[Werthead]

Interesting to see people's reaction to Faile changes after reading the new book...

[Slick Mongoose]

Quote

Try 'A New Spring' first. It's a small novel. If you like it, move on to WoT. If not, you know enough.

Or not. That's 2nd only to Crossroads of Twilight in the list of worst Jordan books.

Quote

If you want a fun series then read it certainly, it is worth reading, take the pain in 6, 7, 8 & 9 and then hopefully a decent finish in the last 3. 10 is ok not on par with the first ones but better than the late middle.

I hope you meant 11. Book 10 was the worst fantasy book i've ever read.

And 6 was good. I don't know why some people like the previous books but not that one. 7 is where the downward slide starts.

Quote

Interesting to see people's reaction to Faile changes after reading the new book...

I've never minded Faile, just the tedious storyline she found herself in.

[MecnunK]

Slick Mongoose, on 05 October 2009 - 03:31 PM, said:

Quote

Try 'A New Spring' first. It's a small novel. If you like it, move on to WoT. If not, you know enough.

Or not. That's 2nd only to Crossroads of Twilight in the list of worst Jordan books.

Quote

If you want a fun series then read it certainly, it is worth reading, take the pain in 6, 7, 8 & 9 and then hopefully a decent finish in the last 3. 10 is ok not on par with the first ones but better than the late middle.

I hope you meant 11. Book 10 was the worst fantasy book i've ever read.

And 6 was good. I don't know why some people like the previous books but not that one. 7 is where the downward slide starts.

Quote

Interesting to see people's reaction to Faile changes after reading the new book...

I've never minded Faile, just the tedious storyline she found herself in.

yeah sorry probably meant 11, cant keep track....and the fact that Fail is a total B*****h escaped your notice

[Abyss]

I've also never understood the Failehate. There are ample more annoying characters in the series, notably at certain points, Loial, Nynaeve and Egwene.

- Abyss, puts it down to overobsession with Perrin...

[Gem Windcaster]

Abyss, on 05 October 2009 - 08:55 PM, said:

I've also never understood the Failehate. There are ample more annoying characters in the series, notably at certain points, Loial, Nynaeve and Egwene.

- Abyss, puts it down to overobsession with Perrin...

Agreed, although Egwene is less annoying in the later books.

[Werthead]

Nynaeve also improves remarkably in later books. I can't really ever remember Loial being annoying, mainly because after some of his tirseome bumbling Entish behaviour had carried on for a bit he'd suddenly start caving in Trolloc skulls with a massive axe, which you have to respect.

The only major character who never really grows up is Elayne. Her total lack of any kind of feeling of responsibility or culpability for the civil war and the earlier problems caused by Rahvin is really enraging by the end of Book 11. I'm surprised no-one called her on simply not being able to be Aes Sedai and Queen at the same time, as obviously her feeling of responsibility to the White Tower is greater than it is to Andor, and that has resulted in horrendous damage to the kingdom.

[Macros]

Faile is irritating, Egwene, elayne are annoying, Basically ever Aes sedai is annoying (i forget her name but

Spoiler

old amryl seat, shes ok

)
Scratch that, every female is annoying, excepting min.
But at the the absolute
ABSOLUTE top of my hate list is Cadsuane.
ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Sixty]

You know an author's got you hooked if you absolutely loathe one of the characters but still keep reading.

Love or hate = good
Apathy = bad

This post has been edited by Sixty: 24 October 2009 - 05:03 PM

[Terez]

Macros, on 08 October 2009 - 07:06 PM, said:

Faile is irritating, Egwene, elayne are annoying, Basically ever Aes sedai is annoying (i forget her name but

Spoiler

old amryl seat, shes ok

)
Scratch that, every female is annoying, excepting min.
But at the the absolute
ABSOLUTE top of my hate list is Cadsuane.
ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Spoiler

There is something for you in this book.

