[Slow Ben]

Theres been quite a few discussions about that if you want to do some search-fu. But basically an ascendant is somewhere between mortal and a god. They've ascended. Soletaken can be all 3! Mortal, ascendant, or god.

[Zetubal]

Spoiler

Case and point: Awesomander.

This post has been edited by Zetubal: 12 June 2018 - 09:53 PM

[worry]

Those posts should probably be spoilered or moved. They're not plot spoilers, per se, but still...they're beyond the scope of the DG forum.

[Gorefest]

Mako2401, on 12 June 2018 - 08:53 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 12 June 2018 - 04:33 PM, said:

On a side and hopefully spoilerfree note, regarding your Rake observation. He is indeed Soletaken, but it is important to note that there are many roads to Ascendancy. The Path of Hands is just one.

I thought that Ascendancy means you become a God. Does Ascendancy means you become a Soletaken?

That was not what I was saying, or what the original question was. But I don’t want to be drawn into a discussion on it here because, as Worry says, it is borderline spoiler territory.

[Burn's Bridge]

Raraku - Chapter 5
Fiddler and the kids make it to the settlement with G'ral on their trail. Apsalar starts talking like Cotillion and they confirm what we all thought - that Kellanved and Dancer became Shadowthrone and Cotillion when Laseen tried to kill them. Importantly, Apsalar/Cotillion says that Kellanved didn't order the T'lan Imass to slaughter the people of Aren; it was Laseen. Also it is weird that Apsalar still has Cotillion's memories. I thought if Cotillion left her, he left her completely. If she still has his memories (and skills, etc.), that's still like having a partial possession. Not to mention Apsalar is (probably) still inhabited by Rigga, or so it is implied by someone (I forget whom) at the end of Gardens. Might also explain why Sorry lost it when she thought Kruppe was a Seer (since Cotillion must hate Rigga, who I think is a Seer). Anyhow, sidetracking. The point is, Apsalar is like three people in one, and I'm not sure how much of Cotillion she has in her. Also, she says Shadowthrone and Cotillion are technically different people from Kellanved and Dancer...like they're the same, but different enough that, for example, Dancer could trust Kellanved, but Cotillion would not trust Shadowthrone.

Another point is that Gardens says the Hounds of Shadow are ancient, but Kellanved only became King of Shadow ten years ago. Obviously there are other players in House Death (edit: correction, Shadow), specifically Queen and Magi, that aren't mentioned at all. So it seems like Shadow wasn't created out of the blue ten years ago, but it received a new King and Assassin. Which makes me wonder, would multiple Ascendants ever occupy the same title? Like would Kellanved have ascended if there were already a King in place?

Kalam hands the Book of the Apocalypse over to Sha'ik (yay!) who is abruptly killed (wow) by the Red Blades following him (after he leaves). Kalam wants to kill Laseen so the Apocalypse can stop, otherwise the Malazans and Seven Cities will go slaughter each other - he even thinks he'll become the new Herald of Death if he fails to kill Laseen. But now Sha'ik is dead, and the Toblakai and that other bodyguard are wondering if the prophecy will still come true.

What a fun book to read. Onto the next one.. Whirlwind!

This post has been edited by Burn's Bridge: 13 June 2018 - 04:52 AM

[Esa1996]

Mako2401, on 12 June 2018 - 08:53 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 12 June 2018 - 04:33 PM, said:

On a side and hopefully spoilerfree note, regarding your Rake observation. He is indeed Soletaken, but it is important to note that there are many roads to Ascendancy. The Path of Hands is just one.

I thought that Ascendancy means you become a God. Does Ascendancy means you become a Soletaken?

If you don't want to know the answer, don't click this:

Spoiler

Ascending makes you an ascendant / immortal. To become a god you need followers who see you as a god. All gods are ascendants, but not all ascendants are gods. Ascending doesn't make you a Soletaken either, though some ascendants and gods are Soletaken or D'ivers.

EDIT: Seems you got a couple answers already

This post has been edited by Esa1996: 13 June 2018 - 03:18 PM

[Burn's Bridge]

Whirlwind - Chapter 6
Felisin, Baudin, and Hebroic make a prison break (Beneth "supposedly" dead; Felisin doesn't believe it). Kulp and some Malazan marines fight a mob on the beach and take a boat to get Hebroic. Disguised Duiker rides back to the destroyed Hissar and is forced to join the rebel army. Icarium and Mappo find a big boat at Pust's home that probably belongs to Servant. Pust reads the Deck and says they have to go to Raraku because Sha'ik is dead. Mappo doesn't like this because (he thinks to himself) that Whirlwind might rise again, and I think Whirlwind might be the name of a goddess. Or Dryjhna. (Edit: And I think Mappo believes if Whirlwind rises, he'll have to reveal his secret to Icarium. I think.)

Fiddler and the kids ride a road into Raraku which is supposed to lead to, according to Quick Ben, an Azath House called Tremorlor. (I don't know what the Azath are or what this house is supposed to do.)

Kalam still rides through the desert accompanied by the aptorian demon which fends of an attack by a wolf D'ivers. He doesn't really know what's up with Sha'ik's demon.

