[Khellendros]

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 02:52 AM, said:

The Dude, on 30 April 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

4. Obdi/Ghennen volunteering to be silenced and Fener doing it. I wouldn't have won if this didn't happen. I was going to be lynched the next day, I had to talk my way out of it with the recruiter fake reveal. If I had been silenced, there is no way I could have weaseled my way out of a lynch that day and I would have been on to alt#2 with everyone knowing who I was and not enough defense to win.

This isn't true. By the time I volunteered to be silenced town was convinced that the serial killer was magically going to let them win the game. The idiotic 'if hes the SK, why isn't scum killing him' made me want to strangle puppies.

It wasn't "IF he's the SK, why isn't scum killing him?", but rather, "He IS the SK, why isn't scum killing him?". I sense that we can go round and round on this one till kingdom come

[Obdigore]

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 02:52 AM, said:

The Dude, on 30 April 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

4. Obdi/Ghennen volunteering to be silenced and Fener doing it. I wouldn't have won if this didn't happen. I was going to be lynched the next day, I had to talk my way out of it with the recruiter fake reveal. If I had been silenced, there is no way I could have weaseled my way out of a lynch that day and I would have been on to alt#2 with everyone knowing who I was and not enough defense to win.

This isn't true. By the time I volunteered to be silenced town was convinced that the serial killer was magically going to let them win the game. The idiotic 'if hes the SK, why isn't scum killing him' made me want to strangle puppies.

It wasn't "IF he's the SK, why isn't scum killing him?", but rather, "He IS the SK, why isn't scum killing him?". I sense that we can go round and round on this one till kingdom come

Either way, it is a retarded sentiment. Why do you think scum wouldn't have tried killing him numerous times?

[Khellendros]

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 03:29 AM, said:

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 02:52 AM, said:

The Dude, on 30 April 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

4. Obdi/Ghennen volunteering to be silenced and Fener doing it. I wouldn't have won if this didn't happen. I was going to be lynched the next day, I had to talk my way out of it with the recruiter fake reveal. If I had been silenced, there is no way I could have weaseled my way out of a lynch that day and I would have been on to alt#2 with everyone knowing who I was and not enough defense to win.

This isn't true. By the time I volunteered to be silenced town was convinced that the serial killer was magically going to let them win the game. The idiotic 'if hes the SK, why isn't scum killing him' made me want to strangle puppies.

It wasn't "IF he's the SK, why isn't scum killing him?", but rather, "He IS the SK, why isn't scum killing him?". I sense that we can go round and round on this one till kingdom come

Either way, it is a retarded sentiment. Why do you think scum wouldn't have tried killing him numerous times?

Is that a trick question? Scum basically tried all of one time to kill him and, when that didn't work, did nothing. Real good effort for individuals who were going apoplectic at his continued existence. Perhaps a closer read of the Sylar role PM and what it takes to shoot him down would have helped.

And round we go...

[Brujah]

The Dude, on 30 April 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

Great game by D'rek. Your organization was amazing and for the size of the game, for there to be this few mistakes... well major kudos to you!

I think if you ran this same game, with the same people, in the same roles 100 times, I would be hard pressed to win even 1-2 more times. So many things had to go right:


1. I was outed early and the reload happened. Saved my ass. Funny thing is I think he just wanted to get a lover convo going with me and didn't suspect serial killer... bad luck there.
2. Lio not revealing all my actions immediately.
3. Barghast (brujah) defending me on thread. I still don't know what that was all about. His single act of backing me on thread bought me at least 4-5 more days. Even had ppl convinced I wasn't the SK!
4. Obdi/Ghennen volunteering to be silenced and Fener doing it. I wouldn't have won if this didn't happen. I was going to be lynched the next day, I had to talk my way out of it with the recruiter fake reveal. If I had been silenced, there is no way I could have weaseled my way out of a lynch that day and I would have been on to alt#2 with everyone knowing who I was and not enough defense to win.
5. Kesso deciding to guard others. Though I still may have one if he kept guarding me, it would have been much much more unlikely.
6. I had an extra alt at the end to absorb DKT's 4th alt. I did not see that 4th alt coming.

I dunno. It was beyond obvious that you were the SK as soon as HDD outted you as Sylar. I figured defending you might make you not want to kill me. I also felt overwhelmed against scum. I misread of course, how strong they were. We'd already lynched and killed 3 or so scum that were initially town, so I figured recruiting was rampant.

