[Atrahal]

Omtose, on 17 April 2012 - 09:36 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 17 April 2012 - 09:29 PM, said:

Merrid, on 17 April 2012 - 09:26 PM, said:

Let me see if I got all this straight. Based on what he said, Atrahal thinks Alkend is a mystery faction allied with HoA. I'm connected with him somehow because some people speculate I'm HoA because of my "stress" merchant reveal?

The argument seemed to revolve around whether Alkend's words were slip-ups or misunderstood. Am I summarizing this right?

OH NOES A SUMMARY!!!*







*except I'm doing it for myself to see if I've got this all straight, I couldn't care less if it's helpful for anyone else

No. Your summary is wrong. Everyone agrees that Alkend made innocuous, normal mistakes when reading the scene. Mistakes that everyone would have made. This is generally accepted. He then went on and speculated about "mystery roles", who they were aligned with, how many there were, and whether or not they were temporary. It is this speculation combined with his obvious but not condemning lack of knowledge of the facts of the scene that make him suspicious.

See, this is where the words 'mountain' and 'molehill' spring to mind. You believe Alkend just made innocous mistakes and YET YOU STILL try and use that to strengthen your case. Dude, you don't need to, your case based solely on his speculation of 'mystery roles' was fine by itself, but the way you try and crowbar other things in just makes me think that you know more about Alkend than the rest of us. Or you're being obtuse.

Obtuse is a nice word, I agree. The point about his "innocuous mistakes" are twofold:

1) At this point in the game, no one had made any analysis of the scenes or made any connections about the characters mentioned in them. Before I discovered this information, he hadn't made any "mistakes" at all. So this was new information and he was the first person to make these "mistakes" by speculating about them on thread.

2) Without the mistakes, his speculation isn't as damning. For instance, he assumed the Dreadfather was a "mystery role" and a number of other things about his alliance with the Thieves. Without that innocuous assumption, there is less reason to suspect Alkend as the OTHER "mystery role". If he hadn't commented on that scene and tried to be helpful and discuss mystery factions, there would be no case.

This is all just groundwork. No one's arguing about how easy it would be NOT to recognize that the Dreadfather is a member of the Cult of Vultures. So why is it even a big deal? Why are you still talking about it? Isn't all of this obvious?

Or are you just being obtuse?

[Path-Shaper]

On the third night, I called Adnan into my presence again, trying to see if polite conversation would bring forth more on the Thieves Guild. The man proved tight lipped once more, and food nor fruit nor wine nor sweets nor music nor gentle administrations and perfume baths with the ladies of my harem could bring forth a response, apart from a discussion on the need for an all-female harem for a female ruler. It is one of the endless sources of gossip about my sexual preferences, and while I occassionally do dip into that treasury of lush curves and soft flesh for a moment of solace, it is more or less a trophy cabinet and a strongroom of potential hostages.

Many of the desert tribes haven't yet dealt with the fact that their Khalif is a woman, and so they rather treat me as a man, sending their daughters for my bed and to help me sire my bastard sons and a stable of daughters to be traded back. In a way, it is rather amusing, although, at the height of inter tribal warfare several decades back, I had to add an entire wing to the palace, so eager were the various factions to please me with their most beautiful offspring and exotic bed slaves. There are only so many ways in which one can employ a lady of proper breeding without insulting her family, and I've already had to break up knife fights between the daughters of Khanate notables over who presided over my stable, or quell the feuding by poison that is the favorite way to settle issues of city-born ladies.

Adnan proved a popular diversion for several of my ladies. I let them have their fun, and I bet being tied to a bed post with silk scarves was less of a punishment to him than the iron bands securing his hands and throat to a cold, damp stone wall in my dungeons, anyway.

The city had been relatively quiet that night, usually a sign of business going well for the Beggar's Guild.

It is now day 4. No-one died.


t is Day 4. 31 hours and 59 minutes remaining

12 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Atrahal, Barghast, Galayn Lord, Kessobahn, Korabas, Korlat, Merrid, Okaros, Omtose, Tiamatha

7 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.


Players not voted: Alkend, Anthras, Atrahal, Barghast, Galayn Lord, Kessobahn, Korabas, Korlat, Merrid, Okaros, Omtose, Tiamatha

IT IS NOW DAWN.
1. PLEASE CONSUME WATER FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR RETAINERS (OR PAYING NON-WATER MAINTENANCE COSTS)
2. PLEASE ADD ALL SURROUNDING AND WELL PRODUCTION TO YOUR STORAGE
3. MAKE SURE NONE OF YOUR GOODS ARE STILL ON THE DAY 3 MARKET.
4. START DAY 4 AND UPDATE YOUR STORAGE WITH A SEPERATE POST.

