[D'rek]

(In the DoD forum so discussion of later characters doesn't need spoilering)

So, yeah, been re-reading MoI and Envy has a brother.

Quote

The T'lan Imass turned her head. 'Who has granted the beast this edged gift?'
Lady Envy shrugged with delight at the opportunity to return such a gesture. 'A misguided sibling who'd thought he was being kind. All right, perhaps that was too simplistic an answer. My sibling had found the goddess, terribly damaged by the Fall, and needed a warm-blooded place to lay her spirit, so that it could heal. Serendipity. The ay's pack was dead, whilst she herself was too young to survive in normal circumstances. Worse yet, she was the last left on the entire continent.'
'Your sibling has a misplaced sense of mercy, Lady Envy.'
'I agree. We have something in common after all! How wonderful!'

Feel free to discuss who it could possibly be, from among characters already seen or heard of (not that we've definitely seen him). I would imagine Envy has the same family views as the draconean ascendants, and so this may be only a half-brother, and therefore the child of Draconus and someone other than Sheltatha, or vice versa...

This post has been edited by Impressive Clergyman: 07 March 2009 - 12:40 AM

[Silencer]

When I first read that paragraph I thought it was K'rul....don't know why. I now doubt that.

We haven't met them, and, given the nature of the Elder times, I wouldn't be surprised if the sibling is dead.

Or, she is talking about sibling in the sense that Mother Dark is, in some ways, a sibling to her - old, ancient, and related in a round-about sort of way. Grizzen Farl?

[D'rek]

Possible. But what kind of entity/person would save Fanderay/Baaljagg? This bears consideration, yes?

Seeing as Sheltatha is somewhat Edur-ish, I was thinking she could possibly be the mother of Tulas Shorn, and since he loves animals so much, it would make sense for him to have saved Fanderay/Baaljagg.

[Silencer]

Gar. I lost my post I'd made.

Summary:

Thought Tulas Shorn was dead long before the Fall (Edur succession killings).

Can't think of anybody else who is related or possibly related to Envy who is kind enough to do that.

[Illuyankas]

Good chance it's a typo, was meant to be a she and is Spite. Someone needs to find the bit of Baaljagg's memory where she meets the bandaged-handed entity who does the god-installing and see if there's any more gender identification there.

[Sinisdar Toste]

im just gonna put it out there that the only indication of gender is the word he, which could easily have been meant to be she. its only used once in the passage as well, making it impossible to confirm if she was talking about a man or woman.

depressing realities aside i think it could have been a brother of envy's, you never know, maybe draco had a little upstart of his own that made a play for Dragnipur and he had to lay the lad low.

[Lisheo]

Bandaged hand entity means K'rul. It was how he was clearly described in the prologue of MoI, and I can't see why SE would go to such lengths to describe him if it wasn't important later on.

[D'rek]

Lisheo, on Mar 6 2009, 10:06 PM, said:

Bandaged hand entity means K'rul. It was how he was clearly described in the prologue of MoI, and I can't see why SE would go to such lengths to describe him if it wasn't important later on.

Everyone is described like that. Edgewalker, K'rul, Draconus, Hood... they all wear rags for no apparent reason, seeing as they're fucking gods and you'd think those temple coffers would have enough money for a shopping spree or shower installation... I'll bet ya Mowri dresses like an Emperor...

Oh, hey, I realized. It's Orfantal. Silly me.

[Talamadas]

So that would mean "sibling" as in also eleint soletaken?
I must say that i think either the K'rul or the typo theory will be correct. We will see.

[Lisheo]

Draconus, iirc, wears rags becuase he's in Dragnipur. Edgewalker wears rags because he's dead.
Let's take them, both then.
Draconus was considered cruel, and also her father, so not him.
Edgewalker rarely leaves shadow except on a Shadow Moon.
Hood? It's possible, especially as it's the soul of the goddess, and Hood is not unkind, but he's not related to Envy in any way.
Thus, most likely, K'rul. also, it said bandage-wrapped, and K'rul was wrappped in rotting rags. And he seems kindest. See Buke(?) in MoI.

[L'oric]

Lisheo, on Mar 7 2009, 05:17 AM, said:

Draconus, iirc, wears rags becuase he's in Dragnipur. Edgewalker wears rags because he's dead.
Let's take them, both then.
Draconus was considered cruel, and also her father, so not him.
Edgewalker rarely leaves shadow except on a Shadow Moon.
Hood? It's possible, especially as it's the soul of the goddess, and Hood is not unkind, but he's not related to Envy in any way.
Thus, most likely, K'rul. also, it said bandage-wrapped, and K'rul was wrappped in rotting rags. And he seems kindest. See Buke(?) in MoI.

Doesn't Draconus call K'rul brother when they go take on Kallor along with Nightchill? Or is it the other way around? Anyway if they are "brothers" then I would think Envy would not describe him the same way. Family or relation or something along those lines.

I am going to vote not Krul either. I am going to go for typo or unknown power player. Maybe its one of the guys playing nursemaid to Killy.

Sincerely

[D'rek]

Lisheo, on Mar 7 2009, 06:17 AM, said:

Draconus, iirc, wears rags becuase he's in Dragnipur. Edgewalker wears rags because he's dead.
Let's take them, both then.
Draconus was considered cruel, and also her father, so not him.
Edgewalker rarely leaves shadow except on a Shadow Moon.
Hood? It's possible, especially as it's the soul of the goddess, and Hood is not unkind, but he's not related to Envy in any way.
Thus, most likely, K'rul. also, it said bandage-wrapped, and K'rul was wrappped in rotting rags. And he seems kindest. See Buke(?) in MoI.

I wasn't seriously considering them, just illustrating that a lot of important dudes from those days wear rags and dress shabbily...

The fact that she states the person was her sibling twice with clarity makes me think it's not just a stretch-of-phrase, and really I don't think K'rul could ever be considered her brother, he's a generation and hundreds of thousands of years or more older than her... if anything he'd be an uncle...

[T'renn]

If HE saved Fanderay, maybe it was the Errant, since he offered Fanderay sanctuary ? I mean he is described a beautifull, like the sisters, he is human, so....

[Theotendo]

Imperial High Mage Tayschrenn, on Mar 7 2009, 08:36 PM, said:

If HE saved Fanderay, maybe it was the Errant, since he offered Fanderay sanctuary ? I mean he is described a beautifull, like the sisters, he is human, so....

Wasn't it the fallen Fener who was given sanctuary?

Given the twisted histories of the Elder ascendants, I wouldn't be surprised if Envy had a brother or half brother hidden away somewhere. But SE's work isn't without its typos here and there. Either or *shrugs*.

The Errant does date back to the Imass periods...who knows?

[Aptorian]

I'm just going to ignore everything that people has said in here and put my lot in with the people saying it's K'rull. It's how I remember it anyway.

[Abyss]

Most of how MoI played out certainly seemed to be part of Krul's master plan.

And the 'sibling' ref, given the Elder God/Tiste/Draconic family trees, is certainly wide open for debate.

- Abyss, bets on Nefarias Bredd...

[Benji]

At risk of sounding redundant...

Envy's brother is Wolverine.

End of.

[Sindriss]

Have to agree with it probably being a typo and the meaning was she and not he.

[tiam]

I read it as she anyway and always assumed it was nightchill.

Moving on swiftly...

[Egwene]

Resurrecting this old thread because I just came across the paragraph and wondered if in light of more recent publications, anyone has new thoughts on this.

PS: Could a mod move the whole thread to the 'General book topics' board, please, so we can discuss without having to worry about spoilers. Thanks.