[caladanbrood]

Terez, on 26 September 2009 - 11:14 PM, said:

But I can understand the frustration of hard core Malazan fans, that SE's books have not proven to be as marketable as Goodkind (gives a bad impression of the masses, for sure) - apparently most people can't read them because of all the details to keep up with. In WoT, there are a lot of details to keep up with, but they're delivered in a way that makes it easier, I think - anyone can read the books and enjoy them, but not just anyone can read them and understand everything that is going on. But the people who don't understand exactly what is going on are just surprised when the truth comes out - it's not confusing to read.

This is interesting actually, if slightly necro-ing the post, but I actually found WoT easy to read only at a superficial level. Once I tried to look much deeper into it, it was a pretty hard slog, whereas with Erikson he just drops random details in so naturally I hardly noticed that's what he was doing. But that's just me.

Of course the advantage of Jordan is that he didn't decide to make half the characters deep ponderers of the nature of life the universe and everything after the first four books...

[Terez]

Right, it's a give and take to me. Yes, RJ is very easy to read on the surface, though it gets difficult for casual fans after book 6 because there are more characters to keep up with and not so much action to keep you engaged. But digging deep into RJ is purposefully a slog - he makes many issues very debatable, and the clues are scattered to the winds through the series, except on the counterintuitive ones, like "Lews Therin is not actually talking to Rand, but Rand has created the illusion of that in order to disassociate himself from Lews Therin". There's tons of evidence for that in every Rand chapter but a few, going back way before the memories, but RJ could get away with that, because he made the theory sooo counterintuitive that he can dump tons of evidence for it without being obvious.

I love Erikson's philosophical rants with some characters. With other characters, it bores the hell out of me. But that's just me. I love Eriksons' breaks from cliche, but I love RJ's deceptive use of them. I feel like I miss less plot points by skimming through the dress descriptions than I do by skimming through the more boring philosophical rants of SE.

[Roldom]

i have to admit that when i bought my 1st malazan book, MoI, i found it hard to get past the 1st few chapters, took me about 2 years and 4 attempts! ( bad i know but i was only about 18 and to busy going out getting drunk to give it the time it deserved) during that time i read WoT and it really helped get me out of the more simplistic fantasy book rut that i found myself in, and now MoI is probz my favourite book of all time, and i love the malazan universe!


generaly I enjoyed the wheel of time, tho ive only read RJ's 11, havent seen the 12th yet. But i do understand why everyone thinks its pretty repetative, they enemys are quite archtypical, but some of the plot lines are good, i thnk the world of dreams is a great idea, as is the whole wolf arc of the story,
sadly Trollocs are just orcs spelt differently but the fades were a kinda new idea, tho similar to the ringwraths of Lotr now i come to think about it....

just imagine if rands insanity made him more like iskaral pust? now that would make a great story....

ps eddings was one of the 1st fantasy authers i read back when i was about 12 and i loved it, reread alot of his stuff and while its incredibly simplistic still find it readable....and proberbly a good way to get younger readers into fantasy. glad i read it whilest young as rereads nowadays leave my yawning a little
that said there is no excuse for the dreamers books he wrote, they were truly awefull (i want to rip out my eyes and throw them against a wall style aweful) in my opinion

[Thelomen Toblerone]

I have, on so very few occasions, experienced the level of hatred I have for Elayne. Egwene is also a massive bitch, Cadsuane deserves to die horribly, most of the female characters are at best mildly irritating. But Elayne is by such a margint he most disagreeable character I've come across, that my rage reading her scenes is boundless. Every sentence she doesn't die in some gruesome and horrible way, I die myself a little inside.

If there's any justice in the world, in the next book

Spoiler

she will die in childbirth, a horrifically lengthy labour culminating in death from massive haemorrhaging due to a monstrously torn vagina.

