[Tiste Simeon]

It keeps the media focus away from how awful the Tories are...

[Mezla PigDog]

I think it's been mishandled, him and his team are naïve. I also think the press are massively biased against him but then I worry I sound like Donald Trump. Pretty fed up of Labours failure to nail the Tories on Brexit. It seems like it should be so easy. Even from a pro-Brexit stance, the lack of any clarity anywhere is the hugest dereliction of leadership duty.

[Maark Abbott]

Mezla PigDog, on 06 September 2018 - 08:26 PM, said:

I think it's been mishandled, him and his team are naïve. I also think the press are massively biased against him but then I worry I sound like Donald Trump. Pretty fed up of Labours failure to nail the Tories on Brexit. It seems like it should be so easy. Even from a pro-Brexit stance, the lack of any clarity anywhere is the hugest dereliction of leadership duty.

You'd not be wrong - the media bias is very real, however 90% of our media is right-wing owned (and generally by Tory party donors) so there's a logic to that. You can say with moderate certitude that if the BBC are running anti-Corbyn stories, the Nasty Party are about to push something heinous through on the sly.

[Mezla PigDog]

I agree with that but when the BBC are in on it then I think there is probably a glimmer of truth to it. I can't abide BBC news. It's too sensationalist and well, shit for my liking but I know how lucky we are as a country to have it when you see the alternatives out there. I don't think they are biased against Corbyn per se but their political correspondents circulate in and are informed solely from the Westminster bubble. Corbyn is an outsider from that clique and so I think they are biased against him in that sense - he's not playing their game and they can't find a new way to operate to go and find the relevant stories. That means they get their Labour stories from the New Labour Old Guard who follow the communication template established by Blair and Alistair Campbell. I can't decide if the fact that Corbyn doesn't care is a good or a damagingly naïve thing to do. I want it to be a good thing. I work from home and watch the Daily Politics/Politics Live semi regularly while I eat my lunch - it mostly makes me angry because their political correspondents reporting on spectacularly serious stuff contribute to making a circus out of it just to make themselves look like stars.

Anyway, I don't know. I hope Corbyn's approach is going to work but I wish there was a Corbyn equivalent without his baggage from the old days. I don't like all of this waiting around for something to happen - a more savvy opposition should have capitalised on the governments ineptitude by now. Alternatively looking at the long game it's probably better for the Tories to be given enough rope to hang themselves since Brexit is their mess.

[Gorefest]

To hang themselves? To hang the whole country more likely. Brexit is going to take the UK at least another generation to recover from. On top of the current drawn-out austerity drought it is going to severely cripple various parts of the country and people.

[Mezla PigDog]

Yeah but if Labour was in charge then they would probably also have to see it through and carry the can for the cock up or be accused of thwarting a democratic result. I would say that they must be waiting for the tide of public opinion to change but Corbyn is pro-Leave while most of his MPs are Remain. They're crippled and have no idea what to do as a Party on Brexit. Corbyn is guilty of a lack of any clarity as well and could be accused of a complete lack of leadership on the issue and allowing it all to go to pot under the Tories for his own political gain. I have no idea how the country will recover from this.

[Silencer]

War, presumably. The only time tested method for 'fixing' fuck ups. Which should be easy to do, given America currently wants to start ww3 and all the UK has to do is wait for them to kick it off.

Seriously, though, as much as I hope that doesn't happen in this day and age, it is a classic approach to distraction and easing economic woes.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

I guess Brexit will make the UK largely exempt from this (except when interacting with internet users in the EU):

https://boingboing.n...erds-2.html/amp

[Morgoth]

Azath Vitr (D, on 13 September 2018 - 03:54 PM, said:

I guess Brexit will make the UK largely exempt from this (except when interacting with internet users in the EU):

https://boingboing.n...erds-2.html/amp

Well, if you look at the voting numbers and at what EU block the Tories belong to, I think you'll find your answer.

[Tsundoku]

Good fucking luck trying to maintain that border ...

https://www.news.com...4b2d1867ed98a1b

So what do our Norn Iron members think about this theoretical part of Brexit?

[Gorefest]

If only it were theoretical. It's a bloody headache. A backstop to the backstop, but at the same time claiming that you'd never actually agree to it. It makes not one iota of sense. Why put it in there in the first place then? Just to appease the EU? But it is meaningless if you already say that you are never going to abide by it.

[Macros]

I'd say our first problem is the fact that we haven't had a sitting government for basically two fucking years (they're still getting paid don't worry).

Outside of that, a hard sea border will really slow down the ferry check-in process and likely spike the prices of goods and deliveries north and south of the border.
I forsee the Rosslare to Cherbourg ferry route getting rapidly upgraded regardless of what happens.

A hard land border quite simply will bring back the troubles. Period.

[Mezla PigDog]

We had some developments at work this week. I dare not expand on details but safe to say we've been sucked fully into Brexit politics and I have no respect for either side right now.

