[Rikkter]

Path-Shaper, on 03 April 2014 - 08:31 PM, said:

By accident, I deleted a post about Galayn Lord's player name. Bad hand-eye coordination and a phone.

Anyway, like that post suggested, it was an oversight on my behalf. GL was lf course Tatts.

That was my post, yeah just after confirmation of what we mostly all knew but was wondering if there was a mechanic behind it

[Rikkter]

Path-Shaper, on 03 April 2014 - 09:39 PM, said:

There's roughly 17 hours and 20 minutes left in the day and I am off to bed.

Weekend freeze starts at the end of the night 3 resolution, or at the end of the regular game day, whichever comes first.

That makes it around 7 hours to go. I personally don't think that 7 hours will be enough time for people to sort through D1 and D2 properly.

I do of course acknowledge that my D2 output wasn't much, it was based primarily upon levelling up.

[Rikkter]

"The time is not yet right!"

There we go, 31 hours or so left. Now those people who have time, damned well sit down and build good cases.

As I said, I'm not around much at all but now may have some time tomorrow - time we now have depending on how PS handles a non-timing out day over weekend.


edit:corrected colour tags

This post has been edited by Rikkter: 04 April 2014 - 07:49 AM

[Path-Shaper]

The game clock is extended by 24 hours. There are 30 hours and 40 minutes left in the day.

I will start the weekend break at 17.00 CET, meaning in 6 hours and 40 minutes. The remaining 24 hours will be on the clock when the weekend freeze is over.

[Path-Shaper]

Now to do a vote count...

[Bek Okhan]

Rikkter, on 04 April 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

"The time is not yet right!"

There we go, 31 hours or so left. Now those people who have time, damned well sit down and build good cases.

As I said, I'm not around much at all but now may have some time tomorrow - time we now have depending on how PS handles a non-timing out day over weekend.


edit:corrected colour tags

I just want to say thats a great town ability Its a good time to use it too because Day 2 was pretty saturated. I think as I was responsible for a good part of the flood, I'm the only one looking at it closely, we'd benefit more if people got a chance to sift through it after work.

Even though we did post alot late day 2 there was decent content in amongst the posting. I'll use this to do searches on Denul. I already suspect an obvious pattern.

Denul:
No ones taken me seriously on how his introduction time and a lack of an NA coincide. My first instinct was to assume because Denul was allowed to play despite the "illness" and "late realization the game hadn't started" he must not be exceptional. Now I'm not so sure.

Has there ever been a history of scum awarded powers conditionally exempting them from a modkill rule? I won't really be able to relie on that assumption, but I am starting to think Denul sticks out from the traditional player and might benefit from this.

His online activity has shown a pattern but I just assumed he was new to this game of mafia and after enough re-reads would start to see the game lynches and town momentum. He hasn't and has not commented significantly except when I may be implicated. His current vote on me is sound even if the case around it overlooks soooo much content to the contrary. I blame the volume here, not unusual. Denuls suspicion on me to before this point however feels very weird. I'll try build a case to better explain myself.

Anyways thanks Rikkter, I'm glad you afforded us more time.

[Lock]

Yeah, I think that was a good move. Also, it seems to me that that is a very "town-like" ability, so that makes me feel better about him.

[Path-Shaper]

29 hours 36 minutes on the clock.

10 are alive.
Ampelas, Bek Okhan, Denul, Eloth, Korabas, Kessobahn, Lock, Monok Ochem, Okral Lom, Rikkter.

6 for lynch, 5 for night.

1 vote for Bek Okhan (Denul)
1 vote for Ampelas (Rikkter)
1 vote for Rikkter (Korabas)
1 vote for Eloth (Monok Ochem)

Not voted: Ampelas, Bek Okhan, Eloth, Kessobahn, Lock, Okral Lom.

This post has been edited by Path-Shaper: 04 April 2014 - 11:26 AM

[Monok Ochem]

I'm pretty sure my vote is on Eloth Tapps, near the start of day.
unless this vote block thing has made eloth unvotable for the day, which would be highly suspicious

[Bek Okhan]

Rikkter, on 02 April 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

Denul, on 02 April 2014 - 07:40 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 02 April 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

Ok point 5

Quote

5.Open Support of GL

has already been addressed and is evident in every quote running the Tiam as scum angle.

I think Tiam deserves a lynch. Im gonna vote on him but maybe the train can be a bit relaxed? we need to pad our post count and stay well away from hammering till maybe the last two hours or less.

Vote Tiamatha

While I was reading the Day 1 crap, Tiam was the one who stuck out most to me. Problem is, it's basically for pushing so hard to level up. He and GL spent a good chunk of time spamming away.

