[QuickTidal]

Tear gas was SPECIFICALLY mentioned by health advocates earlier this year as something NOT to use as a suppression tactic during the pandemic because COVID-19 is a respiratory virus spread via droplets and the LAST thing you should be causing massive groups of people to do is cough, and snot, and sneeze their bodily juices out around each other.

Cops knew this.

Cops did this shit anyways. Across the country (and even in mine, Montreal kicked of like that).

When the numbers across your country for Covid spike hard, it's not just going to be because of the protests...it's going to be because police used tear gas that made things infinitely worse.

[Obdigore]

Cause, on 02 June 2020 - 07:47 PM, said:

Saying tear gas is illegal iin warfare is a bit misleading. I think it is more a protection against chemical weapons that scooped up tear gas to prevent the possibility of weakening the ban by creating exceptions and loop holes, I doubt soldiers prefer being shot by bullets or artillery to pepper spray. There are real outrages enough without having to manufacture more.

So wait, what you're saying is that Tear Gas, which is a chemical weapon, is considered a War Crime, but it's 'misleading' because you want to excuse it? Is it considered a War Crime? Yes.

Full fucking stop.

[Primateus]

Macros, on 02 June 2020 - 06:30 PM, said:

A border some that size would make a lot of countries just a border

Apart from a small area, that zone is the entirety of Denmark.

This post has been edited by Primateus: 02 June 2020 - 08:36 PM

[EmperorMagus]

What Obdigore said. You can't excuse it by saying it's not as bad as other chemical weapons. It is also a violation of art. 21 of the Covenant on Civil and Political Rights to tear gas peaceful protestors. Systematic and widespread violations of article 21 are crimes against humanity.

So not only a war crime but also a crime against humanity.

[Cause]

Obdigore, on 02 June 2020 - 08:09 PM, said:

Cause, on 02 June 2020 - 07:47 PM, said:

Saying tear gas is illegal iin warfare is a bit misleading. I think it is more a protection against chemical weapons that scooped up tear gas to prevent the possibility of weakening the ban by creating exceptions and loop holes, I doubt soldiers prefer being shot by bullets or artillery to pepper spray. There are real outrages enough without having to manufacture more.

So wait, what you're saying is that Tear Gas, which is a chemical weapon, is considered a War Crime, but it's 'misleading' because you want to excuse it? Is it considered a War Crime? Yes.

Full fucking stop.

Well if you want to play the game of strict interpretation of the law than Trump is allowed to call in the cbp to patrol the 100 mile border. Clearly that’s not the intent it was meant for.

A ban against weapons that literally melt your lungs with acids also bans pepper spray in war but you can still run someone over with a tank. So let’s understand what the intent was. In fact a quick google search tells me that the USA signed with the specific exemption that they can still use pepper spray on prisoners of war if they riot in a prisoners camp.

If you take away water cannons, they will switch to pepper spread, take that away they will switch to rubber bullets (possible brain trauma and blindness), take that away and they will use tasers (potential for heart attacks), take that away and they will resort to their batons, take that away and they will shoot.

Every nation in the world has riot control and sometimes the legitimate need to use it. Again I support the intent of the protesters, I support police reform. However there has also been looting and arson. There will be riots in the future. Sports games have riots, war protests have riots, Job strikes have riots and the police will be called in to deal with it.

[Cause]

Obdigore, on 02 June 2020 - 08:09 PM, said:

Cause, on 02 June 2020 - 07:47 PM, said:

Saying tear gas is illegal iin warfare is a bit misleading. I think it is more a protection against chemical weapons that scooped up tear gas to prevent the possibility of weakening the ban by creating exceptions and loop holes, I doubt soldiers prefer being shot by bullets or artillery to pepper spray. There are real outrages enough without having to manufacture more.

So wait, what you're saying is that Tear Gas, which is a chemical weapon, is considered a War Crime, but it's 'misleading' because you want to excuse it? Is it considered a War Crime? Yes.

Full fucking stop.

[EmperorMagus]

The problem with chemical weapons is that they are indiscriminate. They affect peaceful participants and non-participants and can be lethal to the vulnerable. That is the reason why they are banned.