That's pretty much it for this chapter. A lot of narrative but not a whole lot of lore. Interested in finding more about the Azath House!

This post has been edited by Burn's Bridge: 15 June 2018 - 07:53 AM

[Zetubal]

Just a sidenote: Dude's called Heboric

[Gorefest]

Don't forget that you already encountered an Azath House in the previous novel. It engulfed and contained Raest’s Finnest.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 15 June 2018 - 02:25 PM

[Burn's Bridge]

Ah yes... the house through which Vorcan and Rallick walked. How mysterious...

Whirlwind - Chapter 7
Duiker leaves the group that conscripted him and goes off to find Coltaine, who he thinks is in Dryj Spring (being pursued by High Mage Kamist Reloe of the Whirlwind army.) Felisin, Baudin, and HebORIC aren't getting along. Heboric's lagging behind, Felisin and Baudin hate each other, and Felisin thinks Heboric should just die. They do come across a massive jade finger sticking out of the sand, which I bet will be important. Can't recall any mention of it before now. Baudin poens the warren of Fener by touching Heboric's stump to his chest (go figure). Everything gets all trippy and apparently Fener now popped out of his warren and into the mortal realm. Great. But at least Heboric's healed.

Interesting note, Felisin says, "Have you come out of the Abyss, Fener?" Never heard of the Abyss before. (Fiddler also thinks later, "What in the Abyss is going on?") So there's an Abyss. whatever that is. Also, Felisin says something about Fener's warren bordering Chaos. Could be wrong, but this language almost makes it seem like warrens have a physical route, like a map. I know Chaos is a path between warrens that is considered unstable, and until now I thought it was a metaphorical language. I thought someone who is in the process of travelling from one warren to another was said to be in Chaos. But maybe Chaos is like a road, a dangerous road to travel, and the warrens are like stops along the way. Fener's warren could be adjacent to a road? Or maybe the metaphorical interpretation is correct, and "bordering Chaos" refers to stability, rather than actual travel: Fener is almost as unstable as Chaos. No idea; speculation based on two words.

Mappo recalls his past: he was a wandering Trell who fought the Trell who chose to remain settled. Their settlement was burned and Mappo became a chosen one (chosen for what, I don't know) by the Nameless Ones. He and Icarium discuss how Sha'ik might be an Ascendant overseeing the Whirlwind and her death was part of the prophecy (rather than interrupting it, as her bodyguards had thought).

Fiddler and the kids are not only still pursued by Gral, but also come across D'ivers and Soletaken - wolves, a bear, and more; as usual, they're fighting with each other. Fiddler gets seriously wounded and things get nasty when Gryllen (massive swarm of rats called Tide of Madness) comes along - hey, that's the name from the first chapter. Icarium and Mappo thought they came along rat tracks. Well, a Trell and Jhag (of course, Icarium and Mappo) meet the party, scare off Gryllen, and then we end with Fiddler blacking out.

Things really getting interesting! We have 5 plotlines going on: Felisin's prison break, Kulp's stealing the boat (those two plotlines might converge) Duiker and Coltaine, Kalam and the demon heading for Aren, and now Icarium and Mappo (trying to figure out the convergence and Path of Hands) whose plotline is converging with Fiddler, Crokus, and Apsalar (heading for Tremorlor Azath House). Looking forward to chapter eight!

[James Hutton]

Ok, this is too much. I will start rereading DG now.

[Esa1996]

Heh, just realized that I'm checking this thread multiple times a day for new progress updates

[Burn's Bridge]

Thanks for the enthusiasm Esa, and nice - we got James to do a reread. Just read an awesome chapter today so update soon.

[Burn's Bridge]

Whirlwind - Chapter 8
A chapter with a fair amount of lore. Duiker is on the trail of Coltaine's army, and learns that Coltaine has mad skillz. He wiped an entire army despite being vastly outnumbered, although Duiker wonders how Coltaine is going to keep it up especially if Kamist Reloe can anticipate Coltaine's route (to water sources).

Felisin tries to kill Baudin after seducing him for revenge on Beneth... I find Felisin's story very captivating. She conveys well her fall from nobility and her descent into pessimism and bitterness. Kulp and the marines rescuing Felisin, Baudin, and Heboric raises a lot of questions. Who is that insane mage they are fighting on the water? Are they inside his warren, and what warren is it? What is the significance of the talon that Baudin carries? Baudin has a Fener ghost hand used to open Fener's warren when healing? Is Fener actually in the mortal realm now? Why did the ghost ship Silanda, the only Tiste Andii trade ship on Quon, never return when the Emperor took over? Was it because the Tiste Andii and the Empire were at odds? (Moon's Spawn was allied against them in Gardens.) Or did it have something to do with the Tiste Edur in the cabin? It seems like the Tiste Edur took over the ship's crew by decapitating all the humans and Andii, and controlling them with the whistle. Why did they do that? How did the Tiste Edur captain and his crew die? Is the ship preserved in a warren considering the bodies still appear fresh? It was interesting to learn about the Tiste Edur. It seems the Andii are pure Dark, and the Edur are a mixture of Dark and Light. Somehow Light came from Dark (as was mentioned in Gardens as well), and I don't know how yet.

