[dktorode]

you dont work for Martins PR team by any chance do you wert?

[Werthead]

dktorode, on 08 June 2010 - 11:54 AM, said:

all i see is blah blah blah.... i want to suck Martins dick some more...blah blah blah.
The guy has let his fans down, just deal with it already!

Ah, you refuse to engage substantially with the points raised and resort to pesonal insults. Classic behaviour from those whose arguments have crumbled to dust in front of them.

You wanted the book as fast as possible, even if it was utter shit. Fair enough. The difference is that I want the book to be as good as possible, and if that means waiting a few extra years, so be it. There's plenty of decent books to read in the meantime, including from the two authors this forum is dedicated to.

[acesn8s]

All the Martin complainers make me chuckle now. You want indignation, get in line behind the Jean Auel readers:

The Clan of the Cave Bear, 1980
The Valley of Horses, 1982
The Mammoth Hunters, 1985
The Plains of Passage, 1990
The Shelters of Stone, 2002
The Land of Painted Caves, 2011

31 f'in years.

[dktorode]

Werthead, on 08 June 2010 - 12:46 PM, said:

dktorode, on 08 June 2010 - 11:54 AM, said:

all i see is blah blah blah.... i want to suck Martins dick some more...blah blah blah.
The guy has let his fans down, just deal with it already!

Ah, you refuse to engage substantially with the points raised and resort to pesonal insults. Classic behaviour from those whose arguments have crumbled to dust in front of them.

You wanted the book as fast as possible, even if it was utter shit. Fair enough. The difference is that I want the book to be as good as possible, and if that means waiting a few extra years, so be it. There's plenty of decent books to read in the meantime, including from the two authors this forum is dedicated to.

See...you were the one arguing.

I was the one moaning...
You took it apon yourself to try and start an argument to defend poor martin.
Im merely stating the way i feel



edit - I see i got neg repped ...thats hardly a personal attack wert.
You are trying to justify why I feel cheated!!
No matter how much you stick up for the man (ie...suck his cock), the way i feel is the way i feel and no amount of postulating on his behalf is going to change that...So you "sucking his cock" is me saying you seem to be way too invested in this "argument" and perhaps you are taking it a little bit too seriously....but watever....

meh

This post has been edited by dktorode: 08 June 2010 - 01:51 PM

[dktorode]

Werthead, on 08 June 2010 - 12:46 PM, said:

You wanted the book as fast as possible, even if it was utter shit. Fair enough.

This should actually read

Werthead, on 08 June 2010 - 12:46 PM, said:

You wanted a book.... Fair enough.

[dktorode]

acesn8s, on 08 June 2010 - 01:18 PM, said:

All the Martin complainers make me chuckle now. You want indignation, get in line behind the Jean Auel readers:

The Clan of the Cave Bear, 1980
The Valley of Horses, 1982
The Mammoth Hunters, 1985
The Plains of Passage, 1990
The Shelters of Stone, 2002
The Land of Painted Caves, 2011

31 f'in years.

If someone had just mentioned something like this to me about martin a few years ago i would not be here now trolling the daylights out of wert

[masan's saddle]

dktorode, on 08 June 2010 - 01:24 PM, said:

acesn8s, on 08 June 2010 - 01:18 PM, said:

All the Martin complainers make me chuckle now. You want indignation, get in line behind the Jean Auel readers:

The Clan of the Cave Bear, 1980
The Valley of Horses, 1982
The Mammoth Hunters, 1985
The Plains of Passage, 1990
The Shelters of Stone, 2002
The Land of Painted Caves, 2011

31 f'in years.

If someone had just mentioned something like this to me about martin a few years ago i would not be here now trolling the daylights out of wert

 f6YUU.png (288.76K)
Number of downloads: 0

[haroos]

dktorode, on 08 June 2010 - 01:24 PM, said:

acesn8s, on 08 June 2010 - 01:18 PM, said:

All the Martin complainers make me chuckle now. You want indignation, get in line behind the Jean Auel readers:

The Clan of the Cave Bear, 1980
The Valley of Horses, 1982
The Mammoth Hunters, 1985
The Plains of Passage, 1990
The Shelters of Stone, 2002
The Land of Painted Caves, 2011

31 f'in years.