Further, just because the US made a reservation while joining the treaty does not make the treaty invalid or tear gas an appropriate riot suppression tactic. It's just typical US hypocrisy.

[Macros]

I think you're giving the Police in the US too much respect Cause. They've been documentedly shits for a long time. More so than a lot of other police forces (yes generalisation, there are plenty of good cops I'm sure) But the evidence plays it out like this - the police WANT protests to turn violent to turn the shit on. So they turn it on regardless, then when it goes to shit, they can hold their hands up and say - look, arson and stuff!

[amphibian]

Macros, on 02 June 2020 - 08:52 PM, said:

I think you're giving the Police in the US too much respect Cause. They've been documentedly shits for a long time. More so than a lot of other police forces (yes generalisation, there are plenty of good cops I'm sure) But the evidence plays it out like this - the police WANT protests to turn violent to turn the shit on. So they turn it on regardless, then when it goes to shit, they can hold their hands up and say - look, arson and stuff!

The leaders of the NYC unions for the lower ranking police officers Pat Lynch and Ed Mullins have had an antagonistic relationship with basically every mayor the city has had in the last 25 years. They have had power for a very long time in those unions and decided in 2014 or 2015 that De Blasio was basically the devil incarnate for his "anti-police" actions.

Anyways, Mullins used the Twitter account of the NYC Sergeants Benevolent Association to threaten the mayor's daughter by revealing her address and more info after she was arrested during a protest.

https://www.newsweek...aughter-1507750

De Blasio's response has been to sort of brush this off and continue to say that the police are good.

I actually think the police rank and file would respect him more if he destroyed Mullins for threatening his daughter. The way it currently stands, de Blasio has little control over the cops in his city and a non-trivial number of cops are joking about hurting his daughter as well as the people protesting (then going out there to do it).

So that's the biggest police force in the country and that's the screwed up dynamic happening right now.

[amphibian]

Some more discussion of what's going on with the NYC mayor: https://www.politico...efender-1289640

Of some importance is the departure of several staff members over the years who helped put together the police reform platform that saw him win the election. Rachel Noerdlinger being one - her departure from the administration was caused by a total mess in her personal life (not living in NYC, a several thousand dollar E-ZPass bill, and so on) - that changed how 2014/2015 went for the mayor.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'NYPD Scanner Broadcasts Calls to Shoot, Run Over Protesters

[...] the question now is whether those words came from a cop or someone who stole a radio.

As protesters marched toward the 77th Precinct in Brooklyn, you could hear someone on the scanner calling in to describe the scene before another voice urges cops to, "Shoot those motherf*****s."

Later in the evening, the scanner picked up what sounded like officers saying they were surrounded by protesters near the intersection of Albany and Dean Streets in Crown Heights. A voice on the scanner responds, "Run them over."

Obviously, the scanner broadcasts are beyond alarming IF they really came from police officers. NYPD tells us ... they're aware of the comments and are looking into it.

TMZ independently found the radio transmissions on a website that records police scanners -- so the audio is legit.'

https://www.tmz.com/...6vwXJAUuEMG3BNk

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 03 June 2020 - 02:52 AM

[QuickTidal]

Protesters in the states are now starting to use HK defensive tactics, umbrellas en masse, dousing tear gas in traffic cones with water, helmets ect.

https://www.reddit.c...tm_medium=web2x

I figure "Be Like Water" and "Laser Pointers" are next.

The oppressed learning from the other oppressed around the world.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 03 June 2020 - 12:29 PM

[QuickTidal]

The other three officers have now been charged in Floyd's death as accessories, and Chauvin's charge has been upped to 2nd Degree.

[Malankazooie]

Yeah, I knew the charge would be considered and changed. Video is too damning. Letting experts do their jobs and then proceeding accordingly is procedurally the right move. There's a lot of noise at the beginning of these, especially across social media.
<><><><><><><>

In other news. Damn, the curfews are being enacted earlier and earlier. Most sunlight of the year right now (June). Setting 7pm curfews (or earlier is some cases) is fucked. I guess the line of thinking is that peaceful protests are meant to be directed at business hours operations (aka 9-to-5)?

