[Sorrit]

I'm still giving you the benefit of the doubt, because Kalse seemed to be unsure of a few game mechanics. So he could of just been crazy.

[Sorrit]

Tellan, on 31 July 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

Sorrit, on 31 July 2012 - 10:41 AM, said:

Tennes, on 31 July 2012 - 10:35 AM, said:

Sorrit are you the symp?

Are you guys retarded or something?

If he CFs finder WE WIN. GAME OVER. WE LYNCH SL AND KASCHAN NEXT TWO DAYS.

If he's fucking with us, we lynched another innocent. Then we have to kill Rashan and Tellan. May have only covered for one. Still don't know the other.

How is lynching Kalse Not Our best plan? We fucking win if he's finder.

Scum POSSIBLE 3, town 6 tomorow. We can easily kill SL and then Kaschan.

If he's lying and we kill an Inno, its scum 3 possibly, and town 6, but we still have to lynch Rashan and tellan.

And if there not BOTH scum, they fucked us.

Figure it out, dips.

Lynch Kalse.

I see where you're coming from, but in this game, the Coroner Find only includes faction, right? I don't remember seeing 'Roled Innocent' in any of the CFs so far. So there's no guarantee Kalse will CF as finder, he might just CF as town. And in that way, we couldn't tell if he was finder or symp.

This is why I'm voting SL.

BTW, I realize I was using CF wrong at times, but you knew what I meant. Also, I didn't know Finders EVER CFed as just town in a low TMDI game. I thought it was like a generic rule.

Anyway, why did you write out 'Roled Innocent'? I wondered about that.

[Sorrit]

We have about 10 hours, I think.
remove vote

[Liosan]

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

Liosan, if your first choice for atrahal doesn't happen, who is your pick for his partner? You said Telas?

I would be willing to put my vote on Telas, but it's more of a gut feeling case than anything concrete. I would also be willing to vote Rashan. But I would much prefer if we lynched Atrahal.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 5. 9 hours and 7 minutes remaining
7 Players still alive: Atrahal, Kaschan, Liosan, Rashan, Sorrit, Telas, Tellan

4 votes to lynch, 4 votes to go to night.

2 Votes for Atrahal ( Tellan, Liosan )

Players not voted: Atrahal, Kaschan, Rashan, Sorrit, Telas

[Tellan]

Okay, about 8 hours left. I know people are busy, but Kaschan's level of activity is disapointing.



Kaschan, PLEASE start from the beginning and read backwards. We didn't need your input on that old stuff nearly as much as we need it on the current cases. Clearly your time is limited, so no point in using it on the old stuff.

[Kaschan]

@ Tellan - ok, but I can't process in reverse, so if I ask stupid questions, deal with it.

[Kaschan]

Liosan, on 01 August 2012 - 05:38 PM, said:

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

Liosan, if your first choice for atrahal doesn't happen, who is your pick for his partner? You said Telas?

I would be willing to put my vote on Telas, but it's more of a gut feeling case than anything concrete. I would also be willing to vote Rashan. But I would much prefer if we lynched Atrahal.

I can go with this, same reason as stated before


and Sorrit, never seen anybody so all over the place before, making sense one minute and then not

[Sorrit]

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 04:24 PM, said:

Tellan, on 31 July 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

Sorrit, on 31 July 2012 - 10:41 AM, said:

Tennes, on 31 July 2012 - 10:35 AM, said:

Sorrit are you the symp?

Are you guys retarded or something?

If he CFs finder WE WIN. GAME OVER. WE LYNCH SL AND KASCHAN NEXT TWO DAYS.

If he's fucking with us, we lynched another innocent. Then we have to kill Rashan and Tellan. May have only covered for one. Still don't know the other.

How is lynching Kalse Not Our best plan? We fucking win if he's finder.

Scum POSSIBLE 3, town 6 tomorow. We can easily kill SL and then Kaschan.