[Atrahal]

Merrid, on 17 April 2012 - 09:34 PM, said:

@Atrahal

But you believe I'm HoA?

I don't know, honestly, but there isn't any evidence to the contrary and no one (including yourself) has denied it. That's all I can really think to say about it. There's a good chance it's true, but I just don't know for sure.

[Omtose]

Atrahal, on 17 April 2012 - 10:12 PM, said:

Omtose, on 17 April 2012 - 09:36 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 17 April 2012 - 09:29 PM, said:

Merrid, on 17 April 2012 - 09:26 PM, said:

Let me see if I got all this straight. Based on what he said, Atrahal thinks Alkend is a mystery faction allied with HoA. I'm connected with him somehow because some people speculate I'm HoA because of my "stress" merchant reveal?

The argument seemed to revolve around whether Alkend's words were slip-ups or misunderstood. Am I summarizing this right?

OH NOES A SUMMARY!!!*







*except I'm doing it for myself to see if I've got this all straight, I couldn't care less if it's helpful for anyone else

No. Your summary is wrong. Everyone agrees that Alkend made innocuous, normal mistakes when reading the scene. Mistakes that everyone would have made. This is generally accepted. He then went on and speculated about "mystery roles", who they were aligned with, how many there were, and whether or not they were temporary. It is this speculation combined with his obvious but not condemning lack of knowledge of the facts of the scene that make him suspicious.

See, this is where the words 'mountain' and 'molehill' spring to mind. You believe Alkend just made innocous mistakes and YET YOU STILL try and use that to strengthen your case. Dude, you don't need to, your case based solely on his speculation of 'mystery roles' was fine by itself, but the way you try and crowbar other things in just makes me think that you know more about Alkend than the rest of us. Or you're being obtuse.

Obtuse is a nice word, I agree. The point about his "innocuous mistakes" are twofold:

1) At this point in the game, no one had made any analysis of the scenes or made any connections about the characters mentioned in them. Before I discovered this information, he hadn't made any "mistakes" at all. So this was new information and he was the first person to make these "mistakes" by speculating about them on thread.

2) Without the mistakes, his speculation isn't as damning. For instance, he assumed the Dreadfather was a "mystery role" and a number of other things about his alliance with the Thieves. Without that innocuous assumption, there is less reason to suspect Alkend as the OTHER "mystery role". If he hadn't commented on that scene and tried to be helpful and discuss mystery factions, there would be no case.

This is all just groundwork. No one's arguing about how easy it would be NOT to recognize that the Dreadfather is a member of the Cult of Vultures. So why is it even a big deal? Why are you still talking about it? Isn't all of this obvious?

Or are you just being obtuse?

"It's not a big deal, but it makes him suspicious, but it's not a big deal."

I see.

Or maybe I don't. Perhaps I am being obtuse, or dumb, or maybe I just don't don't really understand the links. Perhaps it's because you haven't linked them. You've merely said that it is so. That is, you say 'without the mistakes, his speculation isn't as damning.' But why? And why does it make it more damning? Really you're only repeating that it does. And at one point you say they are innocous mistakes, and at another you write them as 'mistakes', suggesting they're no such thing. So which is it? See, the reason people (not just me) keep returning to it is, I believe, because people don't really understand fully your reasoning.

I think that what you may be trying to say is that Alkend struck you as fixated on the mystery roles, and thus you're operating under the 'he who smelt it, dealt it' rule.

Which I would agree is groundwork, yes. So build on it

[Path-Shaper]

Early in the morning, when I'm pouring my first cup of tea in a translucently thin cup of porcelain, inlaid with a shura wishing death to my enemies - a rather weird inscription to go with breakfast, if I may remark, but then, it was a gift of the House of Iron - I am approached by Huassan ibn Qolat. He wishes me health with an honesty that nearly convinces me that I am in fact in need of such a thing, and then makes a more than generous donation to my coffers, begging just the trifle of being named Master of the Caravans.

And what can I do but acquiesce? It seems that unless certain individuals in the Cult and the Beggar's Guild work miracles (or, with an eye on the sky and Dalum's one eyed face), wreak havoc, victory seems within the grasp of the House of Agreements.