Fiddler wakes up healed by Iskaral Pust and in the company of Icarium and Mappo. Now that Fiddler is healed by Pust, is he connected to Shadow somehow? Will Apsalar be affected while in the Shadow Temple? (Pust claims no.) We learn some more about the Azath Houses, and that they are all connected. The party is trying to use the Vanished Roads that very occasionally appear in the desert to lead them to Tremorlor, which would transport them to Deadhouse on Malaz Isle to return Apsalar home. Why did Pust suddenly stop speaking when he admitted Cotillion's skills still reside within Apsalar? Why did Mappo say he seeks to keep Icarium's search endless? What does it mean that Kellanved and Dancer occupied Deadhouse, and is it similar to what happened when Vorcan and Rallick walked through the Azath House in Darujhistan?

Two more chapters left in the Book of Whirlwind!

[Puck]

Nice one

Also, this:

Esa1996, on 17 June 2018 - 04:17 PM, said:

Heh, just realized that I'm checking this thread multiple times a day for new progress updates

[Mako2401]

This chapter by chapter is better than the TOR chapter by chapter.

[Esa1996]

Mako2401, on 18 June 2018 - 06:49 PM, said:

This chapter by chapter is better than the TOR chapter by chapter.

Lol, you're not even finished with the series yet you're reading this But yeah, I also prefer this to the TOR reread.

This post has been edited by Esa1996: 19 June 2018 - 12:02 AM

[Burn's Bridge]

You all are so kind. Well here's another entry!

Whirlwind - Chapter 9
Kalam plods along and finds a group of bandits that want to attack some Malazans. Kalam trolls them and pretends to join up, but when he finds the Malazan camp, he and the Malazans kill them all. Well, almost all. There's one bandit left guarding some food. They try to loot the food but another seven bandits show up. That's fine, because Kalam is OP and he kills the noob bandits solo. The Malazans - captain Keneb and some others - are under command of Korbolo Dom. That guy was an ex-Fist who was too violent for Laseen and got sent to Halaf, where he married a woman there, turned renegade, killed half his squad, and then led a Whirlwind Army. That army attacked Keneb and company back in another city of Orbal. The kid wants to become a Lv. 99 assassin like Kalam but for now they all join up together. (Apt follows them at a distance.) EDIT: Something called a Jhistal is in Aren.

Meanwhile Felisin and her best friends ever are sailing along in a warren, when some mud starts becoming humanoid. Dafuq? Whoa, it's T'lan Imass! The mud became T'lan Imass. Now if that made too much sense for you, just look at what happens next. The T'lan Imass (Hentos Ilm) call Kulp a Servant of the Chained One - that sounds like the Crippled God! - which Kulp denies, and says that the mage to whom Heboric is linked is causing a great spreading wound. Hentos could be talking about either Fener or the Crippled God (well, the Chained One) being the source of the wound. Hard to tell based on context. I think it's more likely the Chained One. A wound? Metaphorical language? Nope, it's a wound. In the sky. A black, red-rimmed circle. And Legara Breed, a clanless T'lan Imass, floats up, up into the sky, and "bridges" the wound, whatever that means - which causes him an eternity of pain. Stormy, one of the Malazan marines, is so upset by this (eternal pain is horrible, even for a mud-person you barely know) that Hentos Ilm had to calm him down. But he gets a stone sword out of the deal. Sweet. Looks like it might be too heavy for his max equip weight though. We'll see.

And then all the T'lan Imass disappear. But they swipe one of the heads before they go. (They said they were there for their kin. Tiste Andii? Attached to them somehow?)

Anyway, more importantly, we learn that this ship is inside the warren of Kurald Emurlahn. That's a new Elder Warren (well newly mentioned) that belongs to the Tiste Edur. What's really interesting is that Kulp's Meanas warren, which is a Shadow Warren, is actually a child of Kurald Emurlahn. So Shadow was born of Edur? "Before Shadowthrone and Cotillion, there were Tiste Edur." So Shadowthrone and Cotillion may have come from Tiste Edur somehow, but we know Shadow was born of Emurlahn. Also we learn that Logros T'lan Imass no longer serve the Malazan empire, which confirms that they were indeed allied - and if I remember correctly, they were allied with Kellanved until Laseen took over.

Awesome chapter. One more in Whirlwind!

This post has been edited by Burn's Bridge: 19 June 2018 - 07:30 PM

[Zetubal]

Burn, on 19 June 2018 - 02:38 PM, said:

So Shadowthrone and Cotillion may have come from Tiste Edur somehow

What do you mean by that?

[Burn's Bridge]

Zetubal, on 19 June 2018 - 06:02 PM, said:

Burn, on 19 June 2018 - 02:38 PM, said:

So Shadowthrone and Cotillion may have come from Tiste Edur somehow

What do you mean by that?

Oh I’ll rephrase: the Tiste Edur preceded Shadowthrone and Cotillion but that’s all I know, and it’s ambiguous. I also know the Meanas warren is a child of the Tiste Edur warren, but I don’t know if that means all of Shadow came from them.