If he's lying and we kill an Inno, its scum 3 possibly, and town 6, but we still have to lynch Rashan and tellan.

And if there not BOTH scum, they fucked us.

Figure it out, dips.

Lynch Kalse.

I see where you're coming from, but in this game, the Coroner Find only includes faction, right? I don't remember seeing 'Roled Innocent' in any of the CFs so far. So there's no guarantee Kalse will CF as finder, he might just CF as town. And in that way, we couldn't tell if he was finder or symp.

This is why I'm voting SL.

BTW, I realize I was using CF wrong at times, but you knew what I meant. Also, I didn't know Finders EVER CFed as just town in a low TMDI game. I thought it was like a generic rule.

Anyway, why did you write out 'Roled Innocent'? I wondered about that.

Nevermind, Liosan answers for me. I didn't know if you were saying Finders show up as Finders only when town show up as town and Roled Innocent. I never paid attention, I guess.

Liosan, on 01 August 2012 - 02:48 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 01 August 2012 - 07:06 AM, said:

Liosan, on 01 August 2012 - 12:45 AM, said:

I put a solid few hours of each day into this except for last Friday when I got slammed at work. It's a shame that I'm not able to be around when everyone else is all the time, but that's the way it is when you have a job and friends! That being said, I'm not one to sit here and vomit out everything that comes to mind. I make a case, and refute when I can, and move on when I'm convinced. I try to put only useful information on thread, make my accusations, and not create pages and pages of useless garble like some other unnamed princesses.

That all being said, I don't really believe that Atrahal ever made any great effort to defend himself from me... This is what he said:

Quote

In terms of what Lio is saying against me, I find it laughable that he can say he is happy to add to a lynch train to get a lynch, but finds me suspicious for doing the same. If I was switching my vote around a lot I could understand his suspicion, but I haven't been doing that at all.

He's right, he hasn't been switching his vote around a lot, but he didn't at all respond to the real case I made, which was that he spent most of Day 2 making random cases (against two confirmed innos if I am not mistaken) and all around just throwing suspicion around until he can safely throw a vote at Tellan again (because Eloth brought him back up).

I spent that day making cases in an attempt to get some conversation going. It did serve some purpose, I came to the conclusion that Eloth was an innocent newbie. No one was interested in either of the cases I made, and in the end I voted along with everyone else to get the lynch.

Quote

And then Day 3 he throws out comments like...

Quote

You're an idiot. What if PS isn't including roles in the CF? Then that leaves us no wiser as to where the scum is hiding.

..which just seems like deliberately misunderstanding how these games are played as a standard to muddy up people's choices and thoughts. A finder CFs Finder in every M&P game I've ever played... and....

How many games have you actually played? I've only played a few, but in ONLY ONE has the finder CF-ed as such, and that was commented on as unusual during the game. It was a valid point, as Sorrit's entire play was based on the fact that we would know whether Kalse was inno or not when lynched, which certainly wasn't the case.

Quote

Quote

I said nothing at all about lynching Kalse. In fact, I think this play is much more likely to be the work of a symp than scum, in which case there is no point at all in lynching him. We'd be better to look at who he was trying to protect.

Quote

Who said anything about lynching Kaschan? And we don't have to lynch the symp, just scum. It's not D-day yet, and your fatalistic attitude and insults are not going to help anyone.

...which is pretty much dumb as far as I am concerned. If we are sure someone is the symp, why leave them around? It automatically gives us an extra day before D Day, and once it's as obvious as it was that Kalse was the symp, why would they do anything to symp and possibly have their killers caught? They'd just be around creating havoc onthread that wouldn't help anyone who is town.

I maintain that lynching Kalse was a bad move. It was a waste of a lynch, it gave us no further information on who the killers were, it gave the killers another night to reduce our numbers and we lost the opportunity to lynch a killer. I can see the reasoning behind the choice to lynch Kalse and I would have voted for him if it was necessary for the lynch, but I don't agree with the lynch of a symp.

