[Grasp]

You saying testosterone is exclusively male? Sounds like poor training in biology to me

[Trake]

Hanas, on 24 October 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

I like Ghennan so far.

I did earlier, but you don't think his switch away from his own suspicions to easily following is a bit strong?

[Hanas]

OK. So Jalan likes Ghennan and Ultama linked up for the fact of leaving Ghennan-like behaviour out of Ultama's case making.
The problem there Ultama being Ultama. It fits the pattern of an RI trying to get things going and digging himself a hole in the process.

[Lock]

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 01:04 PM, said:

Lock, on 24 October 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

In essence, I am don't like the manner in which people are following my vote and the justifications they are giving for doing so. I would like to hear back from Fanderay.

I will also be around to vote.

It is not wishy washy not to want to let people get away with hopping on a train with the excuse of simple momentum, or not to want to create an illusion that we only have one choice when that is not that case. It is common sense.

This accusation of erraticism is getting tiring (and is utterly hypocritical, may I add). I have been playing like this all game. Being wishy washy and simply not being tunnel visioned are different things. Making several different assertions and putting pressure in several different places is one thing. Being middle of the road, non committal and vague on every assertion you make is another.

If everybody has to explain & justify every single vote, it will deter getting the lynch through as I have seen many times the second half of trains be composed of pile-ons, drive-bys & meager attempts at reason.


The problem with aging war on multiple fronts is the weakening of points from which your attention wavers in favor of the new assault. I think that is the downside of your approach. At some point, people will begin to ignore you.

Sure, not everyone has to fully be behind a train. But the more people justify their votes the better. I also feel that people should be called out on suspicious votes, and suspicious votes make me want to reconsider my position on the train.

I'm not claiming my approach is flawless, but personally I favour mentioning the things you find suspicious over letting it slide so you can zealously focus on a single issue. It's a spectrum, and I'm happy enough with where I am on it. The game benefits a variety of different styles (not counting certain ones anyhow )

I agree with the first part, I was just making the point that no one will ever get 100% of explanation attached to every vote. I also am not condemning your approach, so much as commenting that I can see where Ultama is coming from. I do think you can risk losing the strength of your voice from over use.

[Lock]

Grasp, on 24 October 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

You saying testosterone is exclusively male? Sounds like poor training in biology to me

No, I just associate males with pissing contests. But if there are some females involved, maybe that's why no one has called me a "fucktard" yet. Keeping it classy, like.

[Trake]

Hanas, on 24 October 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

OK. So Jalan likes Ghennan and Ultama linked up for the fact of leaving Ghennan-like behaviour out of Ultama's case making.
The problem there Ultama being Ultama. It fits the pattern of an RI trying to get things going and digging himself a hole in the process.

That struck me as firmly tongue in cheek really. Jalan has been coasting. So has Lock for that matter, skirts getting involved.

[Fanderay]

Ultama, on 24 October 2013 - 10:58 AM, said:

That is two votes for Fanderay. I am going to have a look at him.

I will quote and post below;

Day one, page one Fanderay posts a lot of posts. 7 posts on the first page. Call it what you will but it is basically filler. Fluff.

Day One page 2. He votes for me. This is his last post on day one. He said he was catching up but didn't comment on anything else for the rest of that day. The vote came across, to me, at least as a joke vote. It's not something you are serious on to lynch someone for. What irks me, is he says that he is catching up but then does not return until day 2.

Fanderay, on 22 October 2013 - 08:26 PM, said:

just like no one's dumb enough to WIFOM on Day 1?

vote Ultama

catching up

Day 2. Page 4, post 160. He highlights Monok's self vote. That is the first thing he picks up on.

Quote

ok, wtf was this?

Does he mention the no lynch, or little amounts of votes, or anything regarding Togg or even the first part of my analysis on Cast. No. He goes straight to what I said about Monok. That is fairly narrow minded of him.

Quote

so, someone grabbing hteir toys and leaving and obstructing town from lynching in the process is... town?

I don't see the logic. If you're town, you ALWAYS play for the team. Even if though your team is full of retards. Just because you're not being listened to doesn't mean you have the right to fuck up everyone else.

And, realistically, that's what MO's self-vote did. It made sure we won't lynch Day 1.

