[Tiste Simeon]

They should give up on Spiderman, renounce the third movie and publicly lynch the man responsible for it. Then go and make something good.

[D'rek]

The most common villain speculation I've heard for spidey-4 is lizard-man, Peter's one-armed professor from #2 and #3, who comic-wise gets mutated into a giant lizard whilst trying to regrow his arm. The idea is that the little sample of venom that the prof guy tested in the 3rd would be used by him for its regenerative capabilities but would turn him into lizard-man.

Of course, it's a terrible, terrible idea. First of all, there's already been a good-guy-turned-bad-for-personal-ambition, and that was Doc-Oc in #2, so nothing new there. Secondly, they did 3 villains last movie, so doing only 1, not very interesting villain will fail miserably. And Thirdly, lizard-man has no talents beyond being strong and taking a punch, it would be the most boring-ass progression of battles ever. They could try and work on that with some lizard-camouflage or something, but frankly all the villains so far have been able to miraculously hide in plain sight so this wont be much of a change, either.

Kingpin could possibly be good if they got him to assemble his evil team, you know, rhino, shocker, vulture, etc. A spidey-vs-evil-team could be a slight improvement over the last 2 movies. Unlikely, though.

[Abyss]

My inner former comic geek self demands that i point out it's 'The Lizard', not 'Lizard-Man'. The fact that they have included one-armed doctor repeatedly suggests they are keeping that option open. That said, i'm betting on the following:

1) Insanely sexy actress cast as 'The Black Cat'.

2) At least two villains. If they do go with Kingpin (aside: M Duncan Clark as the Kingpin was an awesome bit of casting in a bad flic, and i don't know who they could get who would top that) as the brains of the operation there's a ton of Spidey villains they can send in as muscle. Electro and/or the Shocker seem like easy ones to do with CGI. Venom in 3 leaves the door open to Carnage in 4. etc etc.

The sick part is that for all that it was complete tripe, the movie made dollars and the studio may not step up much for the next one.

- Abyss, ...sees perhaps a Trek-like pattern developing - 1 was weak, 2 was great, 3 eye bleedingly bad, 4...

[Aptorian]

Off the top of my head, spidey villains I think they could make a good film out of...

Kingpin of course.

Mysterio, it could be an extremely confusing/awesome memento'ish film with reality and fiction blurring

The Hobgoblin, some story about him finding Osborn tech, possibly fighting the Kingping for the underworld

Silvermane, the cybernetic body version. This guy was cool, but would probably not work unless introduced in a prior films, for example at war with the kingpin.

The Jackal, the guy who cloned Parker and created all those crazy clones. Again, this would probably only work if he'd been introduced before.

If they really had top top the 3 villains of the third film I guess the best option would be to use the sinister six, allthough that could become a real mess if they attempted to give them all a story.

[Illuyankas]

Mysterio could only be played by Bruce Campbell.

[caladanbrood]

Tiste Simeon, on Jun 9 2009, 06:12 PM, said:

They should give up on Spiderman, renounce the third movie and publicly lynch the man responsible for it. Then go and make something good.

Yeah, it made literally no money, so this is very likely to happen.



Oh. Wait

[Abyss]

They could do a revamped Sinister Six and just pick six random Spidey villains, give them a new look, set them up as Kingpin's enforcers and not worry about backstory beyond an identifiable visual for each to facilitate the action figures.

Mysterio would be a good one but only if they skipped the big fishbowl on his head. Jackal is too tied to the Clone mess - i can't see them going there for a few more films. Technically they already did Hobgoblin with Harry back in 3. Tombstone is a good one. Easy to do the makeup and effects. Rhino... i can't see it.... look at the Juggernaut in XM3 for why not. Spider-slayer robots would be easy CGI. Scorpion... CGI could do it but notwithstanding the good work they did with Doc Ock in 2, it would be silly... his primary weapon is on his ass. Tarantula would be a fun one to update... martial artist with blades... on his boots... umm, maybe not. Vulture... nah. Silvermane is sort of obscure. Kraven... Kraven's a good one. Play up the whole urban hunter angle and it could be neat.

- Abyss, amazed how many of those he remembered just from the thinkymeatz...

[Aptorian]

I always hated Kraven, I thought he was a silly villain, even for that day and age. But then they did the story of his death and I was completely blown, by far my favorite story from back when.

[Cause]

A mob war between silvermane and the kingpin with spidey in the middle. Throw in throw away henchmen like hammerhead for once of fights.

