[Mockra]

Bendal Home, on 21 October 2016 - 09:13 AM, said:

I find this interesting, the interaction betwen Serc, Mockra and I, and how they are speaking.

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 11:41 AM, said:

Okay correct me if I am wrong on Mockra.

He quotes Gait
He quotes Kessobahn
He quotes Me
He votes Liosan, then removes
Votes Omtose
Suspects Lio
Quotes Aranatha
Labels Aranatha a possible symp
mentions Telas voting based on Gut.


No where at all has he interacted with Serc based on "finding his content".

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 11:46 AM, said:

Serc quotes Mockra, Aranatha, Me, Omtose and Kessobahn but only has Liosan as a suspect. Ie Votes for Liosan, and suspects him, although he did cast a tiny bit of shade on Aranatha and Kesso for seemingly changing direction often.

Here Mockra on Ara

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:06 PM, said:

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

Other than that first quote by Serc on Mockra which is talking about Canals there is little to no interaction between them. Aranatha has been unusually quiet today, scum holding their breath? I'll be back after lunch, in an hour. Pondering things.

Aranatha's posting times suggest he's in NA. It's barely 8 Am here.

Trying to get a read on this before I hit the subway andlose signal. I ought to be I for the last 30 mins before timeout at least

Don't see the need for him to defend Ara's posting time.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:08 PM, said:

My honest feeling about Serc yesterday was "hmm. A list. Scum love lists". But that did not seem strong enough to warrant a vote.

Would Mockra as a symp say this about his master? But flip it and he could

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:16 PM, said:

yes, I can see that. My eyebrow is raised quizzically upon his sudden verbiage as well.

The above was my response to his post implying I was distancing from you.

So Mockra was touchy about this.

As to point 1: it was (supposedly) D-Day, I see you come on and start churning out myriad of posts... and then you pick the only player not present.

As for 2: if you think that's "touchy", then so must be every response I make to any observation about me, ever. This is Mafia. I tend to be blunt when people make wishy-washy statements about me that they can then come back to later (see: Lio).

[Mockra]

Bendal Home, on 21 October 2016 - 09:22 AM, said:

Liosan, on 20 October 2016 - 01:30 PM, said:

Okay, that was a very quick read. There was no counter on the reveal and that would be ballsy/insane to bet on that if scum, so I trust Kesso and Gait are lovers. This leaves Aranatha and Mockra as the most scummy people on my list, I'm okay with vote of any of those, leaning towards Aranatha myself.

Serc also appeared on my radar. As said previously, nothing particular, but the general posting style reeks of coasting dressed up as contributing. But that's weaksauce. I had Bendal on my PI list, but the amount of WIFOMING he's been delivering this day is way over the top. Symp or scum?

That said, I need to get back to work :| Will put my vote on Aranatha and will be checking the thread, but can't really post much. What's the vote count and timer?

vote Aranatha

Pinch of salt but Lio was bang on with Ara.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on 20 October 2016 - 01:31 PM, said:

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:27 PM, said:

Telas taking the obstinate view worries me, tbh. With 8 people around, it'd take everyone minus scum to lynch. WCS still 3 scum, so Telas refusing to budge from Aranatha could be a subtle symp hint maybe? Gah, i'm getting paranoid.

I'm actually kind of tempted to follow Telas' instincts on that - that misread by Aranatha was pretty odd.

I have a general policy of not trusting Telas' gut. It (the gut, not the policy) has led me astray waaay too many times.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:42 PM, said:

MY gut is screaming "Liosan". But I admit I might be biased since responding to his "sanity-checking" is what started this whole issue.

yet he does vote Ara in the end.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:46 PM, said:

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 01:44 PM, said:

remove vote

how many votes on him?

4 now.

I don't like it, but thinking on it, I doubt Serc is killer.

I didn't mention Serc to Mockra. I Wasn't even thinking Serc, I wanted Mockra lynched...

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 01:46 PM, said:

left it late in the day, too late I think.

Personally would've liked Mockra lynched.

Unlike some, I don't play with my gut. My gut's an idiot.

And if you haven't done the vote-remove vote as I was voting, would've been my vote hammering, not you. Did you get cold feet there, for a second, hmm?

