[Cyphon]

Thoughts? Opinions? Theories?

[Jade-Green Pig-Hog Swine-Beast]

Got me some great new carpet!






No, not really.

[Coco with marshmallows]

been watching the news fairly avidly.

it never fails to surprise me how quick people are to shit in their own backyard.

And of course, if the police do respond with any measure of force, given the amount of young kids involved in the trouble, its a fair bet that a kid would be hurt.

And one injured kid and the police would be crucified - I guarantee the parents would be screaming that their baby wasn't doing anything wrong.

The police can't win in that respect.

[Dolorous Menhir]

Why, this is violence!

[worry]

I haven't seen any coverage of this, can anyone sum up what's going on?

[Puck]

I agree with Coco there, tbh. Watching the news I was actually more concerned with the police, because no matter what started the whole thing they'll get blamed in the end.

Also, I just don't get the need to set one's own neighborhood aflame. From the distance it doesn't seem like people are trying to make a political statement either, seems more like opportunistic rioting and this kind of thing makes me angry.

[polishgenius]

 Robin Goodfellow, on 08 August 2011 - 10:02 PM, said:

From the distance it doesn't seem like people are trying to make a political statement either, seems more like opportunistic rioting and this kind of thing makes me angry.

This. It's just a bunch of scumbags taking the opportunity to kick off and steal stuff. Coz how does setting local businesses on fire and stealing all their stuff send any kind of message to the police that isn't "we're all c**ts, come and beat us down"?

Animals.

[Thelomen Toblerone]

Was in Hackney Saturday night and got caught through Tottenham on the way back, just saw a shit load of fires and hurried on. Sunday it came to my area (my road was on the news with a car being set on fire and exploding, interesting), and now it's just spread across the whole of London - my girlfriend is stuck in Camden, everyone's locked in for their own safety as when they started to leave there were loads of bricks being lobbed. Fuck knows if she'll get out in time to catch the last train, and what she'll do otherwise. There are just shitloads of kids running around smashing everything up and setting fire to things, houses have been torched in Croydon apparently and there's looting everywhere. The news is only reporting one or two places, but just from people I know texting me alone there is fighting and looting in Whitechapel, Mile End, Camden, Stokey, bits of Tottenham again, the Harringey part of Green Lanes, some parts of Enfield, Croydon, Clapham, Ealing, Peckham, New Cross, Kentish Town, Hackney, and Notting Hill. Fucking madness.

It all started with a legitimate grievance - a guy got shot, police claimed he fired first. Then turned out it was a police bullet that hit the copper, and they guy's gun was in a sock and he never had it to fire a shot. The family led a peaceful protest when, after a couple days, they'd been given no information, and a teenage girl started arguing with a policeman. She got shoved, everyone overreacted, and it kicked on from there and people have decided it's a perfect excuse to cause havoc.

This post has been edited by Thelomen Toblerone: 08 August 2011 - 10:27 PM

[Ulrik]

Heh, I must say, that this time, because of puppy, I cant search internet for news (and Czech, as usually, totally sucks)...so I have a question(s). Is it from parts of city, that are "immigrant area" (as many xenophobic idiots already whispers in one sentence with "Breivik was right"), or is it rather social cause, without relevance to skin colour, religion, penis size...?

Thanks for info, you´ll spare me free time for...anything else:)

[Cyphon]

Birmingham, Leeds and Manchester have some riots too.

[Thelomen Toblerone]

I am increasingly despising twitter. There's something quite upsetting about seeing several messages saying the building your gf is trapped inside has just been burnt down. Thank fuck it was just some prick lying, but jesus fucking christ.

[worry]

 Thelomen Toblerone, on 08 August 2011 - 10:21 PM, said:

It all started with a legitimate grievance - a guy got shot, police claimed he fired first. Then turned out it was a police bullet that hit the copper, and they guy's gun was in a sock and he never had it to fire a shot. The family led a peaceful protest when, after a couple days, they'd been given no information, and a teenage girl started arguing with a policeman. She got shoved, everyone overreacted, and it kicked on from there and people have decided it's a perfect excuse to cause havoc.

The crazy thing is how the two sides in these events never realize what mirror images of each other they are. There's always a protect-our-own attitude on both sides, a refusal to keep the worst elements of either side in check. Cops don't want to "snitch" on each other cuz, what, they're a team? A brotherhood? Corruption becomes rampant when self-regulation breaks down, and it seems with police this might be a bigger problem than most any other profession. And the other side, legit anger or not, is always full of middling tagalongs...they don't start the violence, but when it happens they are plenty happy to oblige. And I can't overstate how ruinous the "no snitching" ideology is to otherwise decent causes, and especially to student-aged morons. It's no different than the corruption in the police, even if it's more disparate by nature.

