[worry]

Surely there are double agents.

[Morgoth]

Also, Vader is the most powerfull force user in the galaxy, more or less. Making a good guess should be something he could do.

[Traveller]

I would guess, based on ep5, that if a ships last trajectory can be charted, the next habitable system along that line could be predicted - especially if there is nothing much but a desert planet trading post on the chart.

Theoretically an escaping ship could exit hyperspace anywhere along that trajectory and be impossible to trace; but maybe fuel restraints or something mean that a jump to the next habitable system is the safest option.

Vader is intuitive all through the movies, right from the start of ep4 when he's certain the plans were in the pod. Looking at a chart with Tatooine as a viable option was likely to have lead to a quick decision, letting them catch up, but after enough time in HS to let Leia deny everything.

[QuickTidal]

Traveller, on 02 January 2017 - 12:20 PM, said:

I would guess, based on ep5, that if a ships last trajectory can be charted, the next habitable system along that line could be predicted - especially if there is nothing much but a desert planet trading post on the chart.

Theoretically an escaping ship could exit hyperspace anywhere along that trajectory and be impossible to trace; but maybe fuel restraints or something mean that a jump to the next habitable system is the safest option.

Vader is intuitive all through the movies, right from the start of ep4 when he's certain the plans were in the pod. Looking at a chart with Tatooine as a viable option was likely to have lead to a quick decision, letting them catch up, but after enough time in HS to let Leia deny everything.

^^This.

Also, I EXPLICITLY trust the Lucasfilm New Canon Story Group and Pablo Hidalgo. Their work in the rest of the SW media has been utterly impeccable to a fine point. You can literally fire any question or concern of canonicity or continuity or what you might assume is a mistake or pothole....and Hidalgo will tell you why and how it fits in the canon....

And here he answers a slew of those types of questions (including the one at issue), have a read. The man is a FONT of Exacting Star Wars Knowledge.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 02 January 2017 - 03:08 PM

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

https://mobile.twitt...776564822446080

https://mobile.twitt...778453391699968

Either trolling or unable to announce a forthcoming release...

[QuickTidal]

Hmmm....he calls it the "good fight"....If I had to guess, I'd say that the unaltered versions may indeed be coming out finally in High Def. Only time will tell.

The problem with that is that the SE's fixed a LOT of stuff that needed fixing (not the least of which were digital space shots, all the cleanups, the lightsaber colour, the Cloud City window shots, the explosions, the world celebrations of the fall of the Emperor) and assorted other things that were fixed that you might not notice...and only made two or three changes that pissed people off (Han Shot First being on of the bigger ones, with the other probably being the new Jabba's Palace performance [which I like actually]...and maybe the replacement of the Yub Nub sequence in ROTJ...and I prefer the SE version of that anyways)...so I think I'd rather just keep the SE's...and ignore the problematic choices, like Han Shoots Second, because as a whole the SE's just made those films better.

So MAYBE the reason it sounds so cryptic is because there will be new SE's that come out that will excise the more nefarious changes from the prints, and leave in all the good changes?

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 02 January 2017 - 05:02 PM

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

Have you seen Harmy's Despecialized versions? He's put in an inhuman amount of work to fix the errors you mentioned, along with dozens of other issues (including massive amounts of color grading and even some rotoscoping) — while leaving out the incongruous changes that Lucas added in.


http://originaltrilo...id/12713/page/1

https://docs.google....d23bqb5ryD4/pub

This post has been edited by Whisperzzzzzzz: 03 January 2017 - 05:03 AM

[QuickTidal]

Whisperzzzzzzz, on 03 January 2017 - 05:01 AM, said:

Have you seen Harmy's Despecialized versions? He's put in an inhuman amount of work to fix the errors you mentioned, along with dozens of other issues (including massive amounts of color grading and even some rotoscoping) — while leaving out the incongruous changes that Lucas added in.


http://originaltrilo...id/12713/page/1

https://docs.google....d23bqb5ryD4/pub

Huh, cool!

[Traveller]

QuickTidal, on 02 January 2017 - 04:47 PM, said:

..and only made two or three changes that pissed people off (Han Shot First being on of the bigger ones, with the other probably being the new Jabba's Palace performance [which I like actually]...and maybe the replacement of the Yub Nub sequence in ROTJ...and I prefer the SE version of that anyways)...

Whaat! That Jabba scene in the SE is the biggest sore thumb. In neon. Even my four year old looked perplexed, as previously he'd been watching the original and had accidentally put on the SE. It breaks up the scene with the dancer, which was originally quite menacing. I don't mind the ending of Jedi, it would be preferable to the original if they hadn't gone and pasted Hayden into it, which makes no sense at all on any level.