Huassan ibn Qolat is now Carmandari-Bashi (Chief of the Caravans – Courtly Title)

(this game is going quite a bit faster than I thought it would - as well as being more one sided than I expected).

[Barghast]

Shit we need to get HoA lynched ASAP

[Atrahal]

When I say "mistakes", it's because no one considered them to be wrong until we (well, I) found out that the Dreadfather is a Cult member. No one posted between him and then my case, but then again, no one had looked at the details of the OP either.... So they weren't "mistakes" until someone went back and actually checked on the facts. Up until then it was just idle speculation; could be right, could be wrong. But after I investigated, we now knew for certain that some of what he said is wrong. That's an important distinction. And he was the first to misinterpret the scene.

My point was never that "Wow, it would have been SO HARD not to pick up on all of this detailed and scattered information." It was, "Now that we know there was all this detail out there, how does that recontextualize Alkend's speculation about mystery roles?" And it my eyes, it made him likely to be one of those mystery roles. It's a simple case. There is not much to it. If no one had picked up on the faction distinctions, we wouldn't be having this discussion because Alkend wouldn't be under suspicion. That's why the "innocent mistakes" matter.

[Atrahal]

Path-Shaper, on 17 April 2012 - 10:30 PM, said:

Early in the morning, when I'm pouring my first cup of tea in a translucently thin cup of porcelain, inlaid with a shura wishing death to my enemies - a rather weird inscription to go with breakfast, if I may remark, but then, it was a gift of the House of Iron - I am approached by Huassan ibn Qolat. He wishes me health with an honesty that nearly convinces me that I am in fact in need of such a thing, and then makes a more than generous donation to my coffers, begging just the trifle of being named Master of the Caravans.

And what can I do but acquiesce? It seems that unless certain individuals in the Cult and the Beggar's Guild work miracles (or, with an eye on the sky and Dalum's one eyed face), wreak havoc, victory seems within the grasp of the House of Agreements.

Huassan ibn Qolat is now Carmandari-Bashi (Chief of the Caravans – Courtly Title)

(this game is going quite a bit faster than I thought it would - as well as being more one sided than I expected).

I bet if we just chill and let the day timeout again things will be just fine, amirite?

[Path-Shaper]

Early in the morning, a bruised, battered, bloody and beaten figure stumbles out of an ally. His clothing torn, his eyes bleeding red tears, his ears pierced by needles and his body full of what looks like whipmarks that crackle with magical energy, he tries to build speed and run. A coil of deep purple magic curls itself around his leg from a nearby shadow, and yanks him into the dark, dark alley again. "Not so fast," a cold and crazed voice whispers.

Hassan the Dreadfather has found prey.

[Omtose]

Where the shit is everyone getting all this money from?

Well, looks like the Dreadfather's lost patience

[Path-Shaper]

And with that, I am off.
Apologies to people who aren't in my timezone, I know you guys are badly off with regard to P-S service.
Note for full game: get a co-mod

Lady Bliss is going to copy and paste a couple of PMs from thread to SH, with which I am horribly behind, so you'll see P-S around but may not get answers.
Thanks to Lady Bliss, and have a good night

[Barghast]

Well, I guess we now know the Dreadfather is actually a role...

[Omtose]

Barghast, on 17 April 2012 - 10:56 PM, said:

Well, I guess we now know the Dreadfather is actually a role...

[Atrahal]

[Barghast]

I meant in this game...

[Omtose]

Yeah, I know what you meant. You still deserve those smileys.

[Barghast]

And now my info is up there... Damn finders...

[Barghast]

And someone already bought it. Hey! Hey you! What makes me so interesting, huh?

[Barghast]

Was it you, Korabas? I know you were suspicious of me. Maybe you're the finder, and want others to know my alignment? Your slightly unnatural responses to Atrahal were suspicious as well. IGMEOY

[Omtose]

Barghast, on 17 April 2012 - 11:24 PM, said:

Was it you, Korabas? I know you were suspicious of me. Maybe you're the finder, and want others to know my alignment? Your slightly unnatural responses to Atrahal were suspicious as well. IGMEOY

Guess it's not Korabas as his info is now up.


Ok - this brings us down to Alkend, Anthras, Tiamatha, and Kessobahn as the bastards selling information on others, correct? I'm willing to lynch any of these

Edit: Galayn Lord and Okaros, too.

This post has been edited by Omtose: 17 April 2012 - 11:45 PM