Quote

Anyway, I believe that Atrahal is one of the scum, but I am afraid to vote him just yet for fear that he's not and the 2 scum hammer. So I'll hold off for now, but unless something more compelling comes up, that's where my vote's going. If Atrahal CFs scum, I'm going to give you all a great big fuck you for not listening to me 2-3 days ago. If not, well, I won't.

I think you are blinded by the certainty of your case. You have barely even considered any other options, and this blinkering is dangerous. I'm not convinced you are scum so I'm not voting for you yet, but you're on my list of liklies.

I've played a few. Point is, finder usually CFs as finder, even if the RIs don't CF as RI. You can maintain what you want, I maintain you're continuing to try to throw us off your trail, so there's that. And I'm not blinded by the certainty of my case, I have taken the time to analyze other cases, and given my opinion on all the remaining people. I think you're scum, and your partner is probably Telas. I'm more confident that you're scum then Telas, so my vote goes to you. You've done nothing to convince me I shouldn't vote you.

vote Atrahal

[Sorrit]

Kaschan, on 01 August 2012 - 08:48 PM, said:

Liosan, on 01 August 2012 - 05:38 PM, said:

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

Liosan, if your first choice for atrahal doesn't happen, who is your pick for his partner? You said Telas?

I would be willing to put my vote on Telas, but it's more of a gut feeling case than anything concrete. I would also be willing to vote Rashan. But I would much prefer if we lynched Atrahal.

I can go with this, same reason as stated before


and Sorrit, never seen anybody so all over the place before, making sense one minute and then not

It's what I do best. Still have to say it's better than rarely being here. In my short mafia career, I've never seen someone so absent. Don't you think we could of really used you here when Kalse said he was the finder, and that he found you and SL scum? Had you been here, we may have avoided having to kill SL to prove he was lying. Maybe. Are you voting Atrahal, then?

[Kaschan]

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

Kaschan, on 01 August 2012 - 02:36 PM, said:

Kalse, on 31 July 2012 - 12:53 PM, said:

kaschan is scum!! hes a killer, my main thoughts now are on the 2nd killer

Tellan, on 31 July 2012 - 10:30 AM, said:

I say we lynch SL, as I believe this may be a play by Kalse to clear him. I find him the more suspicious of the pair anyway.

remove vote

Vote Sheltatha Lore

I think tellan is the other killer. and he used this post to switch from the killer to the symp
no find to back this up however as i expect to die tonight I thought i point it out while i still can

Since I believe Kalse was a symp, then this pointing at Tellan makes me feel less slightly suspicious of him.

I'm not leaning any direction just yet. Just saying that he could have been symping for Tellan. So he accuses Tellan of switching the Lynch, then finds him innocent with his fake finder powers. Could of been his plan all along. We won't know. If Tellan is scum, though, it could easily incriminate you as well Kaschan. I tend to believe your town based on Kalse's fake finds. Still, we can't rule out anything, yet.

I'm not removing my vote until you give us more.

Tellan, my BIGGEST worry, is that if you're town, and we were about to Lynch you, wth would make Kalse pull his finder routine? It makes zero sense. He could of just waited for one more town death, and done it. And had he done this, waited for you to be lynched ASSUMING you're Inno, it takes another day off towns chances, yet left enough to test his reveal. He jumped the gun for a reason.

this sounds like you're trying to use WIFOM to the 3rd degree, very confusing

[Tellan]

We all think WIFOM. That's human nature. Sorrit types what he thinks. It's why his posts are so hard to read.

[Sorrit]

I'll gladly try to clarify if someone just points it out to me. I'm not trying to make them hard to read.

[Sorrit]

Are you going to lay a vote Kaschan, or still waiting?

[Tellan]

He's got a little under 7 hours, hopefully he'll make a decision by then.