[Mezla PigDog]

Watching some of the Armistice Day stuff on TV. It's very moving. And to think how easily people forget one of the founding reasons for the European Union. How lucky we are to have grown up in an era where most of us can't comprehend how much of a relief it is to be in a Union with your neighbours.

Anyone asks me to send my son off to war and I'll tell them where to go and stick it.

[EmperorMagus]

Apparently there is some sort of agreement between the two negotiating groups now. But it seems unlikely that the agreement will be accepted by the British Parliament.

I have to say, I'm impressed that May has gotten this far. I thought this farce would continue until the March 29.

[TheRetiredBridgeburner]

EmperorMagus, on 14 November 2018 - 06:02 AM, said:

Apparently there is some sort of agreement between the two negotiating groups now. But it seems unlikely that the agreement will be accepted by the British Parliament.

I have to say, I'm impressed that May has gotten this far. I thought this farce would continue until the March 29.

As much as I'm not a lover of the Tories, I feel a bit sorry for May. Whatever happens, she is completely damned and has had to try and clean up what is basically Cameron's mess. There was nothing she could do to not come out of this basically the most hated woman in British politics. I'm not saying she's always helped herself, but that doesn't change the fact she's been left in a pretty unfair situation.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

TheRetiredBridgeburner, on 14 November 2018 - 07:42 AM, said:

EmperorMagus, on 14 November 2018 - 06:02 AM, said:

Apparently there is some sort of agreement between the two negotiating groups now. But it seems unlikely that the agreement will be accepted by the British Parliament.

I have to say, I'm impressed that May has gotten this far. I thought this farce would continue until the March 29.

As much as I'm not a lover of the Tories, I feel a bit sorry for May. Whatever happens, she is completely damned and has had to try and clean up what is basically Cameron's mess. There was nothing she could do to not come out of this basically the most hated woman in British politics. I'm not saying she's always helped herself, but that doesn't change the fact she's been left in a pretty unfair situation.

... like a fox?

[Gorefest]

TheRetiredBridgeburner, on 14 November 2018 - 07:42 AM, said:

As much as I'm not a lover of the Tories, I feel a bit sorry for May.

I don't share that sentiment one iota. The woman purely sits there out of lust for power. She was a pretty poor home secretary under Cameron, with 'go home' vans in the streets (I mean, you run a seriously dodgy enterprise if even Nigel Farage says that it is 'unpleasant') and the Windrush scandal handling. She voted to remain in the EU and subsequently ended up leading the Tory party in handling the Brexit, setting herself up with some of the most seedy and despicable elements of that movement (Johnson, Gove) around her and advocating a hard line. She has no original ideas or vision, just a lust for power. It is a situation entirely of her own making. Nobody forced her to stand for party leader. The woman just follows any direction that keeps her in the driving seat and screw the UK. I suspect she couldn't care less either if any deal that she reaches inflames the Northern Ireland situation or might even force a breaking of the UK, as long as she can get her plan through. The only reason why she pays lip service to Northern Irish concerns is that she is desperately reliant on DUP backing to have a parliamentary majority. The woman is politics through and through, only interested in her own career. Screw her. Let her sweat.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 14 November 2018 - 03:33 PM

[Khellendros]

Gorefest, on 14 November 2018 - 03:31 PM, said:

TheRetiredBridgeburner, on 14 November 2018 - 07:42 AM, said:

As much as I'm not a lover of the Tories, I feel a bit sorry for May.

I don't share that sentiment one iota. The woman purely sits there out of lust for power. She was a pretty poor home secretary under Cameron, with 'go home' vans in the streets (I mean, you run a seriously dodgy enterprise if even Nigel Farage says that it is 'unpleasant') and the Windrush scandal handling. She voted to remain in the EU and subsequently ended up leading the Tory party in handling the Brexit, setting herself up with some of the most seedy and despicable elements of that movement (Johnson, Gove) around her and advocating a hard line. She has no original ideas or vision, just a lust for power. It is a situation entirely of her own making. Nobody forced her to stand for party leader. The woman just follows any direction that keeps her in the driving seat and screw the UK. I suspect she couldn't care less either if any deal that she reaches inflames the Northern Ireland situation or might even force a breaking of the UK, as long as she can get her plan through. The only reason why she pays lip service to Northern Irish concerns is that she is desperately reliant on DUP backing to have a parliamentary majority. The woman is politics through and through, only interested in her own career. Screw her. Let her sweat.

One small correction: May was not a pretty poor Home Secretary, she was an awful one. But the fact that nonetheless she was also one of the longest-sitting Home Secs ever demonstrates her political ability to keep on the right side of others in her party.

[Gorefest]

To be frank, I originally had 'terrible' in there but I decided to amend it because I must confess I was a bit fuzzy on what she did and did not preside over. But I'm happy to subscribe to awful. The woman is a coldblooded egotist, if you ask me.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 14 November 2018 - 04:20 PM