[Slow Ben]

Rewatching Andor season 1 and it’s still so fucking good.

The dialogue is top notch, subtext, a multi faceted story with compelling characters with depth, political intrigue.

It’s an interesting story that’s well told. Almost all post prequel Star Wars feels poorly/clunky made.

It’s easily the best Star wars we’ve had since the OT.

[Chance]

Slow Ben, on 23 April 2025 - 05:19 PM, said:

Rewatching Andor season 1 and it’s still so fucking good.

The dialogue is top notch, subtext, a multi faceted story with compelling characters with depth, political intrigue.

It’s an interesting story that’s well told. Almost all post prequel Star Wars feels poorly/clunky made.

It’s easily the best Star wars we’ve had since the OT.

I found it slow but also very good. Pretty sure Andor, Rogue One and Mando S1-2 are going down as the only good star wars from Disney, with some of the others being mediocre and some outright offensive.

Used to be more positive to some of the projects but there is very little rewatchability in Disney starwars.

Personal hope is that they simply chose to forget about the rey movies and do something interesting with that movie that is supposed to take place after the original trilogy but realistically any Star Wars movie without Luke, Leya and Han in the trailer is unlikely to make its money back at the boxoffice I think.

[QuickTidal]

Chance, on 23 April 2025 - 06:13 PM, said:

but realistically any Star Wars movie without Luke, Leya and Han in the trailer is unlikely to make its money back at the boxoffice I think.

I dunno, the Starfighter movie with Ryan Gosling they announced sounds pretty dope.

[Chance]

QuickTidal, on 23 April 2025 - 06:18 PM, said:

Chance, on 23 April 2025 - 06:13 PM, said:

but realistically any Star Wars movie without Luke, Leya and Han in the trailer is unlikely to make its money back at the boxoffice I think.

I dunno, the Starfighter movie with Ryan Gosling they announced sounds pretty dope.

My wild ass guess is that it will be very hard to motivate sufficient people to go see it, not that it can't be awesome.

Personally I think it's the most likely announced project to have a chance of being awesome with both the Mando movie and Rey movie having significant to overwhelming risks of being flops.

This post has been edited by Chance: 23 April 2025 - 06:35 PM

[Garak]

I'm loving the world building going. To me Star Wars stories (whatever the medium) are pieces to a giant puzzle I like to have fun with. I've got a file where I keep every story for my headcannon (a combo of EU and new Cannon stuff + some great fanfics by HandofThrawn45 that covers some unfinished stuff) in order and I have fun seeing how things connect, especially when it's unintentional stuff. I don't want Andor to give me a run and gun adventure, I got Rebels or a dozen other stories in this era for that, I want to see the slow stuff that goes into building the Rebellion and the Empire's mundane evil. The Ghorman Massacre has been one of those events often referenced but never shown. It's the trigger for Mon Mothma to abandon the Senate and trying ti change anything from within, it's the moment when she realizes what will be needed to take down the Empire and how evil it really is. So seeing the build up to this is both fascinating and frightening, how casual they talk about it. Plus seeing Deedra and Syril in a relantioship is just ... so bizarre. They are such awkward humans and yet it seems they cohabit well it's kinda endearing ... if they weren't damn fascists. Plus as I said world building gives me joy, seeing stuff like the Avenger, Chandrilan traditions, the repulsor transport that kinda looked like a WW2 half-track.

Regarding Rise of Skywalker. I did not enjoy that movie for two reasons. The first was the pacing that seemed like it had ADHD. Five minute talk scene, action scene, five minute talk scene, action - no scene was allowed to breathe, everything felt rushed (also the fanatical Hux as the traitor was just ... wat?... I get him trying to screw over or kill Kylo but this didn't feel like that). The second was JJ undoing what Ryan did (granted I didn't like what Ryan did or more specifically the way he did it, which seemed dismissive of the OT) because it all felt unprofessional. Reminded me of Traviss and Denning having a spat during the LotF series, sniping each other with every book as the series went on. Of course I still feel like the ST was done with no plan and no idea established on how it should go and they wasted characters (poor Finn) and plot lines.

Of course you can disagree with me on everything I said, I don't mind it, this is my opinion and the way I engage with SW.

[Slow Ben]

 Chance, on 23 April 2025 - 06:13 PM, said:

 Slow Ben, on 23 April 2025 - 05:19 PM, said:

Rewatching Andor season 1 and it’s still so fucking good.