If someone had just mentioned something like this to me about martin a few years ago i would not be here now trolling the daylights out of wert

i don't think it's the same, martin was an established writer before soiaf, and between the 3rd and 4th and the 4th and the 5th (which is not yet published) he wrote
and edited and contributed to quite a few other books.
jean auel wrote nothing else, and i assume that her writing career is not central to her life, or she would have written more.

and i will give you another example to prove it :
raymond feist's midkemia books, also written in the past 30+ years.
however he wrote them as a series of series and each one was written and published in a set time, according to his schedule.

i'm sure there are many more examples to both sides.

This post has been edited by haroos: 08 June 2010 - 03:01 PM

[Werthead]

acesn8s, on 08 June 2010 - 01:18 PM, said:

All the Martin complainers make me chuckle now. You want indignation, get in line behind the Jean Auel readers:

The Clan of the Cave Bear, 1980
The Valley of Horses, 1982
The Mammoth Hunters, 1985
The Plains of Passage, 1990
The Shelters of Stone, 2002
The Land of Painted Caves, 2011

31 f'in years.

The traditional response to that would be:

Jean M. Auel is not your bitch! Plus, she's speeding up, down from 12 to 9 years for the latest book. What are you complaining about?

Is the sixth book the last one or are there more planned. I nearly picked these up years ago before I realised the series was unfinished.

Quote

raymond feist's midkemia books, also written in the past 30+ years.
however he wrote them as a series of series and each one was written and published in a set time, according to his schedule.

Yes, but you forget an important and vital point: Raymond E. Feist is shit.

Or rather, he's shit now. He actually used to be pretty good, when the books took longer to come out.

This post has been edited by Werthead: 08 June 2010 - 03:24 PM

[champ]

personally, the wait annoyed me, only because in his last book he wrote that the next one was nearly finished and i bought the earlier books on the pretence that the series shouldnt take too much longer to finish... lol

but i wont bitch and moan about it, i just simply wont buy anymore of his books until the series is finished as cant be assed going through this after every book

[Grief]

Keep it civil, leave out the personal insults.

[D'rek]

Well if you're really looking for another example there's King's Dark Tower series. Took him, what, 20 years after the first publishing of The Gunslinger to get it over with? (And unlike Aubel all he does is write and has written plenty of other books in the meantime that I guess some people could've been angry at him for doing instead of Dark Tower; unlike Wert's opinion of Feist he's great)

[polishgenius]

Thing is, offering examples and counter-examples is a completely pointless exercise because every writer has different abilities and different levels of acceptance of when a work is 'finished', in terms of editing and tidying details and such. It's just impossible to apply the same set of rules to different writers.

[Werthead]

D, on 08 June 2010 - 03:53 PM, said:

Well if you're really looking for another example there's King's Dark Tower series. Took him, what, 20 years after the first publishing of The Gunslinger to get it over with? (And unlike Aubel all he does is write and has written plenty of other books in the meantime that I guess some people could've been angry at him for doing instead of Dark Tower; unlike Wert's opinion of Feist he's great)

That's true. However, King's situation is also odd in that only a small number of his readers are fans of the Dark Tower series. IIRC, King has said those books only sell about half as well as his 'normal' horror books (although that's still enough for them to be bestsellers, of course), and at signings the Dark Tower fans are outnumbered a lot by people who've never read them. I think it's also fair to say that if you listed King's books in order of profile, you'd also have the likes of The Stand, It, The Tommyknockers, The Shining, Carrie and maybe Pet Semetary all above the DT series.

So whilst I know a lot of DT fans who indeed were annoyed with King leaving the DT universe behind for 6-7 years at a time before coming back to it, most King fans weren't that bothered about it.