Otherwise Electro has the possibility to be insanely powerful

[Icarium Kalam]

venom? don't really think that was resolved in the 3rd one.

[Cause]

I got it. We had sand man now bring on the hydro man.

[D'rek]

Venom comes back, Carnage appears, Spidey almost loses to them but is saved by Warmachine, at which point you realize it is an exact copy of the 90s cartoon's symbiote series, and you revel in the awesomeness of such a thing. I forget who's masterminding that whole thing... doctor strange or something.

[Aptorian]

Icarium Kalam, on Jun 10 2009, 01:02 AM, said:

venom? don't really think that was resolved in the 3rd one.

Oh but it was. Peter parker made a fence of iron girder and made them vibrate by hitting them (because we all know that a construct like a iron girder is made to vibrate in perfect unison) and then while Venom is weak he is hit by a goblin grenade and turns into a very small pile of ash. The writers left absolutly no sane possibility of Venom returning. And they never showed Venom dropping a small bit of seed anywhere, like we saw in the comics when Carnage was born.

Generally the whole venom story was so poorly handled during that film that I don't think its worth it to even mention the symbiote again.¨¨

D'rek, on Jun 10 2009, 04:17 AM, said:

Venom comes back, Carnage appears, Spidey almost loses to them but is saved by Warmachine, at which point you realize it is an exact copy of the 90s cartoon's symbiote series, and you revel in the awesomeness of such a thing. I forget who's masterminding that whole thing... doctor strange or something.

Well, in the comics, it was Carnage himself just tearing up the city for fun with other psycopaths. In the cartoon... was it masterminded by someone else? I know there was some bullshit with time travel and other timeline spider-men, but I only remember that old psychic spiderwoman being involved.

[Yellow]

Venom was done so, so badly in 3. The whole thing was a great big catastrophe. They should walk away from this one - just rip everyone's contracts up and walk away.

[dktorode]

Yes these are all cool options but wich one of these besides King Pin is "a big part of New York." Which the producer has confirmed.

[D'rek]

Aptorian, on Jun 9 2009, 10:23 PM, said:

D'rek, on Jun 10 2009, 04:17 AM, said:

Venom comes back, Carnage appears, Spidey almost loses to them but is saved by Warmachine, at which point you realize it is an exact copy of the 90s cartoon's symbiote series, and you revel in the awesomeness of such a thing. I forget who's masterminding that whole thing... doctor strange or something.

Well, in the comics, it was Carnage himself just tearing up the city for fun with other psycopaths. In the cartoon... was it masterminded by someone else? I know there was some bullshit with time travel and other timeline spider-men, but I only remember that old psychic spiderwoman being involved.

In the 90s cartoon one, Venom comes back on a space-shuttle crash (Jameson Jr. piloting of course), and Kingpin sends Rhino to steal something from the crash. Brock takes photos of Spidey at the crash-site, but misses the rhino completely so spidey gets slandered by Jameson Sr who then puts a bounty on him. He starts doubting his heroic self. Symbiote latches on to him and feeds on his doubts. He goes and beats up Rhino much more viciously then he would have otherwise. Also confronts some mercenaries trying to get the bounty and he's whooping their butts until they use a sonic-wave weapon and he retreats thinking 'wtf?'. Also thoroughly enjoying his new abilities, like magic clothing-changing and physical enhancements, becomes quite a womanizer too!

There's some more clashes between Rhino and Shocker (both working for Kingpin), and he has control issues with not killing them (at one point he decides not to kill Shocker and then the symbiote acts on its own and pushes him off a building anyway). Confronts Brock, ties him up in a bell tower. The bell rings right next to him and the symbiote retreats (sonic vibrations bad for symbiote). Spidey goes home, symbiote takes over Brock.

This is the cool part - Spidey tries to go about his regular life and Venom keeps fucking things up for him behind the scenes. Fights Rhino and Shocker again, would've lost but Venom intervenes then leaves spidey webbed, hanging and unmasked in a busy street. Eventually spidey lures him, beats him and throws the symbiote on a launching space shuttle.


