[Tarthenal Theloman Toblakai]

i think that if the Azav tree thingy as it is now called (which i love!) had been introduced too early it would have been too odd and random personally, what with the introduction of super magic weilding at Pale, mega Tiste Andii dragon Soultakens and Tyrant craziness the tree thing might have pushed the whole lot over the edge lol. I also think that magic, and super dark swords of epicness and dragons are more 'main stream' and thus maybe easier to swallow thus the later introduction? Maybe the Azav was supposed to be an unkown given the fact that the Azav are super secret and sneaky and unknown throughout the whole series. That being said, i had zero problem reading GoTM and followed everything happily enough to buy a Kindle Paperwhite and buy the rest of the books and dissolve my real life into them! haha. Not saying I fully understood EVERYTHING first go as a lot was being introduced, that being said I am not pro experienced reader either, my complete reading experience is ASoIaF and the Malazan books as a whole (just about to finish The Healthy Dead) .Peoples minds are wired differently, why do I like Iron Maiden and Metallica but not AC/DC? who knows! but that is just how it is!

[Daeg]

Everyone tried to help the best we could.

How do you describe these books? How do you explain the depth of emotion? Where would you start?

All we can do is encourage people to read on. If the reasons we give are not good enough reasons...then don't. I don't think anyone here feels a responsibility to sell the book to anyone. Especially a stranger who spouts negativity to every sincere reply. This set speaks for its self as far as I'm concerned.

No avid reader needs to be sold on a set. Either they read it or they don't...

And if this is a joke by some other member...its a pretty good one....a good joke

[Jade-Green Pig-Hog Swine-Beast]

Maybe Mr Knightmare is larl_Agongorry reincarnate!

[Sarkaukar]

Sad, sad day for the OP. It also, for me anyhow, illustrates the different types of people in the world and why the human race has so many conflicts. Super simplified, there are those which the world is either black or white (belief in one specific thing and it takes going to hell and back to change that view) and those who can see the the shades of gray (does not take things on face view, question things, etc).

OP, I can say that GotM was not may introduction into this world, in fact I rarely read fantasy, as I am more of a scifi person. I have read WoT (2nd novel 1st - everyone was passed out and it was just laying there on the table..) and the Tolkien trilogy (but only after I had saw the 1st movie). I also was looking for something, if fantasy, did not have ogres, elves, dwarves, trolls, wizards, witches etc. And I have only read those books only once, never had the inclination to reread them, even to catch up on things. I could not stomach the novels about Drizzt. I picked up two of them in the same way I did the Malazan Books of the Fallen.

So,I was bored and was looking at something to grab my attention that was not a 1 book show and it was initially the cover of Deadhouse Gates with the fiery orange flames, the men on horseback and demon dogs (actual names require more reading ) ready to clamp down. I have happen to have gotten into the habit of picking a random page to read to see if it was good enough to even look at the others. Lets just say the description of some of the bodily functions after being zapped with lightning and the clean up afterwards had me saying a few expletives.

If I had picked up GotM by itself, I am not sure if I would have read anymore of the books. And I did not have the benefit of this forum until after I had read several others, waiting on the next one. The friends (and they their family/friends, around 75 now) that I got hooked onto this series, for the most part also had the same sentiments. For many they had to start with Deathhouse Gate first then went back and read GotM and for a few, they had a better understanding of GotM after being informed it was game played out and setup as a movie script, and of those most of them are in RPG games, so on reflection they could see the game play. A few of the authors in the Battletech world also gameplayed their mech combat.

Read Deathhouse Gates, then the next, and so on. If you have read any of the threads in these forums, most of us have laughed, cried out in despair and anguish, shed a tear in sorrow to the point of having to put the book down and walk away for a bit. Are you able to say the same thing for WoT or LotR? Or for others, were your reactions as extreme and often as it has been with MBotF series as a whole?

Again, it is sad. It falls in line with you can not really judge a book by its cover but with the MBofF series, you can not judge the series by the 1st book, especially since the book was not originally written as the 1st of a series.

[Stormcat]

Everything you hate about it is something I liked. Am I a hipster? What the hell is a hipster anyway?

[Aptorian]

I am pretty sure Kallor is a Hipster. He walked this land when the Imass were but children.

