will choose strategy first during second round, then Khell, then Lady Bliss, and so on.

What's the reason you want to do it that way? To stop what Morgoth, Gnaw and Tapper did last game? So by the time it gets to Tapper he has less choice of race, homeworld and ends up with a strategy card he probably didn't want, and if the (is Bliss second?) second person takes politics to make themselves speaker then Tapper is once again near last for Strategy pick so effectively it may take 5? turns before he gets a top 3 strategy pick. Last game didn't last that many rounds.

Edit. That is why Leadership had the number 1, Imperial 8 and Naalu had special initiative. Not just for strategy pick but for points scoring as well. We knew where we stood if it came down to people reaching 14 VP in the same round, winner would be Naalu followed by whoever took leadership etc

This post has been edited by Tattersail_: 10 July 2018 - 01:58 PM

[D'rek]

 Tattersail_, on 10 July 2018 - 01:55 PM, said:

What's the reason you want to do it that way? To stop what Morgoth, Gnaw and Tapper did last game?

Any 3 people adjacent in the list could still form a Politics Block, they just wouldn't be map-adjacent.

[Tapper]

I know I partly brought up the issue surrounding Speaker, but let's see how it goes. Worst case scenario, we end up with a wildly unbalanced game. Best case scenario, it is awesome chaos.

[Tapper]

 D, on 10 July 2018 - 01:57 PM, said:

 Tattersail_, on 10 July 2018 - 01:55 PM, said:

What's the reason you want to do it that way? To stop what Morgoth, Gnaw and Tapper did last game?

Any 3 people adjacent in the list could still form a Politics Block, they just wouldn't be map-adjacent.

It might be harder to trade goods/favors to set up the connection and trust level, though. We did it from a stable trade alliance and with a board that promised no-one could easily invade the other.

[Galactic Council]

That's how we did it last game, it basically emulates how it would be done at a table, except that at a table it would literally be the people sitting next to each other.

I dunno, I'm not set in stone about that, if you guys think we should do it another way, let's hear it. But I'm not going to take "Wah, but that gives Khell an advantage" as a valid excuse. Everything I've done, I've done with a randomizer. If Khell has an advantage, it's cause the randomizer put him in that position. It could just as easily have been anyone else.

[Galactic Council]

 Tattersail_, on 10 July 2018 - 01:55 PM, said:

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:47 PM, said:

 D, on 10 July 2018 - 01:14 PM, said:

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 01:10 PM, said:

I was gonna use the randomized signup list in the exact same way that you used the signup list last game.

I don't remember how I did that.

So the list that we are using for race choices and map tile placement order will be the strategy phase initiative order. That means that in the first round, Khell will choose first, then we will move down the list the same way we're currently doing for race choices and map tile placement. Once the speaker chip is moved to someone else, it will start on them, then move down the list, then back from the start. So let's say that Tapper gets the speaker chip after first round, he will choose strategy first during second round, then Khell, then Lady Bliss, and so on.

What's the reason you want to do it that way? To stop what Morgoth, Gnaw and Tapper did last game? So by the time it gets to Tapper he has less choice of race, homeworld and ends up with a strategy card he probably didn't want, and if the (is Bliss second?) second person takes politics to make themselves speaker then Tapper is once again near last for Strategy pick so effectively it may take 5? turns before he gets a top 3 strategy pick. Last game didn't last that many rounds.

Edit. That is why Leadership had the number 1, Imperial 8 and Naalu had special initiative. Not just for strategy pick but for points scoring as well. We knew where we stood if it came down to people reaching 14 VP in the same round, winner would be Naalu followed by whoever took leadership etc

Last game I had Politics for the first 2 or 3 rounds despite where the speaker chip was, basically until someone on the other side of the table paid me enough for me to give the speaker chip to them, at which point the Tapper/Gnaw/Morgoth thing was created to ensure that I couldn't hoard Politics and the speaker chip anymore. Just because Lady Bliss has the choice to choose Politics before anyone else but Khell doesn't mean she will - there are much more useful strategy cards out there, so I'd say that Politics will more likely be chosen 4th or 5th.

[Tattersail_]

Do the numbers count for anything? Is initiative order the same, so if Khell is speaker he has initiative 1? Tapper initiative 8? For points scoring.

[Galactic Council]

The other idea I had was to randomize the strategy card selection order each round, but that would basically negate one of the advantages of taking Politics - that is, to negotiate with someone or a group of people to put the speaker chip on their end of the list.

I think this way, it's not necessarily going to be one side of the board that hoards the chip. It may be a small group of players that does it, but they could be all over the board, so it will be a little more difficult to have the same trade relations Gnaw/Morgoth/Tapper did last game.

[Galactic Council]

 Tattersail_, on 10 July 2018 - 02:06 PM, said:

Do the numbers count for anything? Is initiative order the same, so if Khell is speaker he has initiative 1? Tapper initiative 8? For points scoring.

