[Mentalist]

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

[Andorion]

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

Interesting... you liked the ending? To me it seemed a bit contrived

[End of Disc One]

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 02:12 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

Interesting... you liked the ending? To me it seemed a bit contrived

The general consensus is that it's a fantastic ending. Most satisfying ending I've read to a trilogy.

[Andorion]

End of Disc One, on 24 August 2016 - 03:04 PM, said:

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 02:12 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

Interesting... you liked the ending? To me it seemed a bit contrived

The general consensus is that it's a fantastic ending. Most satisfying ending I've read to a trilogy.

Initially I rather liked the ending, but after I finished all the other Sanderson stuff, I noticed that Sanderson is a bit heavy handed with gods. This started bothering me, and nowhere is this more heavy than in Book 3 of Mistborn

I mean that Gods seem to be present or accessible in a rather trivial manner in his books. I am not articulating this very well.

Edit: I have found that my initial Sanderson reactions and 6 month after Sanderson reactions simply don't tally. As to why, I have no clue. At one point I will have to revisit the original Mistborn trilogy

This post has been edited by Andorion: 24 August 2016 - 03:23 PM

[Mentalist]

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 03:17 PM, said:

End of Disc One, on 24 August 2016 - 03:04 PM, said:

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 02:12 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

Interesting... you liked the ending? To me it seemed a bit contrived

The general consensus is that it's a fantastic ending. Most satisfying ending I've read to a trilogy.

Initially I rather liked the ending, but after I finished all the other Sanderson stuff, I noticed that Sanderson is a bit heavy handed with gods. This started bothering me, and nowhere is this more heavy than in Book 3 of Mistborn

I mean that Gods seem to be present or accessible in a rather trivial manner in his books. I am not articulating this very well.

Edit: I have found that my initial Sanderson reactions and 6 month after Sanderson reactions simply don't tally. As to why, I have no clue. At one point I will have to revisit the original Mistborn trilogy

It's been years since I read Mistborn, so this is purely from memory:

Spoiler

The first 2 books played with the "nice job breaking it, hero" trope to build up ongoing suspense.

Book 3 is the one where Ruin, the "evil" God became more apparent- which makes sense, given Sanderson's "gods" are basically empowered people representing their "aspect". Even then, his presence is most often deduced from absence of information, rather then a straight-up infodump. The misdirection about the blood-spikes, for instance, and Vin's earring.

I liked the slow piecing together of the Hero's story. And Sazed's ascension plays into the pattern of "gods are ascended people with human flaws", but it wasn't exactly sign-posted. And I found it incredibly neat how all the little extra bits of Sazed's knowledge throughout the series, that I felt were casual world-building ended up tying the ending together. It felt... organic, rather then contrived.

Sanderson is a pretty good storyteller. But I feel Mistborn/Warbreaker-size works are his best format. Stormlight Archive suffers from being so big that his (rather significantly) sub-par characterization and dialogue become much more apparent, since there's so much more of them. His pacing improved from tWoK to the second book, but I still don't feel anything close to Malaz-level love for Stormlight.

Then again, I wasn't totally hooked on Malaz until MoI either...

[Abyss]

Stormlight caught me with the sheer scope of the thing. Not in story... in pure story it's three or so characters in a relatively narrow part of a world building to one or two big action pieces per book (so far) ... but the backstory, the supporting cast, the history... it's fantasy candy. Not as complex as Malazan, not as twisted as SIF, almost too familiar at times, but the sheer fun of reading it just wipes any hesitation from me.

Full disclosure: I did these as earbooks and Michael Kramer is a glorious narrator who could make a pizza delivery menu sound epic.

[Mentalist]

As I've said before, I can see the glimmers of Sanderson's scope, and I am impressed by his ambition.

But looking at the 2 volumes out, then the map of Roshar, then the fact there's 8 more books to come, i'm not convinced there's enough stuff for 10-doorstopper series.

SE went to town in MoI, dropping plot threads left right and centre, mixing it up with insane action. It sold me to the point I could no longer wait 2 weeks for the next library copy of HoC and had to go and buy all 6 books out at the time.

Sanderson is yet to wow me like that to make me think "yes, holy shit, stuff in future Cosmere books is gonna be EPIC". The Knights Radiant angle isn't enough for me.

[End of Disc One]

Technically the Stormlight Archive will be 2 sets of 5 books, in the way that Mistborn was originally planned to be 3 sets of trilogies.

And I don't know, most of the events in the first 2 books have taken place in a relatively small section of Roshar. I think there is a ton of potential to fill up 10 books. And we have barely scratched the surface of the magic systems.

[Andorion]

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

As I've said before, I can see the glimmers of Sanderson's scope, and I am impressed by his ambition.

But looking at the 2 volumes out, then the map of Roshar, then the fact there's 8 more books to come, i'm not convinced there's enough stuff for 10-doorstopper series.