I anticipate the same charge levelled my way tomorrow. Tiam / Ampelas are my 2 top candidates at the moment. Ampelas has done a complete about turn on their posting, 37 D1 to none today so far.

Ok this was Denuls initial read on Day 2. fairly decent interpretation of Tiam as scum but if read the way I read it its a down play of tiam and GLs activity.


Now lets reverse and look at GL after the vote on Denul:

Galayn Lord, on 01 April 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

Alkend, on 01 April 2014 - 02:48 PM, said:

I don't have much faith in day 1 signaling cases. The chimpanzee stuff is too easy to both happen and be misconstrued. Not gonna vote that way.

Galayn Lord seems really wishywashy to me, though. He's shifted his "target" focus a couple times. Seems like he implied at one point that he has no level 5 ability, which the OP says all townies have. Very suspicious. Not a ton to go on, but the best day 1 choice IMO.

Vote Galayn Lord

Gorilla and Monkey have been used but not chimpanzee. This looks like deflection away from MO, especially at us locked 2 for 2 in votes.

Wishy Washy in what way, because throughout the game I have stuck to my thoughts. The Denul vote was in hope that he would post but we are getting close to the end of the day and I think Bek looked to be the scummiest person on thread so far.

Of course I am going to look at multiple targets, it is day one.

Why do you need the OP to let you know what abilities townies may have? I was addressing Korabas when I mentioned this as I don't want to paint a target on my back.

That whole post is scummy to be honest Alkend.

GL based this over my misinterpretation we all might level up seperately. this was my fuzziest moment and I took my train of thought further than I should have. But I corrected myself well enough and I might add at the time one thing GL ignored and almost everyone else conceded was my suggestion to keep posting low and PREVENT scum rising in levels till we knew what they could do at level 0. Now failing this I realized we would not be able to hold back players convinced posting however they like was best case scenario, NAMELY GL and Tiam. I realized my suggestion would not fly then thought I might aswell look at cases and see if I can catch scum faster to prevent fast levelling. I found MO and GL to be suspicious and voted. As I dialogued with GL though his focus on me led me to believe he was pulling an angle. this and his spammy nature led me to believe nothing he did was honest (Also Alkend really had the right idea. Signalling was easily a scum attempt to get Monok to look scummy and the ruccus about that case might have and probably did hide the real signalling).

Anyways I started doubting my vote on Monok because Monok voted GL first and never shifted, Cant think Scum would do that so brazenly. Started to think GL was the right target and voted on him. That all worked out in the end and we eventually lynched.

All that aside whats important here is that I had still resolved to low post and realized as we had two very overactive candidates pushing for levels my best bet was to adopt Rikkters strategy.

Now back to the Denul case. I raise all that up because heres Denuls interpretation of all that:

Bek Okhan, on 02 April 2014 - 08:05 PM, said:

Denul, on 02 April 2014 - 07:47 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 02 April 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

Denul, on 02 April 2014 - 07:39 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 02 April 2014 - 06:50 PM, said:

@ Denul: Keep reading. hope you see the logic behind that as you continue. scum wanted lethal powers and Day 1 level one wouldn't work for them. we shooting for level 5 as we speak so post up!

So as far as I can read, you've completely 180'd on your opinion about leveling up, but that's not supposed to be suspicious?

I think it's possible, also, that Galayn Lord was voting for you to distance himself from you. I'm still finishing up the reread, I want to see what the other cases are about.

How have I 180'd? I wanted a low post Day 1. Day 2 would be a safe drive for 600 posts needed to get to level 5 and we have our info as to where scum started so we can gauge new levels between 1 and 5 probably help scum. as we are already well into that we might aswell push for level 5 in earnest. its all there in Rikkters post I'll find it for you.

So we're basing this on conjecture, then? I mean, there's merit to what Rikkter has said, but you're ready to just believe him? Base your strategy on him?

The read on Rikkters posts line up well with my own and honestly thats what I expect town to do. Scum won't want the playing field to be level, especially one man down. Level 5 is "theoretically" in our favor.

Rikkters strategy flew in the face of what GL was hoping to achieve at every level. I think he's played a good town game and I need to trust my own read of players to make deductions.

Its up to you if you want to delve deeper into Rikkter or myself, build a case if you like. It helps town if more of us are close to certain of each other.

.Now setting aside ALL the people GL could have voted to distance himself with its interesting Denul, of all people, brings it up first when it applied to him twice over. (due to the O Y incident and it being a signalling possibility )

I find it very hard to believe someone could read me specifically and not see a progression of thinking on thread. I definately stuck to my guns Day 1 and adopted a new approach Day 2 in the interest of helping town. Had this been a scum ruse to achieve higher levels why would I push till level 5 at the end largely on my own steam? scum would push for levels 3, maybe 4 at the best and then try slow posting down.