No, absolutely not, Initiative Order for all other phases will continue to work the exact same way. This list is only used for Strategy Card selection. After that, initiative order is determined by the numbers on the strategy cards (and the Naalu token),

[Khellendros]

I say we try it out Blend's way - I can see the reasoning behind it as an effort to stop Speaker chip hoarding on one side of the Galaxy - and this can still be done, but might be harder to maintain. It's meant to be a chaotic galaxy out there!

[Khellendros]

 Tattersail_, on 10 July 2018 - 02:06 PM, said:

Do the numbers count for anything? Is initiative order the same, so if Khell is speaker he has initiative 1? Tapper initiative 8? For points scoring.

I think you're taking Blend's use of the word initiative too literally. Initiative will always be decided by what strategy card you have (or if you have the Naalu token).

[twelve]

Why are we complicating things? Just assign everyone's home world for them based on the initiative order and keep the same rules as last game that you pick strategy before the player on your left.

[Imperial Historian]

Sorry guys was planning on picking the mentak and not had time to look at the other races to see which I like the look of. Works really busy so will try to look and choose tonight.

[Morgoth]

I'm fine with Blend's system. It'll just requires of us to be aware of the advantages when building the galaxy, and place hexes accordingly.

[Tattersail_]

 Morgoth, on 10 July 2018 - 02:55 PM, said:

I'm fine with Blend's system. It'll just requires of us to be aware of the advantages when building the galaxy, and place hexes accordingly.

Like what for example, for us lesser mortals

[Tapper]

 Galactic Council, on 10 July 2018 - 02:02 PM, said:

That's how we did it last game, it basically emulates how it would be done at a table, except that at a table it would literally be the people sitting next to each other.

I dunno, I'm not set in stone about that, if you guys think we should do it another way, let's hear it. But I'm not going to take "Wah, but that gives Khell an advantage" as a valid excuse. Everything I've done, I've done with a randomizer. If Khell has an advantage, it's cause the randomizer put him in that position. It could just as easily have been anyone else.

Agreed on the randomization. The whole routine as you lay it out is per the Rules Reference, apart from the seat order being different from the initiative order.

What tickles a little on the power of the #1 player selecting everything first is that in a six player game the last player still has a choice out of 3 Strategies, even if those are likely Imperial, Diplomacy and Trade/Warfare. This is more choice than the #8 and #9 player have by default in our game (edit: but it worked fine last game).

But, since initiative order =/= seating arrangement (or rather, seating arrangement is determined after the initiative order), you have a second issue.
We have 45 tiles (5 per player) and that means 3 home systems (C, F and I) will have only 2 neighbouring hexes to their HS tile, where the other 6 players have 3 adjacent hexes.
That can be a big deal, because there's no other hex that is easier to reach for that player than for their neighbours. In the Rules Reference the same happens with the 5-player set-up (there with 3 players having 3 hexes and 2 players having 4), there Fantasy Flight suggest a one-time compensation through TG (2 TG, on turn 1) for the players who have 3 only.

This post has been edited by Tapper: 10 July 2018 - 03:09 PM

[Morgoth]

 Tattersail_, on 10 July 2018 - 02:58 PM, said:

 Morgoth, on 10 July 2018 - 02:55 PM, said:

I'm fine with Blend's system. It'll just requires of us to be aware of the advantages when building the galaxy, and place hexes accordingly.

Like what for example, for us lesser mortals

Make sure to place less favourable hexes in the most advantageous areas, make access to Mecatol Rex more of a chore and so forth. Placing down hexes is just as much sabotaging for the others as it is giving ourselves an advantage.

[D'rek]

 Tapper, on 10 July 2018 - 03:08 PM, said:

But, since initiative order =/= seating arrangement (or rather, seating arrangement is determined after the initiative order), you have a second issue.
We have 45 tiles (5 per player) and that means 3 home systems (C, F and I) will have only 2 neighbouring hexes to their HS tile, where the other 6 players have 3 adjacent hexes.
That can be a big deal, because there's no other hex that is easier to reach for that player than for their neighbours. In the Rules Reference the same happens with the 5-player set-up (there with 3 players having 3 hexes and 2 players having 4), there Fantasy Flight suggest a one-time compensation through TG (2 TG, on turn 1) for the players who have 3 only.

I think the 5-player tg compensation is more about how those players are closer to their neighbours than the other players (some are 3 tiles away from each other, others are 2), but in our map all homeworlds are 2 tiles away from both neighbours.

Being one of the homeworlds that only has 2 adjacent tiles gives you a less wide initial expansion than the 3-adjacent HWs, but on the other hand they're more defensible, too. Since (other than Khell) we'll all get to only place 1 tile next to our homeworlds I don't think it'll make that much difference (unless you get screwed out of getting a HW position that you get to place a tile next to it).