[Vengeance]

Not Brent Weeks, on 07 January 2014 - 08:33 AM, said:

[Puts on fake Moderator mask]

Guys how about we try to keep it civil. The tone has steadily become more and more antagonistic. If you need to resort to calling people trolls maybe it is time to take a step back and breathe for an hour.

[removes fake Moderator mask]

Seriously now, we've had these discussions a thousand times. Don't start calling the guy a troll when the regulars are themselves going out of the way to pick on Knightmare.

Try to stick to the high road and don't just keep on repeating that the guy must obviously be dumb.

Are you saying that I am not a regular? Calling someone a Troll is a breather for me. Usually if I am angry at a person I make disparaging remarks about conjugal visits that their mother had with a wandering donkey/ape/raccoon/Elmer Fud/Yosemite Sam/Raglefant at a road side brothel of your choice. In this case I was just calling it as I saw it. He was acting Trollish.

[HiddenOne]

Jade-Green Pig-Hog Swine-Beast, on 07 January 2014 - 03:14 PM, said:

Maybe Mr Knightmare is larl_Agongorry reincarnate!

Blasphemer, Iarl_Agongorry will not be mocked!

[Jade-Green Pig-Hog Swine-Beast]

I beg forgiveness!

[HoosierDaddy]

Not Brent Weeks, on 07 January 2014 - 08:33 AM, said:

[Puts on fake Moderator mask]

Guys how about we try to keep it civil. The tone has steadily become more and more antagonistic. If you need to resort to calling people trolls maybe it is time to take a step back and breathe for an hour.

[removes fake Moderator mask]

Seriously now, we've had these discussions a thousand times. Don't start calling the guy a troll when the regulars are themselves going out of the way to pick on Knightmare.

Try to stick to the high road and don't just keep on repeating that the guy must obviously be dumb.

Personally I find it more interesting to hear peoples dislikes of the books, than reading another ZOMG THIS IS THE BEST thread.

Telling someone the series might not be for them after a pretty vigorous discussion isn't antagonistic. That being said, once the fingers went into the ears and "No! No! No!" was the content being provided what more do you expect?

[Kanese S's]

Not Brent Weeks, on 07 January 2014 - 04:58 PM, said:

I am pretty sure Kallor is a Hipster. He walked this land when the Imass were but children.

He was into empire-building before it was cool.

[Stormcat]

[Jade-Green Pig-Hog Swine-Beast]

The face of Mr Knightmare, forever.

[Anicetus]

Vengeance, on 06 January 2014 - 08:24 PM, said:

Mr Knightmare, on 06 January 2014 - 08:21 PM, said:

Quote

Judging this story by the first book is like judging the lotr story by the first 50 pages...in other words...Erikson is just getting started...

And this is part of the problem. I HATE people telling me that "you can't judge a series just by the first book/first three episodes/first movie in the trilogy etc.

Yes I can. Nothing is beyond judgment I can very well say that the soup tasted like an Ogre's armpit even tough I have a great barbeque coming my way.

If the first of ANYTHING doesn't grab me than what's the point? Isn't that the point of the first book? To make me want more? To make me fall in love with the world or the character so that I crave to learn more about it and them?

If I didn't get DH for free I would NEVER go and read it because I tough that GoTM was awful. Why waste my time on an 800+ page book when I have already read one from the same author and I have an experience with it and I hated it? I could be spending that time with another book that I might enjoy.

Obviously the book had a profound effect on you. So much so that you felt the need to come on a forum about the series where you are sure to run into people who like and enjoy the book and spout off how much you hate the book. Thus leading me to one conclusion above all others

TROLL BEGONE!!! BEGONE I SAY!!!

Well said, he strikes me as an articulate troll. Pushing buttons in a civilized enough way to elicit real responses. Also if it takes him five rereads to comprehend something, there is always the young adult section..... these books have more characters but keeping up with the storyline is NOT hard. If you get lost read the dramatis personae (spl).

Anyways all the suggestions given to the OP are pretty good. I honestly would tell him NOT to read the books.

[Crux]

I finished GotM 3 weeks ago, and now I'm half way through DG. I really enjoyed GotM, but so far I'm I'm LOVING DG. GotM was good, but DG seems so much better. I think Erikson really stepped it up after GotM.

