[haroos]

any guesses ?

my guess is dassem ultor/dessembrae.

since mok from MoI is number 3 and has 2 marks on his mask, that means that the number 2 has 1 mark, so either no marks is being the best, or
the clean maks is reserved to someone.
it's just a hunch.

[WhiskeyJackDaniels]

haroos, on 10 May 2010 - 06:02 PM, said:

any guesses ?

my guess is dassem ultor/dessembrae.

since mok from MoI is number 3 and has 2 marks on his mask, that means that the number 2 has 1 mark, so either no marks is being the best, or
the clean maks is reserved to someone.
it's just a hunch.

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying in your post. Yes, the Seguleh First wears a pure white mask we've been told. Why does that mean they are looking for Dassem though? We don't have any information that he has any run-ins with any Seguleh. Perhaps they are looking for the Second, and perhaps Mok as well, but I don't know what else they could be looking for.

TtH Spoiler:

Spoiler

Unless it is something about the Tyrant of Darujhistan, either to prevent or enable his release.

[anothevilbadguy]

haroos, on 10 May 2010 - 06:02 PM, said:

any guesses ?

my guess is dassem ultor/dessembrae.

since mok from MoI is number 3 and has 2 marks on his mask, that means that the number 2 has 1 mark, so either no marks is being the best, or
the clean maks is reserved to someone.
it's just a hunch.

There is a First, who is on the seguleh island. And Envy's suggestion that Mok was sent off due to the threat he posed, indicates that the First is just a man like Mok.

This post has been edited by anothevilbadguy: 10 May 2010 - 09:06 PM

[HiddenOne]

I think the

Spoiler

Second works(ed) for Hood. Isn't he chasing after Dassem in another book? Seems like there was a scene where he shows up and somebody says "Hey I saw Dassem over in City X" to get him to leave?

Someone confirm or refute, quotes would be awesome.

This post has been edited by HiddenOne: 12 June 2010 - 12:47 PM

[Aptorian]

The Second was looking for Skinner, an Avowed commander of the Crimson Guard. His grudge with Skinner is of a personal nature, but we don't know why the 2nd is so pissed off.

We hear about this in Bonehunters and Toll the Hounds.

[The Seguleh 46th]

anothevilbadguy, on 10 May 2010 - 06:33 PM, said:

haroos, on 10 May 2010 - 06:02 PM, said:

any guesses ?

my guess is dassem ultor/dessembrae.

since mok from MoI is number 3 and has 2 marks on his mask, that means that the number 2 has 1 mark, so either no marks is being the best, or
the clean maks is reserved to someone.
it's just a hunch.

There is a First, who is on the seguleh island. And Envy's suggestion that Mok was sent off due to the threat he posed, indicates that the First is just a man like Mok.

That's the way i have it as well. I am curious as well to what they are looking for though. I do agree with WJD in the

Spoiler

Darujhistan Tyrant theory, and imagine it has something to do with the pickled Seguleh found in the BB's bar. K'ruls Bar IIRC? The real mystery to me is if they opposed the Tyrant dude or worked for him, although i think Vorcan being a member (might have lost her union card by now though with all her previous actions, lol) of the Torrud Cabal suggests to me they are against him or her (Tyrant)

But i could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. Or the second. Or third. Yep......

This post has been edited by The Seguleh 46th: 12 June 2010 - 06:31 PM

[Sinisdar Toste]

im pretty sure that in tBH when the second busts in to the monastery where cutter and the rest are re-supplying, he mentions that the segulah were the tyrants army and the cabal the tyrants very own cabal.

although it could have been baruk in TtH. i know i'm remembering it from somewhere.

[HoosierDaddy]

It's from TBH. "Brilliant insanity!" Or some such.

