[Malankazooie]

Biden's mental fitness has kind of put some worry in me of late. He's had a string of gaffes and verbal foibles that I think now could be, with some examination, viewed as more then just "folksy grandpa taking in his old timey way". It's going to come up if he goes forward to face Trump.

[amphibian]

Sanders did dozens of events to campaign for Hillary for weeks and did a great deal to assist her directly after he ended the primary run. The narrative of him not supporting Hillary after she clinched the nomination is a pure fiction.

The Mook led team turned down a lot of help - most famously ending up in the "the model is right, don't campaign in Michigan or Wisconsin" strategies that were discussed for months after the campaign. Part of the turn downs was turning down more help from Sanders and his campaign that was offered.

I have watched carefully for Sanders' actions and he's shown up consistently for women up and down ticket and tried to get progressive candidates funded and elected. He's been far more polite than Hillary about what happened in 2016 and up to present day.

I think Warren and Sanders are by far the best candidates in the Democratic field and I lean Sanders. I do not think Warren should drop out at this point, nor would her delegates put Sanders over the top right now (especially with Bootyjeg and Klob endorsing Biden). She's still got significant support and funding, but I don't know how long that will last with her stumbles in messaging (backing away from Medicare for All, having the spat with Bernie, and getting away from her connection to the discontent that many experience). If she doesn't surge back to the front, I'd like to see her endorse Sanders.

Gabbard is a loon with Hindu right wing ties (of importance to me, the liberal Hindu New Yorker) and a ton of Republican lite positions. She appears to be a poor politician with a nice superficial image. Zero chance or influence beyond her seat and I bet she'll lose that fairly soon.

I've seen smart people say that a big chunk of the Biden votes have been those older people trying to get back to the "normalcy" of the Obama days, even while recognizing that Biden is not in good shape personally. Sanders may be too wrapped up in the mindsets influenced by "Communism is bad" propaganda from the Cold War for them to choose in a primary - even though that's dumb on its face.

The Let Dairy Die thing is a group that protests a bunch of campaign events by basically everyone to try and get eyeballs on them. California has a lot of dairy farms that are struggling, so it's a delicate time. The corrupt asshole Devin Nunes comes from a Portuguese dairy farming family that used to be in California and now is in Iowa, even if he himself stayed in California. It's big business in that region and the ravenous need of the industry nationwide for illegal immigrants to work on their farms for cheap (while abusing them and keeping wages low) is an open secret.

[Malankazooie]

Gabbard is building cachet for when she pivots to being a full time contributor on Fox News. She''ll do well with the victim card devotees of conservative media, and make beaucoup $ with her message"the democratic party rejected me" sob story, paired with Sean Hannity welcoming her to the no spin zone / here is where you belong launch of her Fox News career.

[Tiste Simeon]

Malankazooie, on 04 March 2020 - 09:09 PM, said:

Gabbard is building cachet for when she pivots to being a full time contributor on Fox News. She''ll do well with the victim card devotees of conservative media, and make beaucoup $ with her message"the democratic party rejected me" sob story, paired with Sean Hannity welcoming her to the no spin zone / here is where you belong launch of her Fox News career.

And certain people will absolutely eat it up...

[Mentalist]

If it comes down to Trump v. Biden, Biden'll lose because he's the "swamp" that needs to be "drained"

if it's Bernie v Trump, it's still a coin toss, but the coin's gonna be weighed more against Bernie than it would've been 4 years ago.

I guess we'll know in about a month what kinds of contingency plans we should be thinking of.

[amphibian]

I need to say that Gabbard's positions were or are further left than Biden or Bloomberg. Her vote in the impeachment is still a goddamn embarrassment that shouldn't be forgotten for a long while.

[Morgoth]

Aptorian, on 04 March 2020 - 06:58 PM, said:

Morgoth, on 04 March 2020 - 03:32 PM, said:

Aptorian, on 04 March 2020 - 02:05 PM, said:

Of the political positions I've heard of, I'd definitely put Sanders in the far left category in Denmark.

I find that hard to believe. Universal healthcare, free college education available for all, those are pretty mainstream by Danish standards I think? They certainly are here in Norway. Even our market liberalism party supports free higher education. His plans for strengthening unions will not come close to what protections we have for unions here in Norway, and though I'd have assumed it was the same in Denmark I guess I don't know that. The immigration stuff is hardly particularly liberal by the standards of western Europe, though I know Danish immigration laws are quite harsh. Immigration is a tricky question anyway, our two most anti-immigration parties for example are socialists and on the far right respectively. Different reasons but same result. In that same vein, I don't know anything about Danish environmental policy, but Bernie's Green New Deal doesn't seem all that radical to me, and again, environmentalism isn't as easy as a pure left/right issue either.

What policies does Sanders stand for that makes you think he'd be on the far left in Denmark?

It's not that Denmark as a whole isn't left leaning compared to the USA but rather that there's differences about how the various parties want to go about financing and structuring the social support structure.

The Danish model, which I'm sure is similar to Sweden and Norway, is that you support a strong private sector, so that it can help finance the public sector. As the "Demographic pull" (The elderly, immigrants, sick people) strains social security, the parties are hesitant to push strong socialist ideas. Meaning I'd place Bernie firmly in the range of our most left leaning party, Enhedslisten.