^That's the alien-costume saga. The Carnage bit comes in 2 episodes much later when the symbiote returns and rebonds with Brock, who promptly breaks out of the insane asylum. It's orchestrated by Dormammu who sends Venom to steal some Stark device. Fight ensues between Warmachine and spidey and Venom fails. Needing some help, Venom gets his former asylum-mate symbioted and thus Carnage. Carnage goes around killing a billion people in the streets while Venom goes to the Daily Bugle for some vengeance. It all culimnates in a big showdown between Spidey, Iron Man & Warmachine versus Venom, Carnage, Baron Mondo and Dormammu. Yum

[Aptorian]

D'rek, on Jun 10 2009, 03:06 PM, said:

^That's the alien-costume saga. The Carnage bit comes in 2 episodes much later when the symbiote returns and rebonds with Brock, who promptly breaks out of the insane asylum. It's orchestrated by Dormammu who sends Venom to steal some Stark device. Fight ensues between Warmachine and spidey and Venom fails. Needing some help, Venom gets his former asylum-mate symbioted and thus Carnage. Carnage goes around killing a billion people in the streets while Venom goes to the Daily Bugle for some vengeance. It all culimnates in a big showdown between Spidey, Iron Man & Warmachine versus Venom, Carnage, Baron Mondo and Dormammu. Yum

I don't think I've seen the same carnage episodes as you. I remember watching this story where Carnage for some reason is travelling through time destroying... places I think... with bombs... or something. Anyway, the seer spider lady opens up portals and gathers spidermen from different timelines, one is a sixarmed peter parker, one is a rich peter parker with an iron man spider costume, etc. etc. they fight carnage and some other random evil spider baddies and I have no clue how it ended.

[Bauchelain the Evil]

Pity that, as Apt said, Venom cannot possibly cme back unless they do something incredibly ridiculus. And even if they manage to do that I've no more faith in Spiderman movies after the horrible thing that was called Spiderman 3. Even it is only half as horrible as SM 3 it would still be awful.
Anyway which of Spidey most serious enemies are left?
Vulture: orrible even in the comics and too easy to beat
Carnage: without Venom you can't do it
Kingpin:not a bad idea, they could throw some supervillains as henchmen so Spidey can kick asses and won't understand that Kingpin is behind everything until it's too late.
Lizard: seeing how the on-armed doctor has appeared it's possible and I've actually liked Lizardespecially when he started to control reptilians to invade New York
Rhino: big dumb guy who just charges people, not good
Electro: actually a good idea, powerful enough to kick Spidey's ass at the beginning and they could put a great beginning scene with a huge thunderstorm and Electro hit by the lightning.
Kraven:good scenes with the city hunt
Mysterio:if they can handle it, and I very much doubt it, his illusions could have great efect on Spiderman

[Abyss]

I remember this - it was from the second (or third or whatever) cartoon series - the one with the guitar riff at the beginning that ran for like four years, not the one where Spidey spends the whole time in a thinly disguised bi-sexual open relationship with Iceman, Firestar and a bichon frise.

The Spideys of like six realities (Best bit - they are trading origins and Spidey looks at the 'Scarlett Spider clone saga Spidey' and says 'Actually, i don't even wanna know what your story is".) had to keep dimension hopping to stop SpideyCarnage from detonating a reality destroying bomb that tied in to like three previous plotlines. The rest of the Spideys die or go nuts and get taken out but Spidey eventually stops Spidercarnage and then Madam Web rewards him by saying she was going to reunite him with Mary Jane who was dead or vanished or something by then but the series got cancelled and no one ever knew wtf the freakt old woman was talking about until the writers did an interview.



- Abyss, ...alternately liked and despised that series...

[Aptorian]

Abyss, on Jun 10 2009, 04:40 PM, said:

I remember this - it was from the second (or third or whatever) cartoon series - the one with the guitar riff at the beginning that ran for like four years, not the one where Spidey spends the whole time in a thinly disguised bi-sexual open relationship with Iceman, Firestar and a bichon frise.

The Spideys of like six realities (Best bit - they are trading origins and Spidey looks at the 'Scarlett Spider clone saga Spidey' and says 'Actually, i don't even wanna know what your story is".) had to keep dimension hopping to stop SpideyCarnage from detonating a reality destroying bomb that tied in to like three previous plotlines. The rest of the Spideys die or go nuts and get taken out but Spidey eventually stops Spidercarnage and then Madam Web rewards him by saying she was going to reunite him with Mary Jane who was dead or vanished or something by then but the series got cancelled and no one ever knew wtf the freakt old woman was talking about until the writers did an interview.

- Abyss, ...alternately liked and despised that series...

Yes, this is the episode(s) I was talking about. Cool and awfull at the same time.

@ Bauchelin - I liked the Vulture. I thought he was usually a cool oldschool supervillain. I especially liked the revamp of him where he became a lifesucking supervillain, who at one time stole Spidermans youth.