[Mockra]

Gait, on 21 October 2016 - 09:50 AM, said:

There was a lot of symp talk before Serc voted and thread was in general assuming symp being alive, if Mockra was the killer then the symp, if alive, would have to be either you Telas, which is not likely untrue, or the symp is their symp is voting them, which is also unlikely if were talking general but it created this situation where the scenarios of Mockra the killer is just unlikely so we probably would not vote that way

But what Kesso said, we shouldn't assume symp to be dead but neither to be alive

Obviously we have to play WCS and assume we need to get it right today.
But the symp talk is taking us into way too much conjecture. Each of the suspects ought to be looked at by the merits of their behaviour, not the perceived sympage from another player- this perceived sympage can be looked at as suspicious for that player.

[Mockra]

Serc, on 21 October 2016 - 10:28 AM, said:

I'm thinking I have no real way of looking non-scum because I'd be arguing against every aspect of my play. unlike bendal I'm not panicking. this is out of my hands. Scum has keyed in on my absence on the Aranatha vote and my connections to Aranatha and Mockra in a Quote. Bendal has been highlighting and re-highlighting this over and above Bendals own signal case which was a set up for a Role reveal. Please look at the two together and tell me where the logic leaves you.

I can say all I want here but the fact is my words are going to be seen as sowing confusion.

My Vote should tell you clearly what I think of the other two plyers. Please just make your decision on the facts and either lose us the game circling back to me or win the game with a vote on the player playing the Killer role in this deadlock situation.

Not panicking is good (last thing we need is Beddal 2.0 right now).

The "not caring" bit I'm not so happy with.

[Mockra]

Kessobahn, on 21 October 2016 - 11:03 AM, said:

My second scenario is that Mockra is the killer. I have no symp in mind for this and, frankly, it's not relevant to the case whether there is or is not a symp.


So Gait and I reveal. Mockra is one of those who has a vote and Gait, and promptly removes it.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 11:35 AM, said:

Well, this changes everything

remove vote

If anyone should be questioning why they are here (someone suggested they wouldn't be back in time - Bendal?), they clear that up, making sure we understand that there should be no suspicion as to why/how they've now shown up.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 11:41 AM, said:

Incidentally I did say the day times out right before I get to work (still home now...) so I was fully intending to come back before timeout

Bendal's already pointed this out - Mockra explains why Aranatha's not around.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:06 PM, said:

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

Other than that first quote by Serc on Mockra which is talking about Canals there is little to no interaction between them. Aranatha has been unusually quiet today, scum holding their breath? I'll be back after lunch, in an hour. Pondering things.

Aranatha's posting times suggest he's in NA. It's barely 8 Am here.

Trying to get a read on this before I hit the subway andlose signal. I ought to be I for the last 30 mins before timeout at least

Prods gently towards Serc here.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:08 PM, said:

My honest feeling about Serc yesterday was "hmm. A list. Scum love lists". But that did not seem strong enough to warrant a vote.

Prods gently towards Bendal here.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:16 PM, said:

yes, I can see that. My eyebrow is raised quizzically upon his sudden verbiage as well.

The above was my response to his post implying I was distancing from you.

Possible distancing from Aranatha here (but also gently prodding towards Liosan at the same time).

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on 20 October 2016 - 01:10 PM, said:

Unless there's been some pro distancing going on (always possible), the partnerships that I can see are:

Liosan and Aranatha
Mockra and Serc

So which pair is scummier?

Fun fact: both Lio and Aranatha tried to start smth with me at some point.

Prods gently towards Telas here. Again, if looking at Mockra as the killer, we might see some distancing going on from Aranatha here too. And if we are going with the Mockra/Aranatha scenario, they certainly have distancing history from earlier in the game with Aranatha's voting shenanigans.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:27 PM, said:

Telas taking the obstinate view worries me, tbh. With 8 people around, it'd take everyone minus scum to lynch. WCS still 3 scum, so Telas refusing to budge from Aranatha could be a subtle symp hint maybe? Gah, i'm getting paranoid.

Liosan asks for vote count and timer. Mockra doesn't bother checking the time left but is quite aware that there are now two votes on Aranatha.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:33 PM, said:

Liosan, on 20 October 2016 - 01:30 PM, said:

Okay, that was a very quick read. There was no counter on the reveal and that would be ballsy/insane to bet on that if scum, so I trust Kesso and Gait are lovers. This leaves Aranatha and Mockra as the most scummy people on my list, I'm okay with vote of any of those, leaning towards Aranatha myself.

Serc also appeared on my radar. As said previously, nothing particular, but the general posting style reeks of coasting dressed up as contributing. But that's weaksauce. I had Bendal on my PI list, but the amount of WIFOMING he's been delivering this day is way over the top. Symp or scum?