I really don't see how anyone can look at that and consider it "town play"

I underline this. I know I mentioned that Fanderay didn't vote when he did but I don't think he played for town on day one. He was not part of any discussion on lynches and he did a drive by wifom vote on me and disappeared until day two. That irks me quite a lot. That is not very town like. I am not saying his points are wrong but I am saying he comes across as scummy.

Sticks with his day one vote and votes for me again. The only two players he has mentioned all game so far is Monok for the removal of vote and me. So is this very town like? Are we not meant to be looking for scum. Do we do this by focusing on just one player?

He then paints Monok as the symp and I am the scum. This post goes in his favor because it does make sense.

Quote

just, FYI, at this point you had FOUR votes-Pallid, Me, MO and Ghen

so then Trake bitches about lack of participation and puts a "for now" vote on MO.

MO then does a craptastic emosplosion, self votes and tells us he's fucking off for the night, WHILE EFFECTIVELY SHUTTING DOWN THE ONLY LIKELY TRAIN.

the reason his self-vote is suspicious is fuck is not just because it's a dumbass move, but because it's a dumbass move to justify removing from the only viable train atm. And since it's a self-vote out of the fucking blue, it's designed to have people talk about it, rather than about who he was removing from--which is exactly what you'd have us do.

I dunno if you're scum. you may be getting framed by MO. but MO's play screams symp,, so lynching him I'd expect town CF, which isn't helpful at this stage. coupled with your play on Day 2, it's enough in my mind to warrant voting you.

Now Fanderay is more involved in the game, his activity is once again up to a higher level. He is communicating back and forth with me, replying to Monok and Jalan. This period of day two makes Fanderay look good.


YET

since then what have we had? Two posts from him saying

Fanderay, on 23 October 2013 - 10:14 PM, said:

that was anti-climactic.

and

Quote

you know you're a humanities major when......

So when we all need to pull together and figure out who we are going to lynch, he disappears again and doesn't give us his ideas. A pattern has emerged. Be active when it doesn't matter but when it counts disappear.

Vote Fanderay

Or, you know, be more active during work hours in the day, and then not as active after work when I'm at home. But hey, who has the time to look at such silly things as posting times and think about time zones?

You know, I was hoping to be nice today, since unlike yesterday i'm properly caffeinated this morning, but I guess it was too much to hope for....

[Lock]

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

Lock, on 24 October 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

I don't expect Fandy to come on and defend at all.

Why?

Looking over his posts, this seems roughly his timezone...

nope, no meta reasoning. He's going to play it cool and hope this blows over.

[Hanas]

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

Hanas, on 24 October 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

I like Ghennan so far.

I did earlier, but you don't think his switch away from his own suspicions to easily following is a bit strong?

Maybe. But there might be a resignation factor. In fact, I am also dying to see a CF because I'd hate to go into a potential d-day (or d-day -1) with 2 scum chosen CFs only.
I think today's consensus lynch was always going to be Monok. Ultama... It is 100% meta but I think too many recognize the pattern and look back at other games to find the town CF there.
I was surprised by Fanderay getting that far but I can guess they were/are a logical alternative.

[Lock]

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 01:18 PM, said:

Hanas, on 24 October 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

OK. So Jalan likes Ghennan and Ultama linked up for the fact of leaving Ghennan-like behaviour out of Ultama's case making.
The problem there Ultama being Ultama. It fits the pattern of an RI trying to get things going and digging himself a hole in the process.

That struck me as firmly tongue in cheek really. Jalan has been coasting. So has Lock for that matter, skirts getting involved.

I'm sorry, isn't our little convo here enough to be considered involved?

[Trake]

Lock, on 24 October 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

I also am not condemning your approach, so much as commenting that I can see where Ultama is coming from. I do think you can risk losing the strength of your voice from over use.

This is pretty funny, since Ultama has been criticised for being all over the place.

[Fanderay]

Ultama, on 24 October 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

Ultama, on 24 October 2013 - 10:58 AM, said:

So when we all need to pull together and figure out who we are going to lynch, he disappears again and doesn't give us his ideas. A pattern has emerged. Be active when it doesn't matter but when it counts disappear.

Vote Fanderay

Not sure I agree here. He was active at a period of relatively high discussion and then quieter when there wasn't much going on. At worst he could be accused of not taking much initiative to make cases and prompt when there's not much happening, but that can be leveled at most people and isn't very damning, and he was quick to get involved when he did.

I'd like to hear back from him.

