Gothos, on 14 March 2018 - 12:55 PM, said:
I have to ask our resident Canadians... sitting in front row seats, how do you feel about Jordan Peterson and the issue of pronouns?
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Now, while I don't really have anything against adding gender identity into the pool of grounds on which discrimination can be recognized by law, I can't find in that bill exactly why would not calling a transsexual student or faculty member by a gender-neutral pronoun like 'zhe' or 'zher' be so controversial. Why has this risen to the rank of hate speech for so many?
Are we at that point where the rank and meaning of hate speech has become so diluted that a pronoun becomes a matter of defending human rights? Or is this, in fact, a matter that's just been blown out of proportion in certain circles, but
is generally absent from the day-to-day existance of the general population?
In this case, I definitely think it's closer to << a matter that's just been blown out of proportion in certain circles, but
is generally absent from the day-to-day existance of the general population >>. 99% of it all is happening only on university campuses - Peterson or someone like him organizes a speaking, a bunch of student organizes protest or try to disrupt it, other student groups counter-protest/disrupt, etc etc. But you won't see big rallies about any of this on Parliament Hill or anything like that.
Anyway, Peterson's main point in all this seems to be: "If one of my students asked me to refer to them by another pronoun, I would do so (because that's just polite and decent). But the government should not be able to
force me to do so if I didn't want to; it should not be a crime for me to address someone by a pronoun/title they don't like."
Or at least, that's what Peterson says his stance is (was?). I don't know if he's ever actually had a trans/non-binary student/acquaintance who put his claim to the test.
Personally, I totally agree with that above principle/belief. I think we should just encompass trans/non-binary into the existing gender discrimination rules in Canada - maybe cleaning up the wording to include those where necessary - and don't see why they should need special extra rules that limit how everyone speaks... *especially* considering that the actual English (and French) vernacular for these situations has not at all settled into an established convention yet.
All that being said... Jordan Peterson is a crappy interviewer. I've watched a couple of his interviews, and he doesn't stick to his point, he engages too much in weird tangents or logician-style exploration of the topic, etc. He says he gets crazy hard-left unfounded accusations thrown at him... and based on some videos that does indeed seem to be the case - but then he goes from those into these weird explorations of his philosophy on whether there are inherent differences in men and women's corporate aptitudes or something and it has no bearing on compelled trans pronoun usage!
So yes, I completely agree with his main/original point, but I definitely don't identify with Peterson himself. I also definitely don't like the campus groups that storm into his or anyone else's speaking engagements to try and drown it out rather than engage in actual discourse. I think both sides look pretty bad.
But again, outside of university campuses I don't think this is anywhere near a big issue. It might get discussed a lot on reddit, but it's not getting brought up in political campaigns or townhalls. Biggest non-university circumstance I can think of is the Black Lives Matter - Toronto Pride Parade debacle of the last couple years, but I am skeptical as to how much the average (non-Toronto) citizen actually cared about that, either.