In retropect, nearly all of the added scenes were not only uneccessary, but incredibly badly made and poorly edited. The added Jabba scene looks worse than everything around it, and stands out as an originally cut scene as it shares dialogue with the Greedo convo. They're a mess from an editorial point of view.

Anyhoo, they've been holding off releasing the OT in a better resolution for ages - probably waiting for the max amount of hype for their new ones, and then laughing as everyone goes out to buy them all over again.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 03 January 2017 - 08:49 AM

[QuickTidal]

Actually, pasting in Hayden makes MUUUUUCH more sense with regards to current canonicity. Yoda's arc in s6 of TCW learning about how to be a force ghost and what it requires...shows that Anakins force ghost WOULD be his young Jedi form visually. It makes no sense to have his be an unblemished version of old man scarred Anakin who died a reformed Sith Lord.

[Morgoth]

All the terrible CGI figures added to the early parts of A New Hope is incredibly jarring. At times they clog up so much of the screen you can hardly see Luke, Obi Wan or the speeder.

[Aptorian]

Speaking of CGI I really liked how they used Grand Moth Tarkin in Rogue One. When I saw him I realized he had to be CGI but there wasn't really any real give aways, other than at times his skin seemed a bit too shiny or overly textured. I think one of the most impressive things about modern CGI is that they usually manage to make even they eyes lifelike and expressive.

[Whisperzzzzzzz]

QuickTidal, on 03 January 2017 - 07:29 AM, said:

Whisperzzzzzzz, on 03 January 2017 - 05:01 AM, said:

Have you seen Harmy's Despecialized versions? He's put in an inhuman amount of work to fix the errors you mentioned, along with dozens of other issues (including massive amounts of color grading and even some rotoscoping) — while leaving out the incongruous changes that Lucas added in.


http://originaltrilo...id/12713/page/1

https://docs.google....d23bqb5ryD4/pub

Huh, cool!

They're a massive pain to get through the links he provides, so PM if you want easier sources.

It's nice to have the original sarlacc and Han not stepping awkwardly onto Jabba's tail...

This post has been edited by Whisperzzzzzzz: 03 January 2017 - 01:37 PM

[Traveller]

(Sorry don't know how to multi quote from phone)

@ QT - I'd say the opposite re. Anakins force ghost. The others all transformed from the form they were in when they died. Redeemed, older, wiser Anakin is a more true form than a young Anakin at the time he turned dark. Imo. It would have made more sense to have Qui gon present.

@ Morgy - have you seen the 'George Lucas' edit of The Force Awakens on Youtube? It's basically the film but with extra stormtroopers, Dewbacks and everything all thrown at the screen in a funny but unerringly accurate piss take of the SEs.

@ Apt.. yes cgi Tarkin was very clever.. but almost too textured, almost more than the real actors next to him. If they'd toned down the resolution it would have been almost flawless.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 03 January 2017 - 01:41 PM

[QuickTidal]

Traveller, on 03 January 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

(Sorry don't know how to multi quote from phone)

@ QT - I'd say the opposite re. Anakins force ghost. The others all transformed from the form they were in when they died. Redeemed, older, wiser Anakin is a more true form than a young Anakin at the time he turned dark. Imo. It would have made more sense to have Qui gon present.

Sorry, I ought to have been clearer. The journey Yoda undertakes in TCW shows him that they take their Jedi form because it was them at their truest...which in Obi-Wan's, Yoda's case happens to also be the form they died in. With Vader, he died a Sith. Older Anakin (the reformed on at the end of ROTJ isn't a Jedi). The Sith cannot keep their forms after death because they don't have it in them to do so, so much of them is corrupt the Force itself disallows them. They are selfish. The Force Ghost requires a dispersal of self and a giving to the Force after death, which then allows you to take your form. Anakin takes his young form because it was (during the Clone Wars) as uncorrupted a Jedi form as he ever displayed (this is prior to his inexorable turn in ROTS. Up until he kills Dooku, he is still a good Jedi.

Canon info:

Qui-Gon Jinn was the first of the recent Jedi who rediscovered this secret with the assistance of a shaman of the Whills. Qui-Gon's spirit guided Yoda and Obi-Wan Kenobi and revealed to them the secret of retaining one's individuality after becoming one with the Force.

Death for those Jedi were different: their spirits could retain their individuality and could return as voices, dreams, or apparitions at will, so that they could help those in need of their guidance. On death, their bodies vanished; this was not the case with Qui-Gon, however. This state was temporary, as Force ghosts were an intermediate state between life and afterlife; after a certain amount of time, they would then have to move on to the Netherworld of the Force, another realm of existence. Darth Vader learned of this ability through Darth Sidious, and upon his death, the spirits of Kenobi and Yoda completed his training by granting him the last step in becoming a spirit. Anakin's spirit appeared as that of his younger self, prior to his fall to the dark side.