That said, I need to get back to work :| Will put my vote on Aranatha and will be checking the thread, but can't really post much. What's the vote count and timer?

vote Aranatha

You just made it 2 on Aranatha

Gently trying to dissuade me from following Telas on to an Aranatha train.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on 20 October 2016 - 01:31 PM, said:

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:27 PM, said:

Telas taking the obstinate view worries me, tbh. With 8 people around, it'd take everyone minus scum to lynch. WCS still 3 scum, so Telas refusing to budge from Aranatha could be a subtle symp hint maybe? Gah, i'm getting paranoid.

I'm actually kind of tempted to follow Telas' instincts on that - that misread by Aranatha was pretty odd.

I have a general policy of not trusting Telas' gut. It (the gut, not the policy) has led me astray waaay too many times.

Not-so-gently saying we should suspect Liosan instead.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:42 PM, said:

MY gut is screaming "Liosan". But I admit I might be biased since responding to his "sanity-checking" is what started this whole issue.

Before finally voting after me in a cross-post with Bendal Home (possibly when seeing that the writing was on the wall). They thought their vote would have put Aranatha on L-1 but in fact it turned into the hammer.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:44 PM, said:

vote Aranatha

And at that point, they start slightly changing their tune too. Remaining sceptical, but not as sceptical.

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:46 PM, said:

Bendal Home, on 20 October 2016 - 01:44 PM, said:

remove vote

how many votes on him?

4 now.

I don't like it, but thinking on it, I doubt Serc is killer.

Mockra was also more subdued than most at the end of that day, but I don't want to read much into that. They genuinely do seem to have been away travelling for sections, as in this post (they did come back after 45 minutes).

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 12:20 PM, said:

Kk peeps subway time back in , 40 min or so.

So Mockra questions the possible scumminess of Serc, Bendal, Liosan, and Telas in that time. Not by providing their own evidence, but in responding to and backing up things that others post at the time. And I think therein lies the difference to the rooting around that, for example, myself and Bendal were doing.

On the other hand, they also throw Aranatha into it (but always in connection to someone else, be it Telas or Liosan). And they do have that previous history with Aranatha where Ara voted for them.

Thoughts?

You have listed me pointing fingers at everyone (except yourself, Gait and myself) well, all I can say was, each of those posts is a reply to someone asking my opinion of someone else (except the Lio quote. But I think I've made it clear I never liked him). And, once again, my vote would've hammered Aranatha- were it not for Bendal's vote-remove-vote again cross-posting antics.

So I guess we can agree I looked at the suspicious aspects of everyone's play before casting a supposed D-Day vote. How unfocused of me.

[Mockra]

Bendal Home, on 21 October 2016 - 11:26 AM, said:

Well I could see either Serc or Mockra to be the killer. Your case on Mockra is good, and is where I want to vote, but I still think Serc is scum too. I'd vote either of them tbh.

I am not a symp, so but don't expect you to take my word for it.

If the symp is dead, then either Serc or Mockra could be Aranatha's partner because they've both done things that sway away from Ara. The lack of anything from Mockra today sees me suspect him more, and I don't think Serc's vote should be looked at. Telas is wifoming himself over it.



If one thing you are certain of is I am not Aranatha's partner, which I am not, then as long as we lynch one of Serc/Mockra we should still have a tomorrow. My only worry is that we do, you or Gait get killed, and they choose me to be lynched tomorrow which wouldn't make sense but you could see happening.

If you decide Serc should be lynched I'll vote that way, but as I have said, I prefer Mockra today.

And again you pick on my timezone, lol. I am NOT going to get up at 3 in the morning to be on time for your discussion. The world doesn't revolve around Greenwich, y'know.

And, yes, the one thing that frustrates the shit out of me about both Serc and Bendal is their "well either way we'll hit scum" attitude about the other 2 members of our little triangle. It makes them BOTH seem like killers who don't give a damn about anyone but themselves.

[Mockra]

Serc, on 21 October 2016 - 12:27 PM, said:

Bendal Home, on 21 October 2016 - 11:31 AM, said:

Serc, on 21 October 2016 - 11:28 AM, said:

Bendal Home, on 21 October 2016 - 11:26 AM, said:

Well I could see either Serc or Mockra to be the killer. Your case on Mockra is good, and is where I want to vote, but I still think Serc is scum too. I'd vote either of them tbh.