Ok I'm gonna have to step out now. I'll finish my case later today as theres more I'm picking up as I dig.

[Bek Okhan]

Monok Ochem, on 04 April 2014 - 10:17 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure my vote is on Eloth Tapps, near the start of day.
unless this vote block thing has made eloth unvotable for the day, which would be highly suspicious

Yeah...thats not a thing. Don't frett, PS just missed your vote. Also I might add why would you suggest such a power could even exist?

[Path-Shaper]

Monok Ochem, on 04 April 2014 - 10:17 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure my vote is on Eloth Tapps, near the start of day.
unless this vote block thing has made eloth unvotable for the day, which would be highly suspicious

processed, my bad.

[Korabas]

Well, that makes it easier. You don't get my vote anymore Rikkter.

Remove Vote

[Denul]

Lock, on 04 April 2014 - 09:15 AM, said:

Yeah, I think that was a good move. Also, it seems to me that that is a very "town-like" ability, so that makes me feel better about him.

Agreed - extending a Day to help us get a lynch IS a very town-like ability, unlike stopping someone from voting.

[Denul]

Bek Okhan, on 04 April 2014 - 10:40 AM, said:

I find it very hard to believe someone could read me specifically and not see a progression of thinking on thread. I definately stuck to my guns Day 1 and adopted a new approach Day 2 in the interest of helping town. Had this been a scum ruse to achieve higher levels why would I push till level 5 at the end largely on my own steam? scum would push for levels 3, maybe 4 at the best and then try slow posting down.

This reads to me as "If I'm scum, why would I do something town would want?"

Hmmm, I dunno, so you can hide amongst the sheeple?

[Okral Lom]

Rikkter, on 04 April 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

"The time is not yet right!"

There we go, 31 hours or so left. Now those people who have time, damned well sit down and build good cases.

As I said, I'm not around much at all but now may have some time tomorrow - time we now have depending on how PS handles a non-timing out day over weekend.


edit:corrected colour tags

Smart move.

[Okral Lom]

Bek Okhan, on 03 April 2014 - 11:06 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 03 April 2014 - 10:54 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 03 April 2014 - 10:32 PM, said:

Denul, on 03 April 2014 - 09:15 PM, said:

Yeah, sorry, I don't believe your little 'reveal' to be completely honest, and, really, the vote blocking ability is not an ability I see town having for any reason - it's basically useless for a townie to be able to block a vote unless he's certain of a scum and it's D-Day, but even then... It just doesn't strike me as an ability town would have.

Furthermore, you're either willfully ignoring ability text, or PS posts...

I think you're lying - you slipped and now you're trying to make yourself seem unimportant.

vote Bek

I look at this and really this is the only thing you have had on me for this whole time. Your first read through had you looking at me as scum long before suspecting Tiam or GL. you are quick to claim Tiam RI despite faction attachments and now when I actually do slip up Your vote is based on what you think town would never get?

What part of TMDi 7 do you not understand? this may start as town versus town but it clearly had room to grow into a coop of wildcard. Why wouldn't town get obscure powers? I mean I don't get why I got the ability to block a vote but I don't see how getting that power makes me scum. I thought this was the whole reason we pushed for 600 posts, so we had the power to face off against scum on a level playing field. why wouldn't Tapper give town powers like mine? clearly he knows in the mechanic of the game this could be useful and I thought so too. a town able to block one players vote ability can do several things. any derailment on them would have to be forced from fellow scum for example as they cannot back a redirect themselves.

I really saw it as invaluable and your read of it as a scum only tool makes me think you're misleading players on purpose.

this is a decent answer but the truth is that with a power that is so obvious - the person you target is going to be told they can't vote that day - why would you use it so early when that person could easily just reveal it on thread? it would have been so much more useful at endgame, and even if you didn't get to use it, at least it would not have craeted the confusing situation we are in now

It was clear they'd be told. I wanted to see how they'd treat it. Revealing a vote block wasn't a problem. we'd have all sat trying to figure it out and examine Eloth ask questions, basically whats happening to me. what screwed the pooch was your highlighting my worries scum had a similar power and the last vote may get intercepted as I believe scum could do. I did not say it though, till after you'd voted as I had no plan to use my vote block. only after Korabas built a case on Eloth did I think maybe Eloth was flying under the radar and needed that pressure.