[acesn8s]

Werthead, on 08 June 2010 - 03:22 PM, said:

acesn8s, on 08 June 2010 - 01:18 PM, said:

All the Martin complainers make me chuckle now. You want indignation, get in line behind the Jean Auel readers:

The Clan of the Cave Bear, 1980
The Valley of Horses, 1982
The Mammoth Hunters, 1985
The Plains of Passage, 1990
The Shelters of Stone, 2002
The Land of Painted Caves, 2011

31 f'in years.

The traditional response to that would be:

Jean M. Auel is not your bitch! Plus, she's speeding up, down from 12 to 9 years for the latest book. What are you complaining about?

Is the sixth book the last one or are there more planned. I nearly picked these up years ago before I realised the series was unfinished.

No idea. I've never read her books, but for the 8 years I worked in a book store (1988 - 1996). I would constantly be asked when the next "Cave Bear" book would be coming out, and "Did she die?"

I'm content to wait for Martin to write the story he wants to tell; although, I do find it humorous that the WoT will be finished before ASoFaI, and poor RJ (RIP) passed away.

[teholbeddict]

I just wanted to add a bit to the combine comment. He hasn't been run over by one thankfully, but if he had, someone likely would have stepped in and finished the book if not the series for him a la WoT, so that argument doesn't hold any water for me.

[Werthead]

teholbeddict, on 08 June 2010 - 05:33 PM, said:

I just wanted to add a bit to the combine comment. He hasn't been run over by one thankfully, but if he had, someone likely would have stepped in and finished the book if not the series for him a la WoT, so that argument doesn't hold any water for me.

No. Martin dies, the series ends. His literary heirs are under strict instructions not to let anyone even contemplate this idea. If Martin gets to the very last book and discovers he has some illness, it is borderline conceivable he might change his mind (as Jordan did), but if something happened to him now, the series would go unfinished, and copyright law would prevent anyone else from finishing it for another 70-odd years.

[Abyss]

Werthead, on 08 June 2010 - 06:17 PM, said:

...No. Martin dies, the series ends. His literary heirs are under strict instructions not to let anyone even contemplate this idea. If Martin gets to the very last book and discovers he has some illness, it is borderline conceivable he might change his mind (as Jordan did), but if something happened to him now, the series would go unfinished, and copyright law would prevent anyone else from finishing it for another 70-odd years.

If it ever comes up (and i hope it doesn't), I say tall dollars trump author integrity.

- Abyss, cynic.

[HoosierDaddy]

Can I ask why he would be so strict about someone else continuing the story? Yes, it is possible it would be on a lesser plane of writing. Yes, it is possible it could be on a better plane. So, has he stated why?

[D'rek]

Werthead, on 08 June 2010 - 04:33 PM, said:

D, on 08 June 2010 - 03:53 PM, said:

Well if you're really looking for another example there's King's Dark Tower series. Took him, what, 20 years after the first publishing of The Gunslinger to get it over with? (And unlike Aubel all he does is write and has written plenty of other books in the meantime that I guess some people could've been angry at him for doing instead of Dark Tower; unlike Wert's opinion of Feist he's great)

That's true. However, King's situation is also odd in that only a small number of his readers are fans of the Dark Tower series. IIRC, King has said those books only sell about half as well as his 'normal' horror books (although that's still enough for them to be bestsellers, of course), and at signings the Dark Tower fans are outnumbered a lot by people who've never read them. I think it's also fair to say that if you listed King's books in order of profile, you'd also have the likes of The Stand, It, The Tommyknockers, The Shining, Carrie and maybe Pet Semetary all above the DT series.

So whilst I know a lot of DT fans who indeed were annoyed with King leaving the DT universe behind for 6-7 years at a time before coming back to it, most King fans weren't that bothered about it.

A solid point. Of course who knows if Martin won't write something between aSoIaF books that ends up being better and more popular than them!