SE went to town in MoI, dropping plot threads left right and centre, mixing it up with insane action. It sold me to the point I could no longer wait 2 weeks for the next library copy of HoC and had to go and buy all 6 books out at the time.

Sanderson is yet to wow me like that to make me think "yes, holy shit, stuff in future Cosmere books is gonna be EPIC". The Knights Radiant angle isn't enough for me.

My larger problem with the whole Cosmere Mythos is that Sanderson lacks balance. He is an awesome worldbuilder. But he gets carried away with this. He builds entire alternate ecosystems, which of course are highly laudable. But he starts building these super-intricate magic systems and at one point its like a video game. What this focus on world does is distract him from characters, dialogue and ultimately story.

Ment, in your earlier post

Spoiler

you talked about Sazed, My problem is less with Sazed than with the idea that Vin and Elend became Gods. The ascencion just seemed to pat. My brother has a more pronounced reaction - "Sanderson is obsessed with turning people into Gods" He really hated the finale of Hero of Ages as well as JesusRand in WoT Book 13. Now we are Malazan readers. We know ascension. We know flawed Gods. But in Sanderson's scheme, the entire process seems simplistic, a bit too vanilla? Like Sazed of Mistborn and Sazed of Alloy of Law are basically the same person operating in different situations. Now compare this with Cotillions struggle for his humanity and SE's subtle depiction of that

[End of Disc One]

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 03:17 PM, said:

End of Disc One, on 24 August 2016 - 03:04 PM, said:

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 02:12 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

Interesting... you liked the ending? To me it seemed a bit contrived

The general consensus is that it's a fantastic ending. Most satisfying ending I've read to a trilogy.

Initially I rather liked the ending, but after I finished all the other Sanderson stuff, I noticed that Sanderson is a bit heavy handed with gods. This started bothering me, and nowhere is this more heavy than in Book 3 of Mistborn

I mean that Gods seem to be present or accessible in a rather trivial manner in his books. I am not articulating this very well.

Edit: I have found that my initial Sanderson reactions and 6 month after Sanderson reactions simply don't tally. As to why, I have no clue. At one point I will have to revisit the original Mistborn trilogy

Yeah that is strange. I just went back to your Sanderson topic, and you were much more positive about everything back then, especially the Mistborn trilogy ending.

http://forum.malazan...mlight-archive/

[Andorion]

End of Disc One, on 24 August 2016 - 06:07 PM, said:

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 03:17 PM, said:

End of Disc One, on 24 August 2016 - 03:04 PM, said:

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 02:12 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 01:54 PM, said:

To each his own, but I felt that Mistborn had one of the best endings in a fantasy series, in a sense that it was cohesive and looking back I could see how it waas set up.

Interesting... you liked the ending? To me it seemed a bit contrived

The general consensus is that it's a fantastic ending. Most satisfying ending I've read to a trilogy.

Initially I rather liked the ending, but after I finished all the other Sanderson stuff, I noticed that Sanderson is a bit heavy handed with gods. This started bothering me, and nowhere is this more heavy than in Book 3 of Mistborn

I mean that Gods seem to be present or accessible in a rather trivial manner in his books. I am not articulating this very well.

Edit: I have found that my initial Sanderson reactions and 6 month after Sanderson reactions simply don't tally. As to why, I have no clue. At one point I will have to revisit the original Mistborn trilogy

Yeah that is strange. I just went back to your Sanderson topic, and you were much more positive about everything back then, especially the Mistborn trilogy ending.

http://forum.malazan...mlight-archive/

Yeah I know... I actually went back and looked at that thread myself and I was very surprised. But Sanderson is an author about whom my opinion seems to change. Frankly I think I should reread that trilogy.

[Macros]

Hah, skimmed the first page of that thread. Quite the contrast in your opinions.

I think I was similar, from what I recall I did enjoy mistborn, but its doesn't sit very well in my memory now, have no desire to revisit and am baffled as to why I think I may have enjoyed it at the time

[polishgenius]

The more I think back on reading the second two volumes of Mistborn, the less desire I have to start Stormlight. All the stuff about how epically huge it is does tempt me, but then someone will pop in and say it could have been edited to half the length and not lost anything and puts me right off again.


I still wish someone would make a Mistborn movie trilogy though.

[worry]

polishgenius, on 24 August 2016 - 07:01 PM, said:

I still wish someone would make a Mistborn movie trilogy though.

They did make the first novel into a movie. Not sure why they quit.

[Mentalist]

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 05:45 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

As I've said before, I can see the glimmers of Sanderson's scope, and I am impressed by his ambition.

But looking at the 2 volumes out, then the map of Roshar, then the fact there's 8 more books to come, i'm not convinced there's enough stuff for 10-doorstopper series.

SE went to town in MoI, dropping plot threads left right and centre, mixing it up with insane action. It sold me to the point I could no longer wait 2 weeks for the next library copy of HoC and had to go and buy all 6 books out at the time.