[Aptorian]

I did a thread on the Darujistan Tyrant way back in Bonehunters:

http://forum.malazan...h=1

BH p. 129:

Quote

�Beru fend,� he whispered. A Seguleh!�
At that the soldier turned, then walked closer. Daru, you are far from home! Tell me, do the tyrants children still rule Darujistan?�
Cutter shook his head.
You look crazed, mortal, what ails you?�
I'd heard, I mean Seguleh usually say nothing to anyone. Yet you...�
The fever zeal still grips my mortal kin, does it? Idiots! The tyrants army still holds sway in city, then?
Who? What? Darujistan is ruled by a council. We have no army.
Brilliant insanity! No Seguleh in the city?�
No! Just stories. Legends, I mean.
So where are my masked stick-pivoting compatriots hiding?.
An island, it's said, far to the south, off the coast, beyond Morn-
Morn! Now the sense of it comes to me. They are being held in readiness. Darujistan's council, mages one and all, yes? Undying, secretive, paranoid mages! Crouching low lest the tyrant returns, as one day he must! Returns, looking for his army! Hah, a council!�
That's not the council, sir, Cutter said. You are speaking of mages, that would be the T'horrud Cabal-
T'orrud! Yes, clever. Outrageous! Barukanal, Derudanith, Travalegrah, Mammoltenan? These names strike your soul, yes? I see it.�

[worry]

I don't remember where I posted this before, but my hypothesis is that the Tyrant is perhaps a Forkrul Assail. This is because Seguleh sounds a lot like Sechul Lath, because they basically worship martial prowess including agility and precision, the rigidity of their society, and because their white masks could be based off of FA appearance. Plus I wouldn't be surprised if the FA worldview produced a Tyrant of a different sort than Jaghut produce.

In addition (light spoilers from TTH and beyond):

Spoiler

The Darujhistan novel could very well feature Karsa's army, and that calls back to what Calm tells him about seeing him again in the end. And a fight between the Teblor and whoever on one hand (Mott Irregulars?!?!?!?!), and an FA Tyrant and Seguleh on the other would be awesome. On the other hand, revelations in DoD and what could be possible for FA in TCG may very well destroy this theory. And of course Calm was freed several years back in the story, not that I think he personally is the Tyrant, but he would likely have an active interest. We'll see.

[Mischiefs' Folly]

IDK...

[haroos]

worrywort, on 13 June 2010 - 07:59 AM, said:

I don't remember where I posted this before, but my hypothesis is that the Tyrant is perhaps a Forkrul Assail. This is because Seguleh sounds a lot like Sechul Lath, because they basically worship martial prowess including agility and precision, the rigidity of their society, and because their white masks could be based off of FA appearance. Plus I wouldn't be surprised if the FA worldview produced a Tyrant of a different sort than Jaghut produce.

In addition (light spoilers from TTH and beyond):

Spoiler

The Darujhistan novel could very well feature Karsa's army, and that calls back to what Calm tells him about seeing him again in the end. And a fight between the Teblor and whoever on one hand (Mott Irregulars?!?!?!?!), and an FA Tyrant and Seguleh on the other would be awesome. On the other hand, revelations in DoD and what could be possible for FA in TCG may very well destroy this theory. And of course Calm was freed several years back in the story, not that I think he personally is the Tyrant, but he would likely have an active interest. We'll see.

i thought the masks are a form of protection, preventing people from going into emotional states because they perceive facial expressions
as friendly or belligerent.
so a mask would prevent people from reacting on emotion.

[HiddenOne]

Aptorian, on 12 June 2010 - 12:55 PM, said:

The Second was looking for Skinner, an Avowed commander of the Crimson Guard. His grudge with Skinner is of a personal nature, but we don't know why the 2nd is so pissed off.

We hear about this in Bonehunters and Toll the Hounds.

Thanks for the reply. I realized while reading RotCG last night that I had confused the two men.

I also started trying to remember the info the second releases about the island, which this thread answers nicely.

[Abyss]

[quote name='anothevilbadguy' date='10 May 2010 - 02:33 PM' timestamp='1273516433' post='759946']
[quote name='haroos' date='10 May 2010 - 07:02 PM' timestamp='1273514530' post='759938']
any guesses ?
...[/quote]

Is the question what are they looking for when Iron bars and co encounter them?

because the answer is 'i dunno', but i like the 'to stop or restart the Tyrant theory'.

