[Rhand]

I actually never pictured Renly to be so gay, but ah well, it's not like I'll have to put up with that for long.

Liked the episode very much, but the two-handed swordbattle between the Cleganes looked a little clumsy and slow to me. And Tyrion's prison, so eerie!

Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

[worry]

I didn't see anything particularly feminine in that scene, thought obviously when they are alone together they let their guards down to be more tender with each other. I'm definitely glad they aren't trying to drop it till next season. It's not even till book 3 when Jaime finally mentions it (on his return to King's Landing, when talking to him about Brienne's loyalty), but the POV-less nature of the show means it has to be closer to the surface. So it was a really nice touch that Renly is sitting so close to Sansa, which explains why he approaches her with the red rose. So while the show can't have its inner monologues, they've found other ways to weave in detail.

One other scene I think was improved in the episode was the one where Arya is telling Ned what she heard. In the book, he is much more dismissive of her story, which seemed somewhat out of character given the precariousness of the Hand position. But in the show he's skeptical, but she has enough detail to pique his interest, but then they're interrupted and the subject gets dropped by necessity.

[worry]

Rhand, on 16 May 2011 - 08:55 AM, said:

I actually never pictured Renly to be so gay, but ah well, it's not like I'll have to put up with that for long.

Liked the episode very much, but the two-handed swordbattle between the Cleganes looked a little clumsy and slow to me. And Tyrion's prison, so eerie!

Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

I dunno exactly what you mean by that first sentence, but "put up with that" is kind of a jacked thing to say.

The guy with Illyrio is Varys in something of a disguise. In the episode it comes off too quickly after he's with Ned, so there doesn't seem to be enough time, but Littlefinger directly mentions it's him when they confront each other, so it's actually later in the day. In the book it's also pretty subtle, as Arya just catches a glimpse of a fat Tyroshi and another fat dude talking...she doesn't recognize Varys, but she thinks of him as a wizard for some reason I forget.

[Rhand]

worrywort, on 16 May 2011 - 09:42 AM, said:

Rhand, on 16 May 2011 - 08:55 AM, said:

I actually never pictured Renly to be so gay, but ah well, it's not like I'll have to put up with that for long.

Liked the episode very much, but the two-handed swordbattle between the Cleganes looked a little clumsy and slow to me. And Tyrion's prison, so eerie!

Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

I dunno exactly what you mean by that first sentence, but "put up with that" is kind of a jacked thing to say.

Might have been a poor choice of words, I admit, but I'm the kind of guy that copes rather badly with huge differences between the portrayal of books in televised media and my imagination when reading said books. This difference is so big that I'm afraid I'll be seeing the chest-shaving scene in my head every time I read about Renly. Hence my "I wont have to put up with that for long" because, well, we all know what happens to Renly.

[FrederickvanIvanhoe]

Damn good episode if you ask me! I'd rank this episode maybe just below the best Deadwood or BoB episodes but not much below and only below the very best of those series.

[Ceda Cicero]

worrywort, on 16 May 2011 - 09:37 AM, said:

I didn't see anything particularly feminine in that scene, thought obviously when they are alone together they let their guards down to be more tender with each other. I'm definitely glad they aren't trying to drop it till next season. It's not even till book 3 when Jaime finally mentions it (on his return to King's Landing, when talking to him about Brienne's loyalty), but the POV-less nature of the show means it has to be closer to the surface. So it was a really nice touch that Renly is sitting so close to Sansa, which explains why he approaches her with the red rose. So while the show can't have its inner monologues, they've found other ways to weave in detail.

One other scene I think was improved in the episode was the one where Arya is telling Ned what she heard. In the book, he is much more dismissive of her story, which seemed somewhat out of character given the precariousness of the Hand position. But in the show he's skeptical, but she has enough detail to pique his interest, but then they're interrupted and the subject gets dropped by necessity.

Just to clarify, for my part, I suppose it was less the scene that I thought was too feminine and more just the actor playing Ser Loras, upon further reflection. My visualization may have been off on him - I realize he's young, slender, and more than a touch effeminate in the books. But for all that I always pictured him as much, much more masculine. The actor taking him on has a bit of a creepy Twilight/True Blood vibe, IMO.

[Tapper]

Still have to watch it and therefore don't know how he moves and acts, but the pics I googled show him as less of a pretty boy and more of a young guy then I had expected. Also, that is an armor that is so shiny it is ridiculous.