Then we had Steve the Tyrant on the field against us, as well as The Dreadfather. Mostly, I didn't know for sure who anyone on my team was. It felt very bleak. I hoped that you would basically do exactly what you did - realize town, at least me and a few others, were willing to help keep you alive so you could take out the more powerful scum, and help make the end game you vs a few townies, who you had to realize were better to be up against at the end, than powerful scum. I didn't really think we would be able to kill you in the end, and didn't want to waste time trying to do so while town got picked to pieces. I figured losing to just you in the end was better than to an entire team of scum. Especially Goodkind. I'd hated it had they been the ones to beat us.

And finally, I figured we might still get lucky against you somehow. I realize this thinking was indeed as stupid as the entire SH bench told us in every other post, but at the time it felt right. I'm happy with the final results as much as I can as the losing team. We were able to get every last Goodkind and Meyern dead, even if it cost us our lives. So yeah, I'm quite pleased.

The only thing I'd add is that I never felt you were manipulating us or fooling us. At least me, anyway. I thought you realized we were pretty much taking our chances on you wiping out all the scum at our own expense, and settling for at least being the last faction standing. Anyway, hell of a game. You still had to make good decisions and play well, which you did. I wasn't sure if you were Trull, dkt, or Dude, but I didn't mind you winning. If it had been Khell or Tats I would have never even thought about it.

[Khellendros]

Karsa, on 01 May 2013 - 03:41 AM, said:

I didn't really think we would be able to kill you in the end, and didn't want to waste time trying to do so while town got picked to pieces. I figured losing to just you in the end was better than to an entire team of scum.

Boo! BOOO!! Fight to the bitter end, ESPECIALLY in a game like this where you never fucking know what's going on, or what could happen next. We had a goodish final chance to seize an advantage near the end, that no lynch because people weren't around/not paying attention was a travesty.

[Obdigore]

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 03:34 AM, said:

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 03:29 AM, said:

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 02:52 AM, said:

The Dude, on 30 April 2013 - 11:10 PM, said:

4. Obdi/Ghennen volunteering to be silenced and Fener doing it. I wouldn't have won if this didn't happen. I was going to be lynched the next day, I had to talk my way out of it with the recruiter fake reveal. If I had been silenced, there is no way I could have weaseled my way out of a lynch that day and I would have been on to alt#2 with everyone knowing who I was and not enough defense to win.

This isn't true. By the time I volunteered to be silenced town was convinced that the serial killer was magically going to let them win the game. The idiotic 'if hes the SK, why isn't scum killing him' made me want to strangle puppies.

It wasn't "IF he's the SK, why isn't scum killing him?", but rather, "He IS the SK, why isn't scum killing him?". I sense that we can go round and round on this one till kingdom come

Either way, it is a retarded sentiment. Why do you think scum wouldn't have tried killing him numerous times?

Is that a trick question? Scum basically tried all of one time to kill him and, when that didn't work, did nothing. Real good effort for individuals who were going apoplectic at his continued existence. Perhaps a closer read of the Sylar role PM and what it takes to shoot him down would have helped.

And round we go...

I tried to kill him I assumed Fener did but I had no idea of the other peoples powers. It was baffling to me that the idea that 'oh scum will kill SK' floated as long as it did, especially since it was apparent they either weren't or couldn't. And of course only the scum that were already outed on thread could say anything about him and fener was pretty low-posty all game.

I guess I just don't understand the whole 'nah, scum will kill the SK, or maybe he isn't really the SK' idea that was being floated around for days.

[Brujah]

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 03:48 AM, said:

Karsa, on 01 May 2013 - 03:41 AM, said:

I didn't really think we would be able to kill you in the end, and didn't want to waste time trying to do so while town got picked to pieces. I figured losing to just you in the end was better than to an entire team of scum.

Boo! BOOO!! Fight to the bitter end, ESPECIALLY in a game like this where you never fucking know what's going on, or what could happen next. We had a goodish final chance to seize an advantage near the end, that no lynch because people weren't around/not paying attention was a travesty.

I didn't say I gave up. I did what I thought best. You did the exact same thing. You were the one helping defend Tulas with me the hardest. You helped make the case. Hindsight is hindsight, but if we hadn't done what we did, I say our chances for losing to not only the SK, but to Goodkind as well.

I didn't say I didn't try in the end. I did what I could. I didn't have any useful actions for the most part. My first alt had nothing. My second had a one time use to stop NKs. And once I hit Korv I was healing town the entire time. I healed you, Galain quite a few times, and Eldat there at the end hoping he might get lucky.

And I was around for that no lynch that hurt us. I had my vote down. We needed dkt's. I figured he didn't vote on purpose as part of his strategy.