[haroos]

Thelomen Toblerone, on 03 October 2010 - 08:34 PM, said:

I have, on so very few occasions, experienced the level of hatred I have for Elayne. Egwene is also a massive bitch, Cadsuane deserves to die horribly, most of the female characters are at best mildly irritating. But Elayne is by such a margint he most disagreeable character I've come across, that my rage reading her scenes is boundless. Every sentence she doesn't die in some gruesome and horrible way, I die myself a little inside.

If there's any justice in the world, in the next book

Spoiler

she will die in childbirth, a horrifically lengthy labour culminating in death from massive haemorrhaging due to a monstrously torn vagina.

lol "i die a little " ...
if it weren't for my respect to RJ, after his death, i would be probably ranting alot about wot.
there are no good sides to wot, except for it's impact in the genre.

but ... i started reading it 16 years ago ... and some of those years since were among the most enjoyable for me as a fantasy reader.
so i keep the rants at low level since his death.

[Terez]

Thelomen Toblerone, on 03 October 2010 - 08:34 PM, said:

I have, on so very few occasions, experienced the level of hatred I have for Elayne. Egwene is also a massive bitch, Cadsuane deserves to die horribly, most of the female characters are at best mildly irritating. But Elayne is by such a margint he most disagreeable character I've come across, that my rage reading her scenes is boundless. Every sentence she doesn't die in some gruesome and horrible way, I die myself a little inside.

If there's any justice in the world, in the next book

Spoiler

she will die in childbirth, a horrifically lengthy labour culminating in death from massive haemorrhaging due to a monstrously torn vagina.

Wow. She reminds you of who girl that was too good for you, doesn't she?

I think the most disagreeable character I've come across by a fair margin was ...

Spoiler

...Felisin. Her death was too easy. I only felt bad for Tavore.

This post has been edited by Terez: 03 October 2010 - 09:11 PM

[Illuyankas]

Surely ranting about it is easier now since he can't possibly be offended.

[Aptorian]

Terez, on 03 October 2010 - 08:49 PM, said:

Thelomen Toblerone, on 03 October 2010 - 08:34 PM, said:

I have, on so very few occasions, experienced the level of hatred I have for Elayne. Egwene is also a massive bitch, Cadsuane deserves to die horribly, most of the female characters are at best mildly irritating. But Elayne is by such a margint he most disagreeable character I've come across, that my rage reading her scenes is boundless. Every sentence she doesn't die in some gruesome and horrible way, I die myself a little inside.

If there's any justice in the world, in the next book

Spoiler

she will die in childbirth, a horrifically lengthy labour culminating in death from massive haemorrhaging due to a monstrously torn vagina.

Wow. She reminds you of that girl that was too good for you, doesn't she?

I think the most disagreeable character I've come across by a fair margin was [Snip]. Her death was too easy. I only felt bad for [Snip].

Might want to spoiler that Terez...

[Terez]

I thought about it, but then I figured that everyone here had read through book 4 at least.

[Illuyankas]

There's always going to be people who haven't and the best way to prevent a forum turning into a steadily shrinking pile of circlejerk is to be inviting to new guys, and that doesn't involve spoilers from books outside their specific forums, I'm afraid.

I'd still stick a MBOTF spoiler tag on that, but that's just me.

Also stupid stealth edits happening when I don't refresh the page.

This post has been edited by Illuyankas: 03 October 2010 - 09:22 PM

[Defiance]

haroos, on 03 October 2010 - 08:44 PM, said:

there are no good sides to wot, except for it's impact in the genre.

...what?

Just because it's impacted the genre doesn't mean it's necessarily a good thing. I mean, just replaced "wot" with "Twilight." Twilight has had an impact, but I don't think anyone here would say that was for the better.

I read the first seven books and about 100 pages of the eight before I gave up for the same reasons as most people.

Min might be my favorite character from the series. She's certainly the only female (at least that I can recall) that I'd rather fuck than kill.

Lan must have gotten some wonderful handjobs from Nynaeve with all the tugging she does (on second thought, maybe not).

I also liked how Rand became a bigger asshole the more power he got.