I am not a symp, so but don't expect you to take my word for it.

If the symp is dead, then either Serc or Mockra could be Aranatha's partner because they've both done things that sway away from Ara. The lack of anything from Mockra today sees me suspect him more, and I don't think Serc's vote should be looked at. Telas is wifoming himself over it.



If one thing you are certain of is I am not Aranatha's partner, which I am not, then as long as we lynch one of Serc/Mockra we should still have a tomorrow. My only worry is that we do, you or Gait get killed, and they choose me to be lynched tomorrow which wouldn't make sense but you could see happening.

If you decide Serc should be lynched I'll vote that way, but as I have said, I prefer Mockra today.

Hiding behind Kesso again.

Vote Serc


I cannot be arsed dilly dallying around. I like either option. Serc or Mockra, i'll switch if needed.

You know what? screw it.

I should have voted you first when I caught on to your attempt to push the lynch on me. I thought it meant more to disprove your attempt to lync me to whats clearly your symp.

Remove Vote

Vote Bendal Home

Hmm. Interesting

[Mockra]

Telas, on 21 October 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:06 PM, said:

Serc, on 20 October 2016 - 01:02 PM, said:

Shit forgot there might be a symp. ok I'm not crazy about that 50% as I know I'm town and thats a loss for us.

Does anyone think we already hit symp?

the only player the town voted was Omtose who had one post.

Eloth (another one post wonder) was modkilled.

You're basically asking if Mess was symp. I wouldn't count on it. In fact, it'd be ridiculously dumb to count on it.

Further over thinking.
This is mockra telling serc his symp is still alive.

Grimm.

Again I'm likely guilty of over thinking, but serc has been central in nearly all my musings today. I think we still have a reasonable bit of time left.
Want to hear from Mockra before laying my final vote.

This is me telling Serc (and anyone willing to read it) that it's dumb to play as anything other than WCS.

That being said, the way it's been tilting, seems unlikely there's a symp left, unless you've been playing us all along.

[Mockra]

Serc, on 21 October 2016 - 01:41 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on 21 October 2016 - 01:31 PM, said:

Telas, on 21 October 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:06 PM, said:

Serc, on 20 October 2016 - 01:02 PM, said:

Shit forgot there might be a symp. ok I'm not crazy about that 50% as I know I'm town and thats a loss for us.

Does anyone think we already hit symp?

the only player the town voted was Omtose who had one post.

Eloth (another one post wonder) was modkilled.

You're basically asking if Mess was symp. I wouldn't count on it. In fact, it'd be ridiculously dumb to count on it.

Further over thinking.
This is mockra telling serc his symp is still alive.

Grimm.

Again I'm likely guilty of over thinking, but serc has been central in nearly all my musings today. I think we still have a reasonable bit of time left.
Want to hear from Mockra before laying my final vote.

What do you think about Serc's apparent ignorance? He's stated several errors about what's happened in the game which had to be corrected. The biggest example being not realising Liosan was dead. As someone who loves mistakes as tells, I was surprised you weren't all over that. Is it genuine or really laying it on thickly?

How do you see it helping me as scum, being off the lynch train, missing the NA entirely then missing Bendals remove vote in the midst of the ton of comments, a miss telas himself missed aswell?

Effectively playing the "too dumb to be scum"™ card

[Bendal Home]

I am waiting your conclusion.

A nasty thought popped into my head, that I am picking Serc and Mockra, and serc is picking me and Mockra, and Mockra does similar, Serc or I and the fucking Killer is Telas.

[Telas]

Let me rub my hands together and laugh maniacally whilst I twirl my monocle for you Bendal.
I'm not explaining to you again why I am not scum.

Scum lies within you three. I've been waiting for mockra to weigh in and now he is doing so, there's a post from Messing or gait I want to respond to as well, will be home to the laptop again relatively soon so will do it from there

[Mockra]

Ok, that took an hour and a half. Good thing I was supposed to be late for work anyways.

Time to check in and get some stuff done. I'll be around in an hour or so with anymore questions.

For the record: no, I have not made up my mind yet. Out of sheer frustration i'm tempted to vote Bendal (iif only to shut his keyboard up), but I need another look @ Serc as well.

[Serc]

Telas, on 21 October 2016 - 03:04 PM, said:

Let me rub my hands together and laugh maniacally whilst I twirl my monocle for you Bendal.
I'm not explaining to you again why I am not scum.