[QuickTidal]

Apt, on 03 January 2017 - 12:49 PM, said:

Speaking of CGI I really liked how they used Grand Moth Tarkin in Rogue One. When I saw him I realized he had to be CGI but there wasn't really any real give aways, other than at times his skin seemed a bit too shiny or overly textured. I think one of the most impressive things about modern CGI is that they usually manage to make even they eyes lifelike and expressive.

This is because there is a Mocap actor (Guy Henry) who performed the Tarkin scenes. They digitally recreated Cushing overtop of him (like any other MoCap role)...and AFAIK they usually just enhance the existing actors eyes so keep the life in them.

Like I think Ceasar's eyes in the new Apes movies are indeed Andy Serkis's eyes...tweaked to look more apelike.

[Traveller]

QuickTidal, on 03 January 2017 - 03:19 PM, said:

Traveller, on 03 January 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

(Sorry don't know how to multi quote from phone)

@ QT - I'd say the opposite re. Anakins force ghost. The others all transformed from the form they were in when they died. Redeemed, older, wiser Anakin is a more true form than a young Anakin at the time he turned dark. Imo. It would have made more sense to have Qui gon present.

Sorry, I ought to have been clearer. The journey Yoda undertakes in TCW shows him that they take their Jedi form because it was them at their truest...which in Obi-Wan's, Yoda's case happens to also be the form they died in. With Vader, he died a Sith. Older Anakin (the reformed on at the end of ROTJ isn't a Jedi). The Sith cannot keep their forms after death because they don't have it in them to do so, so much of them is corrupt the Force itself disallows them. They are selfish. The Force Ghost requires a dispersal of self and a giving to the Force after death, which then allows you to take your form. Anakin takes his young form because it was (during the Clone Wars) as uncorrupted a Jedi form as he ever displayed (this is prior to his inexorable turn in ROTS. Up until he kills Dooku, he is still a good Jedi.

Canon info:

Qui-Gon Jinn was the first of the recent Jedi who rediscovered this secret with the assistance of a shaman of the Whills. Qui-Gon's spirit guided Yoda and Obi-Wan Kenobi and revealed to them the secret of retaining one's individuality after becoming one with the Force.

Ah, the Lost Missions in CWs are the ones I've yet to see, just because it seems so damned expensive whenever I look.

Although the explanation is fairly sound, it only further highlights the main flaw I have with the whole saga - Anakins reason for turning in the first place. The movies alone hurried the process, which made it seem abrupt and out of character, while CWs expanded on his growing dark tendencies (unsanctioned torture, quick executions) which was nicely done; but it makes it harder to pinpoint an actual moment at which he 'turned', and equally hard to find a time he wasn't fearful, angry and prone to the dark even while he was a jedi.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 03 January 2017 - 04:24 PM

[QuickTidal]

Doesn't your Netflix have TCW? In Canada we do, and int includes S6. You're in for a treat when you get to see it. It's a great season!

Yeah, I think the Anakin we see in TCW is far more believable for the dark side turn than the one we saw in the movies. And I agree that it's not QUITE enough to have yet pushed him over the edge, but I think a year or two more of his tendencies, and pushing by Palpatine and it would have lined up well.

[Traveller]

I have Sky and Amazon Prime which covers most of what I want so I've been reluctant to add Netflix. Although the number of exclusives is making it tempting.

I'll try and pick it up on bluray. I love sticking Clone Wars on; before I watched that I was a total hater of the prequels - but that series alone has made them far more enjoyable*, flaws and all, as well as adding depth to the main characters.

* Well, tolerable anyway.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 03 January 2017 - 05:26 PM

[QuickTidal]

Traveller, on 03 January 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

I have Sky and Amazon Prime which covers most of what I want so I've been reluctant to add Netflix. Although the number of exclusives is making it tempting.

I'll try and pick it up on bluray. I love sticking Clone Wars on; before I watched that I was a total hater of the prequels - but that series alone has made them far more enjoyable*, flaws and all, as well as adding depth to the main characters.

* Well, tolerable anyway.

Oh hells yeah. THE CLONE WARS are the DEFINITIVE Star Wars periphery media for consumption in my mind. They took what the prequels created (and executed relatively poorly)...and retrofitted the series to make it all work and be good.

I love this video on why people should watch the show:

Briar King, on 03 January 2017 - 05:19 PM, said:

Pretty sure he died a Jedi before all that tweaking from 97 onward.

Right, but he was not the same Jedi he was BEFORE his turn to dark. That's who he needs to be as a Force Ghost. The canon explanation has it down as his independence in the force (after death and dispersal "becoming one with it") has to be a pure thing. Post-ROTJ Anakin is not pure, so his manifestation would be from when he was still pure. I realize all this is a retrofit from the original films...but in the context of the wide Star Wars saga we currently enjoy...it makes ultimately more sense to me.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 03 January 2017 - 05:38 PM