Sanderson is yet to wow me like that to make me think "yes, holy shit, stuff in future Cosmere books is gonna be EPIC". The Knights Radiant angle isn't enough for me.

My larger problem with the whole Cosmere Mythos is that Sanderson lacks balance. He is an awesome worldbuilder. But he gets carried away with this. He builds entire alternate ecosystems, which of course are highly laudable. But he starts building these super-intricate magic systems and at one point its like a video game. What this focus on world does is distract him from characters, dialogue and ultimately story.

Ment, in your earlier post

Spoiler

you talked about Sazed, My problem is less with Sazed than with the idea that Vin and Elend became Gods. The ascencion just seemed to pat. My brother has a more pronounced reaction - "Sanderson is obsessed with turning people into Gods" He really hated the finale of Hero of Ages as well as JesusRand in WoT Book 13. Now we are Malazan readers. We know ascension. We know flawed Gods. But in Sanderson's scheme, the entire process seems simplistic, a bit too vanilla? Like Sazed of Mistborn and Sazed of Alloy of Law are basically the same person operating in different situations. Now compare this with Cotillions struggle for his humanity and SE's subtle depiction

of that

Spoiler

ok, first off, iirc, Vin and Elend didn't become gods, but rather went off to be happy in "afterlife". Sazed was the only God, as far as I understood it.

Secondly, I recall next to nothing of Alloy of law (and I didn't read the sequels yet). So when I'm talking about Sazed, I only mean his end of original trilo ascension.

[Coco with marshmallows]

Macros, on 22 August 2016 - 05:57 AM, said:

I know they're linked by "shards" and what ever, but I always struggle to see Brandersons series linked into a shared universe the way gemmells stones of power series is for example (and that's only the jon shannow novels, the macedon novels and...2? More?) and that was a tenuous enough connection.

shards, magic systems all being reflections/linked to one another and several characters (so far)

[theocean]

Sorry ... so what all else is in the mistborn galaxy?

enjoyed the second Era much more than I thought I would.

[Mentalist]

theocean, on 25 August 2016 - 12:58 AM, said:

Sorry ... so what all else is in the mistborn galaxy?

enjoyed the second Era much more than I thought I would.

So far we got Roshar (the setting for Stormlight Archive), the planet from "Warbreaker", and the planet from "Elantris + The Emperor's daughter, all being part of the same universe.

I think there's also a graphic novel series now dealing with yet another world?

[Andorion]

Briar King, on 25 August 2016 - 01:50 AM, said:

Really unknown atm just what the full extent of it is but just to let ya know every single bk/set of bks that he has ever published baring WoT and YA is set on a planet in it. He kinda went Stephen King's Dark Tower with it.

Oh shit I think this thread made Ando go dust his 17th Shard account off

Yup! I found my password and everything!

[Andorion]

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 07:48 PM, said:

Andorion, on 24 August 2016 - 05:45 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 24 August 2016 - 05:18 PM, said:

As I've said before, I can see the glimmers of Sanderson's scope, and I am impressed by his ambition.

But looking at the 2 volumes out, then the map of Roshar, then the fact there's 8 more books to come, i'm not convinced there's enough stuff for 10-doorstopper series.

SE went to town in MoI, dropping plot threads left right and centre, mixing it up with insane action. It sold me to the point I could no longer wait 2 weeks for the next library copy of HoC and had to go and buy all 6 books out at the time.

Sanderson is yet to wow me like that to make me think "yes, holy shit, stuff in future Cosmere books is gonna be EPIC". The Knights Radiant angle isn't enough for me.

My larger problem with the whole Cosmere Mythos is that Sanderson lacks balance. He is an awesome worldbuilder. But he gets carried away with this. He builds entire alternate ecosystems, which of course are highly laudable. But he starts building these super-intricate magic systems and at one point its like a video game. What this focus on world does is distract him from characters, dialogue and ultimately story.

Ment, in your earlier post

Spoiler

you talked about Sazed, My problem is less with Sazed than with the idea that Vin and Elend became Gods. The ascencion just seemed to pat. My brother has a more pronounced reaction - "Sanderson is obsessed with turning people into Gods" He really hated the finale of Hero of Ages as well as JesusRand in WoT Book 13. Now we are Malazan readers. We know ascension. We know flawed Gods. But in Sanderson's scheme, the entire process seems simplistic, a bit too vanilla? Like Sazed of Mistborn and Sazed of Alloy of Law are basically the same person operating in different situations. Now compare this with Cotillions struggle for his humanity and SE's subtle depiction

of that

Spoiler

ok, first off, iirc, Vin and Elend didn't become gods, but rather went off to be happy in "afterlife". Sazed was the only God, as far as I understood it.

Secondly, I recall next to nothing of Alloy of law (and I didn't read the sequels yet). So when I'm talking about Sazed, I only mean his end of original trilo ascension.

Ment, i think I have a reply to this, but I need to look at a couple of things to actually have a post. Like I said, Memory like a sieve