[Terez]

HoosierDaddy, on Jun 25 2009, 03:11 PM, said:

I'm a Fanboy. The 3 are the key to victory for the entire plot. Not including one in a book is ridiculous.

Then why did you say it got out of hand around The Path of Daggers, but not around The Fires of Heaven? Cause there was no Perrin in that book.

Also, there was very little Rand in The Dragon Reborn despite the book focusing on him, and there was even less of him in Crossroads of Twilight (which I admit sucked, because I love Rand, but I enjoyed the Perrin and Mat chapters in that book, and the Elayne and Egwene chapters, and the prologue was good stuff too).

[Tarcanus]

Quote

I notice no one complained when Perrin disappeared for The Fires of Heaven. Why? Because Perrin does not have fanboys. Mat has fanboys.

That's because in The Shadow Rising, Perrin had a kick-ass plot progression in the Two Rivers, and so (for me at least) I could buy the fact that he wasn't in The Fires of Heaven - he had very important things to be doing back in the Two Rivers.

Mat was stuck under a building.

[HoosierDaddy]

Because I forgot that Perrin wasn't in Fires of Heaven? Lol.

[Abyss]

Tarcanus, on Jun 25 2009, 04:14 PM, said:

...
Mat was stuck under a building.

For like six years.

- Abyss, could say matt was 'stoned' the whole time...

[Terez]

Abyss, on Jun 25 2009, 03:28 PM, said:

Tarcanus, on Jun 25 2009, 04:14 PM, said:

...
Mat was stuck under a building.

For like six years.

I think we have had this conversation before, but for everyone else, it was only 39 days according to the WoT Chronology. Less, actually, but that's how many days in the story pass between the time the building falls on him and the next time we see him. Also, it was only 4 years, 5 months, and 18 days between the publications of A Crown of Swords and Winter's Heart. AND, for those who were not fans of the series at the time, it would probably take the average fanboy about a week to get past Mat's time under the building, if that.

Abyss said:

- Abyss, could say matt was 'stoned' the whole time...

I like it. Also, primitive healing and pain relief supports your hypothesis (it's not as if he had an Aes Sedai on hand when it happened).

[HoosierDaddy]

I would imagine some of the damane would have healing abilities.

[stone monkey]

Terez, on Jun 25 2009, 09:38 PM, said:

Also, it was only 4 years, 5 months, and 18 days between the publications of A Crown of Swords and Winter's Heart. AND, for those who were not fans of the series at the time, it would probably take the average fanboy about a week to get past Mat's time under the building, if that.

Abyss said:

- Abyss, could say matt was 'stoned' the whole time...

I like it. Also, primitive healing and pain relief supports your hypothesis (it's not as if he had an Aes Sedai on hand when it happened).

I was a fan of the series at the time and it did piss me off no end...

[Terez]

Only the Aes Sedai they have captured. The Seachan (Karede comes to mind) have expressed extreme discomfort for the idea of being touched with the Power for Healing, since it was discovered that the Aes Sedai do it.

[HoosierDaddy]

Terez, on Jun 25 2009, 04:53 PM, said:

Only the Aes Sedai they have captured. The Seachan (Karede comes to mind) have expressed extreme discomfort for the idea of being touched with the Power for Healing, since it was discovered that the Aes Sedai do it.

But Tylin wouldn't want her Matty-Watty to be all hurt and stuff. (This is, of course, ignoring the power-voider.)

[Terez]

HoosierDaddy, on Jun 25 2009, 03:54 PM, said:

Terez, on Jun 25 2009, 04:53 PM, said:

Only the Aes Sedai they have captured. The Seachan (Karede comes to mind) have expressed extreme discomfort for the idea of being touched with the Power for Healing, since it was discovered that the Aes Sedai do it.

But Tylin wouldn't want her Matty-Watty to be all hurt and stuff. (This is, of course, ignoring the power-voider.)

Yeah well, the Aes Sedai she had on hand took off. Tuon did have one damane in her personal belongings that could have done it, but the descriptions of Mat's recovery make it obvious she wasn't used (Tylin would probably have been scared to ask).

[Abyss]

Terez, on Jun 25 2009, 04:38 PM, said:

Abyss, on Jun 25 2009, 03:28 PM, said:

Tarcanus, on Jun 25 2009, 04:14 PM, said:

...
Mat was stuck under a building.

For like six years.

I think we have had this conversation before, but for everyone else, it was only 39 days according to the WoT Chronology. Less, actually, but that's how many days in the story pass between the time the building falls on him and the next time we see him. Also, it was only 4 years, 5 months, and 18 days between the publications of A Crown of Swords and Winter's Heart. AND, for those who were not fans of the series at the time, it would probably take the average fanboy about a week to get past Mat's time under the building, if that.
...

Tomato, tomahto, he spent six years under a wall. And i could be wrong, but didn't RJ even release a book during that time, and not even acknowledge that Matt spends the entire book being exfoliated by falled bricks?

ETA he did, he TOTALLY DID!. he spent an entire book without even acnowledging Mat was under a wall!!!

Wait, backup, are you saying in book time he spent 40 days under the pile of bricks?!?!

HoosierDaddy, on Jun 25 2009, 04:54 PM, said:

...This is, of course, ignoring the power-voider.)

I didn't know she used laxatives on him.

Mind you, after six years, i bet he was all kinds of bunged up...

- Abyss, always knew Matt rocked...

[Terez]

Abyss, on Jun 25 2009, 04:17 PM, said:

And i could be wrong, but didn't RJ even release a book during that time, and not even acknowledge that Matt spends the entire book being exfoliated by falled bricks?