In my mind a vote block on a gray player encouraged the group to pressure that player. if there was a slip up to be made they'd need to be worried.

A vote block for town is unusual/ how would you use it end game? blocking a vote on a train just makes the train look scummier. And it would be revisited.

If you were at the end of the game and you were pretty sure that there was two scum left and you wanted to make sure that they couldn't get someone to vote with them and then hammer. You could block the vote on one of the players. Thus preventing that probable scum from being able to hammer a inadvertent town vote. See last game for an example.

In my mind that is as powerful as tool at the end of game as a guard can be. But hey that might just be me. Of course the issue with holding on to it and not using it right away is that you might die and not use it. I do have a little bit of an issue with you thinking that you had an action that could be used more then once. Since it was pretty carefully stated in the OP and was a topic of conversation in regards to how town posting strategy for day 1 and 2. It strikes me as very slopping reading time after time.

[Denul]

Okral Lom, on 04 April 2014 - 02:27 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 03 April 2014 - 11:06 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 03 April 2014 - 10:54 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 03 April 2014 - 10:32 PM, said:

Denul, on 03 April 2014 - 09:15 PM, said:

Yeah, sorry, I don't believe your little 'reveal' to be completely honest, and, really, the vote blocking ability is not an ability I see town having for any reason - it's basically useless for a townie to be able to block a vote unless he's certain of a scum and it's D-Day, but even then... It just doesn't strike me as an ability town would have.

Furthermore, you're either willfully ignoring ability text, or PS posts...

I think you're lying - you slipped and now you're trying to make yourself seem unimportant.

vote Bek

I look at this and really this is the only thing you have had on me for this whole time. Your first read through had you looking at me as scum long before suspecting Tiam or GL. you are quick to claim Tiam RI despite faction attachments and now when I actually do slip up Your vote is based on what you think town would never get?

What part of TMDi 7 do you not understand? this may start as town versus town but it clearly had room to grow into a coop of wildcard. Why wouldn't town get obscure powers? I mean I don't get why I got the ability to block a vote but I don't see how getting that power makes me scum. I thought this was the whole reason we pushed for 600 posts, so we had the power to face off against scum on a level playing field. why wouldn't Tapper give town powers like mine? clearly he knows in the mechanic of the game this could be useful and I thought so too. a town able to block one players vote ability can do several things. any derailment on them would have to be forced from fellow scum for example as they cannot back a redirect themselves.

I really saw it as invaluable and your read of it as a scum only tool makes me think you're misleading players on purpose.

this is a decent answer but the truth is that with a power that is so obvious - the person you target is going to be told they can't vote that day - why would you use it so early when that person could easily just reveal it on thread? it would have been so much more useful at endgame, and even if you didn't get to use it, at least it would not have craeted the confusing situation we are in now

It was clear they'd be told. I wanted to see how they'd treat it. Revealing a vote block wasn't a problem. we'd have all sat trying to figure it out and examine Eloth ask questions, basically whats happening to me. what screwed the pooch was your highlighting my worries scum had a similar power and the last vote may get intercepted as I believe scum could do. I did not say it though, till after you'd voted as I had no plan to use my vote block. only after Korabas built a case on Eloth did I think maybe Eloth was flying under the radar and needed that pressure.

In my mind a vote block on a gray player encouraged the group to pressure that player. if there was a slip up to be made they'd need to be worried.

A vote block for town is unusual/ how would you use it end game? blocking a vote on a train just makes the train look scummier. And it would be revisited.

If you were at the end of the game and you were pretty sure that there was two scum left and you wanted to make sure that they couldn't get someone to vote with them and then hammer. You could block the vote on one of the players. Thus preventing that probable scum from being able to hammer a inadvertent town vote. See last game for an example.

In my mind that is as powerful as tool at the end of game as a guard can be. But hey that might just be me. Of course the issue with holding on to it and not using it right away is that you might die and not use it. I do have a little bit of an issue with you thinking that you had an action that could be used more then once. Since it was pretty carefully stated in the OP and was a topic of conversation in regards to how town posting strategy for day 1 and 2. It strikes me as very slopping reading time after time.

BUt that wouldn't actually do anything! It would just make it go to Night and then the killers would kill and the game would end the exact same way. It's a useless ability for a town player to have, as far as I can tell. Perhaps I'll eat my words when I get to SH and see what else is actually going on, but I just don't see a vote block being a town ability.

That being said, my level 5 ability has given me information that makes me believe that one of either you or Bek are scum, and my money's on Bek, specially if he has, as he has said, a vote blocking ability.