And yeah, we did have a shot there at the end. And saying so defends our action of giving some leeway to SK. Had we pulled it off, it would have been brilliant. I think the thing we did wrong at the end was to not stay banded together as town. You thinking I was Erikson and wanting to lynch an Erikson at all did hurt us, though. I think had we all realized that besides Okral, we were all Essels, we'd have had a much better chance. We were all too untrusting. I think at the point when we still had you, me, twelve, eddie, HD, and Trull, had we all known we were all on the same team, we might have done it.

Oh well. I think we did our best. I'm happy with the result, considering we lost. It was the best loss scenario in my opinion.

[Hentos Ilm]

oops... still in alt.

This post has been edited by Hentos Ilm: 01 May 2013 - 04:33 AM

[The Dude]

You know, for all the talk of me manipulating the thread, I don't think I did much of that. Sure, I did everything to my advantage, but I did it in a way that the people I was propositioning were always stuck between a rock and a hard place. I really can't fault the town for siding with me for those few days (obviously). It was a pick you poison situation. Hard to say that town would have been in any better situation if they would have killed me off and let Fener and Togg run the thread. I think town was basically boned at the point that it was a choice between the SK or 2 unlynchable scum. The only difference is right now we would be talking about how dumb town was for letting Fener and Togg run the thread when they were right out in the open.

In the end, even with letting me take out Togg, the town STILL had a shot up until they got apathetic.

This post has been edited by The Dude: 01 May 2013 - 04:35 AM

[Obdigore]

The Dude, on 01 May 2013 - 04:33 AM, said:

You know, for all the talk of me manipulating the thread, I don't think I did much of that. Sure, I did everything to my advantage, but I did it in a way that the people I was propositioning were always stuck between a rock and a hard place. I really can't fault the town for siding with me for those few days (obviously). It was a pick you poison situation. Hard to say that town would have been in any better situation if they would have killed me off and let Fener and Togg run the thread. I think town was basically boned at the point that it was a choice between the SK or 2 unlynchable scum.

The 'oh theres a recruiter thing' was hilarious. I like how you didn't even have to try to make a case to not get lynched because town rushed to your defense, even after you really didn't even defend against being a SK the first day or two after you were revealed as Sylar.

[Khellendros]

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 04:28 AM, said:

I tried to kill him I assumed Fener did but I had no idea of the other peoples powers. It was baffling to me that the idea that 'oh scum will kill SK' floated as long as it did, especially since it was apparent they either weren't or couldn't. And of course only the scum that were already outed on thread could say anything about him and fener was pretty low-posty all game.

I guess I just don't understand the whole 'nah, scum will kill the SK, or maybe he isn't really the SK' idea that was being floated around for days.

I can't speak for everyone, but for me personally it was a matter of the situation I felt town to be in at the time - which was not good. All I could see was powerful scum strutting over the thread and no way to take them down. And, indeed, until Tiam and then Tulas' 5-vig decimation of the scum teams, town were firmly in last place on the win-o-meter.

You are obviously correct that not lynching the SK didn't work out in the end, but it was worth a try in order to wean out the scum teams (not only in terms of killing them, but in actually identifying them - basically anyone who said "why aren't we lynching the SK?!" turned out to be scum ). Alas, best-laid plans and all that.

[Obdigore]

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 04:38 AM, said:

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 04:28 AM, said:

I tried to kill him I assumed Fener did but I had no idea of the other peoples powers. It was baffling to me that the idea that 'oh scum will kill SK' floated as long as it did, especially since it was apparent they either weren't or couldn't. And of course only the scum that were already outed on thread could say anything about him and fener was pretty low-posty all game.

I guess I just don't understand the whole 'nah, scum will kill the SK, or maybe he isn't really the SK' idea that was being floated around for days.

I can't speak for everyone, but for me personally it was a matter of the situation I felt town to be in at the time - which was not good. All I could see was powerful scum strutting over the thread and no way to take them down. And, indeed, until Tiam and then Tulas' 5-vig decimation of the scum teams, town were firmly in last place on the win-o-meter.

You are obviously correct that not lynching the SK didn't work out in the end, but it was worth a try in order to wean out the scum teams (not only in terms of killing them, but in actually identifying them - basically anyone who said "why aren't we lynching the SK?!" turned out to be scum ). Alas, best-laid plans and all that.

Hahaha. I still think that town (and scum) would have wanted to get him off that first alt, especially once it was revealed he absorbed the abilities of everyone he killed. If I understand what happened correctly, town was lucky that the mod puppet got recruited or I don't think the SK would have ever gotten off his first alt after he killed Togg and got sacrosanct.