[quote There is a First, who is on the seguleh island. And Envy's suggestion that Mok was sent off due to the threat he posed, indicates that the First is just a man like Mok.
[/quote]

Keep in mind that even back in MoI Mok was sensitive to the warren magic poisoning Garath, fought Envy's sleep spell like a bastard, and beheaded a K'ell Hunter with no other apparent enhancement. Hints in TtH suggest Denul magic is being used to enhance the Seguleh somehow, but it could be a mislead.

[quote name='worrywort' date='13 June 2010 - 03:59 AM' timestamp='1276415982' post='771226']
I don't remember where I posted this before, but my hypothesis is that the Tyrant is perhaps a Forkrul Assail...
[/quote]

Not a rediculous theory. I've always assumed it was human, but really for no particular reason.
Jagut Tyrants seem to want to be worshipped as Gods, and nothing has suggested that the Darujhistan Tyrant King did that. Nothing up until RCG really suggests an Assail would set itself up over a human empire, but it's not unthinkable.

[quote name='haroos' date='14 June 2010 - 11:57 AM' timestamp='1276531033' post='771471']
... And of course Calm was freed several years back in the story, not that I think he personally is the Tyrant, but he would likely have an active interest. ...[/quote]

related to nothing but Calm was a 'she'.

[quote] i thought the masks are a form of protection, preventing people from going into emotional states because they perceive facial expressions
as friendly or belligerent.
so a mask would prevent people from reacting on emotion.
[/quote]

I thought more or less the same thing - 'only actions matter' kind of approach. tho it was funny how in MoI the Seguleh still communicated via eye contact and staring.

[worry]

Yah, I forgot Calm was a she. But the mask thing...I'm talking about the appearance, not the function. Or a ceremonial function on top of a practical one. But then again, avoiding emotional outbursts/reactions/influences strikes me as possibly FA-like. They like to pretend they are purely rational.

But all in all, it was just a thought mostly related to the Seguleh/Sechul Lath thing and I think it would be cool, but I have no particular confidence that it's correct.

[WhiskeyJackDaniels]

I would guess its not an FA just because there was more than one Tyrant king after the original, and I believe the Second asks Cutter if the Tyrant's children are still ruling Darujhistan. He could have easily just meant inheritors but if not it seems to shoot down the FA theory. I believe Mammot talks at some point about the Tyrant Kings and never indicates that they weren't human.

[haroos]

WhiskeyJackDaniels, on 10 May 2010 - 06:20 PM, said:

haroos, on 10 May 2010 - 06:02 PM, said:

any guesses ?

my guess is dassem ultor/dessembrae.

since mok from MoI is number 3 and has 2 marks on his mask, that means that the number 2 has 1 mark, so either no marks is being the best, or
the clean maks is reserved to someone.
it's just a hunch.

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying in your post. Yes, the Seguleh First wears a pure white mask we've been told. Why does that mean they are looking for Dassem though? We don't have any information that he has any run-ins with any Seguleh. Perhaps they are looking for the Second, and perhaps Mok as well, but I don't know what else they could be looking for.

TtH Spoiler:

Spoiler

Unless it is something about the Tyrant of Darujhistan, either to prevent or enable his release.

it's just that the seguleh are in many ways a cult-nation.
and as such, they must have a figurehead-god that they worship or look to for leadership.
and since they are centered around swordsmanship and not scholarship or magic, and they are also not attempting conquests, i can assume
that they are ... waiting ... for a que, a sign.
it's a theory, nothing more, but dessembrae is a fitting god of such a cult.
for obvious reasons.

[worry]

But he's little over a century old, and the Seguleh culture certainly is not.

[Aptorian]

worrywort, on 14 June 2010 - 09:12 PM, said:

But he's little over a century old, and the Seguleh culture certainly is not.

... less than a thousand years old.

[worry]

You're a dang one-man encyclopedia.