The dialogue is top notch, subtext, a multi faceted story with compelling characters with depth, political intrigue.

It’s an interesting story that’s well told. Almost all post prequel Star Wars feels poorly/clunky made.

It’s easily the best Star wars we’ve had since the OT.

I found it slow but also very good. Pretty sure Andor, Rogue One and Mando S1-2 are going down as the only good star wars from Disney, with some of the others being mediocre and some outright offensive.

I’d definitely agree.


They’re also the only shows where they didn’t try to make a “good Star Wars show”, they were good shows that took place in the star wars universe. So I assume the stories had to be solid before being green lit. As opposed to “ let’s make an obi wan show!”

[Chance]

Slow Ben, on 23 April 2025 - 10:11 PM, said:

Chance, on 23 April 2025 - 06:13 PM, said:

I found it slow but also very good. Pretty sure Andor, Rogue One and Mando S1-2 are going down as the only good star wars from Disney, with some of the others being mediocre and some outright offensive.

I’d definitely agree.


They’re also the only shows where they didn’t try to make a “good Star Wars show”, they were good shows that took place in the star wars universe. So I assume the stories had to be solid before being green lit. As opposed to “ let’s make an obi wan show!”

Sounds right.

A lot of the marvel/disney stuff seems designed by committee with a vague idea to do something around favorite characters instead of being driven by telling a good story, which is an awful way to do art and entertainment. Basically I think most of the people at disney these days don't understand why Star Wars was successful or why the fans love it. If they did they would have filmed Heir of the Empire fairly faithfully (maybe reducing some of the weirdest parts) instead of the last trilogy and likely had a smash hit at least with the core audience.

This post has been edited by Chance: 24 April 2025 - 09:03 AM

[QuickTidal]

Garak, on 23 April 2025 - 06:55 PM, said:

Regarding Rise of Skywalker. I did not enjoy that movie for two reasons. The first was the pacing that seemed like it had ADHD.

I don't at all disagree with you, but I think this falls to JJ having to basically make Films 2 and 3 himself, and that's a LOT to handle in a single film. Whatever we want to say RJ didn't make a second film...the only plot point he left alive at the end was Rey VS Kylo REdux, every other element set up in TFA was abandoned. So JJ had to make up for it. It's not ideal but there was no way to do the 3rd movie otherwise....this is also coincidentally why Colin Trevorrow walked from the third film as well..he was FURIOUS that RJ did what he did, because his script (which you can read online) Duel of the Fates CANNOT work off the back of TLJ. RJ doing his own thing in the middle film fucked everyone.

These three should have had WEEKS of chats about what they were going to do and how it would all slot together before writing a single page of scripts. The fact that they didn't will baffle me forever. From what I understand JJ and Trevorrow were on page with one another, but I could be wrong.

Garak, on 23 April 2025 - 06:55 PM, said:

The second was JJ undoing what Ryan did (granted I didn't like what Ryan did or more specifically the way he did it, which seemed dismissive of the OT) because it all felt unprofessional. Reminded me of Traviss and Denning having a spat during the LotF series, sniping each other with every book as the series went on. Of course I still feel like the ST was done with no plan and no idea established on how it should go and they wasted characters (poor Finn) and plot lines.

100% agreed. The Sequel trilogy is the largest and stupidest clout fight between two auteur writer/directors in history. Both JJ and RJ wanted to make different trilogies. They never spoke much with one another. And when RJ cut most of JJ's plot strands to ribbons, JJ's reaction was to reject a bunch of RJ's plot strands...

I think the clearest indicator that these two were making wildly different projects in their minds was that the original ending of TFA had Luke in his Jedi Robes levitating boulders and meditating...and RJ found out and asked him to take Luke OUT of his Jedi robes and have him not using the force (since HIS version Luke had shut himself off from the force or whatever) to levitate himself or boulders...JJ agreed on the force stuff, but rejected taking him out of his robes...which is why RJ has Luke IMMEDIATELY and inexplicably change out of them at the beginning of TLJ...and concerning the earlier point this is why Rey is levitating boulders and herself meditating in TROS.

These two simply could not get on the same page.


What's worse is they had CAMPS within Lucasfilm who agreed and disagreed with each. Like Pablo Hidalgo (a man I vehemently dislike) who was head of the "story group" was super vocal on twitter about his hatred of TFA ...as it was being made and while it was out in theatres...he was Team RJ...for example. I can't think of much more unprofessional than shit-talking your companies movie while it's in theatres online to your massive following. But he did it.

