[Korvalain]

Tulas Shorn, on 12 October 2009 - 01:52 PM, said:

@Korv

I follow what you're saying. To be honest, I think what was bugging me about the Kalse case all of a sudden was how the votes came in succession after Thyr's case, which is why I removed. Your initial post made it sound like you were using Kalse's laziness to justify your adding a fourth vote, but that could have just pushed the train in a lazy game (as you say) for others to hop on and finish it. Putting the thumb screws on is one thing, but I was afraid it would turn into a speed lynch.

Yeah, I know, and you removing your vote was a smart thing to do. However, since I am going to be offline for several hours and may only do a speedvisit after that, I decided to run the risk that Kalse would come online only after I log off, make a sensible defense and me leaving my vote on, or that I would be seen as building a speed train if that train kicked off. I'd look scummy then, but I think the above explanation makes sense enough for why I do this.

[Tulas Shorn]

Well, by my count we have 4-5ish hours left, and I won't be here for deadline.
I hate casting my vote since it may ensure a Kalse lynch regardless then, but the timing for 4 votes is better now than earlier. I reason that the thread has been so slow, we may not get a lynch if I don't switch. If things swing another way and there are enough votes, fair enough.

Remove Vote

Vote Kalse

[Atrahal]

On my phone, will lay out my case as soon as I have a comp

[Kaschan]

Hey guys. After a long shitty weekend. I am back. Gonna catch up on the thread. and Contribute. I will be here on and off all day so I will be able to get some good work done. I haven't even checked the thread in 2 days. brb when done rereading.

[Kaschan]

Ok, did a quick reread and got up to speed more or less.

It's being skimmed over this late in the game, but I think Tulas' points regarding Tennes have merit. in addition to what he points out, this post really jumped out at me:

Tennes, on 11 October 2009 - 04:56 PM, said:

Oh, wonderful. Sorry Korlat. I still think it was the best option we had though.

I want to hear more about this sabotage mechanic. What systems do you think are at risk? From the OP it sounds like its the ship itself that is being sabotaged, not necessarily specific player items. How many systems do you guys think there are? What systems do you think may have been damaged already?

I was reading the Mafia pointers sectionand one of dibs rules was that the more someone talks about something... the more likely it is they have something to do with it ( paraphrased...poorly) This post kinda came out of nowhere. Why would the sabotage mechanic be on your mind so much as it clearly hasn't impacted the game up to this point.

[Grief]

It is Day 3.
3 hours and 55 minutes left

13 people are still alive: Alkend, Ampelas, Atrahal, Kalse, Karosis, Kaschan, Korbas, Korvalain,Thyrlann, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn,

7 votes to lynch or go to night

4 votes Kalse (Thyrllan, Karosis, Korvalain, Tulas Shorn)
1 vote Alkend (Telas)
1 vote Telas (Alkend)
1 vote Tennes(Ampelas)

6 people haven't voted (Atrahal, Kalse, Kaschan, Korbas, Tellan, Tennes)

This post has been edited by Grief: 12 October 2009 - 04:28 PM

[Kaschan]

So the Train on Korlat went: Tulas, Tennes, Alkend, Karosis, Korv, Anthras, Kalse, Ampleas. If there are no scum on this train I will eat my boots. There were 3 distinct Portions to the train after the initial case. The first is the Tennes alkend vote block back to back. Here is Tennes vote:

Tennes, on 11 October 2009 - 02:05 AM, said:

Oh wow. Nice. That's actually really good, I'm gonna go with that.

vote Korlat

Really? Talk about taking the easy way out. This vote along with with sabotage talks coming out of nowhere really have me wondering about Tennes. Granted, it doesn't look like we have time today to get another lynch, igmeoy!


Next is the Karosis, Korv, Anthras block that happened all within 3 posts of eachother. Honestly I would say Anthras' vote was the scummiest.. but knowing how he was crew... what do I know. Karosis laid out an actual reason behind his vote ( Tennes take note). I have a hard time reading Korv. I will look at him more later.


Then there is the finishers. Kalse and Amp. This is Kalse vote:

Kalse, on 11 October 2009 - 11:47 AM, said:

Interesting case, and Telas could easily have allayed suspicion by voting for Korlat. I don't want to take him to L-1 though without him having a chance to defend himself (Korlat that is). I know he has been on, but it looked as if it was a flying visit. I am around until day times out, so will vote by then rather than have another lynchless day.