Ha, yeah he did, but he was asked about it on the promotional book tour, where it was acknowledged that Mat was under a pile of bricks.

Abyss said:

Wait, backup, are you saying in book time he spent 40 days under the pile of bricks?!?!

No, just that he was only out of the story for that long.

Also, it was obvious that Tylin wore the pants in that relationship. The fact that she liked dressing him up in pink was telling.

[globish rip]

I'm a Fanboy. The 3 are the key to victory for the entire plot. Not including one in a book is ridiculous.

hes the best of the three ta'veren but dude just isnt that important and there are too many characters to include all of them in every book. i mean if u think RJ lost the plot now just imagine how unfocused and unruly the books would be if he tried to keep every stroyline going. dude was injured and then recuperating *shrug* makes sense to keep him off scrn

of course this is easier to say now that i can read the books back-to-back

in terms of rand dying vs. lews therin dying - idk if its that far-fetched to think that the series will conclude w/ rand living. didnt min have a viewing or two indicating that one of them and only one of them has to die? i thought there were other things that foreshadowed this as well - maybe the aelfinn? or maybe one of nicola's foretellings?

[Terez]

eng lng rip, on Jun 25 2009, 09:14 PM, said:

hes the best of the three ta'veren but dude just isnt that important and there are too many characters to include all of them in every book. i mean if u think RJ lost the plot now just imagine how unfocused and unruly the books would be if he tried to keep every stroyline going. dude was injured and then recuperating *shrug* makes sense to keep him off scrn

Which is what RJ said in the tour for the book - he was injured, his story would have been boring, and there were too many things going on during the time he was stuck there.

eng said:

in terms of rand dying vs. lews therin dying - idk if its that far-fetched to think that the series will conclude w/ rand living. didnt min have a viewing or two indicating that one of them and only one of them has to die?

This is the viewing she had:

RJ said:

TITLE - A Crown of Swords
CHAPTER: 33 - A Bath

She folded her arms and frowned up at him through her lashes. She chewed her lip and frowned at the door. She shook her head and muttered under her breath. At last she said, "There is only one, really. I was exaggerating. I saw you and another man. I couldn’t make out either face, but I knew one was you. You touched, and seemed to merge into one another, and... " Her mouth tightened worriedly, and she went on in a very small voice. "I don’t know what it means, Rand, except that one of you dies, and one doesn’t. I - Why are you grinning? This isn’t a joke, Rand. I do not know which of you dies."

"I’m grinning because you’ve given me very good news," he said, touching her cheek. The other man had to be Lews Therin. I’m not just insane and hearing voices, he thought, jubilant. One lived and one died, but he had known for a long time that he was going to die. At least he was not mad. Or not as far mad as he had feared. There was still the temper he could barely control.

We're pretty sure that Rand was wrong, and this vision refers to Moridin, rather than Lews Therin. Moridin is the face Rand has been seeing since The Path of Daggers, and the sickness he's been having as well.

eng said:

i thought there were other things that foreshadowed this as well - maybe the aelfinn? or maybe one of nicola's foretellings?

Nicola: he who is dead yet lives
Aelfinn: to live, you must die
Min: Alivia will "help him die"

[globish rip]

ha thanks although O_o that you have that quote so quick

We're pretty sure that Rand was wrong, and this vision refers to Moridin, rather than Lews Therin. Moridin is the face Rand has been seeing since The Path of Daggers, and the sickness he's been having as well.

okay i remember this - they touched streams of balefire that one time in college and now they're connected in some way. right that makes sense that the viewing is about moridin but i'm not sure it changes anything, really, in terms of whether or not rand *should* die

i mean the resurrection theme has been pretty clearly foreshadowed and would fit really well into the larger themes and ideas the series plays with - i dont personally think that like the epic scope of the series would be betrayed by the dude living pimp w/ his three wives after the last battle or w/e is really my point. and i dont think its a weird expectation to have either

[Terez]

Meh, I think he should die. But I won't be too terribly upset if he doesn't, or if he gets resurrected somehow.

I think the most likely scenario is that Rand will die, and not be resurrected, but he'll get called by the Horn after he dies. That way, everyone has to fight the Last Battle for at least a good while knowing that their only hope of salvation is dead. And Mat gets to ride in and save the day. And all the prophecies are fulfilled - Rand goes on "living" in Tel'aran'rhiod because Birgitte says that Heroes are not dead as other people are dead. Twice dawns the day, Shadow at noon, all that good stuff.

[HoosierDaddy]

Terez, I've learned, is fairly damned knowledgable about WoT. (By fairly damned knowledgeable, I mean she is better with WoT than the die-hards here...)

[Illuyankas]

Don't forget Mat's adopted son turning into a woman and giving birth to a six-legged horse. OK, they might not that it that far, I suppose.

[HoosierDaddy]

Illuyankas, on Jun 26 2009, 12:25 AM, said:

Don't forget Mat's adopted son turning into a woman and giving birth to a six-legged horse. OK, they might not that it that far, I suppose.

Don't forget that Illy is the King Transformer and turns into a chicken that hates you. Nevermind, it could never those though she's out of bounds space, probably.

[Terez]

Illuyankas, on Jun 25 2009, 11:25 PM, said:

Don't forget Mat's adopted son turning into a woman and giving birth to a six-legged horse. OK, they might not that it that far, I suppose.

Olver? Everyone seems to think he'll do something vitally important, but I think he already did about as much as he's going to.