Anyways, the whole thing was an remains a mess that I have to find joy in parts of...because as a whole it's not very good.

[the broken]

Y'know, I think the best Tv product is actually Skeleton Crew. No major flaws, simple and fun.

I think prequel hate basically poisoned the well. TFA as a movie hates the PT, and that set the tone for everything that followed, because it's hard to build anything good out of hatred. By the end, the Republic, the Jedi and the Resistance are destroyed, so whatever comes next has to build everything from scratch. Much too much time has been spent trying to break things made by prior creators, and as a result, nothing has been built.

[Garak]

I really don't get the PT hate. Like sure it has flaws but whatever. The PT, TCW and all the material in that era tell the story of a democracy slowly sliding into fascism and the following era shows how it solidifies it's hold on the galaxy. Which you know ... feels really damn scary considering real things happening right now in the world.

[the broken]

People always say 'it has flaws'. Sure, but so does everything else, so saying that doesn't really mean anything.

[Slow Ben]

 Garak, on 26 April 2025 - 09:38 AM, said:

I really don't get the PT hate. Like sure it has flaws but whatever. The PT, TCW and all the material in that era tell the story of a democracy slowly sliding into fascism and the following era shows how it solidifies it's hold on the galaxy. Which you know ... feels really damn scary considering real things happening right now in the world.

Agree. The pt has major flaws and some pretty poor casting choices. But it was fun, entertaining, and a good story. Plus some really, really great characters. I enjoyed the hell out of it at the time. Pretty sure I watched Attack of the Clones 9 times in the theater while I was in college.



Side note. Re-watching Andor in preparation for season 2 and it’s even better than I remember.

[Slow Ben]

And I'm still standing my ground and have yet to watch The Rise of Skywalker.

This post has been edited by Slow Ben: Today, 04:06 PM

[Chance]

Slow Ben, on 27 April 2025 - 12:02 AM, said:

And I’m still standing my ground and have yet to watch The Last Jedi.

A sound strategy...I wish I hadn't payed to see it or The Rise of Skywalker. The most rational stance on the last trilogy is that they are a weird fan-fiction universe of no particular importance to star wars in general.

This post has been edited by Chance: Yesterday, 02:45 PM

[Abyss]

Slow Ben, on 27 April 2025 - 12:01 AM, said:

Garak, on 26 April 2025 - 09:38 AM, said:

I really don't get the PT hate. Like sure it has flaws but whatever. The PT, TCW and all the material in that era tell the story of a democracy full of dumb people doing dumb things slowly sliding into fascism and the following era shows how it solidifies it's hold on the galaxy. Which you know ... feels really damn scary considering real things happening right now in the world.

e
Agree. The pt has major flaws and some pretty poor casting choices and bad acting and bad directing and dialogue so terribad that i wanted to stab myself in the ears while haring it just to make it stop. But it was fun, entertaining, and a good story somewhere in there in all the bad story. Plus some really, really great characters. I enjoyed the hell out of it at the time. Pretty sure I watched Attack of the Clones 9 times in the theater while I was in college and drunk and stoned and bored and procrastinating.

fixed.

There are action sequences in all three movies that are fun eye candy, but the scripts, the stories they actually tell... meh. SO MUCH MEH.

[Slow Ben]

 Abyss, on 28 April 2025 - 01:46 PM, said:

 Slow Ben, on 27 April 2025 - 12:01 AM, said:

 Garak, on 26 April 2025 - 09:38 AM, said:

I really don't get the PT hate. Like sure it has flaws but whatever. The PT, TCW and all the material in that era tell the story of a democracy full of dumb people doing dumb things slowly sliding into fascism and the following era shows how it solidifies it's hold on the galaxy. Which you know ... feels really damn scary considering real things happening right now in the world.

e
Agree. The pt has major flaws and some pretty poor casting choices and bad acting and bad directing and dialogue so terribad that i wanted to stab myself in the ears while haring it just to make it stop. But it was fun, entertaining, and a good story somewhere in there in all the bad story. Plus some really, really great characters. I enjoyed the hell out of it at the time. Pretty sure I watched Attack of the Clones 9 times in the theater while I was in college and drunk and stoned and bored and procrastinating.

fixed.

There are action sequences in all three movies that are fun eye candy, but the scripts, the stories they actually tell... meh. SO MUCH MEH.

Pretty accurate on all accounts.

Spent a lot of Thursday nights at the discount $2.50 theater with snuck in booze.