Kalse, on 11 October 2009 - 02:13 PM, said:

Not a great deal of time left so

Vote Korlat

as per my earlier post.

Man this sets my radar off too. The "I want a lynch and its the only reason i'm voting" is such an easy way out.

Amp's vote.. well it was 2 minutes before lynch... I probably would have done the same thing.


So after looking at Just the train, without any context to the thread. I would say the 3 ppl on it that stand out the most to me are Tennes, Korv. and Kalse.

At this point I would vote for anyone of them based upon the fact that I think there was scum on that train and it's likely in that group of three. imo.

I will be around the rest of the day till lynch so I am not gonna vote just yet. Gonna go back and look at Thy's case on Kalse.

[Kalse]

Korvalain, on 12 October 2009 - 08:07 AM, said:

It's sad to see that we are still hanging on discussions of the OP. Thankfully, we are finally getting to proper behaviour and posting analysis.

I do have one remark concerning the sabotage mechanic as it was on modcraft: what is holding GK back from changing that for this game as well? Nothing at all. It's logical the way it was and it can still effect players rather than the 'ship' as an external entity like Obdi did in the oxygen game, but that does not imply that it can't be changed.

I'm going to go with Thyrllan on this one, and vote Kalse. That is caused in a large part by Alkend's unwillingness to pull the game forward with the info he apparently has.

with that I am referring to this:

Quote

Maybe it's because it's not spycraft. Maybe it's because the limited time I've had with it so far has been a bevy and spam and useless discussion. Or maybe it's just because I think I see things that nobody else ever sees.

So I'm just kind of "playing" the game, but I'm not really being super helpful. That's totally my bad, or whatever, but that's why I'm glad Korlat got lynched. Because it moved the game forward.

rather than this:

Quote

2- I picked up something in one of Korlat's posts that led me to believe he was innocent. I did not defend him because I saw him reading the thread but after I logged off he failed to respond.
However, I will not reveal it because I technically feel that it was going against some rules. Specifically stuff from the role pms. Sort of a hey, this was in my pm and if you recognize it then you must be on my team. I don't want to play the game like that, it has happened in other games and it ruins it.

Also, this by Kalse sets all alarmbells ringing, mainly because of the lazy game we've had so far:

Quote

I have no time now as to go to work but I will be back before day times out. A few things I will say is that the post I wrote when voting Amp was when I was almost asleep and so not expressed very well, and it's because I am inno that I was being very relaxed when I was posting and if you lynch me you are only helping team scum.

So, what piques me?

1- He will be back before deadline but will not say when.
That could be stalling the train, 'cause of course he deserves a chance at defending himself. Name a time, mate, when do you get off work?
2- Being relaxed because you are inno? What kind of mindset is that? 'I can screw up because I'm not scum?' Yeah, I can feel you're a teamplayer who's trying to win the game...
3- 'you are only helping team scum'. Ooooooh, the age old threat of 'go ahead, lynch me, you will only slit your own throat', which contains 0 evidence that you are inno and is just a lazy defense. I swear, from now on, I'm going to vote people who use this waste of reading time.

Why? Well, keeping a lazy bum around who is very relaxed and convinced we should forgive bad phrasing and a laid-back attitude to playing the game is not exactly aiding team inno either, now is it? Besides, how else are we going to find scum except through case making and searching slips? Do you expect us to swallow your excuse hook, line and sinker, but have us put more pressure on others when you see a slip? Fuck that, double standards should never apply in mafia.

Vote Kalse.

Just got back in and find myself in the annoying position of having to agree with everything you say about me. It was poor form writing that post like that, only excuse was I literally had only a minute or two to write something, and I was desperate to write something, because I always get lynched when my back is turned. And yes I know (now) that last sentence was the worst thing I could have written. It wasn't meant as any sort of tease, just that we lynched an inno yesterday who hadn't had a defence (although the chance was there). Steep learning curve I guess.

I do resent the implication that I am a lazy player though. I am not. I read and reread the threads when I playing looking for something, anything that will help my team. My meaning about being relaxed is, and it is something that others have said as well, when playing as scum you tend to analyse every word and sentence, but if you have to do that when inno then really what's the point...sorry guys, it's a game. A game I 'enjoy' (for enjoy read obsess and stress over) but a game nonetheless and whilst I really am a team player I won't be told that I HAVE to play in a certain way.