Are you defending him, whilst voting for him based on Hanas possibly symping?

I disagree with you, he was active when I was firing questions at him which prompted him to answer. Yet when I went away, he went away too, yet there were other people posting on thread. His two lines that he posted was in amongst discussion and his comment on the modkill was a one line thought.

With regards to his vote, I said I thought it was a joke vote when he did it. You may argue that it was intentional but you don't really vote people like that without any substance behind it. He voted drive by style, did not elaborate on it and did not try to rally others behind him for the lynch.

go fuck yourself (again).

You made WIFOM comment. I voted you. ANY discussion of "oh, X wouldn't do Y, because EVERYONE KNOWS ONLY SCUM DO Y" is WIFOM. pure and simple. WIFOM NEVER HELPS TOWN. Thus, yuntill something better came up you were deserving to be voted off with extreme prejudice. I didn't think that required elaboration.

[Trake]

Lock, on 24 October 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

Lock, on 24 October 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

I don't expect Fandy to come on and defend at all.

Why?

Looking over his posts, this seems roughly his timezone...

nope, no meta reasoning. He's going to play it cool and hope this blows over.

Maybe, but he's L-2.

We'll see I suppose.

Edit: In a cross post as it happens. Told you so

This post has been edited by Trake: 24 October 2013 - 01:22 PM

[Jalan]

Here, need coffee, catching up

[Hanas]

You know what... let's just vote a coaster. This situation is damned unpleasant, and the mod-kills invite trouble by following too quickly with no info from them. In the current environment I'd rather lynch someone on whom I have absolutely no read whatsoever and who seems to like to keep it that way, despite a decent post count, than lynching someone on who some shades of grey are gathered and who at the least is being discussed.

Vote Jalan.

[Fanderay]

Path-Shaper, on 24 October 2013 - 12:45 PM, said:

Togg has been modkilled due to inactivity.


It is Day 2. 4 hours and 55 minutes remaining.


9 players alive: Cast, Fanderay, Ghennan, Grasp, Hanas, Jalan, Lock, Trake, Ultama

5 votes to lynch, 5 votes to go to night.

3 votes Fanderay: Ghennan, Ultama, Grasp
1 vote Ultama: Fanderay

Players not voted: Cast, Hanas, Jalan, Lock, Trake

ugh, 2 people down in one day. joy.

[Fanderay]

Trake, on 24 October 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

We have hours and I'm going to be around, I'm hardly tempting time out you morons. Fuck sake.

I would vote Ultama except he was stupid fucking townie the last bunch of times we had this argument so why bother.

I'd suggest you take your meta and stick if where the sun don't shine.If he's being an unhelpful moron, you lynch him for it. It's the only way he'll learn.

[Jalan]

Monok Ochem, on 23 October 2013 - 09:50 PM, said:

Having given this a little thought, I am really not in the right state of mind for a game of Mafia right now. I submit most humbly myapologies for signing up - I thought it would take my mind away from RL issues, it hasn't.

It is hurting team too which isn't good play.

Ultama is keen to label me as town which is insightful since I am, however his reasons for doing so are suspect because I've been playing as I am deliberately to draw out opinions on what isn't good town play and expose biases. Oh and winding up those people who like good, coherent English grammar and punctuation (of which I am one I freely admit)

Those of you who think I'm scummy, this'll blow your mind.

Khell, please modkill me.

Sorry again folks.

Wow. I was seriously not expecting something like that.

I guess that makes things simpler for us, though kinda annoying to have such a big distraction from day 1 occupy us on day 2 and then be swept away like this.

[Fanderay]

Lock, on 24 October 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

I don't expect Fandy to come on and defend at all.

timezones. learn them.

idiot

[Fanderay]

Hanas, on 24 October 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

I am here for the next 90 minutes and can vote.

Basically:
Ultama is probably town for meta-reasons.
I like Ghennan so far.
I am patently unsure about Trake.
It might be very related to the last few hours, but Grasp seems very pushy to get a lynch almost to the point of skipping reasoning entirely.
I can't remember seeing much of Lock.
Cast, meh.
Fanderay: don't see a reason to lynch him. It is basically from rubbing people the wrong way and Ultama fall-out.
Jalan, wtf, 28 posts but can't remember a single one.

I really disliked MO and am sad we didn't get a CF there.

\
since when is "meta" a fucking excuse?