[Cobbles]

Rhand, on 16 May 2011 - 08:55 AM, said:

Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

I watched it on HD. You could see very clearly that it was Varys.

Btw. my wife doesn't like it anymore. She said they overdid the violence. Too gory. Dagger in the eye, throat slit, spear through body. But what really turned her off was the horse. She already complained last week about the dead knight (whose body was sewn up this time).

The episode did shine with the dialogues. Cersei and Robert. Loras and Renly, Varys and Littlefinger, Ned and Jamie. No need to include that much gory detail. And as someone else said, I thought the Hound/Mountain duel looked clumsy and slow. Even the Ned Jamie duel wasn't really great. They swung much too hard (for not having any metal armor) and left themselves open too much too often.

This post has been edited by Cobbles: 16 May 2011 - 12:54 PM

[Ceda Cicero]

Cobbles, on 16 May 2011 - 12:53 PM, said:

Rhand, on 16 May 2011 - 08:55 AM, said:

Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

I watched it on HD. You could see very clearly that it was Varys.

Btw. my wife doesn't like it anymore. She said they overdid the violence. Too gory. Dagger in the eye, throat slit, spear through body. But what really turned her off was the horse. She already complained last week about the dead knight (whose body was sewn up this time).

The episode did shine with the dialogues. Cersei and Robert. Loras and Renly, Varys and Littlefinger, Ned and Jamie. No need to include that much gory detail. And as someone else said, I thought the Hound/Mountain duel looked clumsy and slow. Even the Ned Jamie duel wasn't really great. They swung much too hard (for not having any metal armor) and left themselves open too much too often.

You should change your name from "Cobbles" to "Quibbles."

[Captain Beardface]

The fiancé handled the killing the horse better than the killing of Lady in ep2. She hasn't said much about the gore as I've finally gotten through that it's not a touchy feely type story. She really likes that the characters are human, I think she's well and truly hooked.

[Garak]

The amount of blood is ok. I've seen what overdone looks like (Blood Rayne movie by He who shall not be named ... shudder) and this is not overdone. Also GREGOR killing his horse wasn't pointless (can't remember if he kills it in the book but he probably does) because it defines his character - GREGOR kills and beats the living shit out people for the hell of it, he is a brute that wouldn't look out of place in a Chaos Warband.

[Abyss]

Episode 5 brought the stabby, oh, how it brought the stabby!!!

Excellent ep. Really brought things up a notch right across the board and nicely so.

THE AERIE

Tyrion causing Cat to doubt her actions was nicely done.

The hill tribe attack was fairly random, but well played. Tyrion rushing in to save Cat was absolutely perfect on many levels (i'm a little in awe of how beautifully Peter Dinklage played that scene.

And we got our Bronn, and how. Even his byplay with Tyrion was well handled.

The exterior or the Aerie didn't quite line up with my mental image from the books - i could have sworn it was built into a cliff face as opposed to free standing. That said, the inside was perfect, the cell even more so.

Lysa and Robin were just as distrubing as i expected them to be, and less irritating than in the book.


WINTERFELL

I liked Bran's short scenes, and the show is doing a nice job of building up Theon's treachery. Not that it wasn't well developped in the book, but in the book he's basicallys an oportunist who sees an opening and jumps at it. Here we're seeing a longer running reason for his eventual betrayal.


KING'S LANDING

Oh, we got our money's worth this time...

The Hound vs the Mountain was exactly what massive mess in heavy armour trying to hit each other with big sharp peices of iron should look like. Equal parts awkward and nasty. The Hound's actions were a bit out of nowehere but that was actually a nice touch to add a level to the character. Joffrey's look of enjoyment was also well done. And i particularly liked how Sandor ducked Gregor's last strike and went right into a bow when Robert finally told them to quit fucking about.

Robert and Ned's clash over what to do about Dany was nicely done, especially when the Small Counsel naturally sides with Robert.

Varys stood out here and in every scene he was in... that actor is really nailing this part, at every step from his meeting with Ned to his stroll with Illyrio, you BELIEVE he's a spider.

Ned realizing they were in danger but needing to finish looking into Arryn's death was nicely played by Bean. You could practically feel the audience shouting 'Just leave! Just frikking GO!'

Cercei's meeting with Robert was beautifully played by both actors. Cercei in particular when you know she's trying to decide between reconciling with Robert or having him killed.