[Sorrit]

Kaschan, on 01 August 2012 - 09:00 PM, said:

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

Kaschan, on 01 August 2012 - 02:36 PM, said:

Kalse, on 31 July 2012 - 12:53 PM, said:

kaschan is scum!! hes a killer, my main thoughts now are on the 2nd killer

Tellan, on 31 July 2012 - 10:30 AM, said:

I say we lynch SL, as I believe this may be a play by Kalse to clear him. I find him the more suspicious of the pair anyway.

remove vote

Vote Sheltatha Lore

I think tellan is the other killer. and he used this post to switch from the killer to the symp
no find to back this up however as i expect to die tonight I thought i point it out while i still can

Since I believe Kalse was a symp, then this pointing at Tellan makes me feel less slightly suspicious of him.

I'm not leaning any direction just yet. Just saying that he could have been symping for Tellan. So he accuses Tellan of switching the Lynch, then finds him innocent with his fake finder powers. Could of been his plan all along. We won't know. If Tellan is scum, though, it could easily incriminate you as well Kaschan. I tend to believe your town based on Kalse's fake finds. Still, we can't rule out anything, yet.

I'm not removing my vote until you give us more.

Tellan, my BIGGEST worry, is that if you're town, and we were about to Lynch you, wth would make Kalse pull his finder routine? It makes zero sense. He could of just waited for one more town death, and done it. And had he done this, waited for you to be lynched ASSUMING you're Inno, it takes another day off towns chances, yet left enough to test his reveal. He jumped the gun for a reason.

this sounds like you're trying to use WIFOM to the 3rd degree, very confusing

Anytime we try to guess someone's intentions for an action, WIFOM exists. What I think is a little bit interesting about Kalse's intentions is this:

Kalse saying he'd find on me.

Kalse, on 31 July 2012 - 10:53 AM, said:

Tennes, on 31 July 2012 - 10:50 AM, said:

when we get shelly's cf we'll know if kalse is lying.

exactly

I dont expect to survive tonight but im defo finding on sorrit if I do

Yet chose to clear Tellan, instead. He knew I was town already, because he knew everyone's faction. The symp knows he's the symp, knows the scum, therefore knows the town by default. WIFOM time? Ok. He could of fake claimed me scum, instead of claiming Tellan town. Maybe he finally figured no one would believe him. I'm still wondering why the hell SL, who CFed town, and was called scum by a fake finder, when he knew Kalse was lying about him, didn't vote Kalse. Seems like he would of wanted us to know Kalse was lying, yet didn't help town by not voting him. I wish Kaschan and SL would have showed up just a bit sooner. Oh well. I'm not really stating a case, or much that is actually important, it was just something I remembered him saying about me, and didn't(fake) do. He again,(fake) clears Tellan well after it's obvious we know he's the symp. So was he trying to push a Tellan lynch with that clear? If so then he could of just voted Tellan, put him at L-2, and let him get lynched, and saved his entire finder routine for the next day. I don't like that he didn't jist put Tellan at L-2 if Tellan is town. It would have been a Lynch for sure. I just don't like the entire reveal at all on so many levels.

[Sorrit]

The only thing defending Tellan from all this, imo, is the possibility that Kalse was just wrong about his timeline, or mechanics, or something. He was the one who said we didn't get two NKs on night 1 becuase one of the killers targets had a Bp, or was guarded.

[Kaschan]

Sorrit, on 01 August 2012 - 09:20 PM, said:

Are you going to lay a vote Kaschan, or still waiting?

still busy, still need to read a few pages - I will vote later

[Telas]

I'm back.

So Sorrit, Liosan--why am I suddenly your 3rd option for scum again? Waiting for more than "he's reasonable," because i seriously hope that we aren't lynching people for good town play now.


Kaschan, it has been something like 12 hours since you returned and said you were catching up. Good god you are slow. If tomorrow weren't d-day I'd want to push a lynch on you or rashan for being so utterly useless to town, so people (both town and scum) start to realize this kind of coasting is unacceptable.

[Telas]

In fact, I'll put my vote where my mouth is.

Vote Kaschan

Let's see some fucking content.