The thing is it doesn't seem to much matter how any of us play. High poster - scum. Low poster - scum (although we seldom seem to lynch them as they give us less to go on.) One line posts - scum. Long posts - scum trying to be helpful...and so on and so on.

And if I AM wrong about symps voting for their alleged masters then I hold my hands up. I thought that was the only sure fire way to prove, not your innocence obviously, but that particular scenario is wrong.

Anyay, whine over!

I will now reread the case and try and post a defense as quick as possible...although how you defend yourself without looking scummy I don't know!



Edit: Cross post

This post has been edited by Kalse: 12 October 2009 - 04:28 PM

[Kalse]

Just read Kaschan's post - well I voted with 45ish mins to go, I might or might not have been around at end of day (something had come up). I gave him time to provide a defense, but nothing was forthcoming....I'm not sure what else I was expected to do at that point and I really fail to see the difference between Amp's vote and mine, except about 43 mins!

[Kalse]

Thyrllan, on 11 October 2009 - 08:52 PM, said:

Right, I've gone through the thread - and a sad desert of content that was - and this is what stood out for me.

Alkend, on 08 October 2009 - 06:06 PM, said:

Anthras, on 08 October 2009 - 06:01 PM, said:

@Path-Shaper. Why don't I see an avatar for this Alt?

Vote Anthras

Clearly you are a Klingon with your cloaking device active.

This post when made originally made me wonder about a connection between the two. Nothing else showed such a connection however, and now Anthras is dead so that puts the nail in that particular coffin.

Korvalain, on 09 October 2009 - 03:54 PM, said:

Korlat, on 09 October 2009 - 03:51 PM, said:

for complaining about fanboys is my guess.

so, a question that's been nagging me for a while now: what is this "sabotage" mechanic?

I guess it has something to do with scums victory condition - they have to disable the ships ability to fly:

from the OP story:

Quote

It is now clearthat the Klingons have infiltrated the ship and will attempt to eitherdamage or destroy the ship ability to fight.

Might be that they can't kill, or don't need to achieve lynch immunity, but rather have to do a certain amount of sabotage. Or something.

Now, this stood out for me because there was no kill. Might just be a coincidence but Korvalain definitly deserves some watching. I didn't notice much from him in either direction following though, so as of now I've got nothing on him apart from this thing.

Kalse, on 09 October 2009 - 05:42 PM, said:

Does anyone have an opinion on the Karosis/Tellan bust up? Genuine antipathy or aggressive distancing?

Kalse obviously fears showing an opinion of his own, but needs to be seen to contribute.

I've already answered this. I asked a question about something that seemed strange. The reason that I asked it in this way was because no-one else had even referred to it. It seemed mighty odd. I didn't know it was r/l spilling over into the game. Which is pretty damned unfair if you ask me.

Thyrllan, on 11 October 2009 - 08:52 PM, said:

Alkend, on 09 October 2009 - 08:42 PM, said:

That was a stupid thread catchup. The amount of trash posts in this thread could fill a landfill.

Ampelas and Thyrllan are clearly scum. See how much they titter between each other while pretending to vote?

Remove Vote
Vote Thyrllan

GTFO this ship!

This is where Alkend goes on the whole thyrllan ampelas thing of his. Pointing out it makes no sense just makes him angry. The arguments here are thin, but it does get discussion going, and from this post alone that helps the innos.

Anthras, on 09 October 2009 - 09:43 PM, said:

Read up. Ampelas is seriously setting of my scumdar. And I feel a little better that I'm not alone in voicing concerns.

Now as to ending the day without a lynch, or speed lynching the first person who coughed. Do any of you stat whores know how often we actually hit a scum with a random day one lynch?

Then Anthras jumps in. He was actually on of my main suspects until he turned up dead. This seems very much like trying to be tied to a set of arguments and thus contribute, but perhaps he was just suspicious of Ampelas. His death seems to imply the later.

Alkend, on 09 October 2009 - 10:09 PM, said:

Anyway, you do bring up a good point about Amp/Thyr. If Amp is the scummier looking, vote him first. The logic goes lynch the master not the symp, but that has led to a lot of fake symping over time in various games.

Remove Vote
Vote Ampelas

I like Thyr's avatar better anyway.