[Okral Lom]

Denul, on 04 April 2014 - 02:34 PM, said:

Okral Lom, on 04 April 2014 - 02:27 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 03 April 2014 - 11:06 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 03 April 2014 - 10:54 PM, said:

Bek Okhan, on 03 April 2014 - 10:32 PM, said:

Denul, on 03 April 2014 - 09:15 PM, said:

Yeah, sorry, I don't believe your little 'reveal' to be completely honest, and, really, the vote blocking ability is not an ability I see town having for any reason - it's basically useless for a townie to be able to block a vote unless he's certain of a scum and it's D-Day, but even then... It just doesn't strike me as an ability town would have.

Furthermore, you're either willfully ignoring ability text, or PS posts...

I think you're lying - you slipped and now you're trying to make yourself seem unimportant.

vote Bek

I look at this and really this is the only thing you have had on me for this whole time. Your first read through had you looking at me as scum long before suspecting Tiam or GL. you are quick to claim Tiam RI despite faction attachments and now when I actually do slip up Your vote is based on what you think town would never get?

What part of TMDi 7 do you not understand? this may start as town versus town but it clearly had room to grow into a coop of wildcard. Why wouldn't town get obscure powers? I mean I don't get why I got the ability to block a vote but I don't see how getting that power makes me scum. I thought this was the whole reason we pushed for 600 posts, so we had the power to face off against scum on a level playing field. why wouldn't Tapper give town powers like mine? clearly he knows in the mechanic of the game this could be useful and I thought so too. a town able to block one players vote ability can do several things. any derailment on them would have to be forced from fellow scum for example as they cannot back a redirect themselves.

I really saw it as invaluable and your read of it as a scum only tool makes me think you're misleading players on purpose.

this is a decent answer but the truth is that with a power that is so obvious - the person you target is going to be told they can't vote that day - why would you use it so early when that person could easily just reveal it on thread? it would have been so much more useful at endgame, and even if you didn't get to use it, at least it would not have craeted the confusing situation we are in now

It was clear they'd be told. I wanted to see how they'd treat it. Revealing a vote block wasn't a problem. we'd have all sat trying to figure it out and examine Eloth ask questions, basically whats happening to me. what screwed the pooch was your highlighting my worries scum had a similar power and the last vote may get intercepted as I believe scum could do. I did not say it though, till after you'd voted as I had no plan to use my vote block. only after Korabas built a case on Eloth did I think maybe Eloth was flying under the radar and needed that pressure.

In my mind a vote block on a gray player encouraged the group to pressure that player. if there was a slip up to be made they'd need to be worried.

A vote block for town is unusual/ how would you use it end game? blocking a vote on a train just makes the train look scummier. And it would be revisited.

If you were at the end of the game and you were pretty sure that there was two scum left and you wanted to make sure that they couldn't get someone to vote with them and then hammer. You could block the vote on one of the players. Thus preventing that probable scum from being able to hammer a inadvertent town vote. See last game for an example.

In my mind that is as powerful as tool at the end of game as a guard can be. But hey that might just be me. Of course the issue with holding on to it and not using it right away is that you might die and not use it. I do have a little bit of an issue with you thinking that you had an action that could be used more then once. Since it was pretty carefully stated in the OP and was a topic of conversation in regards to how town posting strategy for day 1 and 2. It strikes me as very slopping reading time after time.

BUt that wouldn't actually do anything! It would just make it go to Night and then the killers would kill and the game would end the exact same way. It's a useless ability for a town player to have, as far as I can tell. Perhaps I'll eat my words when I get to SH and see what else is actually going on, but I just don't see a vote block being a town ability.

That being said, my level 5 ability has given me information that makes me believe that one of either you or Bek are scum, and my money's on Bek, specially if he has, as he has said, a vote blocking ability.

Did you see the end of the last game at all? There was 3 town all of whom though that there was a pretty good chance that the other were town. Then there were two scum who were seen by all 3 as being scummy. One of the town voted for another and then the second scum came on and hammered. With a vote block in town hands one of those scum would have for sure been denied the ability to vote. Thus leaving the voting amount at 3 town and 1 scum. Thus preventing a quick scum game. Seems pretty straight forward to me. You would only go to night if the town were stupid enough to vote for night or to let the day time out.

[Okral Lom]

Denul, on 04 April 2014 - 02:34 PM, said:

That being said, my level 5 ability has given me information that makes me believe that one of either you or Bek are scum, and my money's on Bek, specially if he has, as he has said, a vote blocking ability.

That is kind of funny as Bek is going after you pretty hard for being tied to GL. I am still trying to get a feel for the thread. There have been a lot of scummy comments tossed out and about. It is tough to tie them into a cohesive pattern.