[Khellendros]

Karsa, on 01 May 2013 - 04:30 AM, said:

And yeah, we did have a shot there at the end. And saying so defends our action of giving some leeway to SK. Had we pulled it off, it would have been brilliant. I think the thing we did wrong at the end was to not stay banded together as town. You thinking I was Erikson and wanting to lynch an Erikson at all did hurt us, though. I think had we all realized that besides Okral, we were all Essels, we'd have had a much better chance. We were all too untrusting. I think at the point when we still had you, me, twelve, eddie, HD, and Trull, had we all known we were all on the same team, we might have done it.

Yeah, I agree with this. One correction, though - Trull was a Goodkinder. He CFd as Essel because his meta-role was a symp. I explained several times in the game why he could not be a true Essel But I agree with the rest. My 'lynch an Erikson' thing was born from frustration, and I admit that was a mistake.

[Khellendros]

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 04:41 AM, said:

Hahaha. I still think that town (and scum) would have wanted to get him off that first alt, especially once it was revealed he absorbed the abilities of everyone he killed. If I understand what happened correctly, town was lucky that the mod puppet got recruited or I don't think the SK would have ever gotten off his first alt after he killed Togg and got sacrosanct.

Yeah, we totally lucked out (briefly) with the mod puppet. But that's the thing - anything could have happened to turn the tide again!

[Khellendros]

The Dude, on 01 May 2013 - 04:33 AM, said:

You know, for all the talk of me manipulating the thread, I don't think I did much of that. Sure, I did everything to my advantage, but I did it in a way that the people I was propositioning were always stuck between a rock and a hard place. I really can't fault the town for siding with me for those few days (obviously). It was a pick you poison situation. Hard to say that town would have been in any better situation if they would have killed me off and let Fener and Togg run the thread. I think town was basically boned at the point that it was a choice between the SK or 2 unlynchable scum. The only difference is right now we would be talking about how dumb town was for letting Fener and Togg run the thread when they were right out in the open.

In the end, even with letting me take out Togg, the town STILL had a shot up until they got apathetic.

Basically, wot he said.

[Obdigore]

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 04:45 AM, said:

The Dude, on 01 May 2013 - 04:33 AM, said:

You know, for all the talk of me manipulating the thread, I don't think I did much of that. Sure, I did everything to my advantage, but I did it in a way that the people I was propositioning were always stuck between a rock and a hard place. I really can't fault the town for siding with me for those few days (obviously). It was a pick you poison situation. Hard to say that town would have been in any better situation if they would have killed me off and let Fener and Togg run the thread. I think town was basically boned at the point that it was a choice between the SK or 2 unlynchable scum. The only difference is right now we would be talking about how dumb town was for letting Fener and Togg run the thread when they were right out in the open.

In the end, even with letting me take out Togg, the town STILL had a shot up until they got apathetic.

Basically, wot he said.

I kind of wish the teams were setup so it was a straight faction game and 'uber' roles were spread out between factions. I'm also grumpy I didn't get to use my suicide vig (THANKS MENTAL! )

[Brujah]

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 04:42 AM, said:

Karsa, on 01 May 2013 - 04:30 AM, said:

And yeah, we did have a shot there at the end. And saying so defends our action of giving some leeway to SK. Had we pulled it off, it would have been brilliant. I think the thing we did wrong at the end was to not stay banded together as town. You thinking I was Erikson and wanting to lynch an Erikson at all did hurt us, though. I think had we all realized that besides Okral, we were all Essels, we'd have had a much better chance. We were all too untrusting. I think at the point when we still had you, me, twelve, eddie, HD, and Trull, had we all known we were all on the same team, we might have done it.

Yeah, I agree with this. One correction, though - Trull was a Goodkinder. He CFd as Essel because his meta-role was a symp. I explained several times in the game why he could not be a true Essel But I agree with the rest. My 'lynch an Erikson' thing was born from frustration, and I admit that was a mistake.

Oh yeah, Trull was the hypnotist or whatever. Yeah, that was horrible luck for us getting stuck with him and being able to CF as town. But you called it as soon as he died and came yo town. It was just too late by that point for it to matter, anyway. We needed to have trusted each other, and kept twelve alive, but most important, we should have put more pressure on dkt to stay sided with us. We failed to keep him to our cause. His not voting there at the end hurt. I just wish we, as Essels,had had SOME bit of communication or something. None of us knew who was on our team or what they could do. I knew you and Galain were on my team pretty sure, and thought you were a dumbass for believing Dude for that list where he labeled all the town either erikson or essel. I knew dude was just bullshitting because he was wrong about half the list, but figured he was just doing his thing and just ignored it. I think he sucked you in with that, though. You just were willing to assume I was erikson there at the end for no real reason. If we knew at least a LITTLE about our team, it would have been better. I could have traded heals with twelve at least. I thought I did save your ass when I healed you. Not sure. I saved my own ass bouncing a heal off Galain back to me the night Sukul tried to kill me. Anyway, me and Khell were playing, I just wasn't posting a lot. Some of out allies got the apathy Dude mentioned.