[Andor]

Just finished it myself in a 3 day binge, had the advantage of being off work sick though.

Gotta say, as someone who loves the first person POV and brilliant in depth characterization like Farseer or Kingkiller I have put this series off for so damn long expecting to be reading a game of D&D rather than a story.

Very surprised how addicted I am, the characters are actually pretty good, sorta reminds me of Joe Abercrombie, the Phoenix Inn regulars were prob my favorites, Crokus and Kruppe in particular, though I was calling Crokus Corkus the entire book - also really liked Sorry and Hairlock, though I keep picturing Hairlock looking exactly like the gingerbread man.

What probably kept me interested the most is the need to know what the hell is actually going on, that and I love assassins - Cotillion and Ammanas are awesome, also love the twin jesters and the idea of gods at war. Infact theres so much to write about I don't know where to start really so ill just carry on reading.

It wasn't all that confusing as I thought it might have been going off the reviews, also the tor re-read really helped early on.

Oh had to google the challenge question to register to this forum, make sure I got the spelling right and got a massive spoiler from Toll the Hounds, not impressed like... turns out the wiki page has all the characters circumstances after the crippled god so no more google.

Anyways 20% into DG and loving it.

[Spoilsport Stonny]

Andor, on 06 February 2014 - 01:25 PM, said:

Anyways 20% into DG and loving it.

I envy your virginity. ONE OF USSSSSSSSSS......

[Bulwyf]

Mr Knightmare, on 06 January 2014 - 08:21 PM, said:

Quote

Judging this story by the first book is like judging the lotr story by the first 50 pages...in other words...Erikson is just getting started...

And this is part of the problem. I HATE people telling me that "you can't judge a series just by the first book/first three episodes/first movie in the trilogy etc.

Yes I can. Nothing is beyond judgment I can very well say that the soup tasted like an Ogre's armpit even tough I might have a great barbeque coming my way. And if the main course does end up as the most amazing thing ever that still doesn't change the fact that I tasted an Ogre's armpit.

If the first of ANYTHING doesn't grab me than what's the point? Isn't that the point of the first book? To make me want more? To make me fall in love with the world or the character so that I crave to learn more about it and them?

If I didn't get DH for free I would NEVER go and read it because I tough that GoTM was awful. Why waste my time on an 800+ page book when I have already read one from the same author and I have an experience with it and I hated it? I could be spending that time with another book that I might enjoy.

You can't really judge a series by one book. You can judge the one book of a series.
Say you're in a retaurant having a 3 course meal:
The appetizers come out and it's something you like (epic fantasy books), say shrimp for example. Maybe they're seasoned/prepared oddly or some way experimental, that you just don't care for. Can you judge how the whole meal is going to turn out? You can make an assumption based on your experience with the appetizer. The main course could come out and it's the best steak you've ever had in your life, along with an awesome piece of pie for dessert.


Heh, I've dropped a series after thinking the first book was shit before, there's nothing wrong with it. You give the author a shot and it's not your cup of tea.

I also liked GotM and was pretty much hooked at that point. For me it was pretty much my first taste of real reading though, so I didn't know it was an atypical type of read. Before GotM I had really only read Star Wars books. Sometimes I have a hard time giving other authors a fair chance as I find them to be too easy/simple. I try to stay open minded and a lot of times I end up happy that I got past the early predictability of the story/writing and enjoy the story overall.

Again, I enjoyed GotM, and like everyone else is saying, the next 2 books take things to a whole new level.

[Mrs Savagely Wishy Washy]

..... another one tried, and another one left.... in a huff and a puff.

[Adhara]

I understand why the OP didn´t like at first sight GotM, and there is no problem. If you can´t buy magic at such a big size, a lot of demi-god characters and a lack of physical descriptions, these books are not for you. I understand why the OP has posted here, because when I do not like a book I´ve expected to like I want to hear another people who already have enjoy it and see what they think. What I don´t understand is why the OP wants to continue a series whose first book has been a torture for him.

And I wonder who the God Mod Dark Elf The King of Mary Sues could be. This die-hard fan of Rake has no idea.