Alkend, who's so convinced I'm scum, upon being questioned imediatly switches to Ampelas. I actually don't see how his reasoning makes any sense apart from "I'm not to blame!!"..

Thyrllan, on 11 October 2009 - 08:52 PM, said:

Kalse, on 09 October 2009 - 10:41 PM, said:

Remind me never to joke in mafia again, someone always takes offense. It's not my fault you lot have no sense of humour. Besides, I'm no maths genius, but odds of 10 to 1 in a game of 15 means I'm not a safe bet doesn't it? I don't know, I don't bet, and I'm tired. Anyhow,

Vote Ampelas

I'm nobody's symp nor scum of any sort, I need to sleep soon and won't be back before day times out (going by P-S last guess), and I do believe in day 1 lynches and the case on him is the only one with any merit really.

Then Kalse, who has been as pointed out earlier, very non-confrontational and mainly has just kept himself to the background, votes as nr 3 for no apparent reason outside of not wanting to seem a symp. Now, I hate people who jump in with a vote without even trying to justify it. Sheep are worse than useless and I'm damn close to initiating a policy of completely disregarding the opinion of those who show themselves to be sheep. They do nothing but take up space anyways and deserve no more regard than does a wall, or a piece of furniture.

But to get back to Kalse. He continues a trend of being non confrontational and scared of actually ruffling anyone's feathers. Later he claims a whole list of reasons for voting, but he didn't list them here and so his anger at being questioned later makes little sense.

I thought I had, but it was late and I was very tired. Read the next post, I'm sure I fell asleep at some point.

Thyrllan, on 11 October 2009 - 08:52 PM, said:

Alkend, on 10 October 2009 - 12:44 AM, said:

Well I like the OMGUS vote, but I'm not removing. Not like it matters anyway, this is always dead time on the forum and we ain't getting a lynch.

For the record, Thyr, I didn't vote Amp and you for 'moving the game forward,' I did it for your cutesy interaction. I already told you I skimmed catching up because most of this thread is garbage so far. I didn't even notice you were trying to move the game along, I just saw some bold votes and read the text around them and groaned.

Here Alkend actually admits to voting because Ampelas and I had a "cutesy interaction". "I just saw the bold votes and read the text around them and groaned"? What the hell?

Kalse, on 10 October 2009 - 05:05 PM, said:

It could be that whoever said the Klingons don't have full NK abilities might have been right, although I still tend to think that is optimistic.

Ampelas, on 09 October 2009 - 10:58 PM, said:

*sigh* What I get for trying to get things started.

So, we have:

- Alkend, who initially goes for Thyrllan then decides that people prefer Ampelas.
- Anthras, who doesn't drop a vote but has decided that I'm suspicious because I tried to get things moving by mentioning his name earlier.
- Korlat, who doesn't like nice people.
- Kalse, who also happens to be someone who I've raised suspicions of a kind about.

You know, of those reasons I actually find Korlat's the least scummy? Says something about the other's motives...

Your post says absolutely nothing about my motives, in fact your post merely strawmans me. Did you even read my reasons for voting you? No the case against you wasn't great, when are they on day 1? And you were seeding whatever you try to argue otherwise. May have been simple lack of confidence in what you were saying, but people are frequently lynched for less. (I bloody well know I have been!) Your suspicion against me was that I was testing the waters or some such…well, what's the difference with what you were doing? Except I commented once on something that seemed odd to me, and what seemed equally odd was that no-one commented on it. I now know why, but not being good at alt guessing it didn't occur to me that RL was interfering in the game. Besides Korlat stated I was symping you, and I'll be buggered if I let that accusation slide, just because I'm the only one with a sense of humour!

That said, given there were no deaths I am actually glad now we didn't have a lynch, as we haven't got a brilliant history day 1 no matter what anyone says (and having reread whilst NOT being half asleep I do think it was more an attempt to get discussion going - and yes I was having a blast talking Star Trek trivia, so bite me. I love Star Trek and for some strange reason hardly ever get the chance to indulge my passion! ).

Notice his post where he votes above. How does that coincide with his account here? And just read his post. The only actual points he makes are that he was afraid of being branded a symp and that ampelas was seeding. He placed the third vote for that? By his definition, Kalse was seeding himself, as quoted earlier, and his seeding seems to my mind far more suspicious. Kalse's post just does not make sense from the perspective of an innocent. At least to my mind.