A huge difference would have been not losing Silencer, Azath, and there was someone else to non activity.

[D'rek]

corv, on 30 April 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

Good game all. I assume the SK won (congrats Dude).

I would like to call attention to one thing (also recognizing that the mods particularly D'rek the game creator did a great job putting together an epic game):

My mod kill was justifiable. Mentioning twelve's name (however unintentional and unmalicious this action was) was a violation of the game rules and worthy of a mod-kill.

However, I would like to say that banning me from SH for the remainder of the game was over-the-top, essentially locking me out from enjoying the ensuing weeks of action.

I recognize (but do not respect) the mod's authority to doll out this punishment, but I ask the community to consider preventing such behavior in the future for the benefit of the players who make the games the mod's so wonderfully imagine and create possible.

I will not be playing any future games from this mod, however wonderful they may be.

I can understand where you are coming from, but when I'm modding I usually stick to the same thing - any modkill other than inactivity results in no SH access.

Yes, in this case it was a long game, and also in this case twelve probably didn't mind much. But on the other hand, it's still a direct violation of the rules and those are there for a reason. What if twelve was desperately trying to avoid being alted, and you posting his name results in someone else with a vig alting him and killing him? Then you've just gone and ruined the game for twelve.

In this case, that didn't happen. I could argue that you are lucky that it didn't. Either way, I don't want to start a precedent of being lenient on the rules because of what it could cause further down the line. So, IMO, no SH access for the remainder of the game was not over-the-top, it was just standard practice. Extra penalties added beyond standard practice for really bad violation of the rules would have been banning from any of my future games or that sort of thing, but I didn't think there was any reason to impose that sort of thing here.

[The Dude]

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 04:35 AM, said:

The Dude, on 01 May 2013 - 04:33 AM, said:

You know, for all the talk of me manipulating the thread, I don't think I did much of that. Sure, I did everything to my advantage, but I did it in a way that the people I was propositioning were always stuck between a rock and a hard place. I really can't fault the town for siding with me for those few days (obviously). It was a pick you poison situation. Hard to say that town would have been in any better situation if they would have killed me off and let Fener and Togg run the thread. I think town was basically boned at the point that it was a choice between the SK or 2 unlynchable scum.

The 'oh theres a recruiter thing' was hilarious. I like how you didn't even have to try to make a case to not get lynched because town rushed to your defense, even after you really didn't even defend against being a SK the first day or two after you were revealed as Sylar.

There was a grain of truth to what I was saying and a few town could verify that... it had to at least be considered.

[The Dude]

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 04:41 AM, said:

Khellendros, on 01 May 2013 - 04:38 AM, said:

Obdigore, on 01 May 2013 - 04:28 AM, said:

I tried to kill him I assumed Fener did but I had no idea of the other peoples powers. It was baffling to me that the idea that 'oh scum will kill SK' floated as long as it did, especially since it was apparent they either weren't or couldn't. And of course only the scum that were already outed on thread could say anything about him and fener was pretty low-posty all game.

I guess I just don't understand the whole 'nah, scum will kill the SK, or maybe he isn't really the SK' idea that was being floated around for days.

I can't speak for everyone, but for me personally it was a matter of the situation I felt town to be in at the time - which was not good. All I could see was powerful scum strutting over the thread and no way to take them down. And, indeed, until Tiam and then Tulas' 5-vig decimation of the scum teams, town were firmly in last place on the win-o-meter.

You are obviously correct that not lynching the SK didn't work out in the end, but it was worth a try in order to wean out the scum teams (not only in terms of killing them, but in actually identifying them - basically anyone who said "why aren't we lynching the SK?!" turned out to be scum ). Alas, best-laid plans and all that.

Hahaha. I still think that town (and scum) would have wanted to get him off that first alt, especially once it was revealed he absorbed the abilities of everyone he killed. If I understand what happened correctly, town was lucky that the mod puppet got recruited or I don't think the SK would have ever gotten off his first alt after he killed Togg and got sacrosanct.

This is true... After my first lynch I would have been in a world of hurt and willing to do most anything to avoid using my LP's