Renly and Lorus... well... THAT wasn't in the book, that's for sure.... tho it actually makes Renly's part in the eventual Wo5K a lot clearer.

And then the finale... sucks to be Jory... and wow Ned... Great great fight between Ned and Jaime... Jaime didn't look like he was even working very hand, while Ned looked desperate but determined, and just when Jaime starts to work just a bit hard, STABBY IN THE LEG! FUCK!!!


As an aside, while there were no Dothracki scenes in this ep, i really enjoyed all the discussion about the threat Drogo and co posed... they won't cross the ocean but wow are we fucked if they do, etc etc. Kind of neat to see so much impact from characters utterly absent from the ep.


This show keeps getting better.

[Abyss]

Ceda Cicero, on 16 May 2011 - 02:17 AM, said:

...The Robert/Cersei conversation was, for me, the highlight.

Totally agree. SO MUCH going on in that chat.

Quote

... Littlefinger was just spot on in this episode, he killed it. ...

better and better...

Quote

Renly and Loras, ... I still thought it was a bit over the top.

GRRM played this very subtle in the books, but this is tv, and HBO, and fuckit, why not just throw it out there. We already had incest and a kid being thrown out a window and sideways lesbianism and nekkid whores and so on... so why play it subtle. It actually makes them more interesting characters than they were in the books. When Renly dies in the books it barely registers other than Brienne telling us it's supposed to be important.

End of Disc One, on 16 May 2011 - 02:18 AM, said:

...Loved the Varys/LF scene, even though I think Varys was always than LF with information...

The more i think about them the more impressed i am with the conversations in this ep. That exchange was awesome. Hostility and respect and loathing all wrapped up in piles of subtext...

Rhand, on 16 May 2011 - 08:55 AM, said:

...Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

worrywort, on 16 May 2011 - 09:42 AM, said:

...The guy with Illyrio is Varys in something of a disguise. In the episode it comes off too quickly after he's with Ned, so there doesn't seem to be enough time, but Littlefinger directly mentions it's him when they confront each other, so it's actually later in the day. In the book it's also pretty subtle, as Arya just catches a glimpse of a fat Tyroshi and another fat dude talking...she doesn't recognize Varys, but she thinks of him as a wizard for some reason I forget.

Cobbles, on 16 May 2011 - 12:53 PM, said:

Rhand, on 16 May 2011 - 08:55 AM, said:

Btw, who was the guy with Ilyrio (I think it was him atleast) in the dungeons? I never found out in the books, and the image wasn't sharp enough (ah, excuses) to properly see his face.

I watched it on HD. You could see very clearly that it was Varys.

...

I watched it in HD and it was still vague, but the voice and outfit were totally Varys.

[acesn8s]

I loved the shot of Littlefinger stareing at the Iron Throne, before Varys walks in. You can see the wheels turning and then his showdown with Varys was incredible. I also enjoyed the King and Queen's discussion. I actually chuckled when they both lost it after realizing that their 17 year fight is what is holding the Kingdom together.

I missed Ser Barristan on the small council standing up with Ned against the assassination of Dany. I think it should have been there seeing as Artan Whitebeard will be making an appearance later in the series.

Bron rocked, but I was confused as to why they have Tyrion use a shield instead of an axe. That axe become his signature weapon later in the books. Can't wait to see Shagga!

Little Robert and his mommy, ewwww. Just ewww. Perfectly played for Robert. I thought Lysa was too gaunt, but . . . it works. Can't wait to see the other side of her with Littlefinger shows up.

I'm glad that the Ser Hugh clue x 4 was in this episode, looks like I jumped the gun in my criticsm of episode 4.

[Ceda Cicero]

acesn8s, on 16 May 2011 - 03:02 PM, said:

I missed Ser Barristan on the small council standing up with Ned against the assassination of Dany. I think it should have been there seeing as Artan Whitebeard will be making an appearance later in the series.

I missed that too, but then again Barristan's complete backseat role in Ned's gradual slide into danger and eventual death was something that always irked me about him. He's portrayed as being kinda too irrelevant and incompetent in GoT to actually be considered a help to Ned even though they share many of the same principles and especially agree on Dany in particular, but that image doesn't quite jive with the uber-effective Arstan who turns up at Dany's side in ASoS. Maybe B&B felt the same and wanted to keep him out of it for that reason. Or who knows.

