[WhiskeyJackDaniels]

AnomanderRakeSoD, on 19 November 2011 - 01:30 PM, said:

After reading the forums, I'd say, most people support the view that Rake planned things to happen as they happened. There is just far too much evidence to suggest otherwise. I can understand the intent behind fanboy theories, but the conclusions are usually suspect. It's generally a reshaping of the way things are presented to suit their own views.

Cheers

Spoiler

Ok, wasn't a fanboy theory, I like Rake just as much as Traveler. And I don't think we have any evidence that Dassem's vengeance has been quenched by that event. Just because he was emotionally broken for a couple hours doesn't mean he's gonna stop that quest that has dominated his life for years. And my theory said that everything Rake wanted to happen still happened, he had to just make one minor adjustment on the fly, namely having Traveler help him with sacrificing himself instead of doing it himself once the time was right. And I don't really see how my theory is contrary to how we've seen Rake act throughout the books. The only difference being he got into a fight he couldn't actually win, and then had to think on the fly.

[Silk]

And the above is the point I was trying to make.... remove the fanboy element and look back at a series where even the most powerful of people have lost to those deemed to be below them.... and take the comment from Traveller to Rake that he was never the enemy and Rakes slight surprise at that comment could easily mean he had underestimated Traveller and as was said above he may have slightly changed his original plan.... unless we were given the internal POV of both characters during the battle (instead of having it described via Karsa etc) we will never really know what the actual truth was.... cause if Rake had been killed by vengance then all plans would have failed...

[Whiskey Bass]

talking about fanboys. am i correct in thinking that Dassem activly encouraged his own worship/cult while he was 1st Sword of the Empire?

[Siergiej]

He was idolised and loved , but as a leader and warrior, not as a deity. So there was no religious worship, I suppose.

This post has been edited by Siergiej: 11 December 2011 - 08:18 PM

[worry]

Well, given his association with Hood, I wouldn't be surprised if before the loss of his daughter he suffered most from Pride and wasn't necessarily beyond flexing his ego. Not mega-maniacally or anything, but to an extent in reflection of his talent. I'm sure he led by example and all that, and was a charismatic leader, but all that is to say he was a different man before we meet him.

[peaked in highschool osserc]

My top 3 is

1. Dassem
2. The Traveller
3. Dessembrae

[MassiveG]

I'm halfway through HoC but based on Karsa so far - he can take 50 or so humans or 10 Toblakai, but to put things in perspective - Tool can move quick enough to make mincemeat of a very quick Kell Hunter, and Mok made mincemeat of Tool, as well as moving through entire armies of the Pannion, so I think:
1. Icarium
2. Seguleh 1st
3. Seguleh 2nd
4. Mok
Given Rake only good enough to be Seguleh 7/8 then there's a bunch of Seguleh above him. And since Tool is a quick as lightning undead badass you would have to say he would be better than any "mortals" like Dassem and certainly Bridgeburners and even Gruntle

This post has been edited by MassiveG: 16 April 2016 - 04:55 PM

[Andorion]

MassiveG, on 16 April 2016 - 04:53 PM, said:

I'm halfway through HoC but based on Karsa so far - he can take 50 or so humans or 10 Toblakai, but to put things in perspective - Tool can move quick enough to make mincemeat of a very quick Kell Hunter, and Mok made mincemeat of Tool, as well as moving through entire armies of the Pannion, so I think:
1. Icarium
2. Seguleh 1st
3. Seguleh 2nd
4. Mok
Given Rake only good enough to be Seguleh 7/8 then there's a bunch of Seguleh above him. And since Tool is a quick as lightning undead badass you would have to say he would be better than any "mortals" like Dassem and certainly Bridgeburners and even Gruntle

You want to make two lists - one on combat skill, one on magical prowess. The only reason Rake came 7th was he did not call upon his magic.

[Planck]

Andorion, on 16 April 2016 - 05:09 PM, said:

MassiveG, on 16 April 2016 - 04:53 PM, said:

I'm halfway through HoC but based on Karsa so far - he can take 50 or so humans or 10 Toblakai, but to put things in perspective - Tool can move quick enough to make mincemeat of a very quick Kell Hunter, and Mok made mincemeat of Tool, as well as moving through entire armies of the Pannion, so I think:
1. Icarium
2. Seguleh 1st
3. Seguleh 2nd
4. Mok
Given Rake only good enough to be Seguleh 7/8 then there's a bunch of Seguleh above him. And since Tool is a quick as lightning undead badass you would have to say he would be better than any "mortals" like Dassem and certainly Bridgeburners and even Gruntle

You want to make two lists - one on combat skill, one on magical prowess. The only reason Rake came 7th was he did not call upon his magic.

I thought Rake stopped at 7th because he just chose to stop, not because he couldn't continue.

[The Hust Legion]

It was quoted that he just got too damn tiredness something like he went into his warren cause he was so tired. I think he just tried to make it to the top in a very very short amount of time. Just challenging one seguleh after the other. Don't think it fully reflects his prowess as a swordsman as very very few people would actually want to cross blades with him....although not sure if they're scared of dragnipur or rake

[Andorion]

The Hust Legion, on 03 May 2016 - 10:09 AM, said:

It was quoted that he just got too damn tiredness something like he went into his warren cause he was so tired. I think he just tried to make it to the top in a very very short amount of time. Just challenging one seguleh after the other. Don't think it fully reflects his prowess as a swordsman as very very few people would actually want to cross blades with him....although not sure if they're scared of dragnipur or rake

And I bet Rake held Dragnipur back. Dragnipur unleashed is a deadly force by itself. Like in TtH where the chains are unleashed in Darujhistan

[The Hust Legion]

Andorion, on 03 May 2016 - 10:14 AM, said:

The Hust Legion, on 03 May 2016 - 10:09 AM, said:

It was quoted that he just got too damn tiredness something like he went into his warren cause he was so tired. I think he just tried to make it to the top in a very very short amount of time. Just challenging one seguleh after the other. Don't think it fully reflects his prowess as a swordsman as very very few people would actually want to cross blades with him....although not sure if they're scared of dragnipur or rake

And I bet Rake held Dragnipur back. Dragnipur unleashed is a deadly force by itself. Like in TtH where the chains are unleashed in Darujhistan

makes me wonder who in the malazan world could actually go toe to toe with him individually, i mean if rake didnt hold back at all magic,swordmanship,dragnipur personally id say maybe hood, draconus , gothos are the only 3 who could probably manage it. i mean i doubt theyd be able to kill him without dying themselves #rakeOP

[Andorion]

The Hust Legion, on 03 May 2016 - 12:36 PM, said:

Andorion, on 03 May 2016 - 10:14 AM, said:

The Hust Legion, on 03 May 2016 - 10:09 AM, said:

It was quoted that he just got too damn tiredness something like he went into his warren cause he was so tired. I think he just tried to make it to the top in a very very short amount of time. Just challenging one seguleh after the other. Don't think it fully reflects his prowess as a swordsman as very very few people would actually want to cross blades with him....although not sure if they're scared of dragnipur or rake

And I bet Rake held Dragnipur back. Dragnipur unleashed is a deadly force by itself. Like in TtH where the chains are unleashed in Darujhistan

makes me wonder who in the malazan world could actually go toe to toe with him individually, i mean if rake didnt hold back at all magic,swordmanship,dragnipur personally id say maybe hood, draconus , gothos are the only 3 who could probably manage it. i mean i doubt theyd be able to kill him without dying themselves #rakeOP

Well there is Brood.... that hammer unleashed is pretty destructive on its own.