[Jonny]

Rioting has begun in Liverpool, I've heard it's in the Toxteth area at the mo' but there are fears it could spread.

This video shows what the police are up against:

http://imageshack.us...eos/32/tdu.mp4/

[polishgenius]

Real talk in Hackney. Brave lady, hats off to her.

[Anomander Rake]

It's totally crazy, it's just Chavs running amok, looting left right and centre. The problem the police have is that its yobs all over london, and not just one area.

On News they're saying people's houses are getting broken into, they were interviewing one old lady who woke up and there was a man with hood standing in her bedroom, they ran off when they saw she had woken, but she was terrified.

Shops, homes are on fire.

There only other city confirmed to have had copy cat riot has been Birmingham, at least the police there has managed to arrest plenty of people unlike London. A police station in Birmingham is on fire too though.

It seems Turks and Asian's have started to protect their shops and areas, seen reports of Turks driving rioters away from there shops/areas (http://twitpic.com/635ffl) , and some 400 asian youths chasing about 150 rioters from there area.

The Police really do need to start arresting the rioters, rather than forming a line, allowing buildings to be looted and set on fire, and then allowing Rioters to move to other areas.

This post has been edited by Anomander Rake: 09 August 2011 - 12:16 AM

[Ulrik]

Well, average czech person already translated riots this way: "its fall of multiculturalism...its not good old England...immigrants will destroy us..."

[Tsundoku]

That lady in Hackney is totally right.

The authorities need to send a very strong message. Strap cameras to Police helmets etc, then announce a "Shoot to kill" order for those caught committing violent acts or looting. If the camera evidence backs up the police story, good. If the camera doesn't back up the police, prosecute as you would any other act of unnecessary police violence. Send in the army if necessary.

And fuck those who say "fire on our own people, that's just wrong!" Because these people by their actions have clearly demonstrated they are not "y/our" people, they are pieces of shit that should have their rights to be treated as humans removed. Permanently.

Identify all those posting pics of themselves committing crimes and prosecute with maximum sentences, no parole, no "touchy-feely" nice treatment. Bread and water, solitary confinement and labour until they drop.

I am sick and tired of the scum of this world being treated well, to the detriment of the rest of the law-abiding community. It's high time we treated scum as scum. I don't give a flying fuck how hard an upbringing you have had, in the first world you clearly have a choice as to how you are going to behave, and those who make the wrong choices should be dealt with accordingly. Also, fuck constant rehabilitation, it doesn't work, prison is for punishment and deterrence. Those who do their time, get out and lead productive lives - good for you. Those who reoffend - 2 bullets to the back of the head.

Sometimes I think Lucius Accius Telephus had it right with "Oderint Dum Metuant" (let them hate, so long as they fear). The mob needs to learn fear.

Cue accusations of totalitarianism.

This post has been edited by Sombra: 09 August 2011 - 07:25 AM

[Isa]

Rehabilitation may not work wonders on reapeat offenders but neither does prison. The majority of youths engaging in criminal activities/exhibiting deviant behavior in their teens/early 20s will not become criminals as adults. Isn't it worth more to try and nudge them back into society while it's possible than to label them as criminals and deal with their shit until they are in their 60s?
I agree it's important to put a stop to this but with so many individuals involved I don't believe locking them all away is the answer... even if it's tempting when one suspects the majority is just in on it to have a good time and get free stuff.

Either way, I feel for all those living in the middle of this and I hope you stay safe. I'm going down to London on monday, hopefully things will have quieted down by then but right now it seems more likely it'll escalate further...

[Gothos]

This shit looks like it could get bad if serious measures are not taken quickly. The army should clear the streets - do a sweep and round up everyone they find out in the street, beat them till they drop, let those truncheons get used, and throw their asses on trucks and carry the limp unconscious fuckers to some isolation camp until peace is restored.

[worry]

Uhhhhh...Sombra, that doesn't make any sense. If the police enact a "shoot to kill" policy, they would themselves be breaking the law using violence, and would by that logic be deserving of instant execution without trial by their peers, and the domino effect wouldn't leave very many police to do their other job (law enforcement). And if you're grouping people into "law-abiding" and "scum" then I fear your venn diagram is only going to have one circle, and it ain't gonna be the nicer one. I'd wager this very message board, made up of people who presumably have steady internet access, would be depopulated more or less entirely. Unless you're suggesting this should just be a special occasion? In which case, you're just kind of into selectively slaughtering people at your whim (Not judging! Don't kill me! ).

This post has been edited by worrywort: 09 August 2011 - 08:36 AM