I wasn't going to be around for end of day, and as I said earlier I honestly believed the only way to prove you aren't a symp was to vote for your so called master...I was wrong, but it's a lesson I won't forget in a hurry! I really don't get where I was 'seeding'. Surely if that was the case I would have mentioned a few more names. All I was doing was (over)reacting to an accusation. But I get criticised for not being passionate enough so I thought I should bite back at being strawmanned...and I don't care what you are saying, Amp was strawmanning me.

Thyrllan, on 11 October 2009 - 08:52 PM, said:

Alkend, on 11 October 2009 - 02:12 AM, said:

I AM A SHEEP.

Vote Korlat

I would rather vote Ampelas simply because Thyrllan opened up today with more QQ-style posting. Speed lynches are definitely bad in most cases, but isn't anyone else at least somewhat concerned with how Ampelas didn't manage to pick up any votes from the last group people who showed up in the day?

He votes korlat because he's a sheep, but would rather vote ampelas or me for his "case" of day 1? Alkend gives no reason for voting korlat. He would like to vote for ampelas or me, but he votes someone else entirely for no reason giving outside of being a sheep. And this is supposed to help the inno faction?

Alkend, on 11 October 2009 - 05:11 AM, said:

All I got out of that is,

"Waaaa, I appear to be crying over voting for someone else." First Ampelas, now Korlat?

All I get out of this is. "I have no good arguments for doing what I do so instead I try to marginalize the content of Thryllans posts to make it seem that there's nothing to his arguments"


In the end, Kalse and Alkend stand out as my two main candidates for scum. In the end, even though I hold that Alkend definitly do not play for anyone but himself, Kalse seems the more suspicious of the two. Alkend seems somewhat daft, and definitly unwilling to play this game as part of the inno team, but that alone does not make him scum. The way kalse's been playing, and how he reacted to being called out. To me that is much more scummy than Alkend's play.

Kalse

Really don't know what else to say, I clearly don't see things the way others do. And I suspect it's too late in the day to do any good, so I'll just go and have an emo weep in a dark corner!




Edit: And just to put the tin lid on it I've mucked up the quoting...I hope it still makes sense!

This post has been edited by Kalse: 12 October 2009 - 04:52 PM

[Atrahal]

Ok finally got on a computer. After looking at the train several posts jump out at me.

First Tennes, absolutely no qualms about laying a vote down on what to me appeared to be nothing more then a day one strawman case. Your enthusiasm for what was the only case that had been presented smacks of scum trying to hope on to a quick lynch.

Tennes, on 11 October 2009 - 02:05 AM, said:

Oh wow. Nice. That's actually really good, I'm gonna go with that.

vote Korlat

Next up is Alkend, who makes even less of an attempt to disguise hurry to lynch. He votes 7 minutes after Tennes.

Alkend, on 11 October 2009 - 02:12 AM, said:

I AM A SHEEP.

Vote Korlat

I would rather vote Ampelas simply because Thyrllan opened up today with more QQ-style posting. Speed lynches are definitely bad in most cases, but isn't anyone else at least somewhat concerned with how Ampelas didn't manage to pick up any votes from the last group people who showed up in the day?

This post from Karosis is perhaps the most interesting of all three. Not because it looks scummy like the other two but because it gives us an idea of what we are playing against. It also could also explain why Alkend followed Tennes vote so quickly. Was there a real hurry to lynch then. I don't think so. But Alkend didn't waste a second in putting the third vote on Korlat.

Karosis, on 11 October 2009 - 09:35 AM, said:

if people want to see how the mechanic worked why not just look on modcraft? basically the klingons have a saboteur and he sends in a random number which affects a system. each roled character has a system, in the last kirk had a phaser, bones a tricorder and spock a star trekkie thing which made him like a finder. one broken aspect of the first was that kirk knew bones, bones knew spock, and spock knew kirk. and ina game of like seven players it made it impossible for the klingons. no doubt gk has fixed that issue. i also find it highly unlikely the klingons have symps, even a non trekkie like me knows enough to say they are distinctive pastie head looking folk and would have trouble blending in. That said why would they not know each other at start? with 17 players it is unlikely that they have a voting block of four to begin with. inthe last one i think they had a commander and the others all knew who he was but he didnt know them and they didnt know each other. in that case the telas stuff does look promising as a signal. no doubt the mods have tweaked the game heavily but some of the original aspects must remain.

game thread

now gk kept the spoilers hidden for the reason of this game, but you can discern some rules reading it.

vote korlat

i didnt like telas response, and if you knew each other and which to talk of things unrelated to a game of mafia then why do it on thread when others can only judge what is written in context of the game?