This post has been edited by Ceda Cicero: 16 May 2011 - 03:14 PM

[acesn8s]

Does anyone think we'll get an awesome fever/milk of the poppy flash back to the Tower of Joy in Episode 6? The White Bull, The Sword of Morning, and that other guy vs. Ned, Howland Reed, and the rest of the red shirts.

[Ceda Cicero]

Just for shits and giggles, who can come up with the best caption to this picture:




I'm torn between "I wonder if the Mountain shaves his chest..." and "I'd Ride that Mountain any day."

[Ceda Cicero]

Briar King, on 16 May 2011 - 06:01 PM, said:

acesn8s, on 16 May 2011 - 05:07 PM, said:

Does anyone think we'll get an awesome fever/milk of the poppy flash back to the Tower of Joy in Episode 6? The White Bull, The Sword of Morning, and that other guy vs. Ned, Howland Reed, and the rest of the red shirts.

I doubt it. We couldnt even get a voice over "Promise me" in epi 1 when Robert and Ned where looking at Lynna's statue.

Yeah, this in tandem with the fact that the Bran/Crow/Summer dream sequences have been massively cut back leads me to think we won't see it. I think they will find other ways of getting the same basic info out there, though (a good example is Robert and Cersei's discussion of Lyanna in this episode) which is okay with me (though I'd prefer a flashback sequence just as a fanboy) as long as it does get out there... otherwise the R+L=J arc, if it comes to that, will have a lot of people puzzled at the ultimate revelation.

[Tapper]

Ceda Cicero, on 16 May 2011 - 05:08 PM, said:

Just for shits and giggles, who can come up with the best caption to this picture:




I'm torn between "I wonder if the Mountain shaves his chest..." and "I'd Ride that Mountain any day."

"I wonder if I can make him erupt." or: "Shall we do what your horse wants to do with mine?" slash "I'd be a mare to you, you big stallion".

OK, after seeing the episode (after reading how you all hyped it), yeah, it was the most certainly was the most actiony so far. Jory was a psycho there, killing four with four blows, and then he meets mr. Lannister who shows what fighting a real Kingsguard is like. Wow. I did like the Jaime-Ned fight better than the Clegane's, but ymmv.

High point of the show, however, was the Robert-Cersei dialogue. And once more, Leana Heady/Cersei, I'd so marry you. Three blond brats, a dead kid, psychotic nature and that on-going incest thingie with your brother, I can forgive you for all of it.

Littlefinger was awesome.

Now for the minor nitpicking (but with some positives thrown in):

I'm a bit underwhelmed at Renly not being a warrior at all, he's a playboy but he wasn't too bad, iirc - even knowing that he was replaced with Garlan Tyrell at King's Landing... For those cringing at the shaving + off-screen blowjob, well, I thought it was rather tastefully done and it really shows Loras is not a shining prince but a man with some appetite, too - in the books, he seems by contrast mostly sexless, as he is now, it is a lot easier to like him and a lot harder for him to take a job to protect Margaery later on.

The Eyrie was nothing like I expected in its looks, but the sky-cells were. Love the look of the Knights of the Eyrie. Lannister spearmen look a bit like dr. Evil sidekicks, though.

Also, as a really minor sidenote, Theon Greyjoy must have the fastest cock ever, and not in a good way. He went from erection to flaccid in three seconds flat after apparently coming. I mean, kudos for the actor for going full frontal, but this was hardly (hahaw) realistic either. Cute redhead, though.

[Cobbles]

Ceda Cicero, on 16 May 2011 - 01:00 PM, said:

You should change your name from "Cobbles" to "Quibbles."

Thing is, with metal armor (Hound/Mountain duel), you can actually take quite a few blows on your armor. Plate armor is basically sword proof. I'd have to watch it again, but IIRC, the Hound/Mountain duel where both are in heavy armor, everything get's blocked by the sword. It makes it look a bit fake.

In the Ned/Jaime duel, none of them has metal armor. Every hit by the sword will do some damage. So you really have to block everything with your sword. In exchange, you'll be moving faster. Now this only works if you swing much much tighter than these guys were doing. Ned in particular was swinging very widely. Maybe it's the huge sword he has which is really not suited for this kind of fighting.

Look for instance at this or similar links. If you're a bit of a fantasy/sword and sorcery geek, this stuff could be interesting. (No I don't LARP).