[Gust Hubb]

QuickTidal, on 03 June 2020 - 07:55 PM, said:

The other three officers have now been charged in Floyd's death as accessories, and Chauvin's charge has been upped to 2nd Degree.

From what I hear, 2 of those 3 have left the state/area, one with a lawyer knowing where they are and the other completely disappeared.

[Primateus]

James Mattis Denounces Trump

Well written and pretty direct. But he did serve as Trump's SecDef and has kept mostly quiet, until now, since his resignation. I suppose I can understand that, but I would like to hear what others have to add.

This post has been edited by Primateus: 03 June 2020 - 11:16 PM

[amphibian]

Primateus, on 03 June 2020 - 11:15 PM, said:

James Mattis Denounces Trump

Well written and pretty direct. But he did serve as Trump's SecDef and has kept mostly quiet, until now, since his resignation. I suppose I can understand that, but I would like to hear what others have to add.

The reason why these emergent statements and feelings are politically acceptable for these guys to say now (as opposed to the 748493637 racist and awful things Trump has done) is because the counter-protest policing is treating white people like black people.

In the words of Trevon Logan, that's a sacrificing of the American social compact, which certain types of white men can't abide by.

His Twitter thread (short) is here: https://twitter.com/...2498470913?s=19

So it's a tiny bit good that Mattis is speaking now. It's really shitty that it took him this long to speak on it and so many other things. He might not be an actual ally of those protesting even beyond the military stuff.

[Cause]

Trump doesn’t know Matt is, never really worked with the guy, never saw him. Just some junior staffer.

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'Businesses have been looted and burned and had glass broken. This is a covered loss under most business insurance policies. [...]

If you're a business owner, all the physical damage to the building up to your policy limit would be covered. All your contents up to your policy limit will be covered. That would also include a tenant that's responsible for their inside improvements. If it's a restaurant, they have all of the kitchens, the tables. It it's retail, they bring in a lot of fixtures, etc. There's other coverages that people may have or may not. They'll have to check their policy. There's business-interruption coverage that some businesses add on. It helps companies that incur extra expenses to continue operations while the premises are being repaired. It also helps businesses that are forced to suspend operations or limit their hours of operation, replacing the income they would have generated in a typical time frame.

Does the recent wave of coronavirus-related claims complicate matters?

It doesn't. It just means they do need to put in a new claim, because this is a different loss. The coronavirus didn't generate coverage for most businesses because viruses are excluded. Coverage is usually for physical damage to property.

[...] "If businesses file a claim because of the protests, would premiums rise?

It doesn’t affect [the premiums] in the near future. Generally, catastrophes get looked at more in the long-term average. [The California Department of Insurance] looks at a 20-year history when they look at catastrophe. The rates don’t go up immediately—only if you were having riots every year."'

https://slate.com/bu...e-premiums.html

Video police systematically slashing protesters' tires in broad daylight:

https://www.youtube....=youtu.be&t=381

Then when they can't make curfew....

'Guy With Wolverine-Like Claw Chases Down Black Lives Matter Protesters Before Trying To Run Them Over With His SUV'

https://www.comicsan...2646153067.html

This post has been edited by Azath Vitr (D'ivers: 04 June 2020 - 11:20 PM

[Azath Vitr (D'ivers]

'Police officers in Seattle and New York City have been seen with their badge numbers covered as they respond to protests over the police killing of George Floyd.
The National Lawyers Guild New York City chapter sent a letter to the New York Police Department saying that the nonprofit would sue to make officers uncover their badges. They allege that this is a way for officers to "violate demonstators' rights without consequence."

An NYPD spokesperson said that officers are wearing mourning bands to honor the officers who have died from COVID-19, and that they may have fallen from the top of the badge to cover their badge numbers. She said it is a violation to intentionally cover the number.

In Seattle, officers have covered their badges with electrical tape, which is allowed.'

https://www.insider....violence-2020-6