What strong socialist ideas is Bernie pushing? You keep saying he'd be on your far left, but I haven't seen any example of policies he stands for that you think would put him there. I am genuinely curious because nothing on his website would place him on the far left in Norway, or even center left for most of it. Some of his suggestions fits with our labour party, but most is on the right side, distributed between several parties there.

[Aptorian]

I guess taking a different perspective, in terms of messaging, rather than values. It's not so much that his ideas aren't commonly accepted politically, left to center. It's more that you won't hear our current left wing government say anything like that, because they're really shy about saying anything they have to actually stand by. Only people you'll actually hear raging at the industry, the rich people, the lack of funding for social projects is the far left. Rest of the politicians have a muzzle on them because god forbid they say something a spin doctor hasn't fed them.

[Slow Ben]

I’m sad I don’t get to vote for Elizabeth Warren.

She would make an amazing President.

[Malankazooie]

I wonder if she'll be on a short list for VP candidate?

[Abyss]

Malankazooie, on 05 March 2020 - 08:13 PM, said:

I wonder if she'll be on a short list for VP candidate?

Wholly unsubstantiated buzz wants to see her as Senate leader where she might actually accomplish something.

[Malankazooie]

That would be great and ideal, but I don't see enough seats being won by democrats. I would love it if I am wrong.

[Malankazooie]

So Joe and Bernie. I don't think Trump has a bullying nickname for them (or does he?). I believe I've heard him call Bernie "crazy" and a communist, and Joe I think he has repurposed his 'low energy' slight that he used on Jeb Bush, but I think he needs to step it up now. You guys think Trump will come with the hot sauce and think of a new nickname for the one who challenges him?

This post has been edited by Malankazooie: 05 March 2020 - 11:13 PM

[Cause]

I believe its sleep joe

Bernie wont be hard. Comrade Bernie perhaps

[Mentalist]

So what does "campaign suspended" actually mean?

[Abyss]

Malankazooie, on 05 March 2020 - 11:13 PM, said:

So Joe and Bernie. I don't think Trump has a bullying nickname for them (or does he?). I believe I've heard him call Bernie "crazy" and a communist, and Joe I think he has repurposed his 'low energy' slight that he used on Jeb Bush, but I think he needs to step it up now. You guys think Trump will come with the hot sauce and think of a new nickname for the one who challenges him?

My impression is that Trump, and his Russian backers who do not in fact exist except for all the Russian backing, are tacitly supporting or just not actively attacking Bernie because Trump thinks he can beat him and the Russians think he's so divisive to the Dems that Trump will beat him because a significant chunk of voters will either not vote for him or not vote for Biden if he doesn't get the nom... either outcome is win win for Comrade Trump and co.

[Obdigore]

Abyss, on 06 March 2020 - 03:40 PM, said:

Malankazooie, on 05 March 2020 - 11:13 PM, said:

So Joe and Bernie. I don't think Trump has a bullying nickname for them (or does he?). I believe I've heard him call Bernie "crazy" and a communist, and Joe I think he has repurposed his 'low energy' slight that he used on Jeb Bush, but I think he needs to step it up now. You guys think Trump will come with the hot sauce and think of a new nickname for the one who challenges him?

My impression is that Trump, and his Russian backers who do not in fact exist except for all the Russian backing, are tacitly supporting or just not actively attacking Bernie because Trump thinks he can beat him and the Russians think he's so divisive to the Dems that Trump will beat him because a significant chunk of voters will either not vote for him or not vote for Biden if he doesn't get the nom... either outcome is win win for Comrade Trump and co.

Lets be honest, any Russian backing Trump has isn't because they like Trump, or want him to succeed and have a healthy and wholesome life. It's because its a detriment to the US and people, not just Russia, are doing everything they can to sow dissent in the US.

Those same backers were revealed to be posting pro-Sanders stuff, because they are trying to fuel what divides exist. The solution is citizens being able to understand this sort of thing, and see through such attempts. The younger generations (mostly) have this ability, the older generations do not, and this is honestly why you see so much bullshit spread around on facebook.

[Vengeance]

Slow Ben, on 05 March 2020 - 07:57 PM, said:

I’m sad I don’t get to vote for Elizabeth Warren.

She would make an amazing President.

She is still on our Ballet here in IL. I am still going to vote for her. Because fuck them that's why.

[amphibian]

Vengeance, on 06 March 2020 - 06:29 PM, said:

Slow Ben, on 05 March 2020 - 07:57 PM, said:

I’m sad I don’t get to vote for Elizabeth Warren.

She would make an amazing President.

She is still on our Ballet here in IL. I am still going to vote for her. Because fuck them that's why.

You have a functional opportunity to decide between Biden and Sanders as which primary candidate you prefer, while a write-in vote for a candidate who has suspended her campaign (two weeks before you vote) is a meaningless gesture.

I get that she was your first pick and that the system is kind of fucked up, but the write in for her isn't a decision that advances her cause, your cause, or what I'd consider the better future of the country.

[Terez]

It's not write-in. She's on the ballot. (And I voted early for her in IL. No regrets.)

This post has been edited by Terez: 06 March 2020 - 08:21 PM