Now while I don't nessasarily disagree with Thyrllan's case on Kalse I feel that tennes is suspicious enough to warrent more pressure and is probably scum.


Vote Tennes

[Kaschan]

Kalse, on 12 October 2009 - 04:32 PM, said:

Just read Kaschan's post - well I voted with 45ish mins to go, I might or might not have been around at end of day (something had come up). I gave him time to provide a defense, but nothing was forthcoming....I'm not sure what else I was expected to do at that point and I really fail to see the difference between Amp's vote and mine, except about 43 mins!

I see where you are coming from.. but there is a difference. At that point you hadn't said you might not be back, you are only saying that now, after the fact. You actually said in your post before your vote that you will be around till the break. Like I said, of the 2 of you I have more of a scum vibe for tennes.....and you certainly come off as sincere here in your defense. Just some things aren't adding up. Thyr has a well thought out post and what he says makes sense. If it looks like we can get a Tennes lynch I would rather go there though.. I just don't see it happening.

vote tennes

see my above post for explanation

[Kaschan]

X post with Atrahal... and now it looks like we are symping the crap out of Kalse -.-

[Alkend]

4 Kalse, 3 Tennes. Congrats on stalling a lynch.

Remove Vote
Vote Kalse

[Kalse]

Kaschan re your post about my not saying, etc - I know you are right. Small things at the time take on much more importance later on...if we knew what they were at the time this game would be so much easier! I should have made it clearer in my vote post though.

*Hypocrite alert* Now that I have had a chance to read the other cases, Amp makes some very good points about Tennes making backward justifications regarding possible symping and for some reason I find I prefer that case to the one on me.

Seriously though has Tennes been around to defend himself? I'll take another look before I vote.



Edit: Cross post

This post has been edited by Kalse: 12 October 2009 - 05:35 PM

[Alkend]

To clarify for you, you are stalling out the Kalse lynch in a major way.

I suppose I could just vote Tennes and see if anyone else will switch over to vote him off. But L-2 is closer than L-3 considering how we barely got a lynch yesterday.

[Kalse]

No he hasn't been on, and I won't be around for end of day...moral dilemma...not that it appears that my vote makes a difference
...and whatever I do now I'll be damned for it!

Vote Tennes



Edit: Cross post

This post has been edited by Kalse: 12 October 2009 - 05:43 PM

[Path-Shaper]

Day 3, 2 hours and 19 mins left

13 people are still alive: Alkend, Ampelas, Atrahal, Kalse, Karosis, Kaschan, Korbas, Korvalain,Thyrlann, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn,

7 votes to lynch or go to night

5 votes Kalse (Thyrlann, Karosis, Korvalain, Tulas Shorn, Alkend,)
1 vote Alkend (Telas)
4 votes Tennes (Ampelas, Atrahal, Kaschan, Kalse,)

3 people haven't voted (Korbas, Tellan, Tennes,)

[Kaschan]

Alkend, on 12 October 2009 - 05:38 PM, said:

To clarify for you, you are stalling out the Kalse lynch in a major way.

I suppose I could just vote Tennes and see if anyone else will switch over to vote him off. But L-2 is closer than L-3 considering how we barely got a lynch yesterday.

Thank you for the Clarification, but I don't remember asking for any. Your abrasive attitude is wearing thin. grow up Alk. I said I would be here all day. I said I would vote for Kalse or Tennes as they fit the scum profile from the prior lynch train. There is still more than 2 hours to go, why get your panties in a bunch over furthering the discussion... hmmmm



You have now successfully made me not want to switch my vote, just to spite you. cause, honestly... it would be funny.

[Kaschan]

The problem is... if we don't lynch Kalse now, all we will talk about tomorrow is... "Why couldn't we lynch him"... "people are protecting him"... "well, we better lynch him, just to be sure" even if we get a Tennes lynch, we have to deal with that element.

I'd rather not. just get it over with now, and look at Tennes tomorrow., he hasn't been here to defend himself anyway.

remove vote

vote Kalse

Alkend, you have done nothing beneficial to team inno this whole game. Awesome play. sorry we are boring you.