Scum lies within you three. I've been waiting for mockra to weigh in and now he is doing so, there's a post from Messing or gait I want to respond to as well, will be home to the laptop again relatively soon so will do it from there

Auto correct for Mockra?

[Telas]

Auto correct for Kesso, I really need to check before hitting post. There's a Hrrrmmmm that turned in Grimm earlier as well.

looking for post in question

[Serc]

To be honest I think the walls of text need to be summarized.

I am trying to read everything here and follow the game but just seeing all these doubled and tripled replies makes NOTHING clearer. That's serving scum.

Be it one scum player or two I think we all need to state clearly where our thoughts lie.

i.e.

Quote

I think X is the best vote in this situation.

my core reason is Y.

Does this sound agreeable?

[Telas]

Kessobahn, on 21 October 2016 - 01:31 PM, said:

Telas, on 21 October 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

Mockra, on 20 October 2016 - 01:06 PM, said:

Serc, on 20 October 2016 - 01:02 PM, said:

Shit forgot there might be a symp. ok I'm not crazy about that 50% as I know I'm town and thats a loss for us.

Does anyone think we already hit symp?

the only player the town voted was Omtose who had one post.

Eloth (another one post wonder) was modkilled.

You're basically asking if Mess was symp. I wouldn't count on it. In fact, it'd be ridiculously dumb to count on it.

Further over thinking.
This is mockra telling serc his symp is still alive.

Grimm.

Again I'm likely guilty of over thinking, but serc has been central in nearly all my musings today. I think we still have a reasonable bit of time left.
Want to hear from Mockra before laying my final vote.

What do you think about Serc's apparent ignorance? He's stated several errors about what's happened in the game which had to be corrected. The biggest example being not realising Liosan was dead. As someone who loves mistakes as tells, I was surprised you weren't all over that. Is it genuine or really laying it on thickly?

This catches most of what I wanted to cover here.
Grimm was supposed to be Hrrrmmm, me thinking.

The Lio one I recall and it read more to me like "oh noes the doctor is dead, I'm so sad!!!" rather than my favourite, oh silly me I'm so confused, please ignore the harmless silly boy, post.

Trying to sift through Mockra's stuff again but am interested to see where his vote finally falls. I'm leaning towards a Serc vote now en par with my Bendal feelings for several reasons
- He's been central to the logic trains in both directions on a bendal lynch (my thinking) or a mockra lynch (bendals thinking)
- Wasn't on the Arantha train, but posted not too long after its conclusion
- His switch to Bendal post
- Kesso makes a solid point with the other minor confusions he has had.
- scum love lists bitches

My feelings on Bendal have been laid out, granted the vote from serc takes all the sting from my serc symp theory, but we could have a dead symp on board.
Plus there was the whole "oh it takes 4 to lynch not 3??" (paraphrase) post which still sticks in my mind.

I'm still thinking Bendal/Serc, but now I'm torn as I think its Bendal OR Serc, not Bendal AND Serc.

[Telas]

A fair point Serc.

I am ruling Mockra out in my head as a killer, I think its Bendal/ Serc.

I will be reading up more to try and narrow this down

[Kessobahn]

I'm going through one more epic read through of the thread and then I think it will be time to decide.

For Serc: My current thinking is as follows. Telas town. Serc not a symp, and probable town. Mockra or Bendal killer, with current 'slight' leaning toward Mockra.

I reserve the right to change my mind.

[Mockra]

My picks would be Serc and Bendal.

Leaning ever-so-slightly towards Serc, b/c too much dumb "ignorant" plays are starting to feel forced. This may change once I go for lunch and do a re-read.

There's about 5% lingering doubt that Telas might be playing us. But i'm assuming that's just paranoia

[Bendal Home]

Kesso I think you need to confer off thread with Gait.

Mockra makes sense in his replies, but he still has done no scum hunting as far as I can see. Serc neither, their votes do not seem to have any work behind them.

I wish I could see how you can put anyone in the town bracket.

Aranatha's vote of Mockra is fucking weird. I do not understand it.

Serc's post after day one lynch is pro Aranatha



I guess I'd just be re-hashing a lot of things I have already said. I'm not going to push to persuade you or anyone else.

With Serc's reactions and voting today I think I have caught scum. He has turned from bumbling idiot (liosan's death) to pulling up exact quotes to when he needs them. His suicidal altruistic lynch me approach on d day and his about face today has me sold.

I am not going to remove from Serc, I think its him.